Just like every other red state, they will continue to make insubstantial, tiny changes. Then, with no approved map available at election time, they will revert back to the original illegal map.
This is how it's always done now. Conservatives do not respond to court orders or pacifism. They respond only to force.
Looks like federal judges are going to appoint a neutral third party to redraw the district's this time, they've learned that trick.
Of course, Alabama is appealing to the supreme court, and we know which way they lean, so.
Mentioned this elsewhere, but SCOTUS is the one who threw out the original map. AL is essentially defying SCOTUS here and so I doubt they’ll be friendly to the cause.
At the same time, it was the supreme court that actually ruled their maps illegal. I could totally see them saying "oh good you raised the effective black population from 30-40% that's good enough," but it doesn't seem outside the realm of possibility for them to kick Alabama out again.
They ignored SCOTUS the first time, they’ll keep on ignoring the courts this time too
It's truly a stupid move -- SCOTUS is deeply unpopular and very conservative. If Alabama Republicans refuse to abide by its decision, they set a precedent that anyone can. And Republicans stand to lose a whole lot more if we start ignoring SCOTUS.
Bang up job reading the article. The panel directed a special master to draw a new map.
Bang up job not paying attention to how conservatives operate. Also, bang up job not recognizing that conservatives do not respond to anything short of physical force. And bang up job giving conservatives the benefit of the doubt that they will obey a court-issued map. Bang up job!
neat
Mom and Dad are fighting again.
Goddamnit Kim, get back to bed right this instant!
An independent group has been tapped to make the next iteration of maps thankfully.
And conservatives will ignore that as well.
They can try, but they'll regret it. I can think of a handful of recent SCOTUS decisions we should ignore if they want to play that game.
Use bad map for election, now election is possible fraudulent, in a win they claim tapering by dems, in a loss they say oh we used a bad map need to vote again.
Okay Satan, do you really want another civil war? I don't. I don't want to see my friends and loved ones die because of a bunch of political bullshit fueled by greed, power and hate.
I wouldn't even be in favor of whatever government won on either side. Our nation's values are rotten to the core much like what seems to be the entirety of the world's governments, corporations and any other significantly sized organization.
The internet just seems to be fueling more vitriol than ever. We could try coming together and fighting the establishment with shared common sense bipartisan goals while keeping the bullshit out of it but then there's no free lunch for the people with all the money.
I agree the billionaire class and corporatocracy are the common enemy, but conservatives defend them loyally. So if you really want to regulate, limit, tax or dismantle that common enemy, you'll need to go through conservatives to get there. And they aren't budging. They never will. They are the minions of our enemy and will gleefully kill you and your family to defend them. In fact, they are doing that right now by aggressively heating the earth while mocking normal people for panicking about it.
The next civil war will not be fought in trenches. It will be fought at cafe's and on freeways as conservatives commit further acts of domestic terrorism. Conservatism is a plague in desperate need of a cure.
I agree the billionaire class and corporatocracy are the common enemy, but conservatives defend them loyally.
Can you honestly say the wealthy of this nation only play on one party line? I honestly think both sides are just as bad. The political games mostly distract you from the big wins of the ultra-wealthy. When regulation flip flops all the time the winners are in the businesses who effectively write the laws that politicians peddle. It's rare there are experts writing laws that get passed who are not compensated by the very industry they are crafting the laws to regulate.
I learned a lot about public policy in college and what you see in the news isn't generally the key points, it's just whatever outrage fuel they can put on the fire for their respective audience. Regulation and loopholes are rarely easily understood things, it's all for people who understand the complexities of tax code and legalese which isn't most people.
I think the "both sides" you are referring to are just two flavors of conservatism... Neo-liberals are conservatives. They have more tact, but they are not progressives.
Progressives want to regulate corporations, limit wealth hoarding, tax billionaires and help human beings other than themselves. Progressives are not the problem I speak of.
Conservatives, including neo-liberals, are killing the rest of us for their profit. They both go on the same smoldering pile when the time comes.
By both sides I was talking about the two principal political parties. Sure some amount may not be corrupt but the end result is that pro-big money policies reign supreme.
It's hard to talk about any other possible spectrum of theoretical politics because only the two parties really make an impact, you have to look at it collectively. State and Federal legislature has the exact same problems but on different scales.
It's all about looking at it objectively, not idealistically. Ideals aren't the real world. Humans are corrupt, all of us. The level of corruption varies but generally is proportional to the amount of authority we are given to make decisions with financial impacts.
Republicans: "if you are not voting for us, then we don't want you to vote easily, or at all. And we want you to use a map that makes sure your vote doesn't matter."
Stop voting for Republicans, they don't believe in our democracy.
If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy.
They never did.
CHARGE THEM
they’re going to keep doing this until the goddamn election
Agreed.
Hold them in contempt of court and let them spend a week in jail all expenses paid.
They’re just trying to run out the clock so that, come election time, they’ll throw their hands up in the air and go “Welp, guess we’ll have to use the old map”.
Having a special master draw up a map is great in theory, until SCOTUS stays the lower ruling and drawn map and decides to not rule on the case until after elections (if they even were inclined to rule in favor of a fair map to begin with).
I will say that while I have little faith in SCOTUS, this map was originally thrown out by the SCOTUS decision upholding Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act. It’s very unlikely they’d immediately allow the AL legislature to defy them so brazenly.
Yeah, to show that AL can ignore them would show the country that they can be ignored. More likely they'll follow their process then call for the justice department to charge them with treason so they can be brought before them and made an example of.
let them spend a week in jail all expenses paid.
All expenses paid? But that's SOCIALISM!!
Bill them for their time in the clink, it's what they would want.
(/s)
This is the best summary I could come up with:
MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) — Federal judges said Tuesday that they will draft new congressional lines for Alabama after lawmakers refused to create a second district where Black voters at least came close to comprising a majority, as suggested by the court.
The Republican-controlled Alabama Legislature hastily drew new lines this summer after the U.S. Supreme Court in June upheld the panel’s finding that the map — that had one majority-Black district out of seven in a state where 27% of residents are Black — likely violated the U.S. Voting Rights Act.
The law requires the creation of an additional district that affords Black Alabamians, like everyone else, a fair and reasonable opportunity to elect candidates of their choice.
“What I hear you saying is the state of Alabama deliberately chose to disregard our instructions to draw two majority-Black districts or one where minority candidates could be chosen,” Judge Terry Moorer said.
The state argued that justices did not require the creation of a second majority-Black district if doing so would mean violating traditional redistricting principles, such as keeping communities of interest together.
Abha Khanna, an attorney representing one group of plaintiffs in the case, argued during the hearing that Alabama chose “defiance over compliance” and urged the judges to reject the state’s map.
The original article contains 562 words, the summary contains 213 words. Saved 62%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Now do the rest of the Deep South.
I doubt it will happen. Alabama will just ignore them and do what they want and the courts will let them get away with it. They won't do what they're supposed to unless those in charge are thrown in prison and the people draw the maps themselves and don't let anyone in the government have any involvement.
Per the ruling:
"Accordingly, the Special Master and cartographer are DIRECTED to commence work forthwith on a remedial map. Instructions shall follow by separate order.”
You can always rely on Alabama politicians to do the right thing after they've repeatedly made no effort to change racist behavior/norms and the Federal government forces them to comply.
I don't know whether to cry or laugh that this happens all the fucking time with them. I don't think they realize that there's no silent majority of racists behind their back, and that the actual majority of society sees them as racist dregs incapable of not being racist.
They aren't doing the right thing though, the court is bypassing them to have a special master draw up a fair map instead.
Right, at the behest of the federal government. They'll never do the right thing
What happens when Alabama draws the districts wrong again?
From the article,
Federal judges said Tuesday that they will draft new congressional lines for Alabama ... A special master will be tapped to draw new districts for the state, the judges said. Alabama is expected to appeal the decision to the U.S. Supreme Court.
So, unless the Supreme Court overturns this ruling, they won't get that option.
Yup, it’s out of their hands. Plus this map was originally thrown out by SCOTUS, so I doubt they’re going to overturn what is basically their own ruling made a few months ago.
One of the few things that unites judges of every political persuasion is that they really, really hate it when people disobey court orders.
Are they gonna throw the state of Alabama in jail for contempt? I wouldn't put it past the assholes who drew the map to just eat any fines because they want to be racist.
We're in a strange new world where authority yields to party over country. It's ingrained so well now that it'll get a lot worse before people rise up to regain country over party.
Is this like the ruling North Carolina straight up ignored? Asking as someone whose vote is essentially worthless because of gerrymandering.
The three judge panel said they’re appointing a special master to draw the new map, meaning that the legislature doesn’t have to approve it (I think, someone correct me if I’m wrong).
FYI it's "whose"
It is hard to have hope in NC, isn't it? My infant daughter and her mother were in a peaceful protest where the county sheriff decided to teargas them, then almost crushed in the ensuing panic, while the actual Klan was driving around flying Trump and Confederate flags and giving fucking coffee to the pigs.
Republicans haven’t learned you can’t get blood from a turnip.
Just like every other red state, they will continue to make insubstantial, tiny changes. Then, with no approved map available at election time, they will revert back to the original illegal map.
This is how it's always done now. Conservatives do not respond to court orders or pacifism. They respond only to force.
Looks like federal judges are going to appoint a neutral third party to redraw the district's this time, they've learned that trick.
Of course, Alabama is appealing to the supreme court, and we know which way they lean, so.
Mentioned this elsewhere, but SCOTUS is the one who threw out the original map. AL is essentially defying SCOTUS here and so I doubt they’ll be friendly to the cause.
At the same time, it was the supreme court that actually ruled their maps illegal. I could totally see them saying "oh good you raised the effective black population from 30-40% that's good enough," but it doesn't seem outside the realm of possibility for them to kick Alabama out again.
They ignored SCOTUS the first time, they’ll keep on ignoring the courts this time too
It's truly a stupid move -- SCOTUS is deeply unpopular and very conservative. If Alabama Republicans refuse to abide by its decision, they set a precedent that anyone can. And Republicans stand to lose a whole lot more if we start ignoring SCOTUS.
Bang up job reading the article. The panel directed a special master to draw a new map.
Bang up job not paying attention to how conservatives operate. Also, bang up job not recognizing that conservatives do not respond to anything short of physical force. And bang up job giving conservatives the benefit of the doubt that they will obey a court-issued map. Bang up job!
neat
Mom and Dad are fighting again.
Goddamnit Kim, get back to bed right this instant!
An independent group has been tapped to make the next iteration of maps thankfully.
And conservatives will ignore that as well.
They can try, but they'll regret it. I can think of a handful of recent SCOTUS decisions we should ignore if they want to play that game.
Use bad map for election, now election is possible fraudulent, in a win they claim tapering by dems, in a loss they say oh we used a bad map need to vote again.
Okay Satan, do you really want another civil war? I don't. I don't want to see my friends and loved ones die because of a bunch of political bullshit fueled by greed, power and hate.
I wouldn't even be in favor of whatever government won on either side. Our nation's values are rotten to the core much like what seems to be the entirety of the world's governments, corporations and any other significantly sized organization.
The internet just seems to be fueling more vitriol than ever. We could try coming together and fighting the establishment with shared common sense bipartisan goals while keeping the bullshit out of it but then there's no free lunch for the people with all the money.
I agree the billionaire class and corporatocracy are the common enemy, but conservatives defend them loyally. So if you really want to regulate, limit, tax or dismantle that common enemy, you'll need to go through conservatives to get there. And they aren't budging. They never will. They are the minions of our enemy and will gleefully kill you and your family to defend them. In fact, they are doing that right now by aggressively heating the earth while mocking normal people for panicking about it.
The next civil war will not be fought in trenches. It will be fought at cafe's and on freeways as conservatives commit further acts of domestic terrorism. Conservatism is a plague in desperate need of a cure.
Can you honestly say the wealthy of this nation only play on one party line? I honestly think both sides are just as bad. The political games mostly distract you from the big wins of the ultra-wealthy. When regulation flip flops all the time the winners are in the businesses who effectively write the laws that politicians peddle. It's rare there are experts writing laws that get passed who are not compensated by the very industry they are crafting the laws to regulate.
I learned a lot about public policy in college and what you see in the news isn't generally the key points, it's just whatever outrage fuel they can put on the fire for their respective audience. Regulation and loopholes are rarely easily understood things, it's all for people who understand the complexities of tax code and legalese which isn't most people.
I think the "both sides" you are referring to are just two flavors of conservatism... Neo-liberals are conservatives. They have more tact, but they are not progressives.
Progressives want to regulate corporations, limit wealth hoarding, tax billionaires and help human beings other than themselves. Progressives are not the problem I speak of.
Conservatives, including neo-liberals, are killing the rest of us for their profit. They both go on the same smoldering pile when the time comes.
By both sides I was talking about the two principal political parties. Sure some amount may not be corrupt but the end result is that pro-big money policies reign supreme.
It's hard to talk about any other possible spectrum of theoretical politics because only the two parties really make an impact, you have to look at it collectively. State and Federal legislature has the exact same problems but on different scales.
It's all about looking at it objectively, not idealistically. Ideals aren't the real world. Humans are corrupt, all of us. The level of corruption varies but generally is proportional to the amount of authority we are given to make decisions with financial impacts.
Republicans: "if you are not voting for us, then we don't want you to vote easily, or at all. And we want you to use a map that makes sure your vote doesn't matter."
Stop voting for Republicans, they don't believe in our democracy.
They never did.
CHARGE THEM
they’re going to keep doing this until the goddamn election
Agreed.
Hold them in contempt of court and let them spend a week in jail all expenses paid.
They’re just trying to run out the clock so that, come election time, they’ll throw their hands up in the air and go “Welp, guess we’ll have to use the old map”.
Having a special master draw up a map is great in theory, until SCOTUS stays the lower ruling and drawn map and decides to not rule on the case until after elections (if they even were inclined to rule in favor of a fair map to begin with).
I will say that while I have little faith in SCOTUS, this map was originally thrown out by the SCOTUS decision upholding Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act. It’s very unlikely they’d immediately allow the AL legislature to defy them so brazenly.
Yeah, to show that AL can ignore them would show the country that they can be ignored. More likely they'll follow their process then call for the justice department to charge them with treason so they can be brought before them and made an example of.
All expenses paid? But that's SOCIALISM!!
Bill them for their time in the clink, it's what they would want.
(/s)
This is the best summary I could come up with:
MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) — Federal judges said Tuesday that they will draft new congressional lines for Alabama after lawmakers refused to create a second district where Black voters at least came close to comprising a majority, as suggested by the court.
The Republican-controlled Alabama Legislature hastily drew new lines this summer after the U.S. Supreme Court in June upheld the panel’s finding that the map — that had one majority-Black district out of seven in a state where 27% of residents are Black — likely violated the U.S. Voting Rights Act.
The law requires the creation of an additional district that affords Black Alabamians, like everyone else, a fair and reasonable opportunity to elect candidates of their choice.
“What I hear you saying is the state of Alabama deliberately chose to disregard our instructions to draw two majority-Black districts or one where minority candidates could be chosen,” Judge Terry Moorer said.
The state argued that justices did not require the creation of a second majority-Black district if doing so would mean violating traditional redistricting principles, such as keeping communities of interest together.
Abha Khanna, an attorney representing one group of plaintiffs in the case, argued during the hearing that Alabama chose “defiance over compliance” and urged the judges to reject the state’s map.
The original article contains 562 words, the summary contains 213 words. Saved 62%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Now do the rest of the Deep South.
I doubt it will happen. Alabama will just ignore them and do what they want and the courts will let them get away with it. They won't do what they're supposed to unless those in charge are thrown in prison and the people draw the maps themselves and don't let anyone in the government have any involvement.
Per the ruling:
"Accordingly, the Special Master and cartographer are DIRECTED to commence work forthwith on a remedial map. Instructions shall follow by separate order.”
You can always rely on Alabama politicians to do the right thing after they've repeatedly made no effort to change racist behavior/norms and the Federal government forces them to comply.
I don't know whether to cry or laugh that this happens all the fucking time with them. I don't think they realize that there's no silent majority of racists behind their back, and that the actual majority of society sees them as racist dregs incapable of not being racist.
They aren't doing the right thing though, the court is bypassing them to have a special master draw up a fair map instead.
Right, at the behest of the federal government. They'll never do the right thing
What happens when Alabama draws the districts wrong again?
From the article,
So, unless the Supreme Court overturns this ruling, they won't get that option.
Yup, it’s out of their hands. Plus this map was originally thrown out by SCOTUS, so I doubt they’re going to overturn what is basically their own ruling made a few months ago.
One of the few things that unites judges of every political persuasion is that they really, really hate it when people disobey court orders.
Are they gonna throw the state of Alabama in jail for contempt? I wouldn't put it past the assholes who drew the map to just eat any fines because they want to be racist.
We're in a strange new world where authority yields to party over country. It's ingrained so well now that it'll get a lot worse before people rise up to regain country over party.
Is this like the ruling North Carolina straight up ignored? Asking as someone whose vote is essentially worthless because of gerrymandering.
The three judge panel said they’re appointing a special master to draw the new map, meaning that the legislature doesn’t have to approve it (I think, someone correct me if I’m wrong).
FYI it's "whose"
It is hard to have hope in NC, isn't it? My infant daughter and her mother were in a peaceful protest where the county sheriff decided to teargas them, then almost crushed in the ensuing panic, while the actual Klan was driving around flying Trump and Confederate flags and giving fucking coffee to the pigs.
Republicans haven’t learned you can’t get blood from a turnip.