Almost certainly we do. But, do you think if there was a culture that ran dog fights, that would be ok just because it's part of their culture?
I would not find that ok, because all sentient beings are worth moral consideration, and culture is not a good reason to hurt sentient beings. I might not focus on it especially if that culture was already marginalized and discriminated against and there were bigger problems to solve, but I'd still have the understanding that it's bad
I don't think dog fighting is a moral issue: at worst, it's aesthetic.
Really? What about bestiality?
yea. that, too, is an aesthetic issue. it can be gross without being immoral.
We disagree very strongly
you think gross things are immoral?
I think that having sex with sentient beings without their consent is extremely immoral
sentience and consent have nothing to do with one another.
someone experiencing it should have a say in whether or not they experience it
once again, we are going to be disagreeing on the relevant definitions of "someone".
How do you define "someone"?
the experiencers should have a say in whether or not they experience it
this is an impossible standard, and I don't believe it's one you actually ascribe to: for instance, pretty much everyone is ok with sterilizing stray dogs and cats, and there is never a question of consent.
I don't claim to 100% live in an ideal way. I try to keep improving but I don't think I'll ever be perfect
i think in cases where consent is difficult or impossible to achieve, we should act in the best interest of the experiencer in question. But I think that example is a tough one, at first glance I think we shouldn't sterilize them, but then when I consider what will almost certainly happen if they're not sterilized I think it's probably worth doing the one bad thing to prevent worse things from happening. It's an example where I think a utilitarian approach makes the most sense, since the variables are relatively clear
Almost certainly we do. But, do you think if there was a culture that ran dog fights, that would be ok just because it's part of their culture?
I would not find that ok, because all sentient beings are worth moral consideration, and culture is not a good reason to hurt sentient beings. I might not focus on it especially if that culture was already marginalized and discriminated against and there were bigger problems to solve, but I'd still have the understanding that it's bad
I don't think dog fighting is a moral issue: at worst, it's aesthetic.
Really? What about bestiality?
yea. that, too, is an aesthetic issue. it can be gross without being immoral.
We disagree very strongly
you think gross things are immoral?
I think that having sex with sentient beings without their consent is extremely immoral
sentience and consent have nothing to do with one another.
someone experiencing it should have a say in whether or not they experience it
once again, we are going to be disagreeing on the relevant definitions of "someone".
How do you define "someone"?
the experiencers should have a say in whether or not they experience it
this is an impossible standard, and I don't believe it's one you actually ascribe to: for instance, pretty much everyone is ok with sterilizing stray dogs and cats, and there is never a question of consent.
I don't claim to 100% live in an ideal way. I try to keep improving but I don't think I'll ever be perfect
i think in cases where consent is difficult or impossible to achieve, we should act in the best interest of the experiencer in question. But I think that example is a tough one, at first glance I think we shouldn't sterilize them, but then when I consider what will almost certainly happen if they're not sterilized I think it's probably worth doing the one bad thing to prevent worse things from happening. It's an example where I think a utilitarian approach makes the most sense, since the variables are relatively clear