Funny how none of the solutions to try and curb illegal immigration fall on the business owners who knowingly hire them. Enact jail time for those business owners, and see how quickly the demand dries up. No coincidence that most of these business owners are Republican. They want a permanent underclass of vulnerable workers they can exploit.
Funny how none of the solutions to try and curb illegal immigration fall on the business owners who knowingly hire them.
No coincidence that most of these business owners are Republican.
That's more a correlation than causation. Blue collar business owners tend to skew Republican because Republicans cater to the anti-union and anti-poc proclivities of socially conservative white nationalist land barons. When Dems were the party of the apartheid-era South, they dominated this same voting block.
But the brutal treatment of migrant workers has had a socio-economic impact on Gulf Coast states. Florida's orange production has dropped from 240M pounds in 2004 to 16M in 2024. Supplies of meat and dairy produce have sagged as ranchers from Nevada to Alabama to Iowa are running out of cheap exploitable laborers. More and more businesses are turning to the carceral state to provide field hands, but even that doesn't work well in states where people aren't having kids to lock up and the existing prisoner base is aging past the point of functional field labor.
Even with the most sadistic and malicious attitude towards your fellow humans, this isn't a profitable economic policy. It is being driven largely be the outright terror wealthier white land owners have of the young Spanish speaking migrants that dominate their workforce.
The White House is finalizing plans for a U.S.-Mexico border clampdown that would shut off asylum requests and automatically deny entrance to migrants once the number of people encountered by American border officials exceeded a new daily threshold, with President Joe Biden expected to sign an executive order as early as Tuesday, according to four people familiar with the matter.
The president has been weighing additional executive action since the collapse of a bipartisan border bill earlier this year.
The Biden administration has grown ever more conservative on border issues as the president faces ceaseless criticism from Republicans and there are large numbers of migrants crossing into the U.S. from Mexico who are not easily returned, especially as global displacement grows from war, climate change and more.
sounds like a right leaning conservative to me
what about additional executive action on anything else like women's rights, minimum wage, or anything that could count toward the human good
Neoliberals have coopted the term progressive, just like they coopt, whitewash, and scrub away all of our movements.
This is a failure of Congress. Biden only has three options. Turn them away at the border, detain, or nothing. Nothing defaults to current immigration policy of busing from border cities to sanctuary cities. Sanctuary cities are at capacity, so the migrants would be homeless upon arrival. What do you propose he do? Turn away, detain, or leave them homeless in overcrowded sanctuary cities?
what about additional executive action on anything else like women’s rights
Your "minimum wage" link states multiple times that it is only for federal employees, not for the general population. There are still states where you can get less than 10$/h.
The President cannot unilaterally increase the minimum wage, which is spelled out in the Fair Labor Standards Act. Only Congress can amend that law. Biden's Executive Order went as far as he's legally allowed to go.
Greetings from $8.75/hr land
Greeting from $7.25/hr land!
Well yeah he's a Federal Executive office holder. Is anyone confused about that? Anyone not understand the difference between state and federal government?
sounds like a right leaning conservative to me
There have been leftists who were also anti-immigration. Cesar Chavez campaigned against illegal immigration as he saw those immigrants as a main source of scab labor. The main economic argument against an open border policy is that it depresses wages.
It just happens to be that the right uses anti-immigration more as it is the easiest economic giveaway to low wage citizens.
Sounds like you don’t know the difference between presidential and congressional power.
Only Congress can issue immigration reform and increase the budget for sanctuary cities.
POTUS can only allow entry, detain, or turn away at the border.
Our sanctuary cities are at capacity.
What do you want him to do?
Most progressive president since FDR?
Really shows how low that bar was/is
Thats whats crazy. I just want these people to stop gaslighting us into thinking Biden was even within pissing distance to FDR.
That was way worse actually, 2/3 of them were US citizens
I agree. I don't know which is more interesting, that the progressive standard-bearer unilaterally executed one of the most egregious civil rights violations of the 20th century, or that progressive voters have completely forgotten that he did.
Yep, you're completely right. FDR's bad immigration stance makes Biden's good. Yep, that is exactly how logic works.
That's quite literally not what I said or implied.
Then what exactly were you implying?
FDR's policy was bad, deplorable even. Biden's policy is also bad.
Migrants come here for jobs. Until employers who violate federal and state laws on employment of unauthorized residents are held criminally liable, migrants will keep coming.
This is not rocket science. Any other measure is red herring to keep two party circle jerking going.
Bipartisanship only moves in one direction, and it is right.
Fuck this. These people are fleeing horrible situations. We should be welcoming everyone to this country.
But won't you think of Kevin from Nowhere, Idaho and his very real fear that droving gangs of bloodthirsty, drug-fuelled migrants will vote in his local elections? THINK OF THE KEVINS! /s
Situations often caused by US policy like the drug war, or as a result of climate change. Climate refugees are only going to get more common too.
No, when you have sex traffickers and drug cartels coming over, I don't think that's very smart. What I think needs to happen is to lower the limit of how long it takes to become a citizen of this country, that's what really needs to change.
we should ban drug cartels and sex trafficers then if policy is so good at keeping them out
They already are banned. I wonder, why there is a fentanyl crisis in the US?
Is it because of migrant caravans? enlighten this non racist
Yeah but then you probably say you want to ban all guns as well, just so that people can come over undocumented and bring over whatever they want. Again, doesn't sound smart. What about all the people who did it the legal way? I don't think having completely open borders is a great idea. It's why I advocated for lessen the amount of time it takes to become a citizen, so they can do it the legal way and don't have to get deported. You don't even want people to be documented? You're just going to let anyone in from one of the countries with the highest crime rates?
As much as it must appeal to all sorts of criminals to see so many of their peers represented in the US government I believe most asylum seekers aren't just looking for new criminal job opportunities.
Also yes I'm what I would describe as a pragmatic anarchist so indeed we should eventually get rid of all national borders.
You're a very scared little person aren't you. Everyone is out to get what little you have. Why don't you take a look at what your own countrymen are taking from you? Why are you worried about migrants when your own homegrown capitalists are robbing you blind.
Your threat isn't Brown people my friend.
Nobody brought up race except you. And ah, I can see now, you're an anarchist? Enjoy making below $15/hour then chump. Cry about why nobody gives you opportunities, its because your mind is absolutely smooth as butter. I will gladly keep all my firearms, thank you very much for giving me more reasons to do so. I just love how you immediately pulled the race card, that's how you try to win all your conversations eh? Pathetic.
Oh I wonder what kind of people pass through the US Mexico border to enter the US.
You don't have to worry about my financial situation I'm doing extremely well compared to the American median, which should be much higher than it is, but aren't billionaires so cool? Which one is your favorite?
Maybe I'll sneak in through your northern border and spook you later. I might not look so recognizably foreign though so be careful of every single person you see we're coming for you: boo!
Migrants are given one year of free housing to decide if they want to naturalize or move to another nation. Current immigration law leaves hosting up to individual cities, without Federal mandates for participation. Sanctuary cities are at capacity, and are using a turnstile system to allow new migrants in as existing migrants leave.
POTUS can control detainment or turn away migrants at the border with the power of Executive Order.
Turning migrants away resulted in increased deaths in Mexico, while detainment is clearly not reasonably hospitable to people in need.
Honest question- besides the obvious solution of congressional immigration reform giving migrants the right to assisted stay in places other than sanctuary cities, what should Biden do? Turn away, detain, or overcrowd sanctuary cities?
We could increase funding and streamline the path to citizenship to meet the levels of immigration instead of letting a massive backlog build up that will only make the problem worse.
I agree. That the congressional immigration reform that I mentioned. Only Congress can increase the budget. Biden repealed Title 42 and left the border open while pressing Congress for that exact legislation. They haven’t legislated a full reform since 1986. The reform passed in 2019 was for minors and an amendment tied to border security. Trump twisted the mandatory acceptance for minors into Title 42, detaining them while deporting their parents.
So with congressional reform options aside, what do you think Biden should do?
He could not actively make it worse by implementing counterproductive limitations.
You’re vaguely stating what he shouldn’t do. Which of his three options do you think is best? Turn away, detain, or nothing and overcrowd sanctuary cities with homeless migrants?
Biden wouldn't be overcrowding sanctuary cities, that would be the result of obstruction in congress.
That is also the least worst thing he could do, nothing at all. All of the other options are worse because of congressional obstruction.
It’s not about blame, it’s about resources. If a sanctuary city states they’re at capacity, they no longer can provide housing for the migrants.
Doing nothing results in following existing immigration policy. Migrants would be bused from border cities to sanctuary cities. Without housing, the migrants would be homeless in the overcrowded sanctuary cities. Are you suggesting that’s the better option for migrants, or suggesting he does it to deflect the blame back on to Congress?
Releasing that pressure by denying migrants the proper asylum process means that the problem can be ignored for longer instead of the sanctuary cities applying more pressure for actual change.
This is a counterproductive band aid.
They’ve been asking for support since last year. Congress failed to pass a bill.
Republucans obstructed the bill they asked for. It will take longer than a year to overcome that hurdle.
It’s been almost forty years since comprehensive immigration reform was passed. The problem is Congress, not POTUS. Biden only has the three options I mentioned above.
He has a fourth option to do nothing about it because that is better than those three options. Sometimes doing nothing is better than doing something.
I know this seems like needless cruelty towards the most marginalized people in our society, but think about it this way:
If Biden accomplishes the republican agenda better than Trump, that means moderate republicans will vote Biden. And everyone on the left has to vote Biden anyway. This is why Biden has the highest approval rating ever.
It's crazy how the president can get around congress whenever they want to, but only to do bad things.
Edit: In case anyone didn't get the sarcasm, moderate republicans will never vote for diet-fascism when they can have the real thing, and carrying out the republican agenda just makes your base stay home, since the only argument that can be made is "Well Trump might do the same thing but worse". This is both cruel and dumb.
I know this seems like needless cruelty towards the most marginalized people in our society but the Democrat candidate acting like a Republican is actually a really good thing.
Funny how none of the solutions to try and curb illegal immigration fall on the business owners who knowingly hire them. Enact jail time for those business owners, and see how quickly the demand dries up. No coincidence that most of these business owners are Republican. They want a permanent underclass of vulnerable workers they can exploit.
They do... kinda. This problem peaked under COVID, when you had fruit rotting in fields thanks to our sudden crack down on migrant travel. We saw a similar sudden drop in available farm labor back in 2017, when Trump was ramping up border enforcement against seasonal laborers.
That's more a correlation than causation. Blue collar business owners tend to skew Republican because Republicans cater to the anti-union and anti-poc proclivities of socially conservative white nationalist land barons. When Dems were the party of the apartheid-era South, they dominated this same voting block.
But the brutal treatment of migrant workers has had a socio-economic impact on Gulf Coast states. Florida's orange production has dropped from 240M pounds in 2004 to 16M in 2024. Supplies of meat and dairy produce have sagged as ranchers from Nevada to Alabama to Iowa are running out of cheap exploitable laborers. More and more businesses are turning to the carceral state to provide field hands, but even that doesn't work well in states where people aren't having kids to lock up and the existing prisoner base is aging past the point of functional field labor.
Even with the most sadistic and malicious attitude towards your fellow humans, this isn't a profitable economic policy. It is being driven largely be the outright terror wealthier white land owners have of the young Spanish speaking migrants that dominate their workforce.
sounds like a right leaning conservative to me
what about additional executive action on anything else like women's rights, minimum wage, or anything that could count toward the human good
Neoliberals have coopted the term progressive, just like they coopt, whitewash, and scrub away all of our movements.
This is a failure of Congress. Biden only has three options. Turn them away at the border, detain, or nothing. Nothing defaults to current immigration policy of busing from border cities to sanctuary cities. Sanctuary cities are at capacity, so the migrants would be homeless upon arrival. What do you propose he do? Turn away, detain, or leave them homeless in overcrowded sanctuary cities?
https://www.research.va.gov/currents/0324-Executive-Order-for-Womens-Health-built-on-VA-research.cfm
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/government-contracts/eo14026
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2023/10/30/fact-sheet-president-biden-issues-executive-order-on-safe-secure-and-trustworthy-artificial-intelligence/
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2024/04/12/executive-order-on-covid-19-and-public-health-preparedness-and-response/
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2024/03/06/executive-order-on-scaling-and-expanding-the-use-of-registered-apprenticeships-in-industries-and-the-federal-government-and-promoting-labor-management-forums/
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2023/12/21/executive-order-on-adjustments-of-certain-rates-of-pay-3/
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2023/07/28/executive-order-on-federal-research-and-development-in-support-of-domestic-manufacturing-and-united-states-jobs/
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2023/06/23/executive-order-on-strengthening-access-to-affordable-high-quality-contraception-and-family-planning-services/
Your "minimum wage" link states multiple times that it is only for federal employees, not for the general population. There are still states where you can get less than 10$/h.
The President cannot unilaterally increase the minimum wage, which is spelled out in the Fair Labor Standards Act. Only Congress can amend that law. Biden's Executive Order went as far as he's legally allowed to go.
Greetings from $8.75/hr land
Greeting from $7.25/hr land!
Well yeah he's a Federal Executive office holder. Is anyone confused about that? Anyone not understand the difference between state and federal government?
There have been leftists who were also anti-immigration. Cesar Chavez campaigned against illegal immigration as he saw those immigrants as a main source of scab labor. The main economic argument against an open border policy is that it depresses wages.
It just happens to be that the right uses anti-immigration more as it is the easiest economic giveaway to low wage citizens.
Sounds like you don’t know the difference between presidential and congressional power.
Only Congress can issue immigration reform and increase the budget for sanctuary cities.
POTUS can only allow entry, detain, or turn away at the border.
Our sanctuary cities are at capacity.
What do you want him to do?
Most progressive president since FDR?
Really shows how low that bar was/is
Thats whats crazy. I just want these people to stop gaslighting us into thinking Biden was even within pissing distance to FDR.
Its just such bad faith to equate the two.
FDR had his anti-immigrant blemishes, too.
Several, actually.
That was way worse actually, 2/3 of them were US citizens
I agree. I don't know which is more interesting, that the progressive standard-bearer unilaterally executed one of the most egregious civil rights violations of the 20th century, or that progressive voters have completely forgotten that he did.
Yep, you're completely right. FDR's bad immigration stance makes Biden's good. Yep, that is exactly how logic works.
That's quite literally not what I said or implied.
Then what exactly were you implying?
FDR's policy was bad, deplorable even. Biden's policy is also bad.
Are we agreeing on this?
Serious question: who was a more progressive POTUS since FDR?
There hasnt been, what with the rightward drift of the Democratic party. The problem is he is not a progressive.
We've done better on two fronts, gay and civil rights.
Aside from that we are more right leaning by every other metric. Him being 80% less progressive than FDR is not a flex.
Edit: have fun losing this election. Yall are so out of touch with the people if you think Joe Biden is progressive.
Immigration is a net positive that boosts the economy and helps build the labor force and supercharge entrepreneurship.
But also, border encounters are higher than they've been since the 1990s, illegal immigration redistributes wealth from those who compete against immigrants to those who employ immigrants (i.e. upward), and the influx of illegal immigrants is placing a disproportionate financial strain on state and local governments along the border. In the short term, and whether we like it or not, increased net immigration puts downward pressure on wages. If Democrats hope to be competitive in places like Arizona, Texas, and Florida, they need to meaningfully address what voters are saying is the most important problem facing this country right now.
Migrants come here for jobs. Until employers who violate federal and state laws on employment of unauthorized residents are held criminally liable, migrants will keep coming.
This is not rocket science. Any other measure is red herring to keep two party circle jerking going.
Bipartisanship only moves in one direction, and it is right.
Fuck this. These people are fleeing horrible situations. We should be welcoming everyone to this country.
But won't you think of Kevin from Nowhere, Idaho and his very real fear that droving gangs of bloodthirsty, drug-fuelled migrants will vote in his local elections? THINK OF THE KEVINS! /s
Situations often caused by US policy like the drug war, or as a result of climate change. Climate refugees are only going to get more common too.
No, when you have sex traffickers and drug cartels coming over, I don't think that's very smart. What I think needs to happen is to lower the limit of how long it takes to become a citizen of this country, that's what really needs to change.
we should ban drug cartels and sex trafficers then if policy is so good at keeping them out
They already are banned. I wonder, why there is a fentanyl crisis in the US?
Is it because of migrant caravans? enlighten this non racist
Yeah but then you probably say you want to ban all guns as well, just so that people can come over undocumented and bring over whatever they want. Again, doesn't sound smart. What about all the people who did it the legal way? I don't think having completely open borders is a great idea. It's why I advocated for lessen the amount of time it takes to become a citizen, so they can do it the legal way and don't have to get deported. You don't even want people to be documented? You're just going to let anyone in from one of the countries with the highest crime rates?
As much as it must appeal to all sorts of criminals to see so many of their peers represented in the US government I believe most asylum seekers aren't just looking for new criminal job opportunities.
Also yes I'm what I would describe as a pragmatic anarchist so indeed we should eventually get rid of all national borders.
You're a very scared little person aren't you. Everyone is out to get what little you have. Why don't you take a look at what your own countrymen are taking from you? Why are you worried about migrants when your own homegrown capitalists are robbing you blind.
Your threat isn't Brown people my friend.
Nobody brought up race except you. And ah, I can see now, you're an anarchist? Enjoy making below $15/hour then chump. Cry about why nobody gives you opportunities, its because your mind is absolutely smooth as butter. I will gladly keep all my firearms, thank you very much for giving me more reasons to do so. I just love how you immediately pulled the race card, that's how you try to win all your conversations eh? Pathetic.
Oh I wonder what kind of people pass through the US Mexico border to enter the US.
You don't have to worry about my financial situation I'm doing extremely well compared to the American median, which should be much higher than it is, but aren't billionaires so cool? Which one is your favorite?
Maybe I'll sneak in through your northern border and spook you later. I might not look so recognizably foreign though so be careful of every single person you see we're coming for you: boo!
Migrants are given one year of free housing to decide if they want to naturalize or move to another nation. Current immigration law leaves hosting up to individual cities, without Federal mandates for participation. Sanctuary cities are at capacity, and are using a turnstile system to allow new migrants in as existing migrants leave.
POTUS can control detainment or turn away migrants at the border with the power of Executive Order.
Turning migrants away resulted in increased deaths in Mexico, while detainment is clearly not reasonably hospitable to people in need.
Honest question- besides the obvious solution of congressional immigration reform giving migrants the right to assisted stay in places other than sanctuary cities, what should Biden do? Turn away, detain, or overcrowd sanctuary cities?
We could increase funding and streamline the path to citizenship to meet the levels of immigration instead of letting a massive backlog build up that will only make the problem worse.
I agree. That the congressional immigration reform that I mentioned. Only Congress can increase the budget. Biden repealed Title 42 and left the border open while pressing Congress for that exact legislation. They haven’t legislated a full reform since 1986. The reform passed in 2019 was for minors and an amendment tied to border security. Trump twisted the mandatory acceptance for minors into Title 42, detaining them while deporting their parents.
https://guides.loc.gov/latinx-civil-rights/irca
https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/6
So with congressional reform options aside, what do you think Biden should do?
He could not actively make it worse by implementing counterproductive limitations.
You’re vaguely stating what he shouldn’t do. Which of his three options do you think is best? Turn away, detain, or nothing and overcrowd sanctuary cities with homeless migrants?
Biden wouldn't be overcrowding sanctuary cities, that would be the result of obstruction in congress.
That is also the least worst thing he could do, nothing at all. All of the other options are worse because of congressional obstruction.
It’s not about blame, it’s about resources. If a sanctuary city states they’re at capacity, they no longer can provide housing for the migrants.
Doing nothing results in following existing immigration policy. Migrants would be bused from border cities to sanctuary cities. Without housing, the migrants would be homeless in the overcrowded sanctuary cities. Are you suggesting that’s the better option for migrants, or suggesting he does it to deflect the blame back on to Congress?
Releasing that pressure by denying migrants the proper asylum process means that the problem can be ignored for longer instead of the sanctuary cities applying more pressure for actual change.
This is a counterproductive band aid.
They’ve been asking for support since last year. Congress failed to pass a bill.
Republucans obstructed the bill they asked for. It will take longer than a year to overcome that hurdle.
It’s been almost forty years since comprehensive immigration reform was passed. The problem is Congress, not POTUS. Biden only has the three options I mentioned above.
He has a fourth option to do nothing about it because that is better than those three options. Sometimes doing nothing is better than doing something.
Limiting migration out of the country, that is.
I know this seems like needless cruelty towards the most marginalized people in our society, but think about it this way:
If Biden accomplishes the republican agenda better than Trump, that means moderate republicans will vote Biden. And everyone on the left has to vote Biden anyway. This is why Biden has the highest approval rating ever.
It's crazy how the president can get around congress whenever they want to, but only to do bad things.
Edit: In case anyone didn't get the sarcasm, moderate republicans will never vote for diet-fascism when they can have the real thing, and carrying out the republican agenda just makes your base stay home, since the only argument that can be made is "Well Trump might do the same thing but worse". This is both cruel and dumb.
I know this seems like needless cruelty towards the most marginalized people in our society but the Democrat candidate acting like a Republican is actually a really good thing.
Classic Liberals