How do you declare war on a state you don’t recognize?
Ask "Drugs."
Also "Terror."
I had a scary dream last night but America didn’t invade Iraq over it.
Try having an oily dream, they'll be on you in a minute
Not yet.
Invade Crimea?
Not sure if you're trying to be clever? You can start a war against anyone or anything.
...take the War on Christmas, for example
You can attack anyone or anything but formal declarations of war are usually state actions.
I guess I’m partly being clever and pointing out that Israel is waving this word “war” around very generously right now, because they’re always dramatizing the direness of their situation, mainly for the American audience. But technically they shouldn’t be using this word unless they recognize the state of Palestine, which they have historically refused to do.
So, as usual, they’re trying to have it both ways.
I'm not sure I understand. Does war declaration being a state action require recognition the state of Palestine? Or can they declare war on "Hamas" or any other entity/group of people. Or do they even have to state who they are at war against? Can they just say "we are at war"?
I can't read the article (I just get an HTTP 403 "Forbidden", interesting) but Israel had previously talked about declaring war on Hamas itself.
This isnt a gotcha. Israel does not recognize the legitimacy of the Palestinian state, but they don't like, pretend it doesn't nominally exist. If Hamas considers themselves a legitimate government, they can be declared war against. They're not legitimate, but they still exist.
As an easy example in the US, everyone in the country doubted the legitimacy of the "Autonomous Zone" in Portland, and yet it very definitely was a thing.
It's a not-so-civil war, if you will
Show me a civil war and I’ll show you a friendly murder.
There’s only one point under discussion here: Israel is calling this a declaration of war after years of refusing to acknowledge Palestinian statehood.
That means they’re playing the optics for a western audience in a self serving, hypocritical way. And geez it might take me an entire bathroom sit to assemble a list of more.
Hamas doesn’t have a PR strategy for the west. They’re just attacking. It’s not right but at least it’s not theater.
Let the American audience understand when they are being played to.
Israel accepted the original plan to have an independent Palestinian state. Palestine rejected it and started the 1947 civil war in an attempt to exterminate the Jews living there.
The borders of the state of Palestine would be "based on the pre-1967 borders". The latest resolution, in November 2013, was passed 165 to 6, with 6 abstentions;[5] with Israel and the United States voting against.[6]
The Palestinian leadership has embraced the concept since the 1982 Arab Summit in Fez.[7] Israel views moves by Palestinian leaders to obtain international recognition of a State of Palestine as being unilateral action by the Palestinians and inconsistent with a negotiated two-state solution.
That means they’re playing the optics for a western audience in a self serving, hypocritical way. ... Hamas doesn’t have a PR strategy for the west. They’re just attacking. It’s not right but at least it’s not theater.
I'm less worried about the hypocrisy and theatrics, than I am about civilian deaths.
But you do you.
You should be, because the u.s. will use this theater to justify sending huge amounts of military aid to Israel to level Gaza. Fuck Hamas but the u.s. sending more weapons over isn't going to help this situation.
Gaza is something like 300km^2. Israel has more than enough to level it a thousand times over. They have hundreds of artillery pieces, hundreds of fighters, an entire navy, something like a thousand tanks, ...
Hell, given they likely have hundreds of nukes, they could level the entire middle-east and end global civilisation as we know it.
The US giving Israel more military aid now, is politics. Not much more.
How do you declare war on a state you don’t recognize?
Ask "Drugs."
Also "Terror."
I had a scary dream last night but America didn’t invade Iraq over it.
Try having an oily dream, they'll be on you in a minute
Not yet.
Invade Crimea?
Not sure if you're trying to be clever? You can start a war against anyone or anything.
...take the War on Christmas, for example
You can attack anyone or anything but formal declarations of war are usually state actions.
I guess I’m partly being clever and pointing out that Israel is waving this word “war” around very generously right now, because they’re always dramatizing the direness of their situation, mainly for the American audience. But technically they shouldn’t be using this word unless they recognize the state of Palestine, which they have historically refused to do.
So, as usual, they’re trying to have it both ways.
I'm not sure I understand. Does war declaration being a state action require recognition the state of Palestine? Or can they declare war on "Hamas" or any other entity/group of people. Or do they even have to state who they are at war against? Can they just say "we are at war"?
I can't read the article (I just get an HTTP 403 "Forbidden", interesting) but Israel had previously talked about declaring war on Hamas itself.
This isnt a gotcha. Israel does not recognize the legitimacy of the Palestinian state, but they don't like, pretend it doesn't nominally exist. If Hamas considers themselves a legitimate government, they can be declared war against. They're not legitimate, but they still exist.
As an easy example in the US, everyone in the country doubted the legitimacy of the "Autonomous Zone" in Portland, and yet it very definitely was a thing.
It's a not-so-civil war, if you will
Show me a civil war and I’ll show you a friendly murder.
Ask Hamas.
They didn’t issue a formal declaration of war.
Wikipedia:
Oh, I do apologize. You are correct. They didn't declare war. They declared jihad.
My mistake.
Bonus:
There’s only one point under discussion here: Israel is calling this a declaration of war after years of refusing to acknowledge Palestinian statehood.
That means they’re playing the optics for a western audience in a self serving, hypocritical way. And geez it might take me an entire bathroom sit to assemble a list of more.
Hamas doesn’t have a PR strategy for the west. They’re just attacking. It’s not right but at least it’s not theater.
Let the American audience understand when they are being played to.
Israel accepted the original plan to have an independent Palestinian state. Palestine rejected it and started the 1947 civil war in an attempt to exterminate the Jews living there.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-state_solution#:~:text=The%20two%2Dstate%20solution%20to,west%20of%20the%20Jordan%20River.
LOL downvoting a direct quote. That’s rich.
I'm less worried about the hypocrisy and theatrics, than I am about civilian deaths.
But you do you.
You should be, because the u.s. will use this theater to justify sending huge amounts of military aid to Israel to level Gaza. Fuck Hamas but the u.s. sending more weapons over isn't going to help this situation.
Gaza is something like 300km^2. Israel has more than enough to level it a thousand times over. They have hundreds of artillery pieces, hundreds of fighters, an entire navy, something like a thousand tanks, ...
Hell, given they likely have hundreds of nukes, they could level the entire middle-east and end global civilisation as we know it.
The US giving Israel more military aid now, is politics. Not much more.