Thankfully, intellectual dishonesty doesn't cause searing abdominal pain, as you'd probably spend a lot of your waking moments curled up in fetal position.
The kids formed the club themselves with TST's approval. Should they not be allowed to form a club if they want to?
Exactly. These clubs are not being put into schools by some outside corporation. They are made by students, with faculty support, like all clubs. The Satanic Temple provides support to these groups, because without an organization like them to back them up, clubs like this would all get shut down by bigoted principals and PTA groups.
Do you think elementary school kids woke up one day and decided to spontaneously join together with other elementary school kids to reach out to the local Satanist chapter to invite them to bring more schoolwork?
Come on. Kids just want to play. The Christians, the Satanists and especially the kids parents are all complicit in using children for political gain.
My daughter has been an outspoken atheist since she was six years old since she told her grandmother, "grandma, when I stay over at your house on the weekends, I don't want to go to church with you, because I don't really believe in god." And none of it has been at my prompting in any way. I haven't been quiet to her about what I personally think, but I also have made it very clear to her that other people think other things and it's up to her to figure out what she believes. She's still an atheist at 13. She's far too shy to open such a club. If my shitty private elementary school existed now and I knew about those clubs by the time I was in fifth or sixth grade, I would have formed one because I wasn't shy. You do not give kids enough credit.
So you're agreeing that the kids probably didn't start an after school Satanists club by themselves?
The article says that it's elementary school, so we're not talking about 13 year olds. These kids are much younger.
I'm glad to hear that your daughter is living her truth.
No, I'm literally saying the opposite. I have no idea how you got that from what I said.
You said that your daughter didn't start a special interest group because she was shy. Similarly, 8 or 9 year old kids probably didn't seek out the local chapter of the Satanists. Someone told them to do this.
I don't think that any religion should be doing that.
Got it. You didn't read my entire post. I'll help you out:
If my shitty private elementary school existed now and I knew about those clubs by the time I was in fifth or sixth grade, I would have formed one because I wasn’t shy.
How would you have known about the Satanists when you were in fifth grade?
Fucking Christ. Did you not even read what I pasted from my original post?
I did read it. Just because I disagree with you doesn't mean that I'm illiterate or unintelligent.
You didn't disagree with me. Your question showed an ignorance of what I said.
Me: "If my shitty private elementary school existed now and I knew about those clubs by the time I was in fifth or sixth grade"
You: "How would you have known about the Satanists when you were in fifth grade?"
I literally said I didn't know about the clubs. I also wouldn't know about TST because they were founded in 2012 and, believe it or not, I'm not 12 years old.
So since you really need an answer to your silly question, I wouldn't have known about The Satanic Temple or the After School Satan Club when I was in fifth grade because I wasn't in fifth grade last year.
I'm saying that you wouldn't have known about the Satanists or any other religion unless an adult told you about it. I'm opposed to preaching to kids.
I'm also a parent (though my kids aren't yet at school age) and I'm frustrated with how public schools have become a battleground for the political gain of warring groups. A Satanist after school club is another example.
You mentioned that you went to private school. I also went to a Catholic private school until third grade so I understand your frustration with them.
The Satanic Temple only goes to schools that have other relgious groups opening after school programs. They preach the belief to follow science and reason and find the best/most logical answers instead of listening to absurd unproven beliefs (such as dinosaurs not being real). They do NOT believe in Satan or preach that any such thing is good.
The name is a little tongue/cheek with the whole idea that some Christians would call any who don't act as sheep and act as part of the heard that follows the lord, their shepherd is satan or guided by satan in disguise.
Yeah, that's my point. Their whole organization is trolling and I don't think that they should use kids for publicity. Nor do I think that they should attempt to influence kids at all, just like every other religion.
Imagine being such a terminal simp for anti-American thuggery that you think standing up for civil rights is "trolling."
I'm standing up for the kids right to live in peace and not be coerced to fulfill the insecurities of any religious group.
No one is forcing any kids to join this club. It is an entirely optional after school activity.
I don't believe that elementary school children sought the local chapter of the Satanists by themselves. Someone invited themselves into the kids lives and I think that's inappropriate.
I don't think that children should be involved in extracurricular religious activity until they're 16. Just like they shouldn't be involved in sexual activity until they're 18, despite being physically capable.
I can see what you're driving towards. It'd be far more ideal for us adults to hash this out, yeah?
I wish they'd remove Under God from the damn pledge of allegiance, but it seems schools are the next major battleground (sometimes literally) for all things political.
You mean bring the pledge back to its original form pre 1954? It wasn't there before, it was added incase people don't know or forgot.
It was written in 1892 without religion
Should get rid of the pledge completely tbh.. Having children pledge allegiance to the country (or, bizarrely, a symbolic piece of cloth) is some North Korea type shit on par with Trump’s military parade..
As a German, let me tell you that it's very much fascist.
Agreed.
Frankly I think the pledge should be gone altogether. It's fuckin weird.
That's exactly my point. Insecure religions (including the Satanists) use schools as a battleground for their political goals. It shouldn't be allowed.
Religion should be something that's between the kids and the parents (for better or for worse) until the kids are matured, maybe 16 years old at least.
It's generally been the case that the parents are the most unbiased wellwishers of the kids, something that religious organizations often cannot do.
Insecure religions (including the Satanists)
It's a non-religious group that chose an ironic name. The name is the only part that is even close to "trolling", everything else is dedicated to science and reasoning.
It's generally been the case that the parents are the most unbiased
Hahahahaha. You actually think parents are unbiased? That's hilarious.
How are they influenced, and they aren't used being used for publicity from what I can tell from the article. One of the first posts here does a pretty good summary of the article that it centers more around the outrage than actually the after-school program itself.
They're not. It's a dishonest argument.
You're confusing Satanists with Pastafarians. The latter ones are indeed grumpy, annoying, one-trick pony trolls, while Satanists are an inclusive, rational, social movement which has understood that levity is serious business.
There's no "and" here. It's only the Christians exploiting the children and anybody who claims otherwise is a motherfucking liar.
Well, there's whoever keeps paying to get rid of child labor laws
I wish that I could be so simple. My personal experience is that all humans are prone to hypocrisy and the tendency to exploit others. The Satanists are not exceptional.
The fascists are the ones doing that. Complain to them, not us.
By teaching them science and critical thinking? Those poor children.....
They have classes for science and critical thinking in school. Do you think the Satanists are more qualified than the department of education?
They also have classes for reading, but that wouldn't rule out a book club. I'm sure they have gym classes too, and are allowed to have after school sports "clubs". This may surprise you, but some kids are more intelligent than average, or have a higher level of interest in a subject than is taught in classes. After school, optional clubs allow them to explore those interests.
Some kids are sexually mature at 9, 10, or 11 years old. But we don't allow them to procreate because we know that they're not emotionally and intellectually developed enough to understand the repercussions of sex.
Similarly, in my opinion, religion is something that should not be pushed onto children, especially in a public school setting, until they are mature enough to contemplate the issues. It's categorically different from other special interests like sports.
Though there are also many sports fanatics who use kids and sometimes damage their well-being, but that's another subject...
Similarly, in my opinion, religion is something that should not be pushed onto children, especially in a public school setting, until they are mature enough to contemplate the issues.
THIS CLUB IS NOT RELIGIOUS!
You have seen nearly a dozen posts pointing this out and you still ignore it and continue to spout blatantly false statements.
It's also not being pushed on anyone. It is an optional after school club. Enough with the lies and blatant misrepresentiation of the facts already.
I'm pretty sure that the Satanists claim to be a religion. That's their whole thing. That's how they get the right to do their trolling.
I'm totally cool with their religion, just as much as anyone else's.
I don't believe that elementary school children sought out the Satanists on their own volition. Someone coerced the kids into doing it.
You would be wrong.
So they don't believe in doing it... but they do it.
Explain to me how it's not just trolling?
Again, I don't believe that elementary school children sought out the Satanists on their own. It would be almost impossible for 8 or 9 year old kids to know that the Satanists exists.
Love using kids as political pawns
Thankfully, intellectual dishonesty doesn't cause searing abdominal pain, as you'd probably spend a lot of your waking moments curled up in fetal position.
The kids formed the club themselves with TST's approval. Should they not be allowed to form a club if they want to?
Exactly. These clubs are not being put into schools by some outside corporation. They are made by students, with faculty support, like all clubs. The Satanic Temple provides support to these groups, because without an organization like them to back them up, clubs like this would all get shut down by bigoted principals and PTA groups.
Do you think elementary school kids woke up one day and decided to spontaneously join together with other elementary school kids to reach out to the local Satanist chapter to invite them to bring more schoolwork?
Come on. Kids just want to play. The Christians, the Satanists and especially the kids parents are all complicit in using children for political gain.
My daughter has been an outspoken atheist since she was six years old since she told her grandmother, "grandma, when I stay over at your house on the weekends, I don't want to go to church with you, because I don't really believe in god." And none of it has been at my prompting in any way. I haven't been quiet to her about what I personally think, but I also have made it very clear to her that other people think other things and it's up to her to figure out what she believes. She's still an atheist at 13. She's far too shy to open such a club. If my shitty private elementary school existed now and I knew about those clubs by the time I was in fifth or sixth grade, I would have formed one because I wasn't shy. You do not give kids enough credit.
So you're agreeing that the kids probably didn't start an after school Satanists club by themselves?
The article says that it's elementary school, so we're not talking about 13 year olds. These kids are much younger.
I'm glad to hear that your daughter is living her truth.
No, I'm literally saying the opposite. I have no idea how you got that from what I said.
You said that your daughter didn't start a special interest group because she was shy. Similarly, 8 or 9 year old kids probably didn't seek out the local chapter of the Satanists. Someone told them to do this.
I don't think that any religion should be doing that.
Got it. You didn't read my entire post. I'll help you out:
How would you have known about the Satanists when you were in fifth grade?
Fucking Christ. Did you not even read what I pasted from my original post?
I did read it. Just because I disagree with you doesn't mean that I'm illiterate or unintelligent.
You didn't disagree with me. Your question showed an ignorance of what I said.
Me: "If my shitty private elementary school existed now and I knew about those clubs by the time I was in fifth or sixth grade"
You: "How would you have known about the Satanists when you were in fifth grade?"
I literally said I didn't know about the clubs. I also wouldn't know about TST because they were founded in 2012 and, believe it or not, I'm not 12 years old.
So since you really need an answer to your silly question, I wouldn't have known about The Satanic Temple or the After School Satan Club when I was in fifth grade because I wasn't in fifth grade last year.
I'm saying that you wouldn't have known about the Satanists or any other religion unless an adult told you about it. I'm opposed to preaching to kids.
I'm also a parent (though my kids aren't yet at school age) and I'm frustrated with how public schools have become a battleground for the political gain of warring groups. A Satanist after school club is another example.
You mentioned that you went to private school. I also went to a Catholic private school until third grade so I understand your frustration with them.
Who? Christians?
Yes. And Christians.
The Satanic Temple only goes to schools that have other relgious groups opening after school programs. They preach the belief to follow science and reason and find the best/most logical answers instead of listening to absurd unproven beliefs (such as dinosaurs not being real). They do NOT believe in Satan or preach that any such thing is good.
The name is a little tongue/cheek with the whole idea that some Christians would call any who don't act as sheep and act as part of the heard that follows the lord, their shepherd is satan or guided by satan in disguise.
Yeah, that's my point. Their whole organization is trolling and I don't think that they should use kids for publicity. Nor do I think that they should attempt to influence kids at all, just like every other religion.
Imagine being such a terminal simp for anti-American thuggery that you think standing up for civil rights is "trolling."
I'm standing up for the kids right to live in peace and not be coerced to fulfill the insecurities of any religious group.
No one is forcing any kids to join this club. It is an entirely optional after school activity.
I don't believe that elementary school children sought the local chapter of the Satanists by themselves. Someone invited themselves into the kids lives and I think that's inappropriate.
I don't think that children should be involved in extracurricular religious activity until they're 16. Just like they shouldn't be involved in sexual activity until they're 18, despite being physically capable.
I can see what you're driving towards. It'd be far more ideal for us adults to hash this out, yeah?
I wish they'd remove Under God from the damn pledge of allegiance, but it seems schools are the next major battleground (sometimes literally) for all things political.
You mean bring the pledge back to its original form pre 1954? It wasn't there before, it was added incase people don't know or forgot.
It was written in 1892 without religion
Should get rid of the pledge completely tbh.. Having children pledge allegiance to the country (or, bizarrely, a symbolic piece of cloth) is some North Korea type shit on par with Trump’s military parade..
As a German, let me tell you that it's very much fascist.
Agreed.
Frankly I think the pledge should be gone altogether. It's fuckin weird.
That's exactly my point. Insecure religions (including the Satanists) use schools as a battleground for their political goals. It shouldn't be allowed.
Religion should be something that's between the kids and the parents (for better or for worse) until the kids are matured, maybe 16 years old at least.
It's generally been the case that the parents are the most unbiased wellwishers of the kids, something that religious organizations often cannot do.
It's a non-religious group that chose an ironic name. The name is the only part that is even close to "trolling", everything else is dedicated to science and reasoning.
Hahahahaha. You actually think parents are unbiased? That's hilarious.
How are they influenced, and they aren't used being used for publicity from what I can tell from the article. One of the first posts here does a pretty good summary of the article that it centers more around the outrage than actually the after-school program itself.
They're not. It's a dishonest argument.
You're confusing Satanists with Pastafarians. The latter ones are indeed grumpy, annoying, one-trick pony trolls, while Satanists are an inclusive, rational, social movement which has understood that levity is serious business.
There's no "and" here. It's only the Christians exploiting the children and anybody who claims otherwise is a motherfucking liar.
Well, there's whoever keeps paying to get rid of child labor laws
I wish that I could be so simple. My personal experience is that all humans are prone to hypocrisy and the tendency to exploit others. The Satanists are not exceptional.
The fascists are the ones doing that. Complain to them, not us.
By teaching them science and critical thinking? Those poor children.....
They have classes for science and critical thinking in school. Do you think the Satanists are more qualified than the department of education?
They also have classes for reading, but that wouldn't rule out a book club. I'm sure they have gym classes too, and are allowed to have after school sports "clubs". This may surprise you, but some kids are more intelligent than average, or have a higher level of interest in a subject than is taught in classes. After school, optional clubs allow them to explore those interests.
Some kids are sexually mature at 9, 10, or 11 years old. But we don't allow them to procreate because we know that they're not emotionally and intellectually developed enough to understand the repercussions of sex.
Similarly, in my opinion, religion is something that should not be pushed onto children, especially in a public school setting, until they are mature enough to contemplate the issues. It's categorically different from other special interests like sports.
Though there are also many sports fanatics who use kids and sometimes damage their well-being, but that's another subject...
THIS CLUB IS NOT RELIGIOUS!
You have seen nearly a dozen posts pointing this out and you still ignore it and continue to spout blatantly false statements.
It's also not being pushed on anyone. It is an optional after school club. Enough with the lies and blatant misrepresentiation of the facts already.
I'm pretty sure that the Satanists claim to be a religion. That's their whole thing. That's how they get the right to do their trolling.
I'm totally cool with their religion, just as much as anyone else's.
I don't believe that elementary school children sought out the Satanists on their own volition. Someone coerced the kids into doing it.
You would be wrong.
So they don't believe in doing it... but they do it.
Explain to me how it's not just trolling?
Again, I don't believe that elementary school children sought out the Satanists on their own. It would be almost impossible for 8 or 9 year old kids to know that the Satanists exists.
"Love using kids as political pawns"
Are you a republican?
No, I'm not. I don't even know what this has to do with Republicans...