The mods and admins have actually discussed their account multiple times.
The consensus is, yes, they have shitty opinions, but having shitty opinions is not against the TOS.
The links they post are legitimate links from respected sources.
So, no, nothing bannable or removable here. The comments and downvotes do their job exposing just how shitty their opinions are.
The problem we have is not with bad opinions.
If I were to copy paste the same response across many threads, intentionally antagonizing users and making that obvious, what is the secret to having that not be considered trolling? Because apparently op somehow discovered how to achieve that. This user is making it beyond obvious. They intend to troll users, and they're putting a lot of effort into it. Can you help us understand what makes that okay?
I don’t think anyone has a problem with shitty opinions. I think the bigger problem is a pattern of behavior that impairs the community.
Copying and pasting the same low effort text multiple times in replies
Refusal to engage in good faith discussions/interactions
Excessive volume of low quality posts and comments
Outright trolling which you all have only moderated a portion of
Overall you have a user that disrupts the community in a variety of ways and contributes nothing of value - especially in their comments. I think at least a temporary ban has been justified for quite some time.
Thank you for calling this out in detail. I think that copy pasting responses several times easily qualifies as trolling and the massive amount of them doing this makes it no question. This alone should be enough.
They should be banned from the instance. I can't quite follow how it's controversial unless some of the mods are letting their politics stand in the way of observations anyone can easily make in a couple of minutes. There is nothing redeeming about this account. They are spreading bad ideas in bad faith, and frankly it shakes my faith in the platform that they can get away with it Scot fucking free. It's disgusting.
I don't have to explain anything to you or anyone else. Feel free to stop responding and commenting on my posts if you don't want to hear replies from me. Thanks! :)
Wasn’t talking to you, bud.
Feel free to stop responding and commenting on my posts and comments if you don't want to hear replies from me. Thanks!
But I was talking to you, friend. Thanks!
Right, because you’re a hypocrite. “Don’t reply to me if you don’t want to interact” but then repeatedly dives into deep conversation threads that didn’t include you to add your useless cut-and-paste copypasta du jour. You’re obviously looking at the post history of some individuals, following them around and injecting yourself where you are not wanted. You know who does that? Trolls.
Well, don't reply to me if you don't want to interact. And what makes you think I am looking at your post history? I posted this article and I was reading the discussion thread. What are you even going on about?! lol
If you don't want a response from me, then you don't have to talk about me or to me. Your choice, friend. Thanks! :)
Troll and a hypocrite, got it. Thanks.
Neither one. But thanks anyway, friend! :)
If only that was true! If it was, you wouldn’t be harassing other users like me.
You feel harassed just because I am responding to replies from you? Wow, ok. Well you can block me if you really feel that way. Thanks!
Or you could stop harassing folks who weren’t even talking to you?
So, let me get this straight—are you saying I’m harassing you because I responded to a comment you made under a post that I shared? This is literally a discussion forum. That’s how it works. People engage in conversations.
Have you actually raised this with the mods, claiming harassment because I replied to your comment in the discussion thread under my post? Because if you didn’t want a response, then why comment in the first place, especially without naming anyone specifically? I assumed it was fair game to jump in.
Do you believe people shouldn’t have the right to respond to comments here? I’m genuinely confused by what the issue is.
Makes perfect sense about the links. Now their conduct of being defensive/borderline trolling in all the responses is not okay.
Thanks for bringing me up to speed.
Why would defending my views or opinions not be ok? Other people defend their opinions, why shouldn't I be able to? Plus if you are that annoyed with me, you can block me and not see anything I post or comment.
So what about the trolling behavior in comments?
People do not complain about his posts, let me repeat that, his posts are not the problem. Nobody cares about his opinions. Nobody minds that he likes third parties, that part is fine.
It's the behavior in comment sections that is the problem. How is it that we have a rule 4 that prohibits trolling, but we allow a user who consistently exhibits comment behavior intended to simply irritate whoever is interacting with them? Low effort, consistently full of logical fallacies, frequently misrepresenting himself and others, etc. These indicate a troll.
Again, it is comment behavior that is the problem. How many of his comments need to be removed before it is identified as a problematic account? I think we deserve some transparency here.
Where and how do you draw the line with regards to trolling behaviors in comments sections?
edit: Let me quote him from just below here, where he replied to someone replying to you right here:
I don’t have to explain anything to you or anyone else. Feel free to stop responding and commenting on my posts if you don’t want to hear replies from me. Thanks! :)
Does this add anything to a conversation? Does this further discourse in any constructive way? Does this encourage people to positively participate in our community?
I appreciate your effort here. It seems like the answer is that this user gets special treatment. Maybe it's a mod or admin's alt and no one is brave enough to stand against it.
I think they're just erring on the side of free speech in general. They've always been fairly lenient with comment behavior that isn't extremely blatant. Since they don't seem to understand the nature of these things, we sort of have a responsibility to educate about it.
I know I have pointed out trolling/suspicious behavior by this account a few times. The mods I've talked to never seem to care and just tell me to block them, as if that actually solves the problem.
That's part of the problem too. They don't understand what a dedicated troll's real long-term goals are. Good on them for never having been one, but I'd rather have a rare example of a healthy large internet community than a trolly one.
I mean, when I try to explain this to mods (I have more than a couple of times) I get crickets. They don't seem particularly concerned as a whole.
Yeah I've been growing a little frustrated as well, as my tone in that earlier comment probably indicated. But a troll isn't the only stubborn person around here, and I actually care about this community and the broader Fediverse project.
I agree, they don't seem particularly concerned, which is why I've steadily pivoted more towards general conversations on what trolling actually is, what the classic trollface.jpg really represents, and methods by which it seeks to accomplish its goals. If this or any other community I'm active in is going to allow these behaviors, it won't be able to claim ignorance of how it all works.
The mods and admins have actually discussed their account multiple times.
The consensus is, yes, they have shitty opinions, but having shitty opinions is not against the TOS.
The links they post are legitimate links from respected sources.
So, no, nothing bannable or removable here. The comments and downvotes do their job exposing just how shitty their opinions are.
The problem we have is not with bad opinions.
If I were to copy paste the same response across many threads, intentionally antagonizing users and making that obvious, what is the secret to having that not be considered trolling? Because apparently op somehow discovered how to achieve that. This user is making it beyond obvious. They intend to troll users, and they're putting a lot of effort into it. Can you help us understand what makes that okay?
I don’t think anyone has a problem with shitty opinions. I think the bigger problem is a pattern of behavior that impairs the community.
Overall you have a user that disrupts the community in a variety of ways and contributes nothing of value - especially in their comments. I think at least a temporary ban has been justified for quite some time.
Thank you for calling this out in detail. I think that copy pasting responses several times easily qualifies as trolling and the massive amount of them doing this makes it no question. This alone should be enough.
They should be banned from the instance. I can't quite follow how it's controversial unless some of the mods are letting their politics stand in the way of observations anyone can easily make in a couple of minutes. There is nothing redeeming about this account. They are spreading bad ideas in bad faith, and frankly it shakes my faith in the platform that they can get away with it Scot fucking free. It's disgusting.
I don't have to explain anything to you or anyone else. Feel free to stop responding and commenting on my posts if you don't want to hear replies from me. Thanks! :)
Wasn’t talking to you, bud.
Feel free to stop responding and commenting on my posts and comments if you don't want to hear replies from me. Thanks!
But I was talking to you, friend. Thanks!
Right, because you’re a hypocrite. “Don’t reply to me if you don’t want to interact” but then repeatedly dives into deep conversation threads that didn’t include you to add your useless cut-and-paste copypasta du jour. You’re obviously looking at the post history of some individuals, following them around and injecting yourself where you are not wanted. You know who does that? Trolls.
Well, don't reply to me if you don't want to interact. And what makes you think I am looking at your post history? I posted this article and I was reading the discussion thread. What are you even going on about?! lol
If you don't want a response from me, then you don't have to talk about me or to me. Your choice, friend. Thanks! :)
Troll and a hypocrite, got it. Thanks.
Neither one. But thanks anyway, friend! :)
If only that was true! If it was, you wouldn’t be harassing other users like me.
You feel harassed just because I am responding to replies from you? Wow, ok. Well you can block me if you really feel that way. Thanks!
Or you could stop harassing folks who weren’t even talking to you?
So, let me get this straight—are you saying I’m harassing you because I responded to a comment you made under a post that I shared? This is literally a discussion forum. That’s how it works. People engage in conversations.
Have you actually raised this with the mods, claiming harassment because I replied to your comment in the discussion thread under my post? Because if you didn’t want a response, then why comment in the first place, especially without naming anyone specifically? I assumed it was fair game to jump in.
Do you believe people shouldn’t have the right to respond to comments here? I’m genuinely confused by what the issue is.
Makes perfect sense about the links. Now their conduct of being defensive/borderline trolling in all the responses is not okay.
Thanks for bringing me up to speed.
Why would defending my views or opinions not be ok? Other people defend their opinions, why shouldn't I be able to? Plus if you are that annoyed with me, you can block me and not see anything I post or comment.
So what about the trolling behavior in comments?
People do not complain about his posts, let me repeat that, his posts are not the problem. Nobody cares about his opinions. Nobody minds that he likes third parties, that part is fine.
It's the behavior in comment sections that is the problem. How is it that we have a rule 4 that prohibits trolling, but we allow a user who consistently exhibits comment behavior intended to simply irritate whoever is interacting with them? Low effort, consistently full of logical fallacies, frequently misrepresenting himself and others, etc. These indicate a troll.
Again, it is comment behavior that is the problem. How many of his comments need to be removed before it is identified as a problematic account? I think we deserve some transparency here.
Where and how do you draw the line with regards to trolling behaviors in comments sections?
edit: Let me quote him from just below here, where he replied to someone replying to you right here:
Does this add anything to a conversation? Does this further discourse in any constructive way? Does this encourage people to positively participate in our community?
I appreciate your effort here. It seems like the answer is that this user gets special treatment. Maybe it's a mod or admin's alt and no one is brave enough to stand against it.
I think they're just erring on the side of free speech in general. They've always been fairly lenient with comment behavior that isn't extremely blatant. Since they don't seem to understand the nature of these things, we sort of have a responsibility to educate about it.
I know I have pointed out trolling/suspicious behavior by this account a few times. The mods I've talked to never seem to care and just tell me to block them, as if that actually solves the problem.
That's part of the problem too. They don't understand what a dedicated troll's real long-term goals are. Good on them for never having been one, but I'd rather have a rare example of a healthy large internet community than a trolly one.
I mean, when I try to explain this to mods (I have more than a couple of times) I get crickets. They don't seem particularly concerned as a whole.
Yeah I've been growing a little frustrated as well, as my tone in that earlier comment probably indicated. But a troll isn't the only stubborn person around here, and I actually care about this community and the broader Fediverse project.
I agree, they don't seem particularly concerned, which is why I've steadily pivoted more towards general conversations on what trolling actually is, what the classic trollface.jpg really represents, and methods by which it seeks to accomplish its goals. If this or any other community I'm active in is going to allow these behaviors, it won't be able to claim ignorance of how it all works.
It's admittedly a big topic though.
Thank you! (I mean, kind of...lol)