So many resources could be saved...

Aopen@discuss.tchncs.de to Technology@lemmy.world – 108 points –

Todays electronics is fast. Imagine how much natural resources could be saved if manufacturers delivered software support until device is truly unusable due to hardware limitations.

This post is being written on 3 years old flagship killer that has never dropped any frame, reached 0% battery or crashed but wont get system updates anymore because...

seemingly 3 years old 7nm flagship SoC is too weak to be used for next decade?

🇪🇺🙏

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I think a good step towards the school would be forcing bootloader unlocking to be available. Just like any other computer allow people root access to their own devices. This opens up the ability to install any operating system A user desires.

Part of the problem is the chip manufacturers. They provide precompiled device drivers for one version of one kernel only, no source, and refuse to update them ever again. It can be a bit difficult to update the rest of the software stack when there's no way to shore up the foundations. Device manufacturers need to start insisting on updated drivers and/or provided driver source code before they buy the chips to put in their phones, tablets, and other systems.

Good luck on that.

A lot of it is still on the phone manufacturers. If Fairphone can provide software support for their 2015 model 8 years later, then I have a hard time believing that a company with a 32 billion USD net income cannot provide more than 3 years of software updates. Looking at you, Samsung!

https://support.fairphone.com/hc/en-us/articles/11351328932497-Update-to-the-latest-Fairphone-OS

Oh, there's undoubtedly plenty of blame to go around. Samsung is one of the few manufacturers large enough that they might be able to apply some pressure to Qualcomm and its ilk, and they aren't doing it, or at least aren't doing it enough.

Fairphone also deliberately chose an industrial variant of the Snapdragon 778G just so they could get by the issue mentioned by nyan.

Samsung also manufactures their own memory and chipset. They could provide long support for those chipset if they wanted to, but that would means giving up short term profit. When smartphone sales truly stagnates and people no longer buy a new phone after 2-3 years anymore, manufacturers may consider this strategy to differentiate from their competitors.

How is company X supposed to sell you model 2.0? 3? 2.0 RepairCare?

Planned obsolescence. Profits. Shareholders.

Weirdly this was the biggest reason I switched from Android to iPhone. I’d used Android since the OG Motorola Droid, and pretty much upgraded every two years as soon as the contract allowed because after two years the phone would be buggy and unresponsive. Then I got a Google Pixel 2 and it was the first phone I’d had where it was still fine after two years, so I kept it. Even after 3 years it was still fine and I had no reason to upgrade, except it stopped receiving security fixes. My wife’s ex-husband is a professional hacker and his default mode is extortion, so trying to keep things up to date on security is important. Still, I was pretty disappointed that I was being pushed into buying a new phone for no reason other than Qualcomm and Google not wanting to support it.

Around the same time we had to get my stepdaughter’s iPhone repaired. It struck me that here she was using an iPhone 6 that was 6 years old at the time but still had parts available and was still getting software updates from the manufacturer. It didn’t have all the latest and greatest hardware but it was still perfectly functional and there was no need to upgrade unless we wanted to. As expensive as phones were getting, it felt harder and harder to justify buying something that was starting to cost $6-800 new and then have to do it again 2-3 years later. Was it ideal switching? No, and there were things I missed from Android, although they’ve slowly caught up (Apple finally added support to change the default notification sound just last year), but it works and at least I feel like I’m not wasting money on hardware that’s designed to break and go to a landfill in two years.

You do you, I couldn't live without the customisable and control I get with Android.

There’s certainly some trade-offs, although really not as much as I expected. Overall a lot of the software seems better on the iPhone than what I had on Android (except for most Google apps), so it hasn’t mattered as much as I would’ve thought. Everyone has to figure out their own pros and cons, but the longevity of Apple phones and what that means for a consumer I think is unappreciated.

I wish the knowledge and methods to flash devices with new/modified firmware was a common standard i take good care of my tech, so much beautiful technology in perfect condition just sitting there unusable because its software is to old.

To solve this, I'd ask: What can we do to incentivize graceful degradation instead of planned obsolescence?

Planned obsolescence really isn't as big of a thing as people think it is. The problem is that people want the newest shiny thing, and they don't want to pay premium prices for something that'll last a long time.

So, manufacturers will use parts that are less durable to fit a price point. It's kinda like server hardware vs consumer hardware.

Now, development has even less to do with planned obsolescence. Development is expensive, and if only 1% of your users is using V8 while 99% are on v12, it doesn't make sense to keep supporting V8.

This is even a thing with open source software. For example, even though RHEL7 doesn't hit EOL until June, many software vendors have already stop providing updates (curl, for example).

Same thoughts. I'm surprised how many power is casually laying in my hand. That it can play stuff like Genshin, PUBG, Fortnite. It couldn't be even thought off when Fruit Ninja, Angry Birds released to sell us the first fun of capacitive screens, gestures. These resources are to last years.

The only objection is I just don't care about having the same phone, getting used to it anymore for they all look the same, I occasionaly take other person's phones at work and when eating out. They are now easier to jump from one device to another. And while it's good, maybe, that you aren't chained to it, it warms you up to buy another piece of plastic. My older Symbian devices were something to adjust to, and honor, and cry over they eventual death, and that phone? I can go to the store to buy another and I won't even sigh. They are ideal portals into the web with no personality besides a phone case. And it's not that fun.

I'd honestly sell some belongings to have a modern specs phone with a keyboard and a linux. These awkward, heavy beasts of the past were so damn cool. Writing just isn't the same with touch-screen, as well as emulation. If there was one, I'd have bought replacement batteries and have used it for decades.

We could have taken that approach with cars as well. Who needs more than 20HP anyway? We should have just kept repairing the Model T and been happier with what we have, right?

Maybe the EU 🇪🇺 should legislate that German car companies should cease to produce new cars and instead commit to repairing what they have already produced, for free presumably?

Take your disgust at this post and now apply it to what you're talking about 😂.

You have very confidently missed the point of the post.

Do they stop making oil and air filters for your car after 3 years? Do the seatbelts artificially refuse to connect after 3 years? Lol

Who needs more than 20HP anyway?

20 hursepurses is maybe pushing it, but 30 to 50 kW would actually be plenty if we kept our cars lightweight and aerodynamically efficient instead of insisting on 3-ton ugly boxes with the frontal area of a house.

Hell, for a single-person lightweight (<40 kg empty weight) electrical vehicle that is expected to go no faster than 30 km/h (often legally limited to 25km/h here in EU) and requires no license to operate, 250 to 300 W is more than enough.

Lotus had it right.

OP is talking about software updates, and you are talking about one of the few products nowadays where decades old models can be maintained without excessive cost.

In most countries the Model T is exempt from any kind of safety inspection and classes of tax, making it an excellent option for the maliciously compliant engineer 😁

Maybe the EU 🇪🇺 should legislate that German car companies should cease to produce new cars and instead commit to repairing what they have already produced, for free presumably?

Why not? While they're at it they can start making buses and trains.

Mercedes in particular absolutely nailed bus design with their Citaro, then promptly proceeded to make a hideous looking successor 🤢 perhaps their car designers can fix that

This response is nonsensical. Auto manufacturers support their vehicles for decades after a car is made.

Your car gets serviced for free for decades after you've bought it? Damn I've been ripped off all these years.

You pay to get your car serviced but with your phone you don't even have that option. When the manufacturer drops support, you don't even have the option to pay for prolonged software support.