With Biden, Democrats are mostly falling in line behind the genocide. It's a bipartisan genocide, with even Bernie being unwilling to support a ceasefire. With Trump, on the other hand, Democrats would reverse course and actually support a ceasefire to obstruct Trump.
-but that's all speculation. I don't know, for sure, that it would happen that way. What I do know is I won't vote for genocide, and I will withhold my vote unless Biden changes his policy on Israel. I won't vote for Trump, I'll even vote Dem down ticket, but I won't vote for genocide.
You, on the other hand, are literally voting for genocide if you support Biden. You just want to absolve yourself of that moral responsibility.
This is the most naive comment I've ever seen in my damn life.
"When you grow up sweatie you'll understand you need to vote for genocide to stop fascism." 🤡
We must always always always vote for the turd in every election, for if the turd doesn't win we'll be stuck with turd plus vomit.
You just want to absolve yourself of that moral responsibility.
That's exactly what you are doing. You're focusing on this one issue, retreating yourself from the binary decision because neither options stands for what you (or I, or morality) would prefer. Completely ignoring that withdrawing from the choice plays into the hand of the infinitely worse candidate. So by not choosing, you do nothing to stop the situation in Gaza, but might actually make things a lot worse for people all over.
You can virtue signal that you did not compromise on your believes, while actually helping your country make a worse place.
You’re focusing on this one issue
We've raised lots of issues. The amounts of the stimulus checks, the way he fucked us over with the BBB, the way he negotiated down for student loan forgiveness, for fucking over the rail workers. The list goes on. Every time we mention something we get shut down. For someone who wants our votes so badly you have a really odd way of showing it.
Now imagine all of that, with a splash of military enforced laws, harder anti-LGBTQ+ laws, defunding the EPA, pulling out of many international agreements, abortion in ANY circumstance being a criminal act….
Read up on his plans before you do a thing stupid like… NOT voting.
The stupid thing was to vote for Joe Biden in the 2020 primaries. Those people can go fuck themselves.
Ahhh… so you’re a trumper.
I voted for Obama twice and Biden once. Call me whatever you want. At the end of the day, do you need my vote or not? If you want it I've given you the terms: don't elect procorporate trash in the primaries.
So…. You’re fine with Trump then? Thats what you’re saying.
I'm fine with the people who voted for Biden in the 2020 primaries electing him all by themselves in 2024. They fucked over my interests in the primaries so they can go fuck themselves in the general.
Like I said, there are so many other issues that Biden has betrayed me on. This is just the red line. Here and no further.
You will let Biden do anything he wants to you and beg for more, just to stop Trump. It's revolting.
If enough Democrats pressured Biden to endorse a ceasefire by withholding their votes, he would! He's a politician. That's what politicians do. This is our only leverage! This is all we can do to stop the genocide, and I really think Biden would reconsider if it looked bad enough.
Why would anyone endorse a ceasefire? Hamas is firing more rockets at Israel just today.
A ceasefire means both sides stop. If you want Hamas to stop firing rockets, you want a ceasefire.
Good job playing into the hands of Zionists, they need you in order to continue the genocide.
This is dumb and self-righteous. It'll be 100 times worse with Trump and we all know this.
We slide farther to the right with each passing year regardless of which party wins. You all seem fine with the direction so we're just upping the timeline. If you want to go in a different direction tell Joe Biden to stop fucking over voters he's depending on. And tell anyone who voted for Biden in the 2020 primaries they're a fucking asshole.
It’ll be 100 times worse with Trump and we all know this.
Really? Why not a million times? A billion!
🤡
I thank god I'm not this illiterate. What do you think Trump's policy is gonna be? He caters to Republicans who WANT funding to Israel. He pushed the Overton window. What do you think he's gonna do? Is he gonna weave them baskets and pick them flowers? 🤔
I think he's going to be obstructed by Democrats, who I am voting for down ticket. I think he's going to ruin Israel's relations with the rest of the world and turn it into a pariah state. I think he's going to overextend himself and fail. I think he's a fat old man and might just die lol
Posting clown emojis just makes you look like a clown. Use your words.
Because the population in Iran is roughly 100 times the population in Palestine.
I don't think we'll have to wait for Trump to see war with Iran.
I guess we'll see what the next 9 months brings.
I'm pretty sure Iran is actively and deliberately pressing the US and its allies to engage in a more widespread war by encouraging and provisioning the Houthis in their current terrorism against unaligned trade ships in the Red Sea.
Kind of like how the US is providing unneeded military aid to Israel. Encourages Israel to "go for it" against their enemies. Two sides of a coin, but with Iran being more deliberate in wanting war because Israel is vastly outnumbered by its neighbors and they think they can eradicate it.
The US doesn't want to eradicate the Palestinians; they just don't care enough about the people stop it. The Iranians want to eradicate the Israelis.
Israel is actively and deliberately pressing all of its neighbors to engage in a more widespread war by constantly bombing them and assassinating their officials.
You’re not only supporting the same genocide with a vote for Trump, you’re also supporting all the bigotry, oppression, misogyny, racism, and cowardice that goes along with it.
And make no mistake- your stubborn refusal to vote against a tyrant over a single issue is what allows said tyrant to rule America.
We WILL blame you if Trump wins.
But why did this particular flare up in the Palestine-Israel conflict be the hill you'll die on? Why, for example, didn't Bidens support for the Saudis against the Houthis, which is much worse by most standards, put you off?
Secondly: how do you think you're helping the Palestinians by helping to replace Biden with Trump?
It was Biden going around Congress to give Israel more bombs blow up civilians that really set me off. He didn't do that for Saudi, he didn't do it for Ukraine, and he certainly doesn't do shit like that for Americans who need him to bypass Congress.
Second, I don't think Trump will be any better or worse than Biden on Palestine. That's why I'm not voting for him.
But I will not vote for genocide. I'd rather die.
(and I might, since I'm a trans communist in a red state)
Are you sure Trump won't be worse on Palestine? He was doing their diplomatic legwork all through his term. Moved the embassy to cement Israel's claim over Jerusalem.
Biden went around congress and stopped weapon sales to Saudi Arabia thus stopping their genocide in Yemen.
Trump actually vetoed congress on the same issue so the genocide could continue.
Effectively, by refusing to stop Trump to spite Biden, you are choosing for two genocides instead of one. On top of all the other things.
@nonailsleft@queermunist gosh, the trolley problem isnt contrived at all, its actually about fucking genocide and the 2-party system.
Well in the real worreldd, US voters are too weak to fix a broken democratic system. This should be addressed by, best chance, taking over the dnc from within and moving towards a supermajority that supports a better system.
But today, tomorrow,... Untill that is fixed: the trolley problem is real. To give someone else control of the trolley does nothing to fix the systemic problem. You might think so. Your gut tells you letting things explode might wake up enough people to start a revolution. But history shows it doesn't.
You can vote to limit genocide and work towards fixing the system, without compromising the other
Your vote lends credibility and mandate to the regime. Your vote says "yes please, I want more of this". They don't care that you are actually voting to minimize the damage, they only care that they can do anything they want to you and you'll beg for more just to stop Trump.
Like I said, if this is a trolley problem then we have to derail the trolley.
With Biden, Democrats are mostly falling in line behind the genocide. It's a bipartisan genocide, with even Bernie being unwilling to support a ceasefire. With Trump, on the other hand, Democrats would reverse course and actually support a ceasefire to obstruct Trump.
-but that's all speculation. I don't know, for sure, that it would happen that way. What I do know is I won't vote for genocide, and I will withhold my vote unless Biden changes his policy on Israel. I won't vote for Trump, I'll even vote Dem down ticket, but I won't vote for genocide.
You, on the other hand, are literally voting for genocide if you support Biden. You just want to absolve yourself of that moral responsibility.
This is the most naive comment I've ever seen in my damn life.
"When you grow up sweatie you'll understand you need to vote for genocide to stop fascism." 🤡
We must always always always vote for the turd in every election, for if the turd doesn't win we'll be stuck with turd plus vomit.
That's exactly what you are doing. You're focusing on this one issue, retreating yourself from the binary decision because neither options stands for what you (or I, or morality) would prefer. Completely ignoring that withdrawing from the choice plays into the hand of the infinitely worse candidate. So by not choosing, you do nothing to stop the situation in Gaza, but might actually make things a lot worse for people all over.
You can virtue signal that you did not compromise on your believes, while actually helping your country make a worse place.
We've raised lots of issues. The amounts of the stimulus checks, the way he fucked us over with the BBB, the way he negotiated down for student loan forgiveness, for fucking over the rail workers. The list goes on. Every time we mention something we get shut down. For someone who wants our votes so badly you have a really odd way of showing it.
Now imagine all of that, with a splash of military enforced laws, harder anti-LGBTQ+ laws, defunding the EPA, pulling out of many international agreements, abortion in ANY circumstance being a criminal act….
Read up on his plans before you do a thing stupid like… NOT voting.
The stupid thing was to vote for Joe Biden in the 2020 primaries. Those people can go fuck themselves.
Ahhh… so you’re a trumper.
I voted for Obama twice and Biden once. Call me whatever you want. At the end of the day, do you need my vote or not? If you want it I've given you the terms: don't elect procorporate trash in the primaries.
So…. You’re fine with Trump then? Thats what you’re saying.
I'm fine with the people who voted for Biden in the 2020 primaries electing him all by themselves in 2024. They fucked over my interests in the primaries so they can go fuck themselves in the general.
Like I said, there are so many other issues that Biden has betrayed me on. This is just the red line. Here and no further.
You will let Biden do anything he wants to you and beg for more, just to stop Trump. It's revolting.
If enough Democrats pressured Biden to endorse a ceasefire by withholding their votes, he would! He's a politician. That's what politicians do. This is our only leverage! This is all we can do to stop the genocide, and I really think Biden would reconsider if it looked bad enough.
Why would anyone endorse a ceasefire? Hamas is firing more rockets at Israel just today.
A ceasefire means both sides stop. If you want Hamas to stop firing rockets, you want a ceasefire.
Hamas isn't going to stop.
Good job playing into the hands of the conservatives. If they can't get your vote they'll push arguments like yours in order to win.
Tell Joe Biden to stop fucking over voters he's depending on.
Good job playing into the hands of Zionists, they need you in order to continue the genocide.
This is dumb and self-righteous. It'll be 100 times worse with Trump and we all know this.
We slide farther to the right with each passing year regardless of which party wins. You all seem fine with the direction so we're just upping the timeline. If you want to go in a different direction tell Joe Biden to stop fucking over voters he's depending on. And tell anyone who voted for Biden in the 2020 primaries they're a fucking asshole.
Really? Why not a million times? A billion!
🤡
I thank god I'm not this illiterate. What do you think Trump's policy is gonna be? He caters to Republicans who WANT funding to Israel. He pushed the Overton window. What do you think he's gonna do? Is he gonna weave them baskets and pick them flowers? 🤔
I think he's going to be obstructed by Democrats, who I am voting for down ticket. I think he's going to ruin Israel's relations with the rest of the world and turn it into a pariah state. I think he's going to overextend himself and fail. I think he's a fat old man and might just die lol
Posting clown emojis just makes you look like a clown. Use your words.
Because the population in Iran is roughly 100 times the population in Palestine.
I don't think we'll have to wait for Trump to see war with Iran.
I guess we'll see what the next 9 months brings.
I'm pretty sure Iran is actively and deliberately pressing the US and its allies to engage in a more widespread war by encouraging and provisioning the Houthis in their current terrorism against unaligned trade ships in the Red Sea.
Kind of like how the US is providing unneeded military aid to Israel. Encourages Israel to "go for it" against their enemies. Two sides of a coin, but with Iran being more deliberate in wanting war because Israel is vastly outnumbered by its neighbors and they think they can eradicate it.
The US doesn't want to eradicate the Palestinians; they just don't care enough about the people stop it. The Iranians want to eradicate the Israelis.
Israel is actively and deliberately pressing all of its neighbors to engage in a more widespread war by constantly bombing them and assassinating their officials.
You’re not only supporting the same genocide with a vote for Trump, you’re also supporting all the bigotry, oppression, misogyny, racism, and cowardice that goes along with it.
And make no mistake- your stubborn refusal to vote against a tyrant over a single issue is what allows said tyrant to rule America.
We WILL blame you if Trump wins.
But why did this particular flare up in the Palestine-Israel conflict be the hill you'll die on? Why, for example, didn't Bidens support for the Saudis against the Houthis, which is much worse by most standards, put you off?
Secondly: how do you think you're helping the Palestinians by helping to replace Biden with Trump?
It was Biden going around Congress to give Israel more bombs blow up civilians that really set me off. He didn't do that for Saudi, he didn't do it for Ukraine, and he certainly doesn't do shit like that for Americans who need him to bypass Congress.
Second, I don't think Trump will be any better or worse than Biden on Palestine. That's why I'm not voting for him.
But I will not vote for genocide. I'd rather die.
(and I might, since I'm a trans communist in a red state)
Are you sure Trump won't be worse on Palestine? He was doing their diplomatic legwork all through his term. Moved the embassy to cement Israel's claim over Jerusalem.
Biden went around congress and stopped weapon sales to Saudi Arabia thus stopping their genocide in Yemen.
Trump actually vetoed congress on the same issue so the genocide could continue.
Effectively, by refusing to stop Trump to spite Biden, you are choosing for two genocides instead of one. On top of all the other things.
@nonailsleft @queermunist gosh, the trolley problem isnt contrived at all, its actually about fucking genocide and the 2-party system.
Well in the real worreldd, US voters are too weak to fix a broken democratic system. This should be addressed by, best chance, taking over the dnc from within and moving towards a supermajority that supports a better system.
But today, tomorrow,... Untill that is fixed: the trolley problem is real. To give someone else control of the trolley does nothing to fix the systemic problem. You might think so. Your gut tells you letting things explode might wake up enough people to start a revolution. But history shows it doesn't.
You can vote to limit genocide and work towards fixing the system, without compromising the other
Your vote lends credibility and mandate to the regime. Your vote says "yes please, I want more of this". They don't care that you are actually voting to minimize the damage, they only care that they can do anything they want to you and you'll beg for more just to stop Trump.
Like I said, if this is a trolley problem then we have to derail the trolley.
Derail the trolley dawg.