She is not being rehabilitated and will never contribute to society in any way again. She is just costing people money for no reason. I am normally against the death penalty, but there are some cases, like this one, that make me think twice.
Idk if they even have the death penalty in the UK but in the US it's significantly more expensive to put someone to death than it is to imprison them for life. Also about a third of death penalty cases end up overturned on appeal. Which is a pleasant way of saying we get it wrong a lot. I feel like that's important to remember, because you're not just deciding what to do in this specific case. You're designing rules, not exceptions.
Capital punishment is prohibited in all circumstances in the UK, that includes times of war. It’s the same across almost all of Europe.
I totally agree for the US. I guess since I don't live there I trust the UK judicial system to be more sorted, but that is probably naive.
Even though I am against it where I live, there are still those cases where there is undeniable proof and the crimes are heinous enough to invoke the primal side of the brain. The logical side of my brain knows that it is a bad idea to give power to the state to kill people.
I just can't imagine how the family would feel in these kind of situations, and sometimes I think the justice given to them can be underwhelming. It's complicated and I find it hard to make a concrete decision to say that the death penalty is absolutely never warranted.
US it’s significantly more expensive to put someone to death than it is to imprison them for life
because of the appeals process. maybe if you guys had an actual functioning justice system over there that didnt convict and sentence people to death because of their skin colour things would be different, but as it stands, THAT is why its more expensive.
No-one hear is arguing over the actual guilt of this lady. A death sentence isnt going to be accidently put on the wrong person. Will she appeal? probably. She can do the same for life in prison too. Its gonna cost a lot no matter what.
In the end she is a worthless, valueless monster the world would be better for if she wasnt consuming oxygen and resources, although pretty sure the death penalty isnt a thing in the UK anyway so the point is moot
What are you getting mad at him for? He's agreeing with you
wasn't getting mad at him mate, not sure what gave you that idea
maybe if you guys had an actual functioning justice system over there that didnt convict and sentence people to death because of their skin colour things would be different,
Sounds big mad to me
Eg, he's right about it being racist AF over here. Shit, we onced sentenced 3 kids to death because a child had been murdered and those 3 kids lived near the place where it happened, listened to dark music and made everyone feel uncomfortable. Google "west Memphis 3", we didn't actually end up murdering any of them but it wasn't for lack of trying.
It's his overall objective in the thread that's the problem. His problem is also not my problem. I'm perfectly content to laugh while he seethes.
not mad, pointing out facts champ. sorry, American justice system is 3rd level inconpetant, if that fact makes you mad, think about why
Why is contributing to society a prereq for living? People aren't just a means to your ends. Even terrible ones.
I would argue that contributing to society can at minimum mean to be a person of good standing who participates without causing trouble. You could be as useless as a retiree since your 20s and still have contributed to society.
You are right. Contributing is not a requirement. I never said that it was, but I could have worded it better. It's more the fact that she did completely unforgivable things and will obviously never be rehabbed. I'm torn on the idea, but people like her just seem like a waste of air.
Also, how does me implying that most people contribute to society make people a means to my ends? That part of your comment makes no sense. I don't give a fuck what people do as long as they don't mess with other people.
I don't know if she can be rehabilitated, but one of my catch phrases is nobody is beyond redemption. I don't know if it's true, but I think it is an important belief. Practically, I'd rather keep a monster alive if it saves a few damaged people with some hope of reforming. I also think that cultivating a mindset of compassion does good things for me as far as how I view and treat other people.
I recognize there's more nuance to your views, but statements like that are made all the same by people who don't have very complicated views of things. I debated four peeps at once at work today that were in support of the death penalty, so I might be a bit biased due to that.
The death penalty is generally MORE expensive than prison for life, and if you don't want it that way your giving the government monetary incentive to give out more death penalties. Which is obviously a HORRIBLE IDEA
I agree generally don't really support the idea except in a few extreme cases where it is a solid case against a monster like this.
Life scentences are not the only reason I'm against death scentences
There's also the off chance that someone is innocent, look at the innocent people jailed in america because of racism for example
This bitch deserves to rot in jail
When you use the death penalty on domeone who turns out to be found innocent you can't get them back, their body is gone
Oh no! Your pennies!
I don't have any money, personally. I said she was costing other people money, not me. Oh no! Your reading comprehension!
She is not being rehabilitated and will never contribute to society in any way again. She is just costing people money for no reason. I am normally against the death penalty, but there are some cases, like this one, that make me think twice.
Idk if they even have the death penalty in the UK but in the US it's significantly more expensive to put someone to death than it is to imprison them for life. Also about a third of death penalty cases end up overturned on appeal. Which is a pleasant way of saying we get it wrong a lot. I feel like that's important to remember, because you're not just deciding what to do in this specific case. You're designing rules, not exceptions.
Capital punishment is prohibited in all circumstances in the UK, that includes times of war. It’s the same across almost all of Europe.
I totally agree for the US. I guess since I don't live there I trust the UK judicial system to be more sorted, but that is probably naive.
Even though I am against it where I live, there are still those cases where there is undeniable proof and the crimes are heinous enough to invoke the primal side of the brain. The logical side of my brain knows that it is a bad idea to give power to the state to kill people.
I just can't imagine how the family would feel in these kind of situations, and sometimes I think the justice given to them can be underwhelming. It's complicated and I find it hard to make a concrete decision to say that the death penalty is absolutely never warranted.
because of the appeals process. maybe if you guys had an actual functioning justice system over there that didnt convict and sentence people to death because of their skin colour things would be different, but as it stands, THAT is why its more expensive.
No-one hear is arguing over the actual guilt of this lady. A death sentence isnt going to be accidently put on the wrong person. Will she appeal? probably. She can do the same for life in prison too. Its gonna cost a lot no matter what.
In the end she is a worthless, valueless monster the world would be better for if she wasnt consuming oxygen and resources, although pretty sure the death penalty isnt a thing in the UK anyway so the point is moot
What are you getting mad at him for? He's agreeing with you
wasn't getting mad at him mate, not sure what gave you that idea
Sounds big mad to me
Eg, he's right about it being racist AF over here. Shit, we onced sentenced 3 kids to death because a child had been murdered and those 3 kids lived near the place where it happened, listened to dark music and made everyone feel uncomfortable. Google "west Memphis 3", we didn't actually end up murdering any of them but it wasn't for lack of trying.
It's his overall objective in the thread that's the problem. His problem is also not my problem. I'm perfectly content to laugh while he seethes.
not mad, pointing out facts champ. sorry, American justice system is 3rd level inconpetant, if that fact makes you mad, think about why
Why is contributing to society a prereq for living? People aren't just a means to your ends. Even terrible ones.
I would argue that contributing to society can at minimum mean to be a person of good standing who participates without causing trouble. You could be as useless as a retiree since your 20s and still have contributed to society.
You are right. Contributing is not a requirement. I never said that it was, but I could have worded it better. It's more the fact that she did completely unforgivable things and will obviously never be rehabbed. I'm torn on the idea, but people like her just seem like a waste of air.
Also, how does me implying that most people contribute to society make people a means to my ends? That part of your comment makes no sense. I don't give a fuck what people do as long as they don't mess with other people.
I don't know if she can be rehabilitated, but one of my catch phrases is nobody is beyond redemption. I don't know if it's true, but I think it is an important belief. Practically, I'd rather keep a monster alive if it saves a few damaged people with some hope of reforming. I also think that cultivating a mindset of compassion does good things for me as far as how I view and treat other people.
I recognize there's more nuance to your views, but statements like that are made all the same by people who don't have very complicated views of things. I debated four peeps at once at work today that were in support of the death penalty, so I might be a bit biased due to that.
The death penalty is generally MORE expensive than prison for life, and if you don't want it that way your giving the government monetary incentive to give out more death penalties. Which is obviously a HORRIBLE IDEA
I agree generally don't really support the idea except in a few extreme cases where it is a solid case against a monster like this.
Life scentences are not the only reason I'm against death scentences
There's also the off chance that someone is innocent, look at the innocent people jailed in america because of racism for example
This bitch deserves to rot in jail
When you use the death penalty on domeone who turns out to be found innocent you can't get them back, their body is gone
Oh no! Your pennies!
I don't have any money, personally. I said she was costing other people money, not me. Oh no! Your reading comprehension!