Key mediator Egypt expresses skepticism about the Gaza cease-fire proposal as more details emerge

girlfreddy@lemmy.ca to World News@lemmy.world – 111 points – Key mediator Egypt expresses skepticism about the Gaza cease-fire proposal as more details emerge
apnews.com

Key mediator Egypt expressed skepticism Wednesday about the proposal meant to bridge gaps in cease-fire talks between Israel and Hamas as more details emerged a day before negotiations were expected to resume in Cairo.

Diplomatic efforts have redoubled as fears grow of a wider regional war after the recent targeted killings of leaders of the militant Hamas and Hezbollah groups, both blamed on Israel, and threats of retaliation.

“The Americans are offering promises, not guarantees,” the official said. “Hamas won’t accept this, because it virtually means Hamas will release the civilian hostages in return for a six-week pause of fighting with no guarantees for a negotiated permanent cease-fire.”

He also said the proposal doesn’t clearly say Israel will withdraw its forces from two strategic corridors in Gaza, the Philadelphi corridor alongside Gaza’s border with Egypt and the Netzarim east-west corridor across the territory. Israel offers to downsize its forces in the Philadelphi corridor, with “promises” to withdraw from the area, he said.

18

I hate how they always say that it won't benefit hamas rather than saying a 6 weeks deal mean that more civilians will die firectly and from famine after

Most of the news of the rest of the world agrees that this war only takes this long because Netanyahou wants it to. Not israel but Netanyahou. When this war stops, so does his career

He does not have any interest in stopping it before he starts a new war with someone else

Two-thirds of Israelis want the war in Gaza to continue. Netanyahu may be unpopular but the genocide isn’t

I would much rather read something by people who dont live in Israel or are directly involved.

So you wont take Israelis own words for their support of genocide but you’ll listen to someone else?

Yes. I believe that the truth is a lot more visible when you take a step back and see the situation from a distance. The situation can and should be stopped a lot faster but there is no motivation

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has an “incentive to perpetuate this as long as possible”, Omar Rahman, a fellow at the Middle East Council on Global Affairs

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/7/4/what-does-israels-want-gaza

And Netanyahu faces anger from some quarters at home. The Hostage and Missing Families Forum, a powerful voice in Israel, has for months repeatedly called on Israel and Hamas to finalize a hostage-and-ceasefire deal.

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/08/15/middleeast/gaza-death-toll-40000-israel-war-intl/index.html

I think its difficult to be objective when you are right in the middle of it all

No one is asking the Israelis to be “objective,” we’re asking them if they support genocide and they overwhelmingly respond “yes”

But they also want the war to finish one way or the other. Netanyahou does not want it to finish.

So what's the excuse if/when he's replaced and next pm does exactly the same?

I have to say that this is the most color I've seen in months on the actual reasons why. On first read, it gives an understanding that both sides are willing to approach a deal - but lack trust in the process and the mediators ability to coerce the other side to actually commit and follow through.

A more cynical read (my second one) through this is that Hamas is still viewing civilian hostages as an asset and leverage. They are hesitant to get a six week ceasefire because they think they should get more than that for civilian hostages. Recent reports are making it clear that Hamas is executing the hostages. Whether as part of their negotiations, a breakdown in discipline, or just simple evil - the mediators have failed to impress upon Hamas the depth of their strategic mistake.

On first read, it gives an understanding that both sides are willing to approach a deal - but lack trust in the process and the mediators ability to coerce the other side to actually commit and follow through.

I don't think this is a bad reading of the article in vacuum, but I don't think it's a fair reading of the situation because AP intentionally or unintentionally has left quite a bit out. Hamas agreed to a US-backed ceasefire back in May that Israel refused. There was plenty of trust on both sides that they'd get what was in the deal, but Israel didn't want that particular deal at that particular time.

What's happening now is Hamas wants Israel to remove their troops and generally stop killing Palestinians, in addition to the other parts of the deal. Israel refuses to put this in writing, saying they'll stop killing people for now, but they're going to leave troops behind to occupy the area - but eventually they'll remove those troops. You're right that Hamas doesn't trust Israel's going to remove those troops, and I think that's entirely reasonable given how the "bridging proposal" is a variation of May's proposal, but striking out things like withdrawing troops. Seems like if that's those are the major changes they're making to the written proposal, they probably don't plan on following through.

But it's also entirely unreasonable for Israel to strike that in the first place. The Palestinians don't want Israel to be an occupying force. There's nothing they can do about the civilians continuing to settle and take their land, but at the very least they're asking for the additional soldiers that have invaded the land in the last year to get out while they're not actively killing Palestinians.

On top of that, Israel's occupation of the Philadelphi Corridor and Rafah crossing is in violation of the Camp David agreements with Egypt. It's really difficult to trust you can make a deal with somebody who's currently not following the agreement they have with your mediator.

This is a helpful article that explains the original deal in more detail than most people want to know: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/6/text-of-the-ceasefire-proposal-approved-by-hamas

Do you have a copy of the bridging proposal? I haven't seen any actual text.

I don't think they've released the text nor a comprehensive list of what it includes. They've only alluded to a few things, like the occupation.

This AP article says as much when it says, "Blinken, who is back in the region this week, said Monday that Israel had agreed to the proposal without saying what it entails." https://www.ap.org/news-highlights/spotlights/2024/why-is-israel-demanding-control-over-2-gaza-corridors-in-the-cease-fire-talks/

Al-Jazeera and similar have all said some variation of that as far as I've seen.

Israel doesn't want a deal where Hamas is allowed to return to the previous situation with daily rocket attacks and the eventual field trip. Hamas doesn't want a deal where they're unable to return to that situation.

Apparently Egyptian negotiators 'reworded' the deal Israel agreed to before to make it acceptable for Hamas. But because of the above, both parties won't ever agree.

3 more...
3 more...

recent reports are making it clear that Hamas is executing the hostages

Possible, but there werent all that many to start with and many are still alive. If they start killing them they will run out pretty quick. With the vast majority of structures leveled think how hard it would be to keep hostages alive, and think about whether Israel has been acting to get them back or keep them safe.

6 more...