Yeah, but Android doesn't make me constantly enter my password to do basic things. Also, Apple takes away a lot of control from their consumers.
I'll take the phone that isn't dumbed down tyvm
Ideally you shouldn't have to compromise. GrapheneOS without Google is an option.
It literally isn't - Graphene only supports Google Pixel phones.
You've apparently missed the point. Graphene exists solely to harden security and privacy by disabling the googly parts of the phone. That is clearly what was meant by "without Google"
You can do that without Graphene though
And?
Graphene is is way over hyped. You can basically the same thing with lineage os. The key is just not using gsf
But then you can't use any apps that require Play Services. The killer feature of GrapheneOS is letting you run Play Services in a sandbox.
Microg will most jobs tho
But that is unethical. Don't run proprietary software when there are good alternatives. I don't want google anywhere near my devices
Why would you even do that in a sandbox? Aren't you sending your personal data to Google servers all the same?
Unlocked bootloader is considered a vulnerability tho
But if your threats model is toxic Tim, satya and sundar, it will do the job just fine.
You can relock the bootloader though can't you?
Genuine question. I used to be an avid ROMer back int day until I got really really annoyed at all the hoops I had to jump through to use Google Wallet.
Now I have a Pixel 7a and I'm considering ROMs again. So I am wondering if I can just relock the bootloader once I find a ROM I like and it'll pass all the Safety net bullshit and allow me to use my phone like it should be, just with a custom ROM on it.
Graphene and calyx would work for you
most phones nowadays don't support relocking the bootloader, they will brick
And how do you know there aren't hardware level trackers in Google's chips? The kind Graphene can't override? Do you trust Google not to do that?
Because this will get .001% more total data considering the low number of GrapheneOS users. Besides, this is highly illegal and would result in significant public outcry and legal consequences far greater in cost than any potential benefits.
And if you cannot trust Google with their processors, you cannot trust any other company either.
Because all of that has stopped OEMs in the past...oh wait! No it hasn't (looks at Lenovo)
The people who install Graphene and other modified Android variants on their devices are a lot more likely to be monitoring packets sent from their devices.
Believe me, we'd know the same day an android device that had been de-Googled called home. That would make worldwide news.
Yeah I trust them not to do it. Cause when it was found out not if when it would hurt them.
Ultimately you can't know everything. At some point you have to trust someone. The graphene people seem to know they are doing imo. Ultimately everything is flawed, you just have to know when to say "good enough ". The pixel hardware is pretty great imo and they are often cheap, so I think it's worth considering them given that they can be hardened in various ways.
Or literally and other custom ROM based on aosc or lineage os
Very true.
+1 for Lineage, been using them since they forked from cyanogenmod
GrapheneOS still takes away a bit of control though. Mainly in that it's locked down for privacy in some ways that you can't disable
@soulfirethewolf@ijeff its biggest lockdown is the security model, which even though it won't disallow you from doing anything you couldn't otherwise do (if you're motivated enough), it draws the line of tradeoffs to make. I gave up rooting and a lot of stuff (like contactless payments) for it's security and stability, and I'm fine with that, but you should ask yourself if that's worth it for you. If you have to go out of your way to break the security model, even once, then it isn't for you.
Yeah, but Android doesn't make me constantly enter my password to do basic things. Also, Apple takes away a lot of control from their consumers.
I'll take the phone that isn't dumbed down tyvm
Ideally you shouldn't have to compromise. GrapheneOS without Google is an option.
It literally isn't - Graphene only supports Google Pixel phones.
You've apparently missed the point. Graphene exists solely to harden security and privacy by disabling the googly parts of the phone. That is clearly what was meant by "without Google"
You can do that without Graphene though
And?
Graphene is is way over hyped. You can basically the same thing with lineage os. The key is just not using gsf
But then you can't use any apps that require Play Services. The killer feature of GrapheneOS is letting you run Play Services in a sandbox.
Microg will most jobs tho
But that is unethical. Don't run proprietary software when there are good alternatives. I don't want google anywhere near my devices
Why would you even do that in a sandbox? Aren't you sending your personal data to Google servers all the same?
Unlocked bootloader is considered a vulnerability tho
But if your threats model is toxic Tim, satya and sundar, it will do the job just fine.
You can relock the bootloader though can't you?
Genuine question. I used to be an avid ROMer back int day until I got really really annoyed at all the hoops I had to jump through to use Google Wallet.
Now I have a Pixel 7a and I'm considering ROMs again. So I am wondering if I can just relock the bootloader once I find a ROM I like and it'll pass all the Safety net bullshit and allow me to use my phone like it should be, just with a custom ROM on it.
Graphene and calyx would work for you
most phones nowadays don't support relocking the bootloader, they will brick
pixel does support it still
Thanks for this info
The kids need to use their buzzwords though
And how do you know there aren't hardware level trackers in Google's chips? The kind Graphene can't override? Do you trust Google not to do that?
Because this will get .001% more total data considering the low number of GrapheneOS users. Besides, this is highly illegal and would result in significant public outcry and legal consequences far greater in cost than any potential benefits.
And if you cannot trust Google with their processors, you cannot trust any other company either.
Because all of that has stopped OEMs in the past...oh wait! No it hasn't (looks at Lenovo)
The people who install Graphene and other modified Android variants on their devices are a lot more likely to be monitoring packets sent from their devices.
Believe me, we'd know the same day an android device that had been de-Googled called home. That would make worldwide news.
Yeah I trust them not to do it. Cause when it was found out not if when it would hurt them.
Ultimately you can't know everything. At some point you have to trust someone. The graphene people seem to know they are doing imo. Ultimately everything is flawed, you just have to know when to say "good enough ". The pixel hardware is pretty great imo and they are often cheap, so I think it's worth considering them given that they can be hardened in various ways.
Just use Lineage os
I want to like Lineage, but while it doesn't come with extra bloat, the system itself doesn't do a whole lot of degoogling core services
Or literally and other custom ROM based on aosc or lineage os
Very true.
+1 for Lineage, been using them since they forked from cyanogenmod
GrapheneOS still takes away a bit of control though. Mainly in that it's locked down for privacy in some ways that you can't disable
@soulfirethewolf @ijeff its biggest lockdown is the security model, which even though it won't disallow you from doing anything you couldn't otherwise do (if you're motivated enough), it draws the line of tradeoffs to make. I gave up rooting and a lot of stuff (like contactless payments) for it's security and stability, and I'm fine with that, but you should ask yourself if that's worth it for you. If you have to go out of your way to break the security model, even once, then it isn't for you.