Dumb plan, Hamas. Israel will just bomb you to shits in record time...
Edit: y'all don't get it. This gives Israel an excuse for total war. You ain't seen nothing yet.
That's what Israel is doing, has been doing, and would continue to do whether the hostages are returned or not.
If it makes no difference either way then they should free the hostages simply because it's the right thing to do...
It really shouldn't be hard or controversial to support the innocent people on both sides of this horrible war. Free the damn hostages and stop the bombings.
The hostages are there for a reason, and that's to give Hamas more leverage during the eventual ceasefire negotiations. There are Palestinian prisoners they need to release and goods they need to get through the blockade, among other things.
Palestinian hostages* who were detained unlawfully under false pretenses.
So you're saying they need them for a ceasefire deal? Then why no negotiations for a ceasefire?
Because Israel doesn't want a ceasefire. They want a complete military victory. That's why Hamas just said no more hostage releases until cessation of hostilities, to pressure them to accept a ceasefire.
a reason, and that's to give Hamas more leverage during the eventual ceasefire negotiations
I don't find "leverage" and political bargaining to be a good reason to take innocent people hostage.
But even if I did, I think Hamas has a pretty fucking terrible track record of negotiating anything on the behalf of Palestinians. The October 7th terror attacks brought Gaza from the frying pan into the fire, and I doubt there will be anything resembling a ceasefire until the hostages are freed.
The morally right thing for Hamas to do is to free the hostages and to turn over anybody who was involved in the October 7th terror attacks. The morally right thing for Israel to do is to implement an immediate ceasefire, facilitate aide into Gaza, and call back all illegal settlers in the West Bank. Will either side do the right thing? I don't know, probably not, but I can only hope.
I don't find "leverage" and political bargaining to be a good reason to take innocent people hostage.
It is when that political bargaining is necessary to get people out of permanent "administrative detention", and when people need... Well, basically everything (including food and water) in Gaza (that's always the case because of the blockade). Remember that half of Gazans are malnourished.
But even if I did, I think Hamas has a pretty fucking terrible track record of negotiating anything on the behalf of Palestinians.
They don't, though. Remember Sheikh Jarrah? Hamas takes hostages because it's the only thing that works.
Israel has said it'd end the war if Hamas surrenders and releases the hostages.
Seems like the only way to prevent Palestinian deaths at this point
Is it?
Because Israel was killing them before Hamas ever existed, and they won’t suddenly stop after.
Jews and Muslims fighting? You don't say?!
Israel has stated their intent and there's enough international pressure on them that they'll keep to it.
I'm all ears about how you think Hamas prolonging the war for months more will benefit the Palestinians.
It won't, but it will kill some Israelis as well, and that's a sacrifice internet armchair generals are willing to make.
Israel is Nazi Germany, they won’t stop anything until they’re forced to.
I mean, its not like they weren’t bombing the shit out of gaza in the first place, killing hundreds every day. I’d be surprised if Israel could bomb gaza any harder than they already are.
"Israel" is committed to destroying Gaza and getting revenge by killing as many people as possible. Hamas doesn't want that, and Hamas has the hostages. So simply: want to destroy Gaza? Your hostages will go down with it.
Israel is committed to destroying the army of Hamas, and to prevent it from ruling Gaza. It is not committed to destroying Gaza.
Hamas could end the war any minute. Pressuring Israel to let Hamas survive instead of pressuring Hamas to surrender and return the hostages is being pro-Hamas, not pro Palestinian.
It is not committed to destroying Gaza.
Then why did they destroy Gaza worse than the allies destroyed WWII Germany?
I think it is quite obvious: to destroy the Hamas infrastructure and to kill as many Hamas militants as possible, while minimising Israeli casualties.
If you have a better suggestion for how to destroy Hamas' ability to continue to attack Israel I'm sure they would love to hear it.
Probably peace, but Netanyahu has been running on not doing that for decades.
Pressuring Israel to let Hamas survive instead of pressuring Hamas to surrender and return the hostages is being pro-Hamas, not pro Palestinian.
"Not wanting the murderous government that is actively finding ways to kill and displace Palestinians in places that it controls to take control of Gaza is being pro-Hamas"
Hamas are the extremists of the Palestinians, the IDF and "Israeli" government are the extremists of the "Israeli" people. Why would I want the IDF to take control of Gaza?
Hamas surrender would PREVENT Israel from occupying Gaza. If Hamas wouldn't have taken the hostages in the first place Israel wouldn't have attacked Gaza.
Is the current Hamas strategy working for the Gazans civilians?
So yes, if you want to support Gazans civilians, and prevent Israel from occupying Gaza, you should push Hamas to surrender and return the hostages.
Dumb plan, Hamas. Israel will just bomb you to shits in record time...
Edit: y'all don't get it. This gives Israel an excuse for total war. You ain't seen nothing yet.
That's what Israel is doing, has been doing, and would continue to do whether the hostages are returned or not.
If it makes no difference either way then they should free the hostages simply because it's the right thing to do...
It really shouldn't be hard or controversial to support the innocent people on both sides of this horrible war. Free the damn hostages and stop the bombings.
The hostages are there for a reason, and that's to give Hamas more leverage during the eventual ceasefire negotiations. There are Palestinian prisoners they need to release and goods they need to get through the blockade, among other things.
Palestinian hostages* who were detained unlawfully under false pretenses.
So you're saying they need them for a ceasefire deal? Then why no negotiations for a ceasefire?
Because Israel doesn't want a ceasefire. They want a complete military victory. That's why Hamas just said no more hostage releases until cessation of hostilities, to pressure them to accept a ceasefire.
I don't find "leverage" and political bargaining to be a good reason to take innocent people hostage.
But even if I did, I think Hamas has a pretty fucking terrible track record of negotiating anything on the behalf of Palestinians. The October 7th terror attacks brought Gaza from the frying pan into the fire, and I doubt there will be anything resembling a ceasefire until the hostages are freed.
The morally right thing for Hamas to do is to free the hostages and to turn over anybody who was involved in the October 7th terror attacks. The morally right thing for Israel to do is to implement an immediate ceasefire, facilitate aide into Gaza, and call back all illegal settlers in the West Bank. Will either side do the right thing? I don't know, probably not, but I can only hope.
It is when that political bargaining is necessary to get people out of permanent "administrative detention", and when people need... Well, basically everything (including food and water) in Gaza (that's always the case because of the blockade). Remember that half of Gazans are malnourished.
They don't, though. Remember Sheikh Jarrah? Hamas takes hostages because it's the only thing that works.
Israel has said it'd end the war if Hamas surrenders and releases the hostages.
Seems like the only way to prevent Palestinian deaths at this point
Is it?
Because Israel was killing them before Hamas ever existed, and they won’t suddenly stop after.
Jews and Muslims fighting? You don't say?!
Israel has stated their intent and there's enough international pressure on them that they'll keep to it.
I'm all ears about how you think Hamas prolonging the war for months more will benefit the Palestinians.
It won't, but it will kill some Israelis as well, and that's a sacrifice internet armchair generals are willing to make.
Israel is Nazi Germany, they won’t stop anything until they’re forced to.
Like they've already been doing the whole time?
I mean, its not like they weren’t bombing the shit out of gaza in the first place, killing hundreds every day. I’d be surprised if Israel could bomb gaza any harder than they already are.
"Israel" is committed to destroying Gaza and getting revenge by killing as many people as possible. Hamas doesn't want that, and Hamas has the hostages. So simply: want to destroy Gaza? Your hostages will go down with it.
Israel is committed to destroying the army of Hamas, and to prevent it from ruling Gaza. It is not committed to destroying Gaza.
Hamas could end the war any minute. Pressuring Israel to let Hamas survive instead of pressuring Hamas to surrender and return the hostages is being pro-Hamas, not pro Palestinian.
Then why did they destroy Gaza worse than the allies destroyed WWII Germany?
I think it is quite obvious: to destroy the Hamas infrastructure and to kill as many Hamas militants as possible, while minimising Israeli casualties.
If you have a better suggestion for how to destroy Hamas' ability to continue to attack Israel I'm sure they would love to hear it.
Probably peace, but Netanyahu has been running on not doing that for decades.
"Not wanting the murderous government that is actively finding ways to kill and displace Palestinians in places that it controls to take control of Gaza is being pro-Hamas"
Hamas are the extremists of the Palestinians, the IDF and "Israeli" government are the extremists of the "Israeli" people. Why would I want the IDF to take control of Gaza?
Hamas surrender would PREVENT Israel from occupying Gaza. If Hamas wouldn't have taken the hostages in the first place Israel wouldn't have attacked Gaza.
Is the current Hamas strategy working for the Gazans civilians?
So yes, if you want to support Gazans civilians, and prevent Israel from occupying Gaza, you should push Hamas to surrender and return the hostages.