As a medical device engineer working in spine - absolutely chiropractors.
What about osteopaths?
Osteopaths (who have a Doctorate of Osteopathy and are often referred to as DOs) go to medical school and receive training that's almost exactly the same as an MD.
the difference (so i'm told) is that DOs are trained to take a more holistic, full-body approach to diagnostics and treatment rather than only focusing on one set of symptoms/treatment. They also do their residencies and internships alongside MDs.
Yes, I've heard some people say that they trust DOs more because they're more deliberately trained to look at a larger picture of a person's health. I don't have my own opinion since I've never met with a DO.
My PCP is a DO. It works for me as my body is still relatively young. (late 30's) I also don't have many issues that would require more intensive/specialized treatment that I don't already have a specialist for.
I was not familiar with this term and had to look it up. From my brief search, it also seems like snake oil, and I don't know why someone would not go to a real physical therapist instead.
I absolutely had a PT after a car accident that used spinal manipulation and it seemed to help. She also had me using elastic bands for stretching and hydrotherapy, so there's that
Fair, I do have a number of MD DO consultants. The initial look I had was not within the DO licensing.
DO are real doctors. Rarer than MDs because there are less schools but totally real docs. My Mom with 30 years nursing experience says their training is basically identical, but DOs are generally nicer.
It depends on the country. Everywhere but the US, I believe, osteopaths are witch doctors on the same level as chiropractors. In the US, they were originally like that, but their professional organization basically pushed it into being a real medical degree.
Now they go to the same length schooling as MD's, and take the same exams as far as I know.
The core of the whole discipline, osteopathy, is a pseudoscience, though. While they are usually competent doctors they still have that core of pseudoscience. They like to market themselves as more "holistic", but that's usually a good dogwhistle term to let you know information not supported by science is going to follow. They bring up that they are the same as MDs, but with additional training in osteopathy, but that can't be true because the schooling is the same length, so to fit in the pseudoscience, they get less science.
The real reason why we have DO's is that we don't have capacity in our country to educate enough MDs, so we have this weird parallel system.
A chiropractor 💯 fixed my throwing arm that I had been dealing with for over 10 years. Made me an absolute believer. That said, I’ve been to two different chiropractors and they were wildly different in everything they did. Dr Lopeig in Great Falls, Virginia is an absolute wizard.
I sometimes come across influencers pushing chrio "treatments" on pets or newborns, saying it makes them "breathe better" or be "more energetic"
It's infuriating
its a bit more than infuriating, thats straight up dangerous.
I've told this story before, but newborn chiropractors are a thing, and many new parents will take their BABIES to get their neck and back snapped around. It's frankly fucking disgusting.
I used to see a lot of threads on reddit about people who got injuries from cheap chiropractors.
Problem is, people go to chiropractor when they don't have access to real doctor, problem either the money or/and most doctors in your city/state can't/refuse do anything about your problem, desperation is one hell of a stimulus
most doctors in your city/state can't/refuse do anything about your problem
There's almost nothing a chiropractor can do if doctors aren't treating you. Except lie and steal your money.
The thing is, placebos can actually be pretty effective. Hell, they're effective even if you know they're a placebo. And the more elaborate and similar to what you think would be involved in curing you, the more effective. So people going to chiropractors might actually be getting real results even if the things they're doing are junk.
Except snake oil can contain bleach...
I can somewhat understand this. I have IBS, and most people with a bowel issue will tell you that IBS is basically your doctor saying ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Instead of getting help from your doctor, you go online and you hear about people finding relief through taking weird supplements, or eating only rice, or taking pre and probiotics of varying types. None of it has any proof, but it's better to try something than to struggle - and sometimes you're lucky or you find some short-lived relief.
The difference is that there often isn't evidence for these things working, whereas there is plenty of evidence out there that says that chiropractors are doing legitimately dangerous practices to your body. The difference is that someone is trying to make a profit from this lack of knowledge.
I’ve had loads of advice like that for IBS, but no amount of FODMAP or probiotics actually makes a difference, because my IBS is stress-triggered. My doctor helped by advising me to avoid stressful situations, which is hard when you move to another country.
It may be that your gut health is constantly poor when stress triggers things. I used to become ill from cold exposure for several years - tyramine from foods leaked through the small intestine to the bloodstream (which is bad) for about three days after each exposure. See https://lemmy.world/comment/10672140
"Only rice" is an elimination diet for allergies that I should have tried decades ago, but dumbass mainstream medicine never recommended.
I found out there are slow allergies mediated by immunoglobulin G that you can't detect while eating, so I did a blood test. Found some strong positives (milks, eggs), and then through elimination found out false negatives that I also can't eat (peanut, soy), and, thanks to the doctor whom I went out of my way to see about IgG, some that are typically harmful to those with IBS that I also need to avoid (gluten, sunflower oil, rapeseed oil). Supplemental protective agents Aloe barbadensis, xyloglucan, and butyrate also help. Getting really healthy now - no more IBS if I don't eat mistakes.
The mainstream doctors say that's all nonsense and that I'm a hypochondriac who perceives having gotten better for no reason.
This was basically my experience but with tinnitus.
It's a symptom of a larger problem but if there is no clear correlation then you're kind of on your own
Holland and Barrett sell supplements. Some people do need to take a vitamin d tablet a day. I do but I've got a prescription for a vitamin d and calcium tablet because I've been low for years.
I work 3rd shift, so I take Vitamin D because the sun is my nemesis.
Be careful with vitamin D though. That is one of the very very few vitamins that you can actually take too much of because it's fat soluble, not water soluble, so excessive vitamin D will build up in your fat cells rather than just getting peed out. It's called vitamin D toxicity (VDT) and it can have some unpleasant neurological effects among other things.
So it's probably a good idea to get your levels checked anyways just to make sure you're taking the right amount if you need it.
Funny, every primary care provider in my country recommends you take Vitamin D, usually pretty huge amounts
Could be because we get barely any sunshine between like October and February. I'm talking 6 hour days, and even those mostly cloudy.
I take vitamin D about 5 months out of the year. Stupid fall back daylight saving time is part of it. Makes me furious my already battered mental health has to get worse from changing the clocks.
Chiropractic.
Everything in Holland and Barrett.
As a medical device engineer working in spine - absolutely chiropractors.
What about osteopaths?
Osteopaths (who have a Doctorate of Osteopathy and are often referred to as DOs) go to medical school and receive training that's almost exactly the same as an MD.
the difference (so i'm told) is that DOs are trained to take a more holistic, full-body approach to diagnostics and treatment rather than only focusing on one set of symptoms/treatment. They also do their residencies and internships alongside MDs.
Yes, I've heard some people say that they trust DOs more because they're more deliberately trained to look at a larger picture of a person's health. I don't have my own opinion since I've never met with a DO.
My PCP is a DO. It works for me as my body is still relatively young. (late 30's) I also don't have many issues that would require more intensive/specialized treatment that I don't already have a specialist for.
I was not familiar with this term and had to look it up. From my brief search, it also seems like snake oil, and I don't know why someone would not go to a real physical therapist instead.
Not saying anything about the source, but https://www.webmd.com/pain-management/osteopathic-medicine
I absolutely had a PT after a car accident that used spinal manipulation and it seemed to help. She also had me using elastic bands for stretching and hydrotherapy, so there's that
Fair, I do have a number of MD DO consultants. The initial look I had was not within the DO licensing.
DO are real doctors. Rarer than MDs because there are less schools but totally real docs. My Mom with 30 years nursing experience says their training is basically identical, but DOs are generally nicer.
It depends on the country. Everywhere but the US, I believe, osteopaths are witch doctors on the same level as chiropractors. In the US, they were originally like that, but their professional organization basically pushed it into being a real medical degree.
Now they go to the same length schooling as MD's, and take the same exams as far as I know.
The core of the whole discipline, osteopathy, is a pseudoscience, though. While they are usually competent doctors they still have that core of pseudoscience. They like to market themselves as more "holistic", but that's usually a good dogwhistle term to let you know information not supported by science is going to follow. They bring up that they are the same as MDs, but with additional training in osteopathy, but that can't be true because the schooling is the same length, so to fit in the pseudoscience, they get less science.
The real reason why we have DO's is that we don't have capacity in our country to educate enough MDs, so we have this weird parallel system.
A chiropractor 💯 fixed my throwing arm that I had been dealing with for over 10 years. Made me an absolute believer. That said, I’ve been to two different chiropractors and they were wildly different in everything they did. Dr Lopeig in Great Falls, Virginia is an absolute wizard.
I sometimes come across influencers pushing chrio "treatments" on pets or newborns, saying it makes them "breathe better" or be "more energetic"
It's infuriating
its a bit more than infuriating, thats straight up dangerous.
I've told this story before, but newborn chiropractors are a thing, and many new parents will take their BABIES to get their neck and back snapped around. It's frankly fucking disgusting.
I used to see a lot of threads on reddit about people who got injuries from cheap chiropractors.
Problem is, people go to chiropractor when they don't have access to real doctor, problem either the money or/and most doctors in your city/state can't/refuse do anything about your problem, desperation is one hell of a stimulus
There's almost nothing a chiropractor can do if doctors aren't treating you. Except lie and steal your money.
The thing is, placebos can actually be pretty effective. Hell, they're effective even if you know they're a placebo. And the more elaborate and similar to what you think would be involved in curing you, the more effective. So people going to chiropractors might actually be getting real results even if the things they're doing are junk.
Except snake oil can contain bleach...
I can somewhat understand this. I have IBS, and most people with a bowel issue will tell you that IBS is basically your doctor saying ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Instead of getting help from your doctor, you go online and you hear about people finding relief through taking weird supplements, or eating only rice, or taking pre and probiotics of varying types. None of it has any proof, but it's better to try something than to struggle - and sometimes you're lucky or you find some short-lived relief.
The difference is that there often isn't evidence for these things working, whereas there is plenty of evidence out there that says that chiropractors are doing legitimately dangerous practices to your body. The difference is that someone is trying to make a profit from this lack of knowledge.
I’ve had loads of advice like that for IBS, but no amount of FODMAP or probiotics actually makes a difference, because my IBS is stress-triggered. My doctor helped by advising me to avoid stressful situations, which is hard when you move to another country.
It may be that your gut health is constantly poor when stress triggers things. I used to become ill from cold exposure for several years - tyramine from foods leaked through the small intestine to the bloodstream (which is bad) for about three days after each exposure. See https://lemmy.world/comment/10672140
"Only rice" is an elimination diet for allergies that I should have tried decades ago, but dumbass mainstream medicine never recommended.
I found out there are slow allergies mediated by immunoglobulin G that you can't detect while eating, so I did a blood test. Found some strong positives (milks, eggs), and then through elimination found out false negatives that I also can't eat (peanut, soy), and, thanks to the doctor whom I went out of my way to see about IgG, some that are typically harmful to those with IBS that I also need to avoid (gluten, sunflower oil, rapeseed oil). Supplemental protective agents Aloe barbadensis, xyloglucan, and butyrate also help. Getting really healthy now - no more IBS if I don't eat mistakes.
The mainstream doctors say that's all nonsense and that I'm a hypochondriac who perceives having gotten better for no reason.
My previous successful departure from the mainstream was making my gallbladder go from "full of stones" to "empty except a thin layer of sediment on the bottom" as seen by ultrasound. Now that there's proof, the doctors can't dismiss that. https://www.quora.com/What-are-some-good-diet-considerations-for-Gallstone-sufferers/answers/107344862
This was basically my experience but with tinnitus.
It's a symptom of a larger problem but if there is no clear correlation then you're kind of on your own
Holland and Barrett sell supplements. Some people do need to take a vitamin d tablet a day. I do but I've got a prescription for a vitamin d and calcium tablet because I've been low for years.
I work 3rd shift, so I take Vitamin D because the sun is my nemesis.
Be careful with vitamin D though. That is one of the very very few vitamins that you can actually take too much of because it's fat soluble, not water soluble, so excessive vitamin D will build up in your fat cells rather than just getting peed out. It's called vitamin D toxicity (VDT) and it can have some unpleasant neurological effects among other things.
So it's probably a good idea to get your levels checked anyways just to make sure you're taking the right amount if you need it.
Funny, every primary care provider in my country recommends you take Vitamin D, usually pretty huge amounts
Could be because we get barely any sunshine between like October and February. I'm talking 6 hour days, and even those mostly cloudy.
I take vitamin D about 5 months out of the year. Stupid fall back daylight saving time is part of it. Makes me furious my already battered mental health has to get worse from changing the clocks.