If you're a single issue voter and still voting for the worst of those two options you're a baffoon.
Will not support this. Do better next time. No, there is no argument that can justify support for those who fund it.
OK, so you think Trump will bring peace to Isreal. Got it.
You have to vote for Joe Biden because he also won't bring peace to Israel
No.
So what message do you think your actually sending?
That I will never, ever support a pro-genocide candidate.
Ever.
So you're not voting? Or are you for some hack grifter like West?
I'll be voting in a way that most clearly sends the message to the Democrats why they lost my vote, which is voting Uncommitted for the presidential.
I am lucky enough to have a progressive running as a state rep to unseat a Republican so I'll be turning out for their sake mainly.
I'm sure the Democrats will consider your message carefully as Trump starts bombing those brown kids.
Parties cater to voters, not to non-voters. If the voters chose Trump, they will move towards his policies, including on Israel. You will achieve the opposite of what you want.
But I'm sure the Palestinians will appreciate the hollow gesture.
I can understand your principles, but the world, and specifically the US election system, doesn't give a shit about them. Not voting always results in the party you dislike most gaining an advantage. That is the net result of your actions.
Hold your nose if you must, but Palestinians can't afford a Republican president. Biden, for all his many faults, at least pushes for a peace.
Iβm sure the Democrats will consider your message carefully as Trump starts bombing those brown kids.
Biden is already supplying all the bombs and bullets Israel needs, there's nothing worse Trump can do in this regard. US bombs are already killing Gazans and the Biden admin has shown no serious attempts at ending the genocide, the question is what kind of future conditions can be created within the Demicratic party to deter them from continuing to field pro-genocide candidates.
Unfortunately neoliberals have guarunteed this problem has no quick fix.
Parties cater to voters, not to non-voters.
Which is why you're all so keen to suppress and deny the uncommitted vote, and instead continually try to reframe it as if people are simply staying home.
I vote reliably. Just never for genocide supporters. I'll submit a blank ballot if necessary to avoid that.
I can understand your principle
This is clearly a lie. You neither have principles nor understand their purpose. If someone is flexible on genocide support they're flexible on literally anything.
It's only a matter of time before you're operating in a frame where your practical policy positions are as extreme right as MAGA is in now and they've moved on to some other even more unimaginable extreme. It's already happening with immigration; Biden's anti-asylum schtick is literally indistinguishable from what Trump attempted during his term and was denied bybthe courts as illegal.
Hold your nose if you must, but Palestinians canβt afford a Republican president. Biden, for all his many faults, at least pushes for a peace.
No. He doesn't. 50,000 starving children and 30,000 dead Gazans killed with US supplied weapons stand as testament to that. The only way the decades long genocide of Palestinians ends is if the Democratic party is coerced by their constituents into ending their support of it. Genocide needs to be a non-starter within the democratic ranks before anyone can pretend to be discussing real solutions to what the far right Israeli regime is doing.
I will be voting uncommitted for president. There isn't much Biden can do about that at this point, he lost his window to prove he cares about peace or even sees Palestians as human beings. Only slim chance is reform of the future DNC to try and prompt them to stop moving to the right, they're not equipped the face Israel right now.
There's nothing worse Trump can do??? With all due respect, but that sounds horribly naive. I fear you do not understand the real-world consequences of your non-vote here. Trump will come to power, and he'll give Israel carte-blanche in Gaza, and possibly even provide direct military support (e.g. US soldiers on the ground or US airstrikes to provide support). The casualties will start racking up much faster than they do now. A Trump presidency allows Israel to go full mask-off.
In a two-party system, not voting isn't an option. You risk giving power to the most pro-genocide candidate here. It sucks massive balls but it is the reality of the US electoral system. Your principles make a full-on genocide more likely to happen.
There's a peace plan brokered by Biden that's been accepted by Israel and that Hamas appears to be receptive to. It would end the genocide happening immediately. Trump is unlikely to make such efforts.
Your non-vote will further the genocide. That's reality. I hope your principles can cope with that.
Trump will come to power, and heβll give Israel carte-blanche in Gaza
They have cart-blanche right now under Biden. Him mumbling vaguely about a red line means nothing.
They're already using US bombs, what do the Gazans care if it falls out of an American plane to? Maybe if we write on the side "This is a Republican-sent bomb" that'll absolve Democrats, huh?
Israel has refused every ceasefire proposal that has come up because they think anything but the destructions of Hamas (and impossibility without killing everyone in Gaza) is the only way they save face.
The logistics of how Trump continuee enabling Israel don't really interest me. If Biden wants to prove he's resisting the genocide he needs to materially prove it with sanctions and aid withdrawl. Wringing his hands isn't cutting it.
If you think Israel has carte-blanche under Biden, then you're in for a rude awakening. Netanyahu is openly courting Republicans, because Biden doesn't allow him to do everything he'd like to do. Military operations in Rafah remain limited, because of Biden's pressure. Aid keeps trickling in because Biden set up the logistics to do so.
No, it's not perfect. And he isn't doing what you'd like him to do. But he does prevent worse, and Trump will do (and has promised to do) so much worse.
So you instead choose even more of that with Donald. Or you are saying the Muslim bans and "finish the job" won't lead to ramping up the attacks? The Christian nationalist heading Congress isn't looking to start the apocalypse and rapture? Lindsey Graham isn't saying Israel should nuke Gaza and that the US did nothing wrong in Hiroshima?
Maybe that will be enough to shock neoliberals awake as to the reality of what they'redealing with, maybe not, but it's the only shot we've got. We can't afford any more lesser evil, we've reached rock bottom with this genocide.
We're not just backsliding slowly, we're at the bottom of the hill.
Ah there it is, if itβs not βBoth Sidesβ, βor voting doesnβt matterβ, itβs βwe need to burn it all downβ.
What a ridiculously stupid take. Youβre absolutely privileged if you can even think that is a viable option.
Fuck off with that bullshit.
Shocking neoliberals awake will do fuckall when they are living under a dictatorship that a (I know you're confused by this concept) Repub-appointed SCOTUS is considering granting a Long Knife to.
There will be more genocide and more war. There will be nothing at all anyone can do since the "let's get the National Guard in" and "deport these protesters to Gaza" guys will be in charge.
We are literally in a comment section discussing the Repub candidate wanting to execute people over whatever slights. Please get a clue. No, it is not as bad as it could be.
They might finally actually admit it's a dictatorship and start behaving accordingly.
But yeah, they could cling to their denial. That's already happening right now though. The shock still has a better chance than the slow boil though, slim a chance as it is neoliberals will ever wake up.
That's so delusional. "Sure, it will become a full Christofascist theocracy, but people might become aware of that, so it is better." You have childish hot takes on the matter.
How is it childish? What's more dangerous; a public that sliwly acclimates to fascism or one that is shocked into action at its immediacy?
All you have to offer is more slow decline. That's the opposite of what I want. This conversation kind of demonstrates why the only hail-mary left is shocking you guys back to reality. It's literally the only option you've left anti-fascists.
You made your position clear that you want a fast decline and permanent Christofascist theocracy. Then what are you going to do? Let's assume the neolibs are woken up. They are not going to be La Resistance, they are going to be Good Germans.
It's galling that you're talking about shocking other people back to reality. It will be harder to push left under the dictatorship, especially after they start executing leftists.
"You guys say every election is the end of days," again, we are literally in the comments section discussing the Repub candidate who has been expressing his desire to do political executions.
What do you think Trump will do differently?
If you're a single issue voter and still voting for the worst of those two options you're a baffoon.
Will not support this. Do better next time. No, there is no argument that can justify support for those who fund it.
OK, so you think Trump will bring peace to Isreal. Got it.
You have to vote for Joe Biden because he also won't bring peace to Israel
No.
So what message do you think your actually sending?
That I will never, ever support a pro-genocide candidate.
Ever.
So you're not voting? Or are you for some hack grifter like West?
I'll be voting in a way that most clearly sends the message to the Democrats why they lost my vote, which is voting Uncommitted for the presidential.
I am lucky enough to have a progressive running as a state rep to unseat a Republican so I'll be turning out for their sake mainly.
I'm sure the Democrats will consider your message carefully as Trump starts bombing those brown kids.
Parties cater to voters, not to non-voters. If the voters chose Trump, they will move towards his policies, including on Israel. You will achieve the opposite of what you want.
But I'm sure the Palestinians will appreciate the hollow gesture.
I can understand your principles, but the world, and specifically the US election system, doesn't give a shit about them. Not voting always results in the party you dislike most gaining an advantage. That is the net result of your actions.
Hold your nose if you must, but Palestinians can't afford a Republican president. Biden, for all his many faults, at least pushes for a peace.
Biden is already supplying all the bombs and bullets Israel needs, there's nothing worse Trump can do in this regard. US bombs are already killing Gazans and the Biden admin has shown no serious attempts at ending the genocide, the question is what kind of future conditions can be created within the Demicratic party to deter them from continuing to field pro-genocide candidates.
Unfortunately neoliberals have guarunteed this problem has no quick fix.
Which is why you're all so keen to suppress and deny the uncommitted vote, and instead continually try to reframe it as if people are simply staying home.
I vote reliably. Just never for genocide supporters. I'll submit a blank ballot if necessary to avoid that.
This is clearly a lie. You neither have principles nor understand their purpose. If someone is flexible on genocide support they're flexible on literally anything.
It's only a matter of time before you're operating in a frame where your practical policy positions are as extreme right as MAGA is in now and they've moved on to some other even more unimaginable extreme. It's already happening with immigration; Biden's anti-asylum schtick is literally indistinguishable from what Trump attempted during his term and was denied bybthe courts as illegal.
No. He doesn't. 50,000 starving children and 30,000 dead Gazans killed with US supplied weapons stand as testament to that. The only way the decades long genocide of Palestinians ends is if the Democratic party is coerced by their constituents into ending their support of it. Genocide needs to be a non-starter within the democratic ranks before anyone can pretend to be discussing real solutions to what the far right Israeli regime is doing.
I will be voting uncommitted for president. There isn't much Biden can do about that at this point, he lost his window to prove he cares about peace or even sees Palestians as human beings. Only slim chance is reform of the future DNC to try and prompt them to stop moving to the right, they're not equipped the face Israel right now.
There's nothing worse Trump can do??? With all due respect, but that sounds horribly naive. I fear you do not understand the real-world consequences of your non-vote here. Trump will come to power, and he'll give Israel carte-blanche in Gaza, and possibly even provide direct military support (e.g. US soldiers on the ground or US airstrikes to provide support). The casualties will start racking up much faster than they do now. A Trump presidency allows Israel to go full mask-off.
In a two-party system, not voting isn't an option. You risk giving power to the most pro-genocide candidate here. It sucks massive balls but it is the reality of the US electoral system. Your principles make a full-on genocide more likely to happen.
There's a peace plan brokered by Biden that's been accepted by Israel and that Hamas appears to be receptive to. It would end the genocide happening immediately. Trump is unlikely to make such efforts.
Your non-vote will further the genocide. That's reality. I hope your principles can cope with that.
They have cart-blanche right now under Biden. Him mumbling vaguely about a red line means nothing.
They're already using US bombs, what do the Gazans care if it falls out of an American plane to? Maybe if we write on the side "This is a Republican-sent bomb" that'll absolve Democrats, huh?
Israel has refused every ceasefire proposal that has come up because they think anything but the destructions of Hamas (and impossibility without killing everyone in Gaza) is the only way they save face.
The logistics of how Trump continuee enabling Israel don't really interest me. If Biden wants to prove he's resisting the genocide he needs to materially prove it with sanctions and aid withdrawl. Wringing his hands isn't cutting it.
If you think Israel has carte-blanche under Biden, then you're in for a rude awakening. Netanyahu is openly courting Republicans, because Biden doesn't allow him to do everything he'd like to do. Military operations in Rafah remain limited, because of Biden's pressure. Aid keeps trickling in because Biden set up the logistics to do so.
No, it's not perfect. And he isn't doing what you'd like him to do. But he does prevent worse, and Trump will do (and has promised to do) so much worse.
Grow up.
So you instead choose even more of that with Donald. Or you are saying the Muslim bans and "finish the job" won't lead to ramping up the attacks? The Christian nationalist heading Congress isn't looking to start the apocalypse and rapture? Lindsey Graham isn't saying Israel should nuke Gaza and that the US did nothing wrong in Hiroshima?
Maybe that will be enough to shock neoliberals awake as to the reality of what they'redealing with, maybe not, but it's the only shot we've got. We can't afford any more lesser evil, we've reached rock bottom with this genocide.
We're not just backsliding slowly, we're at the bottom of the hill.
Ah there it is, if itβs not βBoth Sidesβ, βor voting doesnβt matterβ, itβs βwe need to burn it all downβ.
What a ridiculously stupid take. Youβre absolutely privileged if you can even think that is a viable option.
Fuck off with that bullshit.
Shocking neoliberals awake will do fuckall when they are living under a dictatorship that a (I know you're confused by this concept) Repub-appointed SCOTUS is considering granting a Long Knife to.
There will be more genocide and more war. There will be nothing at all anyone can do since the "let's get the National Guard in" and "deport these protesters to Gaza" guys will be in charge.
We are literally in a comment section discussing the Repub candidate wanting to execute people over whatever slights. Please get a clue. No, it is not as bad as it could be.
They might finally actually admit it's a dictatorship and start behaving accordingly.
But yeah, they could cling to their denial. That's already happening right now though. The shock still has a better chance than the slow boil though, slim a chance as it is neoliberals will ever wake up.
That's so delusional. "Sure, it will become a full Christofascist theocracy, but people might become aware of that, so it is better." You have childish hot takes on the matter.
How is it childish? What's more dangerous; a public that sliwly acclimates to fascism or one that is shocked into action at its immediacy?
All you have to offer is more slow decline. That's the opposite of what I want. This conversation kind of demonstrates why the only hail-mary left is shocking you guys back to reality. It's literally the only option you've left anti-fascists.
You made your position clear that you want a fast decline and permanent Christofascist theocracy. Then what are you going to do? Let's assume the neolibs are woken up. They are not going to be La Resistance, they are going to be Good Germans.
It's galling that you're talking about shocking other people back to reality. It will be harder to push left under the dictatorship, especially after they start executing leftists.
"You guys say every election is the end of days," again, we are literally in the comments section discussing the Repub candidate who has been expressing his desire to do political executions.