The real source is a German news site called "Tag24 News." Why did you link to an MSN reprint of it?
In any event, Jill Stein is almost certainly a Russian asset, and the American version of the Green Party bears little resemblance to the European Greens, both in policy positions and credibility. Ellison has every right to express his opinions about them.
The real source is a German news site called “Tag24 News.” Why did you link to an MSN reprint of it?
Because the MSN link is what comes up in my newsfeed and is the version I read. So I posted. In any event, Tag24News is a legit news site as well
In any event, Jill Stein is almost certainly a Russian asset,
You're welcome to your opinion, but I don't think she is.
You’re welcome to your opinion, but I don’t think she is.
For those that don’t understand how the Electoral College + FPTP voting works, voting for her means helping donald become president due to the spoiler effect.
Willy Wimmer was a Right-wing German politician who in his retirement has effectively become a far-right conspiracy theorist that regularly posts to the Epoch Times.
Not really opinion at this point
It is still an opinion though.
If anything they did was illegal, then it'd be front page news. And apparently enough people like her that it makes Democrats scared and angry enough to try to block her and spread misinformation about her every chance they get. lol
I personally don't care about that photo or your suspicions about her at all all.
If anything they did was illegal
Haven't said she did anything illegal yet. We aren't spreading misinformation. All that is backed up by evidence. You are.
I personally don’t care about that photo or your suspicions about her at all all.
Then report me to the mods, file a complaint with the linked news sources, and/or block me. Also, that photo and damning evidence isn't for you. :D
You are.
What misinformation am I spreading? I just posted a news article. If you believe any part of the article is inaccurate, I encourage you to reach out to the news organization that published it.
Then report me to the mods
Why would I report you to the mods?! I haven't seen you do anything in this thread that's against community rules. I'm fine with you disagreeing with me. I disagree with you too.
I'm not even voting for her. lol
What misinformation am I spreading?
For one, you claim that Democrats are angry or worried about the Green Party and you KNOW (because I and many Many people have proven this to you beyond the point of rational disagreement) they aren't. What they are worried or angry about is the danger of the spoiler effect of these BS 3rd party candidates, with zero chance of winning the presidency, causing the Republicans to win despite almost nobody in these conversations wanting that at all.
You've blatantly said you do not care about the spoiler effect and the only reason someone with your alleged intentions wouldn't care about increasing the chances of Trump winning is if that was what your real goal was.
For one, you claim that Democrats are angry or worried about the Green Party and you KNOW (because I and many Many people have proven this to you beyond the point of rational disagreement) they aren’t.
If they're not angry or worried, then why is there such a strong reaction when I post news about the Green Party? Why go to such lengths to remove them from the ballot? It seems like there's a lot of effort being made for something they're supposedly unconcerned about.
What they are worried or angry about is the danger of the spoiler effect of these BS 3rd party candidates
So, they are worried and angry about the Green Party, just for different reasons. That seems to contradict what you just said.
the only reason someone with your alleged intentions wouldn’t care about increasing the chances of Trump winning is if that was what your real goal was.
The Trump accusation is not only incorrect but painfully unoriginal. The real threat is the Duopoly and capitalism. Whether it’s Trump or Harris, both serve the same ruling class keeping workers down.
Your denial is meaningless. The spoiler effect is proven. Voting 3rd party has cost elections. If you really don't want Trump to win you'd vote Harris, say you were, and clearly state that reality gives you no real choice otherwise you'd vote for whomever. An intelligent stance that acknowledges that you are forced to choose a lesser evil lest 5th grader logic result in the greater evil winning.
If there were primaries, or any 3rd party actually had a chance then by all means vote your conscience. That isn't the case so act your age instead of petulantly voting against your interests just because thinking is hard. Trump will thank you otherwise.
You want to discuss all the mistakes and perversions of/in the system that got us stuck in this mess with no way out that isn't a cop-out I will stand by you and commiserate fullheartedly. But get real in the meantime.
If you really don’t want Trump to win you’d vote Harris, say you were, and clearly state that reality gives you no real choice otherwise you’d vote for whomever.
No thanks. I'll vote for who I want to and who best aligns with my values. And that's not Trump or Harris. :)
And when Trump wins because Harris lost a battleground state by 700 votes a progressive 3rd party got instead what will you say when the US starts sending weapons to Israel en masse?
Why would I say anything? I'm not voting for Trump.
If the Democrats are truly worried about losing votes to a third party, they could adopt policies that actually reflect the values of those voters instead of just expecting us to fall in line.
My vote isn’t driven by fear. If Harris loses by such a slim margin, it’s not the fault of third-party voters—it’s the Democrats’ failure to address the issues that matter to us third-party voters.
They've hired Trump lawyer Jay Sekulow to try to force their way onto the ballot in Nevada, a swing state. They're so obviously compromised.
Heavens no, not ballot representation!
True representation would be an electoral system without the spoiler effect.
Why are you fighting so hard to retain the spoiler effect?
I'm explicitly wanting to get rid of the spoiler effect.
No, see jill stein wants to get rid of first past the post. Democrats fight to keep competitors off the ballot because they benefit from first past the post. You are explicitly fighting to keep it.
No, see jill stein wants to get rid of first past the post.
And I want to be able to jump over entire buildings with a single bound, and shoot lasers out of my eyes.
Talk is cheap when you've lost every single presidential election you've entered, especially losing so bad as to never get any electoral college nominations.
You are explicitly fighting to keep it.
No, I vote in the primaries at every chance to get as left of a candidate nominated as possible. The way to move forward is to take over the DNC. That starts at the ground level.
Just going for the presidency is a failed strategy. So all we can do at this time is harm reduction at that level.
You vote exclusively for candidates that actively support and benefit from first past the post, and are fighting against a candidate that actively supports getting rid of it. You cant claim to want to get rid of it
You vote exclusively for candidates that actively support and benefit from first past the post
That isn't true, and I just told you. This sort of change happens at the local level, at the lower ranks of government.
The president is not the only elected position in government.
and are fighting against a candidate that actively supports getting rid of it.
Not really. Stein is probably barely even on the Harris campaign's radar. The actual, real fight is against Trump.
You cant claim to want to get rid of it
Sure I can, just watch me:
I want to get rid of the spoiler effect, and will help to do so by voting for candidates at the local level who support better voting methods, when such candidates are available.
Such candidates are available, youre arguing they shouldnt be allowed to run because theyll spoil the party that benefits tremendously from first past the post.
Someone should explain to those Muslims in Wisconsin that Stein literally cannot win their state. She has no electors. State law requires that a candidates electors be nominated by state office holders. The greens have no state office holders so they cannot nominate any electors. Even if Stein were to somehow win the state, she can't get the electoral votes for Wisconsin. All she can do is again steal enough votes from Harris to give the election to Trump.
Yeah those muslims just need to rollover and accept democrats or republicans murdering them
A Democrat or a Republican is going to win either way. Only an insane person or an idiot would vote for someone with no chance of winning rather than for the candidate who will do the least harm.
Only an insane person or an idiot would vote for someone with no chance of winning rather than for the candidate who will do the least harm.
So you’re saying all these Muslim voters are either insane or idiots for making their own choice? That doesn’t sound very respectful.
If they vote third party then yes, I do think they're idiots or insane people. But I also have faith they'll make the right decision when election day finally comes.
If they vote third party then yes, I do think they’re idiots or insane people.
Wow, alright then. Gee, I can’t imagine why anyone on the fence wouldn’t be racing to join the Democrats. I mean, with such welcoming, open-minded attitudes like yours, who wouldn’t want to? Lmao.
I'm not a Democrat, I'm just planning to vote for one. Because I'm not a fucking idiot.
So everyone who isn't voting for Harris is "a fucking idiot"? Wow. Ok, then. lmao
Assuming you've paid any attention at all to the last 8 years of American politics, then yeah, not voting for Harris is fucking idiotic.
then yeah, not voting for Harris is fucking idiotic.
So you think half of the United States is idiotic. Wow. Ok, then.
Thinking Trump voters are idiots isn't exactly a hot take.
Isn't exactly rising above and being the better side either.
I'm not a Trump voter, so I don't care. But calling half of the country idiots doesn't exactly warm people up to your cause.
Someone should explain to those Muslims in Wisconsin
I think you’re underestimating them. These workers and voters are educated, smart, and fully aware of the stakes—they don’t need anyone to explain anything.
To imply they can't think for themselves is an insult to their intelligence. They’re not pawns of the duopoly; they know exactly what they’re doing by rejecting the system that’s failed them time and time again. And I support them and their decisions.
They are not rejecting the system. To do that they would need to leave and go somewhere else. What they, and you, are doing is refusing to participate in the system as it currently functions and by doing so allowing the system to put a fascist in charge, a fascist that will happily wipe them out.
What they, and you, are doing is refusing to participate in the system as it currently functions and by doing so allowing the system to put a fascist in charge, a fascist that will happily wipe them out.
I disagree. OP is 1000% aware of the results of the actions they support. They are actively participating in assisting fascists. I refuse to let them act like they're sitting this out because they're so enlightened about the duopoly and whatever nonsense they want to bitch about.
They are actively participating in assisting fascists.
All that because I'm not voting for your candidate? lmao
Also, half of the country isn't voting for your candidate. So are you implying that entirely half of the United States are "actively participating in assisting fascists"?!
So half of America is fascist now?! Say what, mate?!
I'm still not gonna vote for your candidate, but wow, you seem really angry and confused.
I couldn't care less who you vote for. Your propaganda crusade for 3rd party candidates is where I get annoyed. Luckily you're incredibly transparent so I don't think you're all that effective.
No one's angry with you. We just know what you are and it's just annoying that we have to cover your spew of nonsense when we could be having much more productive and interesting discussions.
This ends another pointless conversation with a child. Have a nice day!
Your propaganda crusade for 3rd party candidates is where I get annoyed. Luckily you’re incredibly transparent so I don’t think you’re all that effective.
So if I'm as ineffective as you say, then there's really no reason for you to be annoyed or concerned. Right? I mean, if I'm not making an impact, then what's the harm in just letting me post what I want where I want?
No one’s angry with you.
Um...
We just know what you are
And what am I?
it’s just annoying that we have to cover your spew of nonsense when we could be having much more productive and interesting discussions.
You don’t actually have to deal with my "spew of nonsense" at all. You can simply choose not to interact, skip reading my posts, or block me altogether if it bothers you that much. No one’s forcing you to comment here, right?
Again, I think you’re underestimating them. These workers and voters are educated, smart, and fully aware of the stakes—they are doing what they want to. And I support them voting for whoever they want to vote for. As I support you voting for whoever you want to.
I trust them. This is all bullshit hype. The vast majority of everyone are too smart to fall for this Jill Stein spoiler bullshit. But you keep pumping it. We'll see how it turns out in the end. It's keeping you busy at least.
But you keep pumping it.
Friend, I didn't write the article--I just posted it. How is that "pumping it"?
Are you implying that there should be news we shouldn't post or not allow to be seen? Do you know what that's called?
The real source is a German news site called "Tag24 News." Why did you link to an MSN reprint of it?
In any event, Jill Stein is almost certainly a Russian asset, and the American version of the Green Party bears little resemblance to the European Greens, both in policy positions and credibility. Ellison has every right to express his opinions about them.
Because the MSN link is what comes up in my newsfeed and is the version I read. So I posted. In any event, Tag24News is a legit news site as well
You're welcome to your opinion, but I don't think she is.
Not really opinion at this point...
Putin’s Shill Stein wants Nato disbanded, the US to give up their SC veto, and revoke weapons to help Ukraine defend itself while simultaneously forcing ‘peace’ (subjugation) negotiations with russia.
For those that don’t understand how the Electoral College + FPTP voting works, voting for her means helping donald become president due to the spoiler effect.
2015 Stein breaking bread with Putin, his senior staff, and Mike Flynn (later Trump's national security advisor
More context:
It is still an opinion though.
If anything they did was illegal, then it'd be front page news. And apparently enough people like her that it makes Democrats scared and angry enough to try to block her and spread misinformation about her every chance they get. lol
I personally don't care about that photo or your suspicions about her at all all.
Haven't said she did anything illegal yet. We aren't spreading misinformation. All that is backed up by evidence. You are.
Then report me to the mods, file a complaint with the linked news sources, and/or block me. Also, that photo and damning evidence isn't for you. :D
What misinformation am I spreading? I just posted a news article. If you believe any part of the article is inaccurate, I encourage you to reach out to the news organization that published it.
Why would I report you to the mods?! I haven't seen you do anything in this thread that's against community rules. I'm fine with you disagreeing with me. I disagree with you too.
I'm not even voting for her. lol
For one, you claim that Democrats are angry or worried about the Green Party and you KNOW (because I and many Many people have proven this to you beyond the point of rational disagreement) they aren't. What they are worried or angry about is the danger of the spoiler effect of these BS 3rd party candidates, with zero chance of winning the presidency, causing the Republicans to win despite almost nobody in these conversations wanting that at all.
You've blatantly said you do not care about the spoiler effect and the only reason someone with your alleged intentions wouldn't care about increasing the chances of Trump winning is if that was what your real goal was.
If they're not angry or worried, then why is there such a strong reaction when I post news about the Green Party? Why go to such lengths to remove them from the ballot? It seems like there's a lot of effort being made for something they're supposedly unconcerned about.
So, they are worried and angry about the Green Party, just for different reasons. That seems to contradict what you just said.
The Trump accusation is not only incorrect but painfully unoriginal. The real threat is the Duopoly and capitalism. Whether it’s Trump or Harris, both serve the same ruling class keeping workers down.
If you think I'm voting for Trump, then you haven't noticed any of my posts. lol Have a look: https://lemmy.world/u/UniversalMonk?page=1&sort=New&view=Posts
No one believes you're a socialist
Your denial is meaningless. The spoiler effect is proven. Voting 3rd party has cost elections. If you really don't want Trump to win you'd vote Harris, say you were, and clearly state that reality gives you no real choice otherwise you'd vote for whomever. An intelligent stance that acknowledges that you are forced to choose a lesser evil lest 5th grader logic result in the greater evil winning.
If there were primaries, or any 3rd party actually had a chance then by all means vote your conscience. That isn't the case so act your age instead of petulantly voting against your interests just because thinking is hard. Trump will thank you otherwise.
You want to discuss all the mistakes and perversions of/in the system that got us stuck in this mess with no way out that isn't a cop-out I will stand by you and commiserate fullheartedly. But get real in the meantime.
No thanks. I'll vote for who I want to and who best aligns with my values. And that's not Trump or Harris. :)
And when Trump wins because Harris lost a battleground state by 700 votes a progressive 3rd party got instead what will you say when the US starts sending weapons to Israel en masse?
Why would I say anything? I'm not voting for Trump.
If the Democrats are truly worried about losing votes to a third party, they could adopt policies that actually reflect the values of those voters instead of just expecting us to fall in line.
My vote isn’t driven by fear. If Harris loses by such a slim margin, it’s not the fault of third-party voters—it’s the Democrats’ failure to address the issues that matter to us third-party voters.
This you?
They've hired Trump lawyer Jay Sekulow to try to force their way onto the ballot in Nevada, a swing state. They're so obviously compromised.
Heavens no, not ballot representation!
True representation would be an electoral system without the spoiler effect.
Why are you fighting so hard to retain the spoiler effect?
I'm explicitly wanting to get rid of the spoiler effect.
No, see jill stein wants to get rid of first past the post. Democrats fight to keep competitors off the ballot because they benefit from first past the post. You are explicitly fighting to keep it.
And I want to be able to jump over entire buildings with a single bound, and shoot lasers out of my eyes.
Talk is cheap when you've lost every single presidential election you've entered, especially losing so bad as to never get any electoral college nominations.
No, I vote in the primaries at every chance to get as left of a candidate nominated as possible. The way to move forward is to take over the DNC. That starts at the ground level.
Just going for the presidency is a failed strategy. So all we can do at this time is harm reduction at that level.
You vote exclusively for candidates that actively support and benefit from first past the post, and are fighting against a candidate that actively supports getting rid of it. You cant claim to want to get rid of it
That isn't true, and I just told you. This sort of change happens at the local level, at the lower ranks of government.
The president is not the only elected position in government.
Not really. Stein is probably barely even on the Harris campaign's radar. The actual, real fight is against Trump.
Sure I can, just watch me:
I want to get rid of the spoiler effect, and will help to do so by voting for candidates at the local level who support better voting methods, when such candidates are available.
Such candidates are available, youre arguing they shouldnt be allowed to run because theyll spoil the party that benefits tremendously from first past the post.
Isn't if funny how posters here are saying she and her party are not competent or important, but they are working hard to keep her off the ballot?
So she hires a lawyer, then they cry about that.
It seems like there’s a lot of effort being made for something they’re supposedly unconcerned about. lol
Doesn't bother me at all.
Translation: I'm covering for her as a part time job
Someone should explain to those Muslims in Wisconsin that Stein literally cannot win their state. She has no electors. State law requires that a candidates electors be nominated by state office holders. The greens have no state office holders so they cannot nominate any electors. Even if Stein were to somehow win the state, she can't get the electoral votes for Wisconsin. All she can do is again steal enough votes from Harris to give the election to Trump.
Yeah those muslims just need to rollover and accept democrats or republicans murdering them
A Democrat or a Republican is going to win either way. Only an insane person or an idiot would vote for someone with no chance of winning rather than for the candidate who will do the least harm.
So you’re saying all these Muslim voters are either insane or idiots for making their own choice? That doesn’t sound very respectful.
If they vote third party then yes, I do think they're idiots or insane people. But I also have faith they'll make the right decision when election day finally comes.
Wow, alright then. Gee, I can’t imagine why anyone on the fence wouldn’t be racing to join the Democrats. I mean, with such welcoming, open-minded attitudes like yours, who wouldn’t want to? Lmao.
I'm not a Democrat, I'm just planning to vote for one. Because I'm not a fucking idiot.
So everyone who isn't voting for Harris is "a fucking idiot"? Wow. Ok, then. lmao
Assuming you've paid any attention at all to the last 8 years of American politics, then yeah, not voting for Harris is fucking idiotic.
So you think half of the United States is idiotic. Wow. Ok, then.
Thinking Trump voters are idiots isn't exactly a hot take.
Isn't exactly rising above and being the better side either.
I'm not a Trump voter, so I don't care. But calling half of the country idiots doesn't exactly warm people up to your cause.
Anyone genuinely dedicated to a socialist or environmental cause would pretty clearly see the danger posed by a Trump presidency.
I think you’re underestimating them. These workers and voters are educated, smart, and fully aware of the stakes—they don’t need anyone to explain anything.
To imply they can't think for themselves is an insult to their intelligence. They’re not pawns of the duopoly; they know exactly what they’re doing by rejecting the system that’s failed them time and time again. And I support them and their decisions.
They are not rejecting the system. To do that they would need to leave and go somewhere else. What they, and you, are doing is refusing to participate in the system as it currently functions and by doing so allowing the system to put a fascist in charge, a fascist that will happily wipe them out.
I disagree. OP is 1000% aware of the results of the actions they support. They are actively participating in assisting fascists. I refuse to let them act like they're sitting this out because they're so enlightened about the duopoly and whatever nonsense they want to bitch about.
All that because I'm not voting for your candidate? lmao
Also, half of the country isn't voting for your candidate. So are you implying that entirely half of the United States are "actively participating in assisting fascists"?!
So half of America is fascist now?! Say what, mate?!
I'm still not gonna vote for your candidate, but wow, you seem really angry and confused.
I couldn't care less who you vote for. Your propaganda crusade for 3rd party candidates is where I get annoyed. Luckily you're incredibly transparent so I don't think you're all that effective.
No one's angry with you. We just know what you are and it's just annoying that we have to cover your spew of nonsense when we could be having much more productive and interesting discussions.
This ends another pointless conversation with a child. Have a nice day!
So if I'm as ineffective as you say, then there's really no reason for you to be annoyed or concerned. Right? I mean, if I'm not making an impact, then what's the harm in just letting me post what I want where I want?
Um...
And what am I?
You don’t actually have to deal with my "spew of nonsense" at all. You can simply choose not to interact, skip reading my posts, or block me altogether if it bothers you that much. No one’s forcing you to comment here, right?
Again, I think you’re underestimating them. These workers and voters are educated, smart, and fully aware of the stakes—they are doing what they want to. And I support them voting for whoever they want to vote for. As I support you voting for whoever you want to.
I trust them. This is all bullshit hype. The vast majority of everyone are too smart to fall for this Jill Stein spoiler bullshit. But you keep pumping it. We'll see how it turns out in the end. It's keeping you busy at least.
Friend, I didn't write the article--I just posted it. How is that "pumping it"?
Are you implying that there should be news we shouldn't post or not allow to be seen? Do you know what that's called?
I'm not even voting for Jill Stein, brother.
Good. Fuck Russian asset Jill stein
I'm not voting for her, so your distaste for her doesn't matter to me at all. You are def free to your opinion.
This you?
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