Biden goes into 2024 with the economy getting stronger, but voters feel horrible about it
President Joe Biden goes into next year's election with a vexing challenge: Just as the U.S. economy is getting stronger, people are still feeling horrible about it.
Pollsters and economists say there has never been as wide a gap between the underlying health of the economy and public perception. The divergence could be a decisive factor in whether the Democrat secures a second term next year. Republicans are seizing on the dissatisfaction to skewer Biden, while the White House is finding less success as it tries to highlight economic progress.
“Things are getting better and people think things are going to get worse — and that’s the most dangerous piece of this," said Democratic pollster Celinda Lake, who has worked with Biden. Lake said voters no longer want to just see inflation rates fall — rather, they want an outright decline in prices, something that last happened on a large scale during the Great Depression.
“Honestly, I’m kind of mystified by it,” she said.
Gr. Have to admit, it's kinda annoying when people are still mystified these days. I could understand being mystified 5 years ago, but today, you should have too much evidence.
It's the information space, of course, and how its being utilized to try to rip the west apart. You think being within that process is going to feel stable, normal and predictable? No, no probably not.
Mystifying my ass. Only way it's mystifying is if you believe all conspiracies are fake. Which is just as dumb as thinking all of them are real. Countries absolutely plot against each other though, this is an extremely real and common form of conspiracy throughout history. Look as Kissingers legacy. We engaged in plenty of global conspiracies ourselves, throwing out this or that dictator, training militants here and over there. Do people think "that could never happen here?" or something? Even knowing how dumb Americans can be sometimes? And how about companies, driving these things for profit?
Terrified, infuriated, completely demotivated. Fine, I can understand all those. But mystified just makes me want to slap you. This is not mysterious at all, it's intentional manipulation with propaganda that is achieving sound results. Is she not seeing the propaganda or something, do I have to email her some examples so she understands?
Then there's another piece to the puzzle where many Americans just don't realize inflation represents year-on-year change, and instead view it as total change over time. That's honestly the smaller piece of the puzzle imo, though, Americans are often a little dumb on the details. Fucking annoying though, that I can see this and I'm just a dumb motherfucker on the internet, not a professional pollster.
/rant
Sorry, that one really bugs me, huge pet peeve. I think something has to be wrong with you at this point, if you can't understand why Trump gets the votes he does all through America, and how that relates to things as small as people misunderstanding inflation. Or misunderstanding race... or gender... or economics... or science... or facts... or the media... or education... or the federal govt... or the first amendment... or the civil war... or ... I could go for a long fucking time.
Anyone in here mystified? I figure people around here probably know better, since Fediverse kinda is an information space project in itself.
edit: Thinking about this further, this is probably fueling things like anti-semitism and Q too. Anyone can notice that there's large amounts of disagreement on the things I listed a couple paragraphs up.
In looking for a potential source for the problem, it's easy to stumble on the idea of some shadowy cabal running the world and driving these things. This solution is simple, and it feels good. It's kinda sexy, in a fantastical way. Whereas the much more mundane possibilities are ugly and complicated, and would not make for a fun story at all.
Yeah what if it's not that she or anyone is confused. What you seeing here is propaganda, plain and simple. The reader is supposed to come away with the belief that the economy is good and that therefore things are good, and that any perception they have otherwise is wrong.
Yup. I hate when people play that game expecting us to just follow them down the garden path.
We're not stupid and it grates that they all seem to think we are.
I try to think of it as theyre too stupid to lie well, like a young child. They're not stupid, but it lowers my blood pressure.
Inflation is down. This is not propaganda, but something you can check yourself. Are the prices in the supermarket still rising rapidly or not? If not, then inflation in your area, or the rate change is happening at, is down.
OP never said anything about inflation
If they wanted to bring up any other specific we could've discussed, that'd have been fine. Inflation has been the main line of attack on Biden's economy for the past 2 years though, so I went with the obvious.
Unemployment? GDP? Hell, even corporate profits and the stock market. Specific things though, one at a time.
Fighting emotional responses with statistics is a doomed strategy
No other way to talk about the economy, unfortunately, it's pretty statistical. Though I did try to explain how they could get a sense of inflation (locally, at least) just for themselves. Inflation can be handy that way.
Sadly, elections are not based on rational thought. If people feel the economy isn't doing well - for whatever personal reasons they have - they don't vote for whoever's in charge.
You're not going to "well actually" your way out of malaise. People have to feel like things are getting better for them and the people they know. No amount of statistics will change that.
And that's fine. But, that op specifically wanted to talk about the economy and propaganda, so I figured may as well talk about one of those. Economy is gonna get into statistics, and propaganda is a subjective mess we'd just end up disagreeing on. So I went with economy.
I can't live how I wish things should be. I have to deal with hard realities, like how I can talk about something objective and measurable and maybe, possibly, get somewhere concrete.
And if people were rational I'm sure your statistical analysis of the economy would be effective. But people aren't rational, and no amount of statistics is going to convince someone who can't afford their rent and groceries.
Fair point. Hard realities, though. I can't really control feelings in any way where I would still be able to feel okay about myself. I'd have to lie and manipulate to control feelings, and I don't like that. All I can do is say what I think is true, and leave it up to them.
As long as you recognize that your statistical truth and other people's lived truth can both be real at the same time. And when it comes to elections it's the latter that's going to have the most impact.
Truths belong in holy books. I see things in terms of evidence or feelings.
Hell, gas prices haven’t been lower in years where I am.
Inflation =/= economy good my good fellow! Try and see what I'm saying before you dismiss it outright. Let's change the topic slightly so i know what you really mean.
Do you think there is no propaganda in the us?
No, let's stay on inflation, it's very simple. Inflation is a percentage that prices are rising at each year, right?
Well, i guess youre too smart to get off message huh? Just shoot on over to the block button buddy, youre talkin intro to econ like its a slam dunk and i don't like the way you smell
Details are important. We look at one thing at a time for the same reason that scientists try to reduce down to one variable during laboratory testing. Because it let's us actually get to sound conclusions eventually.