The U.N. team said it also received information from institutional and civil society sources and direct interviews, about "sexual violence against Palestinian men and women in detention settings, during house raids and at checkpoints" after Oct. 7. The detention centers were in Israel.
The U.N. team said it raised the allegations with the Israeli Ministry of Justice and Military Advocate General, which said no complaints of sexual violence against members of the Israeli Defense Forces had been received.
One side is a literal terrorist group and the other is supposed to be the beacon of freedom and western values...
But Israel denies it ever happens and not only doesn't investigate reports, they don't actually record them anywhere.
It's state sponsored and approved.
Which explains why the people who have been their victims for generations sink to the same level as their oppressors.
I thought we knew this already
We know that the initial allegations from NYT were completely false and made up. And that there is zero forensic evidence. This just seems like another PR stunt from israel.
Edit: New breaking points video detailing how broken this report is. A big takeaway is this quote from the UN "investigator"herself:
I don't think NYT was the only one making those allegations. They came from many directions afaik.
This just seems like another PR stunt from israel.
This is from an UN team of experts though
NYT hired an ex-IDF soldier to scourge for any allegation of rape. The statements which were made in that article have all been proven false or non-credible as their stories changed multiple times.
As this report contains no additional information or facts it seems they just copy-pasted the NYT stuff.
Uhm, wasn't this a UN specialist trip to the area to gather their own information?
The UN team visited Israel between 29 January and 14 February.
The trip was led by Pramila Patten, the UN Special Representative on Sexual Violence in Conflict.
"The mission team found that there are reasonable grounds to believe that conflict-related sexual violence occurred in multiple locations during the 7 October attacks," the UN report said.
In the report, the UN said it had "found clear and convincing information that sexual violence, including rape, sexualized torture, cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment has been committed against hostages".
She offered zero evidence.
The report does make a convincing case of the sexual violence having been happened.
Based on the information gathered by the mission team from multiple and independent sources, there are reasonable grounds to believe that conflict-related sexual violence occurred during the 7 October attacks in multiple locations across Gaza periphery, including rape and gang rape, in at least three locations. Across the various locations of the 7 October attacks, the mission team found that several fully naked or partially naked bodies from the waist down were recovered – mostly women – with hands tied and shot multiple times, often in the head. Although circumstantial, such a pattern of undressing and restraining of victims may be indicative of some forms of sexual violence.
At the Nova music festival and its surroundings, there are reasonable grounds to believe that multiple incidents of sexual violence took place with victims being subjected to rape and/or gang rape and then killed or killed while being raped. Credible sources described finding 5 murdered individuals, mostly women, whose bodies were naked from their waist down – and some totally naked – tied with their hands behind their backs, many of whom were shot in the head. On Road 232, credible information based on witness accounts describe an incident of the rape of two women by armed elements. Other reported instances of rape could not be verified in the time allotted. The mission team also found a pattern of bound naked or partially naked bodies from the waist down, in some cases tied to structures including trees and poles, along Road 232. In kibbutz Re’im, the mission team further verified an incident of the rape of a woman outside of a bomb shelter and heard of other allegations of rape that could not yet be verified.
You should read the report, it's much more even handed than you give it credit. It notes the issues in their findings, it does bring it all up straight away, goes after two false claims and doesn't claim to be comprehensive proof, but does make the case that from everything they could find out, sexual violence very likely happened.
And I think all such claims shouldn't be dismissed lightly. And from all we know so far, I think it's very likely sexual violence did happen.
The fact that these are included is practically evidence that the report is filled with disproven IDF propaganda and the UN "investigator" did not in fact investigate anything.
It is highly unlikely that sexual assault happened during the attack. Sexual assault always happens after battles are over. Nobody goes on a raping spree while there's an IDF helicopter firing at them.
The fact that all the main claims have been fully debunked proves it. The only people that still buy into this myth are those that want to believe it.
I don't think your article debunks the claims made by the UN Special Representative. From your linked article
The question has never been whether individual acts of sexual assault may have occurred on October 7. Rape is not uncommon in war, and there were also several hundred civilians who poured into Israel from Gaza that day in a “second wave,” contributing to and participating in the mayhem and violence. The central issue is whether the New York Times presented solid evidence to support its claim that there were newly reported details “establishing that the attacks against women were not isolated events but part of a broader pattern of gender-based violence on Oct. 7” — a claim stated in the headline that Hamas deliberately deployed sexual violence as a weapon of war.
NYT reported that the sexual violence was a systematic thing employed by Hamas as a tool while the UN report is about sexual violence having occurred there.
Also the report specifically mentions some of the same claims and says they've been disproven. And how they've done their own interviews and seen the photographic evidence for other things. So it doesn't seem to be the same NYT thing you're focused on.
There was no photographic evidence nor any video evidence such as CCTV or gopro footage. Nor any forensic evidence, No evidence whatsoever. Just more completely made up Zaka-style claims
Credible information was obtained regarding multiple incidents whereby victims were subjected to rape
and then killed. There are further accounts of individuals who witnessed at least two incidents of
rape of corpses of women.
including one case of genital mutilation
of one male soldier and several female soldiers during the attack on the military base, which likewise could not be established.
So the UN is making a wild claim that Hamas was raping corpses. (and what seems to imply chopping off penises?) Yet no forensic evidence was found. it's literally just the same shit from NYT. With the same Zaka people makes. And multiple of these statements look so made-up that the UN already says "no corpses in this condition were found".
There was no photographic evidence nor any video evidence such as CCTV or gopro footage.
I'm talking about this
"The mission made up of Ms. Patten and nine experts – which was not investigative in nature – conducted 33 meetings with Israeli representatives, examining more than 5,000 photographic images and 50 hours of video footage. It conducted 34 confidential interviews including with survivors and witnesses of the 7 October attacks, released hostages, first responders and others."
And the report has it like this, for example
"In the medicolegal assessment undertaken by the mission team of available photos and videos of crime scenes, a few corpses with conspicuously spread legs were observed. These postures could not be adequately explained by, for instance, “postmortem pugilistic posturing” due to burn damage. The reviewed photos and videos further revealed a minimum of twenty corpses with partially or fully exposed intimate body parts such as breasts and genitalia, resulting from the absence, displacement, or tearing of clothing. Also, at least ten distinct corpses displayed indications of bound wrists and/or tied legs."
They are not saying they have videos or photos of acts of rape but rather that they have reviewed photographic evidence such as that that strongly circumstantially suggests sexual violence. With the whole report calling for further investigation based on the photos and videos they've seen.
So the UN is making a wild claim that Hamas was raping corpses.
No. They are reporting of about an "accounts of individuals who witnessed" rape of corpses (not specifically by Hamas). As your quoted part even says, "There are further accounts of individuals who witnessed at least two incidents of rape of corpses of women".
I feel like you don't understand that they're purposefully using that careful language.
Your example is literally just Gal Abdush, The most debunked claim of all.
Why are you writing long comments before having read the debunking of the NYT article?
This is completely, utterly uncontroversial, except by a subset of the extreme far left at war with reality. Let's see where the downvote ratio ends up.
It's hard to believe when israel lies about everything constantly. Once people saw how the 40 babies rumor was being spread by israel, it's normal to be critical of information.
I encourage you to look into how an Israeli soldier saying "1 decapitated, 40 burned" got turned into "40 decapitated" by a game of telephone. The Israeli government never claimed that, and clarified when they got asked by journalists.
That's not really the point here. If you haven't noticed, recently a lot of people on Lemmy have been suggesting that the reports of rape on Oct 7th were made up or propaganda.
The UN saying that it likely happened is important to counter that propaganda.
Similar to if reports of shooting civilians by IDF were being denied but then validated by 3rd party investigators, rational people should rightfully want to see that spread to counter misleading propaganda.
This is like the third time that we're hearing this bullshit. The NYT article did every possible thing they could to find any "evidence" up to the point that they just started making things up.
From the word "likely" it's clear that there is once again no real evidence, just some IDF mouthpieces that got their stories in order.
Where is the UN report by the way? It is not linked in this article which is very poorly sourced.
Read the article and there's zero evidence as before. "Credible circumstantial information", what does that even mean?
Just more Western media doing what they do best, lie on behalf of Israel.
DNA evidence, fingerprints, blood, etc are all "credible circumstantial information". It's a common category of evidence, encompassing pretty much everything except direct testimony.
There's literally video and images thanks to hamas body cams. It's rough going and I doubt you'd watch it.
At the Nova music festival and its surroundings, there are reasonable grounds to believe
that multiple incidents of sexual violence took place with victims being subjected to rape and/or
gang rape and then killed or killed while being raped. Credible sources described finding 5
murdered individuals, mostly women, whose bodies were naked from their waist down – and
some totally naked – tied with their hands behind their backs, many of whom were shot in the
head. On Road 232, credible information based on witness accounts describe an incident of the
rape of two women by armed elements. Other reported instances of rape could not be verified in
the time allotted. The mission team also found a pattern of bound naked or partially naked bodies
from the waist down, in some cases tied to structures including trees and poles, along Road 232.
In kibbutz Re’im, the mission team further verified an incident of the rape of a woman outside of
a bomb shelter and heard of other allegations of rape that could not yet be verified.
One side is a literal terrorist group and the other is supposed to be the beacon of freedom and western values...
But Israel denies it ever happens and not only doesn't investigate reports, they don't actually record them anywhere.
It's state sponsored and approved.
Which explains why the people who have been their victims for generations sink to the same level as their oppressors.
I thought we knew this already
We know that the initial allegations from NYT were completely false and made up. And that there is zero forensic evidence. This just seems like another PR stunt from israel.
Edit: New breaking points video detailing how broken this report is. A big takeaway is this quote from the UN "investigator"herself:
I don't think NYT was the only one making those allegations. They came from many directions afaik.
This is from an UN team of experts though
NYT hired an ex-IDF soldier to scourge for any allegation of rape. The statements which were made in that article have all been proven false or non-credible as their stories changed multiple times.
As this report contains no additional information or facts it seems they just copy-pasted the NYT stuff.
Uhm, wasn't this a UN specialist trip to the area to gather their own information?
She offered zero evidence.
The report does make a convincing case of the sexual violence having been happened.
You should read the report, it's much more even handed than you give it credit. It notes the issues in their findings, it does bring it all up straight away, goes after two false claims and doesn't claim to be comprehensive proof, but does make the case that from everything they could find out, sexual violence very likely happened.
And I think all such claims shouldn't be dismissed lightly. And from all we know so far, I think it's very likely sexual violence did happen.
These are the same "allegations" which NYT gave which have been fully debunked.
The fact that these are included is practically evidence that the report is filled with disproven IDF propaganda and the UN "investigator" did not in fact investigate anything.
It is highly unlikely that sexual assault happened during the attack. Sexual assault always happens after battles are over. Nobody goes on a raping spree while there's an IDF helicopter firing at them.
The fact that all the main claims have been fully debunked proves it. The only people that still buy into this myth are those that want to believe it.
I don't think your article debunks the claims made by the UN Special Representative. From your linked article
NYT reported that the sexual violence was a systematic thing employed by Hamas as a tool while the UN report is about sexual violence having occurred there.
Also the report specifically mentions some of the same claims and says they've been disproven. And how they've done their own interviews and seen the photographic evidence for other things. So it doesn't seem to be the same NYT thing you're focused on.
There was no photographic evidence nor any video evidence such as CCTV or gopro footage. Nor any forensic evidence, No evidence whatsoever. Just more completely made up Zaka-style claims
So the UN is making a wild claim that Hamas was raping corpses. (and what seems to imply chopping off penises?) Yet no forensic evidence was found. it's literally just the same shit from NYT. With the same Zaka people makes. And multiple of these statements look so made-up that the UN already says "no corpses in this condition were found".
I'm talking about this
"The mission made up of Ms. Patten and nine experts – which was not investigative in nature – conducted 33 meetings with Israeli representatives, examining more than 5,000 photographic images and 50 hours of video footage. It conducted 34 confidential interviews including with survivors and witnesses of the 7 October attacks, released hostages, first responders and others."
And the report has it like this, for example
"In the medicolegal assessment undertaken by the mission team of available photos and videos of crime scenes, a few corpses with conspicuously spread legs were observed. These postures could not be adequately explained by, for instance, “postmortem pugilistic posturing” due to burn damage. The reviewed photos and videos further revealed a minimum of twenty corpses with partially or fully exposed intimate body parts such as breasts and genitalia, resulting from the absence, displacement, or tearing of clothing. Also, at least ten distinct corpses displayed indications of bound wrists and/or tied legs."
They are not saying they have videos or photos of acts of rape but rather that they have reviewed photographic evidence such as that that strongly circumstantially suggests sexual violence. With the whole report calling for further investigation based on the photos and videos they've seen.
No. They are reporting of about an "accounts of individuals who witnessed" rape of corpses (not specifically by Hamas). As your quoted part even says, "There are further accounts of individuals who witnessed at least two incidents of rape of corpses of women".
I feel like you don't understand that they're purposefully using that careful language.
Your example is literally just Gal Abdush, The most debunked claim of all.
Why are you writing long comments before having read the debunking of the NYT article?
This is completely, utterly uncontroversial, except by a subset of the extreme far left at war with reality. Let's see where the downvote ratio ends up.
It's hard to believe when israel lies about everything constantly. Once people saw how the 40 babies rumor was being spread by israel, it's normal to be critical of information.
I encourage you to look into how an Israeli soldier saying "1 decapitated, 40 burned" got turned into "40 decapitated" by a game of telephone. The Israeli government never claimed that, and clarified when they got asked by journalists.
Israel and Hamas are both bad, roast me
That's not really the point here. If you haven't noticed, recently a lot of people on Lemmy have been suggesting that the reports of rape on Oct 7th were made up or propaganda.
The UN saying that it likely happened is important to counter that propaganda.
Similar to if reports of shooting civilians by IDF were being denied but then validated by 3rd party investigators, rational people should rightfully want to see that spread to counter misleading propaganda.
This is like the third time that we're hearing this bullshit. The NYT article did every possible thing they could to find any "evidence" up to the point that they just started making things up.
From the word "likely" it's clear that there is once again no real evidence, just some IDF mouthpieces that got their stories in order.
Where is the UN report by the way? It is not linked in this article which is very poorly sourced.
Read the article and there's zero evidence as before. "Credible circumstantial information", what does that even mean?
Just more Western media doing what they do best, lie on behalf of Israel.
DNA evidence, fingerprints, blood, etc are all "credible circumstantial information". It's a common category of evidence, encompassing pretty much everything except direct testimony.
There's literally video and images thanks to hamas body cams. It's rough going and I doubt you'd watch it.
If you want to read more try the actual report