In the USA less than 9% of the population smokes now. It's probably around ~7% at this point. It's crazy that we keep putting out laws like it's a massive issue. The reality is alcoholism is way worse than it's ever been yet it's still allowed to advertise on the TV and they can sell fruity flavors...but think of the children when it comes to tobacco...
I'm hesitant to spin valid concerns about alcohol into de-vilification of smoking. They are both vices, both unhealthy, both dangerous to the user and those around them for different reasons.
So yeah, it's valid to say we ignore the dangers of alcohol. But also yes, we should "think of the children" when it comes to tobacco.
What kid is picking up coffin nails these days? They vape or drink. It's probably why the FDA dropped deeming regulations when the cigar manufacturers went after them, no kid is smoking a $10 cigar.
That is threadbare justification for deregulation of something we know has basically entirely negative effects and absolutely is something that kids have historically done.
Kids' habits are fickle and unpredictable. Removing barriers to destructive behavior simply because they don't do that behavior as often anymore (the current regulations seem to work??) makes no sense.
The issue is they're not just leaving them in place, they're adding more regulations, while ignoring alcohol. More people are alcoholics now than ever, and everyone is completely fine with it, but smoking is taboo and "omg think of the children".
But... It's still not bad that those smoking regulations are being put in place.
It weakens the argument for additional alcohol regulation when you keep insisting that the regulations being put on another similar vice are pointless.
How do you figure? Those of us who enjoy cigars/pipe tobacco/snuff are basically seeing our vices disappear because "think of the children". Small makers are being forced to close because of the regulations on cigs. All while alcohol is completely allowed to do what it wants.
The argument works exactly the same the other way. Your rationale is based on your own preferences.
In a vacuum both tobacco and alcohol are destructive vices with no real discernible objective "benefits" to larger society. The argument against alcohol is exactly the same as the one against tobacco products. They harm the user and potentially those around them.
I'm not saying that tobacco should be further regulated while alcohol is not. But I am saying that the rationale for alcohol regulation is ultimately based on a desire to limit destructive behavior, which is the same rationale for limits on tobacco. You cannot effectively argue for deregulation of tobacco while arguing for increased regulation of alcohol. They are two sides of the same coin.
I think that's what you are missing here. I'm not arguing for more regulation on alcohol. I'm pointing out the hypocrisy of it all. How alcohol is completely overlooked by society but tobacco is this taboo thing now.
Well, the U.S. consumes a significant amount less alcohol than most European countries. So with both vices, Europe is doing worse than the U.S.
Sure but both countries are pushing tobacco laws like mad, while not touching alcohol.
It's literally prohibition all over again...
I'm one for letting people enjoy whatever vice they want, even if it's hard drugs, but only because I know prohibition doesn't work. We shouldn't be telling adults what they can and cannot enjoy
Cigarettes are much worse for everyone around you than alcohol. Passive smoking is pretty dangerous and the main reason why so many laws exist against smoking in public places.
No it is not, the 2nd hand studies where flawed heavily. Smoking is bad for you period, but second hand smoke is as bad for you as sitting in traffic. Alcohol is bad for people around you as well, lots of DUIs were people are harmed and killed because of it.
To an extent, I see where you're coming from, but if we keep cigarettes legal, most of the additives need to go. There's no need to put tar and acytone in a cigarette.
They don't put those things in cigs. It's a by product of burning tobacco. Those lists of whats in a cigarette are bullshit, it's just the chemical reaction of burning something.
In the USA less than 9% of the population smokes now. It's probably around ~7% at this point. It's crazy that we keep putting out laws like it's a massive issue. The reality is alcoholism is way worse than it's ever been yet it's still allowed to advertise on the TV and they can sell fruity flavors...but think of the children when it comes to tobacco...
I'm hesitant to spin valid concerns about alcohol into de-vilification of smoking. They are both vices, both unhealthy, both dangerous to the user and those around them for different reasons.
So yeah, it's valid to say we ignore the dangers of alcohol. But also yes, we should "think of the children" when it comes to tobacco.
What kid is picking up coffin nails these days? They vape or drink. It's probably why the FDA dropped deeming regulations when the cigar manufacturers went after them, no kid is smoking a $10 cigar.
That is threadbare justification for deregulation of something we know has basically entirely negative effects and absolutely is something that kids have historically done.
Kids' habits are fickle and unpredictable. Removing barriers to destructive behavior simply because they don't do that behavior as often anymore (the current regulations seem to work??) makes no sense.
The issue is they're not just leaving them in place, they're adding more regulations, while ignoring alcohol. More people are alcoholics now than ever, and everyone is completely fine with it, but smoking is taboo and "omg think of the children".
But... It's still not bad that those smoking regulations are being put in place.
It weakens the argument for additional alcohol regulation when you keep insisting that the regulations being put on another similar vice are pointless.
How do you figure? Those of us who enjoy cigars/pipe tobacco/snuff are basically seeing our vices disappear because "think of the children". Small makers are being forced to close because of the regulations on cigs. All while alcohol is completely allowed to do what it wants.
The argument works exactly the same the other way. Your rationale is based on your own preferences.
In a vacuum both tobacco and alcohol are destructive vices with no real discernible objective "benefits" to larger society. The argument against alcohol is exactly the same as the one against tobacco products. They harm the user and potentially those around them.
I'm not saying that tobacco should be further regulated while alcohol is not. But I am saying that the rationale for alcohol regulation is ultimately based on a desire to limit destructive behavior, which is the same rationale for limits on tobacco. You cannot effectively argue for deregulation of tobacco while arguing for increased regulation of alcohol. They are two sides of the same coin.
I think that's what you are missing here. I'm not arguing for more regulation on alcohol. I'm pointing out the hypocrisy of it all. How alcohol is completely overlooked by society but tobacco is this taboo thing now.
Well, the U.S. consumes a significant amount less alcohol than most European countries. So with both vices, Europe is doing worse than the U.S.
Sure but both countries are pushing tobacco laws like mad, while not touching alcohol.
It's literally prohibition all over again...
I'm one for letting people enjoy whatever vice they want, even if it's hard drugs, but only because I know prohibition doesn't work. We shouldn't be telling adults what they can and cannot enjoy
Cigarettes are much worse for everyone around you than alcohol. Passive smoking is pretty dangerous and the main reason why so many laws exist against smoking in public places.
No it is not, the 2nd hand studies where flawed heavily. Smoking is bad for you period, but second hand smoke is as bad for you as sitting in traffic. Alcohol is bad for people around you as well, lots of DUIs were people are harmed and killed because of it.
To an extent, I see where you're coming from, but if we keep cigarettes legal, most of the additives need to go. There's no need to put tar and acytone in a cigarette.
They don't put those things in cigs. It's a by product of burning tobacco. Those lists of whats in a cigarette are bullshit, it's just the chemical reaction of burning something.