Britain left of centre ? . . . these are blairites, "labour" in name only , they literally propped up the second homes buy to let market through the 2000s. and they'd gladly privatise every public service we have left if they can.
I've already heard shit like "individualised healthcare" being mentioned in their "think tanks".
They're probably not worse than the tories, and they probably will fuck it up less, that's about all you can hope for them.
They aren't going to tackle anything fundamental like bank regulation, promoting domestic investment, industrial strategy or developing public services.
I hope France gets a lot better.
100% agreed. Weirdly, Starmer was very left-leaning during his time as a prosecutor, and a lot of people assumed that he'd be a rising force of the left when he moved into politics. Sadly, he seems closer to the right than even Blair did...
to be determined in my opinion. he's been in office two days atm.
give him a chance
My opinion is pretty much based on their manifesto.
I don't see how they can do anything progressive when their mandate is based on that bag of shite.
It's a a democracy, representatives aren't supposed to impose what they want onto the people. They're supposed to represent what the people want. It's likely Starmer is still more left leaning than the consensus of the public. But his job isn't to impose his will on the people but to do what the people want.
And according the abysmal turnout and the fact that starmer's labour couldn't even really outcompete Corbyn's in the popular vote despite the collapse of the Tories, the people naturally want a watered down version of the Tory austerity platform and enlightened centrism?
If there's one thing the UK election will show you, the people want someone to fucking do something about their cost of living problems, not play middle of the road and keep the status quo. They go to the far right because of that.
Politics is about compromise to be a best fit to the will of the people. Starmer is a better fit to the overall will of the people in the UK. Corbyn might have been a better fit to what the left wanted, but are you really claiming he was closer to the overall will of all of the people of the UK than Starmer is?
Democracy is about following the will of the people, not imposing your will upon the people.
Considering he got 40 percent in one of his elections and Starmer didn't even get 35 percent in this one, yeah I guess I am.
At least I have a metric I'm pointing to when I'm saying what the consensus is, instead of generally pulling it out of my ass.
Fuck the metrics, Starmer is PM and Corbyn is just an independent nobody that will effect zero positive change.
But talking big and doing nothing is what socialism is all about these days, isn't it?
Ah yes, let's thank Starmer for his electoral coup of getting Farage to collapse the Tories while being unable to increase labour's vote share. He's a real dooer.
Starmer is PM and Corbyn lost to Boris Johnson. Can't change the facts no matter how much it hurts.
They’re supposed to represent what the people want
They are supposed to listen to their constituents and do whats best for them.
Sometimes that means not giving them what they want, cause the average person is a fucking moron.. and half of them are dumber than that.
Great example would be Brexit.
But who's really the moron here? People that don't like people that call them morons, or socialists who say they're for the working class, need the support of the working class for their movement to succeed, but publicly call the people they need support from "fucking morons"?
Trump also says similar things about people whose support he needs BTW.
Yes yes the "b-b-both sides!" false equivalency again. Thats totally not tried and tired.
You sound basically the same, but if you're wrapping yourself in the red flags of failure while Trump is wrapping himself in the American flag, why would you think someone would even bother to hear you out?
You can't win over the working class because modern socialism doesn't care about being appealing to the working class. It's entirely focused on being holier than thou towards liberals which accomplishes less than nothing. Net negative effect on society in real terms.
Thats nice, Dear.
Thanks, sweetie.
Yeah, by European standards, I don't think New Labour are even just Center-Right: they have far too much love for "businesses", privatisation and deregulation to be an inch left of the traditional Right - in many ways they're pretty much were the Tories were back in Thatcher's day.
Britain left of centre ? . . . these are blairites, "labour" in name only , they literally propped up the second homes buy to let market through the 2000s. and they'd gladly privatise every public service we have left if they can. I've already heard shit like "individualised healthcare" being mentioned in their "think tanks".
They're probably not worse than the tories, and they probably will fuck it up less, that's about all you can hope for them.
They aren't going to tackle anything fundamental like bank regulation, promoting domestic investment, industrial strategy or developing public services.
I hope France gets a lot better.
100% agreed. Weirdly, Starmer was very left-leaning during his time as a prosecutor, and a lot of people assumed that he'd be a rising force of the left when he moved into politics. Sadly, he seems closer to the right than even Blair did...
to be determined in my opinion. he's been in office two days atm.
give him a chance
My opinion is pretty much based on their manifesto. I don't see how they can do anything progressive when their mandate is based on that bag of shite.
It's a a democracy, representatives aren't supposed to impose what they want onto the people. They're supposed to represent what the people want. It's likely Starmer is still more left leaning than the consensus of the public. But his job isn't to impose his will on the people but to do what the people want.
And according the abysmal turnout and the fact that starmer's labour couldn't even really outcompete Corbyn's in the popular vote despite the collapse of the Tories, the people naturally want a watered down version of the Tory austerity platform and enlightened centrism?
If there's one thing the UK election will show you, the people want someone to fucking do something about their cost of living problems, not play middle of the road and keep the status quo. They go to the far right because of that.
Politics is about compromise to be a best fit to the will of the people. Starmer is a better fit to the overall will of the people in the UK. Corbyn might have been a better fit to what the left wanted, but are you really claiming he was closer to the overall will of all of the people of the UK than Starmer is?
Democracy is about following the will of the people, not imposing your will upon the people.
Considering he got 40 percent in one of his elections and Starmer didn't even get 35 percent in this one, yeah I guess I am.
At least I have a metric I'm pointing to when I'm saying what the consensus is, instead of generally pulling it out of my ass.
Fuck the metrics, Starmer is PM and Corbyn is just an independent nobody that will effect zero positive change.
But talking big and doing nothing is what socialism is all about these days, isn't it?
Ah yes, let's thank Starmer for his electoral coup of getting Farage to collapse the Tories while being unable to increase labour's vote share. He's a real dooer.
Starmer is PM and Corbyn lost to Boris Johnson. Can't change the facts no matter how much it hurts.
They are supposed to listen to their constituents and do whats best for them.
Sometimes that means not giving them what they want, cause the average person is a fucking moron.. and half of them are dumber than that.
Great example would be Brexit.
But who's really the moron here? People that don't like people that call them morons, or socialists who say they're for the working class, need the support of the working class for their movement to succeed, but publicly call the people they need support from "fucking morons"?
Trump also says similar things about people whose support he needs BTW.
Yes yes the "b-b-both sides!" false equivalency again. Thats totally not tried and tired.
You sound basically the same, but if you're wrapping yourself in the red flags of failure while Trump is wrapping himself in the American flag, why would you think someone would even bother to hear you out?
You can't win over the working class because modern socialism doesn't care about being appealing to the working class. It's entirely focused on being holier than thou towards liberals which accomplishes less than nothing. Net negative effect on society in real terms.
Thats nice, Dear.
Thanks, sweetie.
Yeah, by European standards, I don't think New Labour are even just Center-Right: they have far too much love for "businesses", privatisation and deregulation to be an inch left of the traditional Right - in many ways they're pretty much were the Tories were back in Thatcher's day.