Time to start planning for another business-friendly Democrat administration. It probably won't have majorities in both houses, but it wouldn't matter much even if they did manage to pull that off. Bipartisanship is the name of the Democrat game, and the next question is whether the Republican remnant will play ball or fall into infighting after whatever bloody nonsense their nutjobs get up to this time.
Doomers and bothsides-ers can fuck off. While you people keep bitching and moaning, the adults in the room are trying to make the world a better place.
Yeah, the adults in the room alright. Who were saying she doesn't need any actual policy a few weeks ago and cheering on fascists like Dick Cheney lol.
Toxic positivity.
That's not what that is.
If we're not allowed to be realistic about our expectations, then yes it very much is toxic positivity.
Literally not what that phrase even means.
I might as well have been quoting the wikipedia article:
Toxic positivity followed by gaslighting.
I get that everything is perfect for you, what with the genocide and all. That doesn't mean that everyone who isn't as happy as you want them to be about it is a child or a Russian bot.
Also not what gaslighting means lol
Anything else you want to deny the accepted meaning of while we're at it?
Anything to avoid talking about the genocide you're so attached to that you scream "Russian bot" at anyone with any misgivings about it.
Who's screaming here?
Modlog's right there. You snap to calling people Russian every chance you get.
It's an infection on lemmy, a bad one
Of people who disagree with you, so they must be Russian. There is no other possible explanation for being upset about genocide.
Centrists are so enamored with the smell of their own farts that they can't imagine anyone not liking the smell.
Not great, so people should continue to apply pressure. And not just over Palestine, but over all MIC capture of our government. Otoh, this administration and hopefully Harris' will continue it is one of the most union friendly in living memory and the FTC has been insanely active. If we're lucky, we might even see the return of the CFPB as a legitimate and effective entity. So your characterization is beyond brain dead.
Not great, so people should continue to apply pressure.
Cool. Tell all your Democrat friends that they can have my vote when they start doing the bare minimum and embargo arms sales to Israel.
"I'm not going to help until you guys fix the problem for me"
"Those guys" are part of the problem, voting for them before they stop helping genocide the Palestinians does not incentivize them to stop being part of the problem.
We can do more than one thing at a time. It's absolutely possible to vote for Democrats to put them in a position to do the things we want while simultaneously pushing that same party to do those things.
Real change requires that we capture the Democratic party while strengthening it, not kneecaping it into submission. Primaries are where the real push happens. That's when it needs to be a drag out fight with the party. Not the general.
I only have one vote for the Presidential seat and it is entirely symbolic because I don't live in a swing state.
You say we need to capture the party, but I'm watching it be captured by "moderate" Republicans who suddenly seem very eager to endorse Harris.
This election didn't have a primary, so it sounds like there never was a chance for a "real push".
You say we need to capture the party, but I'm watching it be captured by "moderate" Republicans who suddenly seem very eager to endorse Harris.
Because a ton of people who are progressive sit out largely using the argument you've put forth. See the problem there?
This election didn't have a primary, so it sounds like there never was a chance for a "real push".
I mean primarying an incumbent president is incredibly difficult, I'm not going to disagree. But in our local primaries here in CO we were able to knock out 2 old guard dems and replace them with young progressives that will be on the ballot this fall. We're literally moving the party to the left. It's an absolute grind, but that's the only way this shit will work.
It's also exactly how the conservative crazies got ahold of the GOP, I'm not just spouting theory. They primaried the fuck out of members that didn't do what they want, especially at the local and state levels, and it has absolutely paid off for them. And that took at least 3 full election cycles if not more.
And it's backfiring, which is part of why the Democrats are going to win the presidency in this election.
We know the Democrats aren't going to do anything to stop Israel, so the only real question left is whether or not the Republican party will fracture after Trump loses again.
Don't forget Trump's threats. If you don't vote now, you may not get another chance for a while.
If there's only one option to "save democracy", then democracy is already dead.
Democracy is always one vote away from death. Sometimes there are just a lot more folks voting for a dangerous candidate.
You misunderstand, I'm trying to point out that a "Democracy" that offers only the illusion of choice is anything but.
There's nothing anti-democratic about having a "dangerous" option on the ballot, but if there's only one "safe" candidate then there is no real choice to be made and democracy is impossible.
I'm not dying on this hill. I encourage you to vote and help us gain a little distance from the failed state, however small.
My encouragement to you is to do more than just voting. It's necessary but insufficient on its own.
Cool. Tell all your Democrat friends that they can have my vote when they start doing the bare minimum and embargo arms sales to Israel.
i'll be sure to tell them that once i'm convinced you aren't a tankie trying to subvert the election.
I'm a single-issue anti-genocide voter. My political ideal is a mashup of Library Socialism and Anarchism. The election can't be subverted, it's already been decided that Harris is winning.
I'm not a single issue voter, and there's plenty I find worrisome with what Kamala said.
such as?
I’m a single-issue anti-genocide voter.
you are going to be deeply disappointed when any number of things happens. Notably when you discover that israel probably isn't just flagrantly committing genocide. When you discover other issues like climate change, and human rights abuse. Or like, nestle.
I can think of a few things that would spook you more than like 40,000 people dying. Notably the roughly 300,000 causalities in the russo-ukraine war that's still ongoing.
The election can’t be subverted, it’s already been decided that Harris is winning.
there is already work being done to potentially subvert the will of the voters: see Georgia, i don't have to explain this one, the board committee thing overseeing elections is trying to usurp total control over the certification of the votes.
yes, harris is already winning that's how polling works. Unfortunately for you, polling is never perfectly accurate.
I like your root instance though. Real recognize real if you know what i mean.
you are going to be deeply disappointed
I have been nothing but deeply disappointed with American politics for the entirety of my adult life.
there is already work being done to potentially subvert the will of the voters
That's nothing new. More like par for the course with American elections.
What's different this time is how many "moderate" Republicans are endorsing the Democrats.
The Democratic Party is over, they're giving up on their left wing to chase anti-trump Republicans. After this election they might as well be the Democratic-Republicans ressurrected. One big neoliberal party with no real competition from the right or left.
Unfortunately for you, polling is never perfectly accurate.
Polling is accurate enough, everyone who was surprised that Trump took the presidency in 2016 was just insufficiently cynical about American politics.
I don't need polling to see which way the wind is blowing, this election has been a done deal since Pelosi convinced Biden to drop out of the race. That itself being an event I predicted as the longshot that the Democrats would need all the way back in 2015 when the DNC started openly conspiring against Bernie.
I like your root instance though.
fistbump
Nah, you aren't worth mentioning.
Far as centrists are concerned, it's becoming a better place.
Hey so maybe wait to see what Harris does after she takes office before you start shitting in the punch bowl?
Like, I get it. I’m jaded as fuck about politics and the electoral system we’re forced to use. But I take it as a VERY promising sign that Biden actually stepped aside. Sure, maybe it was for the “wrong” reasons (age and senility, instead of wrongheaded policies and decisions and being desperately out of touch with younger generations), but I’m happy to take the win where we can get it. Harris is saying a lot of things that are overall resonating with a lot of people, including myself. I’m not deluded enough to think she’ll be a perfect champion of social justice and equality, but at the same time, what she’s saying so far is a damn sight closer to that than any politician I’ve heard since Obama was campaigning in ‘08.
I’m willing to give her a shot. You should too.
btw if you hate our voting system, you should be working towards moving away from FPTP and to something like IRV, maine actually has IRV, and since states are delegated a lot of rights in this regard, it can put a lot of upward pressure on the matter.
Don't misunderstand, part of me is glad that it's going to be Harris and Walz, but I have to be realistic with my expectations. A slightly slower crawl towards fascism and mass climatic genocide seems the best I should expect, but I would love to be pleasantly surprised.
if you're so worried about the imminent threat of a fascist dystopia and believe that the government will not stop it, why don't you start taking matters into your own hands?
Discussing such activities is illegal in the USA.
makes sense, domestic terrorism is generally frowned upon, it's the reason j6ers were charged and served time or are still serving time for it.
well don't discuss it then.
please demonstrate the "slightly" aspect of fascism between the harris and walz campaign, and the trump campaign, i would really love to see this "slight" difference you speak of.
Palestine.
palestine is fascist? They might be, they're a war torn government and of middle eastern culture, so maybe.
Israel? They're a democratic country, so uh. BB himself is wildly unpopular within israel. Those aren't normally possible under fascism.
The US? The country almost subverted electorally. Only to push through on the sheer basedness of mike pence believing in democracy like a gigachad? TBF we have another election cycle coming up. But we're doing fine at the moment so.
The US federal government itself due to it's war actions? Seems highly unlikely to me, popular sentiment for this war is, not great. Granted i don't know any statistics on this, so i may be wrong. Since you're here, and criticizing the government for this one, even calling them "fascist" over it. I would probably venture to argue that this is wrong by fundamental reasoning.
I'm not really smelling any fascism here.
Do you have Covid?
do you have long covid?
Because that would explain why you can't smell the fascism in genocide..
It's a fait accompli.
Time to start planning for another business-friendly Democrat administration. It probably won't have majorities in both houses, but it wouldn't matter much even if they did manage to pull that off. Bipartisanship is the name of the Democrat game, and the next question is whether the Republican remnant will play ball or fall into infighting after whatever bloody nonsense their nutjobs get up to this time.
Doomers and bothsides-ers can fuck off. While you people keep bitching and moaning, the adults in the room are trying to make the world a better place.
Yeah, the adults in the room alright. Who were saying she doesn't need any actual policy a few weeks ago and cheering on fascists like Dick Cheney lol.
Toxic positivity.
That's not what that is.
If we're not allowed to be realistic about our expectations, then yes it very much is toxic positivity.
Literally not what that phrase even means.
I might as well have been quoting the wikipedia article:
Toxic positivity followed by gaslighting.
I get that everything is perfect for you, what with the genocide and all. That doesn't mean that everyone who isn't as happy as you want them to be about it is a child or a Russian bot.
Also not what gaslighting means lol
Anything else you want to deny the accepted meaning of while we're at it?
Anything to avoid talking about the genocide you're so attached to that you scream "Russian bot" at anyone with any misgivings about it.
Who's screaming here?
Modlog's right there. You snap to calling people Russian every chance you get.
It's an infection on lemmy, a bad one
Of people who disagree with you, so they must be Russian. There is no other possible explanation for being upset about genocide.
Centrists are so enamored with the smell of their own farts that they can't imagine anyone not liking the smell.
How's Palestine going?
Not great, so people should continue to apply pressure. And not just over Palestine, but over all MIC capture of our government. Otoh, this administration and hopefully Harris' will continue it is one of the most union friendly in living memory and the FTC has been insanely active. If we're lucky, we might even see the return of the CFPB as a legitimate and effective entity. So your characterization is beyond brain dead.
Cool. Tell all your Democrat friends that they can have my vote when they start doing the bare minimum and embargo arms sales to Israel.
"I'm not going to help until you guys fix the problem for me"
"Those guys" are part of the problem, voting for them before they stop helping genocide the Palestinians does not incentivize them to stop being part of the problem.
We can do more than one thing at a time. It's absolutely possible to vote for Democrats to put them in a position to do the things we want while simultaneously pushing that same party to do those things.
Real change requires that we capture the Democratic party while strengthening it, not kneecaping it into submission. Primaries are where the real push happens. That's when it needs to be a drag out fight with the party. Not the general.
I only have one vote for the Presidential seat and it is entirely symbolic because I don't live in a swing state.
You say we need to capture the party, but I'm watching it be captured by "moderate" Republicans who suddenly seem very eager to endorse Harris.
This election didn't have a primary, so it sounds like there never was a chance for a "real push".
Because a ton of people who are progressive sit out largely using the argument you've put forth. See the problem there?
I mean primarying an incumbent president is incredibly difficult, I'm not going to disagree. But in our local primaries here in CO we were able to knock out 2 old guard dems and replace them with young progressives that will be on the ballot this fall. We're literally moving the party to the left. It's an absolute grind, but that's the only way this shit will work.
It's also exactly how the conservative crazies got ahold of the GOP, I'm not just spouting theory. They primaried the fuck out of members that didn't do what they want, especially at the local and state levels, and it has absolutely paid off for them. And that took at least 3 full election cycles if not more.
And it's backfiring, which is part of why the Democrats are going to win the presidency in this election.
We know the Democrats aren't going to do anything to stop Israel, so the only real question left is whether or not the Republican party will fracture after Trump loses again.
Don't forget Trump's threats. If you don't vote now, you may not get another chance for a while.
If there's only one option to "save democracy", then democracy is already dead.
Democracy is always one vote away from death. Sometimes there are just a lot more folks voting for a dangerous candidate.
You misunderstand, I'm trying to point out that a "Democracy" that offers only the illusion of choice is anything but.
There's nothing anti-democratic about having a "dangerous" option on the ballot, but if there's only one "safe" candidate then there is no real choice to be made and democracy is impossible.
I'm not dying on this hill. I encourage you to vote and help us gain a little distance from the failed state, however small.
My encouragement to you is to do more than just voting. It's necessary but insufficient on its own.
i'll be sure to tell them that once i'm convinced you aren't a tankie trying to subvert the election.
I'm a single-issue anti-genocide voter. My political ideal is a mashup of Library Socialism and Anarchism. The election can't be subverted, it's already been decided that Harris is winning.
I'm not a single issue voter, and there's plenty I find worrisome with what Kamala said.
such as?
you are going to be deeply disappointed when any number of things happens. Notably when you discover that israel probably isn't just flagrantly committing genocide. When you discover other issues like climate change, and human rights abuse. Or like, nestle.
I can think of a few things that would spook you more than like 40,000 people dying. Notably the roughly 300,000 causalities in the russo-ukraine war that's still ongoing.
it most definitely can be, see: 2020 election and the jan 6 plot (a video covering the excessive extents of jan 6th, it's 3 hours long, and straight information)
there is already work being done to potentially subvert the will of the voters: see Georgia, i don't have to explain this one, the board committee thing overseeing elections is trying to usurp total control over the certification of the votes.
yes, harris is already winning that's how polling works. Unfortunately for you, polling is never perfectly accurate.
I like your root instance though. Real recognize real if you know what i mean.
I have been nothing but deeply disappointed with American politics for the entirety of my adult life.
That's nothing new. More like par for the course with American elections.
What's different this time is how many "moderate" Republicans are endorsing the Democrats.
The Democratic Party is over, they're giving up on their left wing to chase anti-trump Republicans. After this election they might as well be the Democratic-Republicans ressurrected. One big neoliberal party with no real competition from the right or left.
Polling is accurate enough, everyone who was surprised that Trump took the presidency in 2016 was just insufficiently cynical about American politics.
I don't need polling to see which way the wind is blowing, this election has been a done deal since Pelosi convinced Biden to drop out of the race. That itself being an event I predicted as the longshot that the Democrats would need all the way back in 2015 when the DNC started openly conspiring against Bernie.
fistbump
Nah, you aren't worth mentioning.
Far as centrists are concerned, it's becoming a better place.
Hey so maybe wait to see what Harris does after she takes office before you start shitting in the punch bowl?
Like, I get it. I’m jaded as fuck about politics and the electoral system we’re forced to use. But I take it as a VERY promising sign that Biden actually stepped aside. Sure, maybe it was for the “wrong” reasons (age and senility, instead of wrongheaded policies and decisions and being desperately out of touch with younger generations), but I’m happy to take the win where we can get it. Harris is saying a lot of things that are overall resonating with a lot of people, including myself. I’m not deluded enough to think she’ll be a perfect champion of social justice and equality, but at the same time, what she’s saying so far is a damn sight closer to that than any politician I’ve heard since Obama was campaigning in ‘08.
I’m willing to give her a shot. You should too.
btw if you hate our voting system, you should be working towards moving away from FPTP and to something like IRV, maine actually has IRV, and since states are delegated a lot of rights in this regard, it can put a lot of upward pressure on the matter.
Don't misunderstand, part of me is glad that it's going to be Harris and Walz, but I have to be realistic with my expectations. A slightly slower crawl towards fascism and mass climatic genocide seems the best I should expect, but I would love to be pleasantly surprised.
if you're so worried about the imminent threat of a fascist dystopia and believe that the government will not stop it, why don't you start taking matters into your own hands?
Discussing such activities is illegal in the USA.
makes sense, domestic terrorism is generally frowned upon, it's the reason j6ers were charged and served time or are still serving time for it.
well don't discuss it then.
please demonstrate the "slightly" aspect of fascism between the harris and walz campaign, and the trump campaign, i would really love to see this "slight" difference you speak of.
Palestine.
palestine is fascist? They might be, they're a war torn government and of middle eastern culture, so maybe.
Israel? They're a democratic country, so uh. BB himself is wildly unpopular within israel. Those aren't normally possible under fascism.
The US? The country almost subverted electorally. Only to push through on the sheer basedness of mike pence believing in democracy like a gigachad? TBF we have another election cycle coming up. But we're doing fine at the moment so.
The US federal government itself due to it's war actions? Seems highly unlikely to me, popular sentiment for this war is, not great. Granted i don't know any statistics on this, so i may be wrong. Since you're here, and criticizing the government for this one, even calling them "fascist" over it. I would probably venture to argue that this is wrong by fundamental reasoning.
I'm not really smelling any fascism here.
Do you have Covid?
do you have long covid?
Because that would explain why you can't smell the fascism in genocide..
this is a funny joke, i will give you that one.