Between the Democrats and Republicans? The GOP that wanted to brutalize Pelosi on the steps of the capital? The GOP that laughed when a man with a hammer nearly murdered her husband with a hammer? The GOP that wants to roll back all civil rights to a time before the revolution? The GOP that wants to install a fascist dictatorship?
Or do you mean the center of where the American public stands?
The center of what Americans want is a hell of a lot more progressive than you, Nancy.
The GOP that wanted to brutalize Pelosi on the steps of the capital? The GOP that laughed when a man with a hammer nearly murdered her husband with a hammer? The GOP that wants to roll back all civil rights to a time before the revolution? The GOP that wants to install a fascist dictatorship?
You are ascribing the actions of individuals to the entire group. Not every GOP person is a MAGA person and not every MAGA person would resort to violence like some on January 6th. Please allow for some nuance.
There is no nuance anymore. If you're actively supporting the GOP at this point, you ARE MAGA, and if you support MAGA, you're okay with fascism.
There is no nuance if you yourself do not provide it.
The nuance was lost the minute they tried to overthrow the capital.
All of them did it? We wouldn't still be standing without McConnell and Pence. As terrible as their policies are they still stood up for the system.
All of them are complicit, yes. It's not that hard to understand. Go ahead and keep apologizing for them.
I'm not apologizing for anyone. I'm just saying they are not all one person and some of them do the right thing sometimes.
Google felony murder and learn to read. Yea they are all complicit
Google hyperpartisan sycophant and look in the mirror. You are also complicit.
McConnell stood up to that part of the system but still enabled the SC we have today.
Yes, he did, but that was within the bounds of the law. This person cannot honestly claim that the entire GOP tried to overthrow the government.
The vast majority of the GOP did virtually nothing to stop the steal, and eventually supported MAGA. You are giving them way too much credit.
Just keeping the discussion honest is all.
Then waayy down here he pretends he's just keeping the discussion honest.
Bad faith thy definition is this guy
Sorry, no. I never both sidesed anything, I just said the other person is telling lies and somehow I'm the problem.
And yet you're not..is that what you think this both sides bullshit is???? "Keeping the discussion honest"???
Bahahahaha
I'm sure not telling lies just to win internet points like some of y'all
We wouldn't be having this conversation if McConnell hadn't protected trump every step of the way. He made a heat of the moment call on J6 that you're praising him for, but his behavior after the fact tells me he regrets his decision.
Any credibility McConnell gained on J6, he last 10 fold on February 13th.
The rest of the GOP came out in strong condemnation of those attacks, right? No equivocating, or pretending they were Democrats, or saying they weren't violent?
Edit: and the Republicans in the Senate voted to remove Trump from office after the House sent them articles of impeachment, right?
Again, what did Pence and McConnell do when given the choice to overthrow the republic? I'm not a MAGA or GOP person by any means, nor am I a Democrat, I'm just trying to point out that things are not as black and white as you bullies want to paint them.
The rest of the GOP literally wanted to hang both of them. McConnell didn't vote to convict on impeachment while equivocating about Trump begin "practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day". These people are cowards, at best.
Sure, they're cowards, but did they overthrow the government?
My only point is that you need to treat people as individuals and not put everyone who has ever voted for the GOP in the MAGA camp. There are Republicans who had just enough backbone on January 6th and there are republicans who do not support Trump today. Believe it or not, there are even republicans who support abortion or believe in gay marriage or support sane gun control measures. Everyone everywhere is an individual.
It's important to allow people to evolve if they so choose.
Buddy, did any of those individuals in power that you are defending vote to remove Trump when he was impeached for running an insurrection? They didn't and that is the cover they are providing as their brownshirts terrorize the people.
I can't speak for them. However, if they simply wanted to terrorize people they could have just overthrown the government.
On one hand you’re moving goal posts to make them seem good. The bar is not literally overthrowing the government…great… on the other everyone’s tolerance for these folks in the party is just as bad as the bad actors because it enables and emboldens them. This is quite literally how the Nazi’s got into power. Because of people like you.
No, they are not good, I'm just saying they're not all the same and they didn't all commit that particular crime.
And what about now? Are all of those same people denying what happened on Jan 6? How long do they get credit for again literally not overthrowing the government and the will of the people when they blocked any accountability for the perpetrators, continue to support the big lie that caused it all, and don’t seem to have the same fortitude if it were to happen in the future?
Some people within that party do not support what happened and others do not support Trump
What evolution have Pence and McConnell done since then?
McConnell has taken up the game "Red Light, Green Light"...I hear he's very good!
Not sure, my only point is that we will not allow anyone in the party to do so if we claim them to be a monolith. There is in fact a divergence of opinions within the party on multiple topics.
To answer my own question, Pence and McConnell have done fuck all. If they want respect, they can disown the party. Especially since Trump spent the last 6 months replacing the people in charge of the GOP machinery with his loyal sycophants.
MAGA is the GOP. Neither Pence nor McConnell have a political future either way.
Not every GOP person is a MAGA person and not every MAGA person would resort to violence like some on January 6th.
And those that don't are silent on the face of it (implicitly condoning the behavior) or are shouted down and pushed out of the party. Don't pretend like the political machine and the voting base don't support this behavior when they keep putting these people back in office.
Don't forget, the GOP was against J6 until they saw the base was for it. Then even the people who could have been in danger said it was ok. So they absolutely support this shit even if they say they don't.
Please allow for some nuance.
In this case, nuance is the excuse used to paper over the support these people have from within the party. Come back when the party machinery and base feel that way, because the individual's "beliefs" are meaningless due to being a nebulous concept that isn't supported by their actions.
Remember, if 10 people are sitting at a table and a Nazi is allowed to sit down, you've got 11 Nazis. And until we see evidence of these beliefs actually being held by a sizable amount of them, I'm not going to pretend it exists outside of their fringe.
What center?
Between the Democrats and Republicans? The GOP that wanted to brutalize Pelosi on the steps of the capital? The GOP that laughed when a man with a hammer nearly murdered her husband with a hammer? The GOP that wants to roll back all civil rights to a time before the revolution? The GOP that wants to install a fascist dictatorship?
Or do you mean the center of where the American public stands?
The center of what Americans want is a hell of a lot more progressive than you, Nancy.
You are ascribing the actions of individuals to the entire group. Not every GOP person is a MAGA person and not every MAGA person would resort to violence like some on January 6th. Please allow for some nuance.
There is no nuance anymore. If you're actively supporting the GOP at this point, you ARE MAGA, and if you support MAGA, you're okay with fascism.
There is no nuance if you yourself do not provide it.
The nuance was lost the minute they tried to overthrow the capital.
All of them did it? We wouldn't still be standing without McConnell and Pence. As terrible as their policies are they still stood up for the system.
All of them are complicit, yes. It's not that hard to understand. Go ahead and keep apologizing for them.
I'm not apologizing for anyone. I'm just saying they are not all one person and some of them do the right thing sometimes.
Google felony murder and learn to read. Yea they are all complicit
Google hyperpartisan sycophant and look in the mirror. You are also complicit.
McConnell stood up to that part of the system but still enabled the SC we have today.
Yes, he did, but that was within the bounds of the law. This person cannot honestly claim that the entire GOP tried to overthrow the government.
The vast majority of the GOP did virtually nothing to stop the steal, and eventually supported MAGA. You are giving them way too much credit.
Just keeping the discussion honest is all.
Then waayy down here he pretends he's just keeping the discussion honest.
Bad faith thy definition is this guy
Sorry, no. I never both sidesed anything, I just said the other person is telling lies and somehow I'm the problem.
And yet you're not..is that what you think this both sides bullshit is???? "Keeping the discussion honest"???
Bahahahaha
I'm sure not telling lies just to win internet points like some of y'all
We wouldn't be having this conversation if McConnell hadn't protected trump every step of the way. He made a heat of the moment call on J6 that you're praising him for, but his behavior after the fact tells me he regrets his decision.
Any credibility McConnell gained on J6, he last 10 fold on February 13th.
The rest of the GOP came out in strong condemnation of those attacks, right? No equivocating, or pretending they were Democrats, or saying they weren't violent?
Edit: and the Republicans in the Senate voted to remove Trump from office after the House sent them articles of impeachment, right?
Again, what did Pence and McConnell do when given the choice to overthrow the republic? I'm not a MAGA or GOP person by any means, nor am I a Democrat, I'm just trying to point out that things are not as black and white as you bullies want to paint them.
The rest of the GOP literally wanted to hang both of them. McConnell didn't vote to convict on impeachment while equivocating about Trump begin "practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day". These people are cowards, at best.
Sure, they're cowards, but did they overthrow the government?
My only point is that you need to treat people as individuals and not put everyone who has ever voted for the GOP in the MAGA camp. There are Republicans who had just enough backbone on January 6th and there are republicans who do not support Trump today. Believe it or not, there are even republicans who support abortion or believe in gay marriage or support sane gun control measures. Everyone everywhere is an individual.
It's important to allow people to evolve if they so choose.
Buddy, did any of those individuals in power that you are defending vote to remove Trump when he was impeached for running an insurrection? They didn't and that is the cover they are providing as their brownshirts terrorize the people.
I can't speak for them. However, if they simply wanted to terrorize people they could have just overthrown the government.
On one hand you’re moving goal posts to make them seem good. The bar is not literally overthrowing the government…great… on the other everyone’s tolerance for these folks in the party is just as bad as the bad actors because it enables and emboldens them. This is quite literally how the Nazi’s got into power. Because of people like you.
No, they are not good, I'm just saying they're not all the same and they didn't all commit that particular crime.
And what about now? Are all of those same people denying what happened on Jan 6? How long do they get credit for again literally not overthrowing the government and the will of the people when they blocked any accountability for the perpetrators, continue to support the big lie that caused it all, and don’t seem to have the same fortitude if it were to happen in the future?
Some people within that party do not support what happened and others do not support Trump
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Republicans_who_oppose_the_Donald_Trump_2024_presidential_campaign
Some..lol.
What evolution have Pence and McConnell done since then?
McConnell has taken up the game "Red Light, Green Light"...I hear he's very good!
Not sure, my only point is that we will not allow anyone in the party to do so if we claim them to be a monolith. There is in fact a divergence of opinions within the party on multiple topics.
To answer my own question, Pence and McConnell have done fuck all. If they want respect, they can disown the party. Especially since Trump spent the last 6 months replacing the people in charge of the GOP machinery with his loyal sycophants.
MAGA is the GOP. Neither Pence nor McConnell have a political future either way.
And those that don't are silent on the face of it (implicitly condoning the behavior) or are shouted down and pushed out of the party. Don't pretend like the political machine and the voting base don't support this behavior when they keep putting these people back in office.
Don't forget, the GOP was against J6 until they saw the base was for it. Then even the people who could have been in danger said it was ok. So they absolutely support this shit even if they say they don't.
In this case, nuance is the excuse used to paper over the support these people have from within the party. Come back when the party machinery and base feel that way, because the individual's "beliefs" are meaningless due to being a nebulous concept that isn't supported by their actions.
Remember, if 10 people are sitting at a table and a Nazi is allowed to sit down, you've got 11 Nazis. And until we see evidence of these beliefs actually being held by a sizable amount of them, I'm not going to pretend it exists outside of their fringe.
He starts the both sides here...