This story has nearly 600 upvotes, so far. Does that imply that we care about winning more than we care about the the wisdom and agency of others?
yes
Is that moral and ethical?
Is derping to get Trump elected moral or ethical?
Is perpetuating false dichotomy?
It's not a false dichotomy at all. The choice in this national election, like basically all national elections preceding it, is between the two major party candidates.
Since that's the reality, any actions you're taking regarding the election and its discussion can be correctly regarded as support for one candidate or the other.
So I ask you again, is derping to help get Trump elected moral or ethical?
I choose to vote to influence the 2028 POTUS election. But, you're not asking. Assume what you wish.
The 2028 POTUS election will not be influenced by derping to help get Trump elected, but perhaps you spelled "canceled" incorrectly.
Your intent is clear. You've still not asked for mine. You've assumed it in false dichotomy, even when told otherwise. Is this "good faith"?
Your intent is also clear, which is why you spin in circles to not declare it outright.
As far as your overall "who cares?" line of questioning or "why should we care?" about Taylor Swift endorsing Kamala Harris...apparently you care, deeply, which is why you're here in this thread advocating against Harris.
The only false dichotomy in this thread is that we cannot care about both "winning" and the "wisdom and agency of others" (whatever the fuck that means).
I care about one thing above everything else -- Keeping Donald Trump away from the levers of power. And I have good reasons for this:
My wife is a Black bisexual Goth Pagan. That's at least three hates from Team Trump.
I have Student Loans. I can repay them at 5% of my income, but 10% will become too much of a burden. And I'd really like to get my 120 payments in to get the rest wiped out.
I care about the future of the planet. Having a guy raging against Solar and Wind for stupid made up reasons in office doesn't support that goal.
I care about keeping Russia out of Ukraine and Israel out of Palestine. While I also care about keeping Hamas out of Israel, I think Trump is bad for ALL those goals.
And that's just the short list.
I support Biden and his successor Harris on the merits, too. The Chips Act is a great win for really getting microchips made in the US. Biden's done a damn good job on investing in US infrastructure, which is an important thing to me. His attempts to deal with Student Loans are a big part of why I have stopped taking night classes and reentered repayment. And he's doing a damn fine job overall. But again. My goal above all other goals is keeping Trump away from the White House.
A vote for RFK Jr. is not going to accomplish this. Not only is he an anti-evidence candidate pushing BS conspiracy theory positions and only a few steps to the left of Trump et al, he's also not going to win, and the most he could do is poach enough left-leaning votes with his last name to get Trump in office.
A vote for Jill Stein is not going to accomplish this. Not only is she a sycophant for Putin and a peddler of disinformation herself (reasons alone to vote against her), her position as an alternative to the Mainstream Left-Most candidate is just another way to steal enough left-wing votes to ... get Trump into office.
A vote for Cornel West is not going to accomplish this. While I admire the man, the reality is that he doesn't have enough access to have even a remote chance of winning the Presidency, and his run only ensures that votes that would have gone to Harris end up going to him, lowering the threshold at which Trump can steal the Presidency...getting Trump into office.
Staying home is not going to accomplish this. All it does is lowers Harris' vote count, making it easier for Trump to steal the Presidency...getting Trump into office.
My goal is to ensure my Black bisexual goth pagan wife doesn't get ground under the bootheels of Trumpian Authoritarianism. One of the ways I do this is by debunking posts like this. I don't care about winning. I care about Trump losing. And I don't see wisdom here. I see...well, Rule 3 so I can't say what I exactly see here, but it's not wisdom or any of its synonyms. I see a willing dismissal of truth here, a poster arguing to give the election to Trump because the Democratic candidate isn't EXACTLY what they demanded. And agency? Pal, nobody's holding a gun to your head and saying you MUST vote Harris. Do any of the options I mentioned above, or go ahead and vote Trump, or any other silly 'protest' vote you want. We're just here saying that you're gonna get Trump for all of us and screw over a whole bunch of people you claim to support.
I'm also a triple minority. I'm not afraid of Trump. I've suffered his kind my whole life.
Perhaps the way to progress is to put the platform you want on every Presidential ballot in 2028. You know how that's done, right?
This poster took one bullet point out of four to nitpick on, while ignoring everything else I posted. I wonder WHY, and you should to, dear reader.
Again. My sole goal is to get Trump away from office, and yes, if I have to work with Progressives, Moderates, Mainstream Democrats, Conservative Dems, and even moderate Republicans, I think we make that work. Actual Progressives feel that we've made real progress on a variety of issues, including Student Loans, Green Energy, and minority rights that will be reversed and reversed hard by a Trump admin. Rather than let this poster spew this nonsense unchallenged, I am here articulating where it is wrong and why you shouldn't listen to it. Please keep this in mind as you read our exchanges, dear reader, and remember: There ARE factions out there trying to get you to throw your vote behind a Third Party or stay home, for the express goal of allowing Trump to steal the election and tear down everything you love. Remember that as you read posts that tell you vote Third Party or just stay home.
This poster assumed bad faith maliciousness instead of asking questions. They can't tell friend from foe. But, they've certainly lots of words to express the status quo reasoning prevalent among you.
express the status quo reasoning prevalent among you.
This story has nearly 600 upvotes, so far. Does that imply that we care about winning more than we care about the the wisdom and agency of others?
yes
Is that moral and ethical?
Is derping to get Trump elected moral or ethical?
Is perpetuating false dichotomy?
It's not a false dichotomy at all. The choice in this national election, like basically all national elections preceding it, is between the two major party candidates.
Since that's the reality, any actions you're taking regarding the election and its discussion can be correctly regarded as support for one candidate or the other.
So I ask you again, is derping to help get Trump elected moral or ethical?
I choose to vote to influence the 2028 POTUS election. But, you're not asking. Assume what you wish.
The 2028 POTUS election will not be influenced by derping to help get Trump elected, but perhaps you spelled "canceled" incorrectly.
Your intent is clear. You've still not asked for mine. You've assumed it in false dichotomy, even when told otherwise. Is this "good faith"?
Your intent is also clear, which is why you spin in circles to not declare it outright.
As far as your overall "who cares?" line of questioning or "why should we care?" about Taylor Swift endorsing Kamala Harris...apparently you care, deeply, which is why you're here in this thread advocating against Harris.
The only false dichotomy in this thread is that we cannot care about both "winning" and the "wisdom and agency of others" (whatever the fuck that means).
I care about one thing above everything else -- Keeping Donald Trump away from the levers of power. And I have good reasons for this:
And that's just the short list.
I support Biden and his successor Harris on the merits, too. The Chips Act is a great win for really getting microchips made in the US. Biden's done a damn good job on investing in US infrastructure, which is an important thing to me. His attempts to deal with Student Loans are a big part of why I have stopped taking night classes and reentered repayment. And he's doing a damn fine job overall. But again. My goal above all other goals is keeping Trump away from the White House.
My goal is to ensure my Black bisexual goth pagan wife doesn't get ground under the bootheels of Trumpian Authoritarianism. One of the ways I do this is by debunking posts like this. I don't care about winning. I care about Trump losing. And I don't see wisdom here. I see...well, Rule 3 so I can't say what I exactly see here, but it's not wisdom or any of its synonyms. I see a willing dismissal of truth here, a poster arguing to give the election to Trump because the Democratic candidate isn't EXACTLY what they demanded. And agency? Pal, nobody's holding a gun to your head and saying you MUST vote Harris. Do any of the options I mentioned above, or go ahead and vote Trump, or any other silly 'protest' vote you want. We're just here saying that you're gonna get Trump for all of us and screw over a whole bunch of people you claim to support.
I'm also a triple minority. I'm not afraid of Trump. I've suffered his kind my whole life.
Perhaps the way to progress is to put the platform you want on every Presidential ballot in 2028. You know how that's done, right?
This poster took one bullet point out of four to nitpick on, while ignoring everything else I posted. I wonder WHY, and you should to, dear reader.
Again. My sole goal is to get Trump away from office, and yes, if I have to work with Progressives, Moderates, Mainstream Democrats, Conservative Dems, and even moderate Republicans, I think we make that work. Actual Progressives feel that we've made real progress on a variety of issues, including Student Loans, Green Energy, and minority rights that will be reversed and reversed hard by a Trump admin. Rather than let this poster spew this nonsense unchallenged, I am here articulating where it is wrong and why you shouldn't listen to it. Please keep this in mind as you read our exchanges, dear reader, and remember: There ARE factions out there trying to get you to throw your vote behind a Third Party or stay home, for the express goal of allowing Trump to steal the election and tear down everything you love. Remember that as you read posts that tell you vote Third Party or just stay home.
This poster assumed bad faith maliciousness instead of asking questions. They can't tell friend from foe. But, they've certainly lots of words to express the status quo reasoning prevalent among you.
🤣