I’m saying the technology leads to more harm than good in its current implementation. I don’t care it’s better than your Audi, it still sucks overall. “Used correctly” shouldn’t be a huge factor in a good design. It should be easy to use correctly and hard to use incorrectly. This is not the current state. It’s very easy to use incorrectly, as you admit, and the accidents demonstrate this.
it still sucks overall
In what way?
It should be easy to use correctly and hard to use incorrectly.
The vehicle prompts you to keep your hands on the wheel and be ready to take over at any moment every time you enable FSD. Everyone using it incorrectly is doing so knowingly.
For the Tesla it’s very easy to use correctly.
Compared to our old cruise control it’s a much better system.
Nothing can stop people from being idiots. Most of the accidents are people being idiots.
I have seen a few where 100% it was a Tesla failure and Tesla should be held 100% accountable for those.
For the Tesla it’s very easy to use correctly.
Not supported by the evidence, but sure, keep relying on your feelings and telling other people it’s their problem. Projection.
It’s clearly supported by the evidence. It’s cruise control. How complicated do you think cruise control is? You put your hands on the wheel and it maintains speed.
Nothing can stop people from being idiots. Most of the accidents are people being idiots.
This is the stupidity I hate most about Tesla shills.
Great engineers make genius innovations all the time to keep idiots from harming themselves or others. Those innovations saturate our society and industries at all levels. Good engineering should be trying to do it more.
Tesla just doesn't care, or is even complicit in giving the idiots just enough freedom so people can think Tesla is ahead of the competition. The only difference from Tesla is that other car manufacturers don't give idiots that freedom.
This is the stupidity I hate most about Tesla shills
This is why I hate most about people obsessed with Elon. They can’t have discussions. It’s all weird illogical wants over Elon.
Great engineers make genius innovations all the time to keep idiots from harming themselves or others
No. When cruise control first came out. It’d drive you right into another car. Auto pilot is just a fancy cruise control.
You can take a normal car and drive it into a wall. Tesla is no different. Using your logic a normal car shouldn’t be able to do that.
When did I refer to Musk? You must be sensitive.
Yes, when cruise control came out over 100 years ago, there were very little controls. Responsible car makers have changes that. Some even recently aimed for zero fatalities for people using their cars and the associated technologies.
And there are many cars that keep you from driving into a wall. Maybe, at this point, you can't keep 100 percent of the idiots from doing something stupid, but responsible car makers do much, much better than Tesla, who actually promotes and markets the actions of idiots abusing the systems in their cars.
The responsible car makers showing drivers performing stunts well beyond the ability or legality of most drivers?
You've got some kind of chip on your shoulder man. It's a car company, who cares.
Responsible car makers have changes that
No they haven’t. I have take by brand new Audi and drive it straight into a well.
They assist people in driving. You are still driving the car.
car makers do much, much better than Tesla
Incorrect. Auto pilot is less likely to be in an accident.
You think giving me Tesla marketing BS, published by a proxy Tesla marketing rag, is going to convince me? If it is anything else like Tesla's marketing department, they just pulled something out of their ass, Musk saw the numbers and told them to fudge it some more, and then they put it up on their website dressed in fancy graphs and tech-speak. That's why you'll never find any actual data that third-party researchers can verify it with.
Tesla's create horrible driving habits in their customers. On the one hand, you have the CEO that creates a culture to disregard for safety and rules, praising users that openly go against the terms of use, as long as they show it doing something cool. On the other hand, you have a system that is just good enough to lull you into a sense of safety and confidence in the system itself. Then one day it decides to kill a motorcyclist, a kid getting off the bus, or a paramedic working on the side of the road. The driver that maybe praised Tesla to their friends and colleagues about how amazing it was is now dumbstruck because the car acted so unexpectedly.
Tesla is just as much as fault as the driver for that situation.
The report doesn't explain why Teslas crashed at a higher rate than any other brand, only that it does
So why do you think Tesla's crash at a higher rate? I think it's a combination of instant acceleration, poor sensor-suite (like the lack of radar), and Tesla giving idiots free-reign to abuse the system as they please.
Maybe because it has nothing to do with Tesla. It’s a EV thing. Tesla just makes more EV than anyone else. It’s interesting to note when people switch to gas, they have more accidents.
The acceleration is a valid reason. Since Tesla has good controls to compensate for it. People don’t get how quickly they can get to an insane soeed
Dude, I was literally in another thread where someone posted a video talking about how many deaths FSD caused (17) and extrapolating those numbers by how many FSD miles were driven lead to fsd being 11x more dangerous than a humans driver.
It had all sorts of upvotes.
Except, those accidents were on AP which has multiple billions of miles driven, not FSD. The NHSTA has only said there was 1 fsd related death. Related, as in, not confirmed to be the cause of.
They don't even know what they're mad about. And i get downvoted for showing the major flaw in their post.
I bet they've never used, or had to acknowledge the warnings prior to using AP. Let alone the even more dire warning FSD gives (or gave prior to v12 anyway, not sure what today's warnings are)
Here, you will see ford is under investigation for its system
People confuse auto pilot with full self driving. They are very different. AP is just assisted cruise control. I’ve had very few issues with it. Compared to my Audi, I love the Tesla AP.
I’m saying the technology leads to more harm than good in its current implementation. I don’t care it’s better than your Audi, it still sucks overall. “Used correctly” shouldn’t be a huge factor in a good design. It should be easy to use correctly and hard to use incorrectly. This is not the current state. It’s very easy to use incorrectly, as you admit, and the accidents demonstrate this.
In what way?
The vehicle prompts you to keep your hands on the wheel and be ready to take over at any moment every time you enable FSD. Everyone using it incorrectly is doing so knowingly.
For the Tesla it’s very easy to use correctly.
Compared to our old cruise control it’s a much better system.
Nothing can stop people from being idiots. Most of the accidents are people being idiots.
I have seen a few where 100% it was a Tesla failure and Tesla should be held 100% accountable for those.
Not supported by the evidence, but sure, keep relying on your feelings and telling other people it’s their problem. Projection.
It’s clearly supported by the evidence. It’s cruise control. How complicated do you think cruise control is? You put your hands on the wheel and it maintains speed.
This is the stupidity I hate most about Tesla shills.
Great engineers make genius innovations all the time to keep idiots from harming themselves or others. Those innovations saturate our society and industries at all levels. Good engineering should be trying to do it more.
Tesla just doesn't care, or is even complicit in giving the idiots just enough freedom so people can think Tesla is ahead of the competition. The only difference from Tesla is that other car manufacturers don't give idiots that freedom.
This is why I hate most about people obsessed with Elon. They can’t have discussions. It’s all weird illogical wants over Elon.
No. When cruise control first came out. It’d drive you right into another car. Auto pilot is just a fancy cruise control.
You can take a normal car and drive it into a wall. Tesla is no different. Using your logic a normal car shouldn’t be able to do that.
When did I refer to Musk? You must be sensitive.
Yes, when cruise control came out over 100 years ago, there were very little controls. Responsible car makers have changes that. Some even recently aimed for zero fatalities for people using their cars and the associated technologies.
And there are many cars that keep you from driving into a wall. Maybe, at this point, you can't keep 100 percent of the idiots from doing something stupid, but responsible car makers do much, much better than Tesla, who actually promotes and markets the actions of idiots abusing the systems in their cars.
The responsible car makers showing drivers performing stunts well beyond the ability or legality of most drivers?
You've got some kind of chip on your shoulder man. It's a car company, who cares.
No they haven’t. I have take by brand new Audi and drive it straight into a well.
They assist people in driving. You are still driving the car.
Incorrect. Auto pilot is less likely to be in an accident.
https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-autopilot-eight-times-less-likely-accident/amp/
You think giving me Tesla marketing BS, published by a proxy Tesla marketing rag, is going to convince me? If it is anything else like Tesla's marketing department, they just pulled something out of their ass, Musk saw the numbers and told them to fudge it some more, and then they put it up on their website dressed in fancy graphs and tech-speak. That's why you'll never find any actual data that third-party researchers can verify it with.
You have this article that looked at a four-month period. During that time, Tesla was responsible for every 10 of 11 deaths related to automated driving features. This report states that Tesla has the most accidents of any brand.
Tesla's create horrible driving habits in their customers. On the one hand, you have the CEO that creates a culture to disregard for safety and rules, praising users that openly go against the terms of use, as long as they show it doing something cool. On the other hand, you have a system that is just good enough to lull you into a sense of safety and confidence in the system itself. Then one day it decides to kill a motorcyclist, a kid getting off the bus, or a paramedic working on the side of the road. The driver that maybe praised Tesla to their friends and colleagues about how amazing it was is now dumbstruck because the car acted so unexpectedly.
Tesla is just as much as fault as the driver for that situation.
So why do you think Tesla's crash at a higher rate? I think it's a combination of instant acceleration, poor sensor-suite (like the lack of radar), and Tesla giving idiots free-reign to abuse the system as they please.
Maybe because it has nothing to do with Tesla. It’s a EV thing. Tesla just makes more EV than anyone else. It’s interesting to note when people switch to gas, they have more accidents.
The acceleration is a valid reason. Since Tesla has good controls to compensate for it. People don’t get how quickly they can get to an insane soeed
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/01/18/business/why-do-people-keep-crashing-teslas
They use the term "rate," which would account for absolute numbers. So just because Tesla sells more EVs wouldn't account for it.
It’s why Tesla is in the news. The same stats run similar for other EV but nobody cares.
The article explains it’s switch from gas to ev and ev to gas and not as much about Tesla
Where are you getting that number? The report just said Tesla had the highest accident rate of all brands.
Dude, I was literally in another thread where someone posted a video talking about how many deaths FSD caused (17) and extrapolating those numbers by how many FSD miles were driven lead to fsd being 11x more dangerous than a humans driver.
It had all sorts of upvotes.
Except, those accidents were on AP which has multiple billions of miles driven, not FSD. The NHSTA has only said there was 1 fsd related death. Related, as in, not confirmed to be the cause of.
They don't even know what they're mad about. And i get downvoted for showing the major flaw in their post.
I bet they've never used, or had to acknowledge the warnings prior to using AP. Let alone the even more dire warning FSD gives (or gave prior to v12 anyway, not sure what today's warnings are)
Here, you will see ford is under investigation for its system
https://techcrunch.com/2024/04/29/ford-bluecruise-investigation-nhtsa-fatal-crashes/#:~:text=Federal%20safety%20regulators%20have%20opened%20an%20into%20Ford%E2%80%99s,has%20confirmed%20BlueCruise%20was%20active%20in%20both%20crashes.
People confuse auto pilot with full self driving. They are very different. AP is just assisted cruise control. I’ve had very few issues with it. Compared to my Audi, I love the Tesla AP.
Fsd is another beast. I have not tried 12 yet