Yosemite needs to issue rain checks for Half Dome permits. Theyâre so hard to get, people donât want to miss out on their Instagram moment. People will still make bad choices but at least you would know thatâs not a factor.
Climbing during a storm? What a dumbass. Would have died from something else eventually, like forgetting to breathe.
That seems pretty harsh. Also they weren't rock climbing, it's a 14 mile hike where only the last 400 ft involves scaling rock using two metal cables to hold onto, and the storm didn't roll in until they were making their descent. She was 20 years old. Very few people die doing this.
Hikes like half dome and angels' landing are super dangerous whether or not people die frequently on them. You're not stupid to do these hikes if you prepare for them, but even if you're prepared, there is still risk.
These hikes can get crowded even with the ticket system, and more and more people rush up these trails to get the shot for their Insta or whatever. Two-way crowds of impatient tourists on these narrow ledges and steep scrambles/climbs are a real issue and even a prepared hiker could get unlucky.
Not to mention other hazards like incliment weather like in this case. Half-dome is a unique weather risk during that final climb because it is just rock. Rock worn extra smooth and made dusty by hikers' boots. If it rains, that dust turns to silty mud and you now have nature's most majestic slip-n-slide.
The national parks make nature accessible, and because it's accessible, people underestimate it and don't respect it like they should.
I'm fairly fit, dabbled in bouldering, etc.
When I got to the cables part of angel's landing, saw the amount of people attempting to finish the hike and their relative fitness level, I noped the f out of there.
I'm not trusting my life with some rando that looks like they have no business doing what they are doing.
Experienced hiker and noob climber here. I did the exact same thing at Angel's Landing. The route would've been easy even without the aid. It's all the inexperienced people fucking around that made it very dangerous.
I left Zion and went to Moab.
Same here. The sheer 800ft. Drops on either sides of of the 2-4ft wide ridge with people coming both ways was a no from me.
Also even just on the way up the the first landing (the like 500sqft flat area where you can rest) with that 1.5ft wide ledge getting up to it and the rope with 300ft sheer drops- I had a frustrated dad wearing flip flops and a 2 year old kid in a baby backpack rushing by everyone while people were heading down too. Shit's wild.
I do agree that it sounds like they weren't trying to be up there during a storm, though.
they weren't trying to be up there during a storm, though.
A ranger told them there were storms in the forecast
Ranger literally told them a storm was forecast. I'm sure they didn't want to be up there during a storm. I mean who the hell does. But there's a whole lot of personal responsibility to be had here for their situation.
Experienced doesn't always mean sensible. Just means lucky enough to not have died until then đ«
Good thing her boots were new though!
.
They don't have any way to make up for it if there's a storm?
I've been in this situation before and no. Usually to get these tickets you got to be near a computer when they release as they go fast. So there isn't much alternative if they miss the time for any reason.
Usually to get these tickets you got to be near a computer when they release
Many controlled access routes don't use a lottery, instead are first come, first serve. I've hovered over the submit button many times.
But, that's not how it works in Yosemite. It's a true lottery. There's a window of time to submit. Then, selections are random.
"In 2010, the National Park Service took action to prevent overcrowding that was thought to lead to accidents, particularly in bad weather. It instituted a 300-person-per-day limit on the summit and required hikers to apply for daily permits through the lottery.
Unfortunately, it didnât work. A 2018 study by Wilderness & Environmental Medicine showed that after the permit system went into effect, the number of incidents per person doubled. The studyâs authors theorized that the difficulty in obtaining a permit made people more intent on reaching the summit with their one chance, despite the risks.
âI think itâs good to limit how many people are up there, because itâs obviously very dangerous,â said McGlynn, who despite heavy rain and hail climbed to the start of the cables with her mother to behold Half Dome from below. âBut they really do nothing to disincentivize people from doing the climb in bad weather.â
The park doesnât issue refunds or allow a Half Dome permit to be transferred to another day, she said, and they donât prioritize permit holders thwarted by storms in future lotteries."
The name was Grace Rohloff?
Really?
I don't get it
Grace "rolled off" the mountain đ„
thx
Rohloff sounds like "roll off", as in "roll off the side of the mountain"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uCop3Ug5OQ
Yosemite needs to issue rain checks for Half Dome permits. Theyâre so hard to get, people donât want to miss out on their Instagram moment. People will still make bad choices but at least you would know thatâs not a factor.
Climbing during a storm? What a dumbass. Would have died from something else eventually, like forgetting to breathe.
That seems pretty harsh. Also they weren't rock climbing, it's a 14 mile hike where only the last 400 ft involves scaling rock using two metal cables to hold onto, and the storm didn't roll in until they were making their descent. She was 20 years old. Very few people die doing this.
Hikes like half dome and angels' landing are super dangerous whether or not people die frequently on them. You're not stupid to do these hikes if you prepare for them, but even if you're prepared, there is still risk.
These hikes can get crowded even with the ticket system, and more and more people rush up these trails to get the shot for their Insta or whatever. Two-way crowds of impatient tourists on these narrow ledges and steep scrambles/climbs are a real issue and even a prepared hiker could get unlucky.
Not to mention other hazards like incliment weather like in this case. Half-dome is a unique weather risk during that final climb because it is just rock. Rock worn extra smooth and made dusty by hikers' boots. If it rains, that dust turns to silty mud and you now have nature's most majestic slip-n-slide.
The national parks make nature accessible, and because it's accessible, people underestimate it and don't respect it like they should.
I'm fairly fit, dabbled in bouldering, etc.
When I got to the cables part of angel's landing, saw the amount of people attempting to finish the hike and their relative fitness level, I noped the f out of there.
I'm not trusting my life with some rando that looks like they have no business doing what they are doing.
Experienced hiker and noob climber here. I did the exact same thing at Angel's Landing. The route would've been easy even without the aid. It's all the inexperienced people fucking around that made it very dangerous.
I left Zion and went to Moab.
Same here. The sheer 800ft. Drops on either sides of of the 2-4ft wide ridge with people coming both ways was a no from me.
Also even just on the way up the the first landing (the like 500sqft flat area where you can rest) with that 1.5ft wide ledge getting up to it and the rope with 300ft sheer drops- I had a frustrated dad wearing flip flops and a 2 year old kid in a baby backpack rushing by everyone while people were heading down too. Shit's wild.
It is pretty steep, though.
goes looking for a picture
https://i.natgeofe.com/n/7bd0c147-c204-49c7-ba89-2493e9de0bdf/6a00e55031d3a38834015433032e9b970c_3x2.png
I do agree that it sounds like they weren't trying to be up there during a storm, though.
Ranger literally told them a storm was forecast. I'm sure they didn't want to be up there during a storm. I mean who the hell does. But there's a whole lot of personal responsibility to be had here for their situation.
https://www.sfgate.com/california-parks/article/college-student-death-half-dome-yosemite-19591633.php
Has more details
Ranger told them a storm was forecast
'Experienced hiker' but her boots were new
Experienced doesn't always mean sensible. Just means lucky enough to not have died until then đ«
Good thing her boots were new though!
.
They don't have any way to make up for it if there's a storm?
I've been in this situation before and no. Usually to get these tickets you got to be near a computer when they release as they go fast. So there isn't much alternative if they miss the time for any reason.
Many controlled access routes don't use a lottery, instead are first come, first serve. I've hovered over the submit button many times.
But, that's not how it works in Yosemite. It's a true lottery. There's a window of time to submit. Then, selections are random.
From a different, much more thorough article:
"In 2010, the National Park Service took action to prevent overcrowding that was thought to lead to accidents, particularly in bad weather. It instituted a 300-person-per-day limit on the summit and required hikers to apply for daily permits through the lottery.
Unfortunately, it didnât work. A 2018 study by Wilderness & Environmental Medicine showed that after the permit system went into effect, the number of incidents per person doubled. The studyâs authors theorized that the difficulty in obtaining a permit made people more intent on reaching the summit with their one chance, despite the risks.
âI think itâs good to limit how many people are up there, because itâs obviously very dangerous,â said McGlynn, who despite heavy rain and hail climbed to the start of the cables with her mother to behold Half Dome from below. âBut they really do nothing to disincentivize people from doing the climb in bad weather.â
The park doesnât issue refunds or allow a Half Dome permit to be transferred to another day, she said, and they donât prioritize permit holders thwarted by storms in future lotteries."
That's nuts. At the very least offer refunds.