Projects like Runtipi have potential for the masses, imo. Single click deployment of apps on your own server....if you can get Runtipi installed first, of course. But hey, a step closer I suppose.
I'm very new to selfhosting, only started in earnest in April of this year. So I definitely felt the hosts frustrations in deploying (or trying to deploy) solutions I wanted to take back from Google and Microsoft. I'm still learning and am almost to the point where I'm comfortable pulling the plug on Google photos entirely. But it's a lot of research for newbs.
The problem with those projects like Runtipi is the same you've with Docker - you'll be hostage to yet another platform that can fuck you up at any moment without notice... like Docker hub did.
Docker does not lock you in with the docker hub though. So no hostage taking.
While that isn't false, defaults carry immense weight. Also, very few have the means to host at scale like Docker Hub; if the goal is to not just repeat the same mistake later, each project would have to host their own, or perhaps band together into smaller groups. And unfortunately, being a good programmer does not make you good at devops or sysadmin work, so now we need to involve more people with those skillsets.
To be clear, I'm totally in favor of this kind of fragmentation. I'm just also realistic about what it means.
Linuxserver.io images don't come directly from Docker Hub any more, and I don't know if anyone noticed or cared. They use their own domain lscr.io that redirects to the Docker repository they're using (currently Github) which makes it easy for them to move the repository without breaking things for users. https://www.linuxserver.io/blog/wrap-up-warm-for-the-winter
That approach is a good idea in general. If you're running a medium to large size project, never directly rely on domain names you don't control because it makes it painful to migrate to something else in the future. Even if your own domain just has a bunch of redirects (both URL redirects and email forwarding), it's better than nothing.
That's the same as saying that Microsoft doesn't make anyone hostage with MS Office, yet they do.
Bullshit. I can use docker without the docker hub very easily. Anyone can host docker images, and docker allows this, no weird hacks needed.
They don't though? The file formats are documented and other office suite software can read and write them.
They do, those formats are a mess, full of small details and non-standard implementations on MS Office and Excel is most like the worst case. Office formats are all open until you realize that means shit because Microsoft does what they want and the standards don't cover everything. If you're serious about office and you need to collaborate with MS Office users those "other office suites" won't cut it. You'll have compatibility issues.
I agree that they're a mess, but there's nothing in there that intentionally holds you hostage. The format is not binary - it's readable to anyone that wants to read it.
That's not really possible with docker TBH, and I say that as a diehard Podman advocate. Docker, the tooling that you install with your package manager, is open source. Sure they have windows and mac desktop stuff that isn't open, but it's not like you're self-hosting with that, right?
Plus there's always Podman to switch to, which can be a (mostly) drop-in replacement, if you want something with a more trustworthy provenience.
You shouldn't be hostage to a platform. Before Docker we didn't have those kinds of issues APT repositories are easy to mirror and they're not run by for profit companies.
Are there any docker FOSS alternatives? It sounds like a good thing in practice but yeah, they seem to have too much power atm.
Projects like Runtipi have potential for the masses, imo. Single click deployment of apps on your own server....if you can get Runtipi installed first, of course. But hey, a step closer I suppose.
I'm very new to selfhosting, only started in earnest in April of this year. So I definitely felt the hosts frustrations in deploying (or trying to deploy) solutions I wanted to take back from Google and Microsoft. I'm still learning and am almost to the point where I'm comfortable pulling the plug on Google photos entirely. But it's a lot of research for newbs.
The problem with those projects like Runtipi is the same you've with Docker - you'll be hostage to yet another platform that can fuck you up at any moment without notice... like Docker hub did.
Docker does not lock you in with the docker hub though. So no hostage taking.
While that isn't false, defaults carry immense weight. Also, very few have the means to host at scale like Docker Hub; if the goal is to not just repeat the same mistake later, each project would have to host their own, or perhaps band together into smaller groups. And unfortunately, being a good programmer does not make you good at devops or sysadmin work, so now we need to involve more people with those skillsets.
To be clear, I'm totally in favor of this kind of fragmentation. I'm just also realistic about what it means.
Linuxserver.io images don't come directly from Docker Hub any more, and I don't know if anyone noticed or cared. They use their own domain lscr.io that redirects to the Docker repository they're using (currently Github) which makes it easy for them to move the repository without breaking things for users. https://www.linuxserver.io/blog/wrap-up-warm-for-the-winter
That approach is a good idea in general. If you're running a medium to large size project, never directly rely on domain names you don't control because it makes it painful to migrate to something else in the future. Even if your own domain just has a bunch of redirects (both URL redirects and email forwarding), it's better than nothing.
That's the same as saying that Microsoft doesn't make anyone hostage with MS Office, yet they do.
Bullshit. I can use docker without the docker hub very easily. Anyone can host docker images, and docker allows this, no weird hacks needed.
They don't though? The file formats are documented and other office suite software can read and write them.
They do, those formats are a mess, full of small details and non-standard implementations on MS Office and Excel is most like the worst case. Office formats are all open until you realize that means shit because Microsoft does what they want and the standards don't cover everything. If you're serious about office and you need to collaborate with MS Office users those "other office suites" won't cut it. You'll have compatibility issues.
I agree that they're a mess, but there's nothing in there that intentionally holds you hostage. The format is not binary - it's readable to anyone that wants to read it.
Do you have an example?
That's not really possible with docker TBH, and I say that as a diehard Podman advocate. Docker, the tooling that you install with your package manager, is open source. Sure they have windows and mac desktop stuff that isn't open, but it's not like you're self-hosting with that, right?
Plus there's always Podman to switch to, which can be a (mostly) drop-in replacement, if you want something with a more trustworthy provenience.
Wait, what did Docker Hub do?
https://blog.alexellis.io/docker-is-deleting-open-source-images/
You shouldn't be hostage to a platform. Before Docker we didn't have those kinds of issues APT repositories are easy to mirror and they're not run by for profit companies.
Are there any docker FOSS alternatives? It sounds like a good thing in practice but yeah, they seem to have too much power atm.
Exactly my point.
Podman