Oh, but she's Israeli, so this is just lies, right guys? Right?
Good call. I hate dumb strawman arguments. Can't win this argument so let's build one I can!
This image is a little bit undercut by the comma directly below it making that actual argument.
No we just don't really give a shit because yeah, no shit a terrorist insurgency mistreated their hostages. It changes absolutely nothing. Really sucks for her, sorry it happened, hope she gets help, fuck Israel.
Hell yes this is exactly the kind of cyclical no thought violent logic we need to keep that conflict going for another hundred years!!
Oh, no you misunderstand, plenty of thought in what I said.
Israel created Hamas without a care in the world, ground Palestine to their knees, kicked them while they were down, and the moment they collected enough spit to put it in Israel's face by making rockets out of the crumbling pipes they can't get materials to fix, Israel went mask off. Started nothing short of a genocide with virtually no opposition. So while Hamas treating their hostages poorly is sad, it's also expected. Want to know what caught even me off guard? Israel has killed more Israeli hostages than Hamas has.
Absolutely go fuck yourself with a soldering iron then pass the message to Israel.
Israel has killed more Israeli hostages than Hamas has.
How do you know this?
What caught me off guard was that Hamas attacked military targets (not exclusively though) and the total amount of children killed on Oct 7 (including Israeli friendly fire) was 36. Israel has destroyed 70% of Gaza's residential areas and killed over 13,000 children. 13,000 children! It seems the label "terrorist" was applied to the wrong side, especially when you consider the current situation in Rafah. Over a million people, starving, traumatized, not knowing when the next attack is coming and completely unable to defend themselves or even find a safe place. It's unconscionable.
How do you know [Israel has killed more of their own hostages than Hamas]?
Reports like this, of which I'm sure there'd be more if the IDF didn't kill the reporters.
Hamas are definitely closer to insurgents but are definitely still terrorists. Yes, pushed there by justifiable reasons, but we shouldn't become disillusioned. They're not good guys, but they are still the result of inhumane and brutal treatment.
Israel did not create Hamas. This is a silly distillation of facts.
Their actions did and they were caught giving Hamas money. Stop lying to yourself and everyone else.
You know, I kept hearing about this a while back so I was curious and I looked it up. Turns out it never was "israel gave hamas money". Turns out Israel was funding certain on the ground initiatives that later folded into Hamas. It's never so black and white, is it? I strongly encourage people to read beyond the headlines of what they read online.
Fuck me, I bet you believe Israel earnestly is trying to hit Hamas bases under every hospital and school. Or maybe that all 13,000 children they've killed were actually Hamas leaders.
Without Hamas, they have no scapegoat to wipe out Palestine. It's never black and white, is it?
Never said that, but nice pivot.
Yeah you're just trying to shoo away the fact Israel funded a terrorist group as a scapegoat for a genocide. Didn't think it was a stretch.
Aaand we're back to point #1. It's like a circular merry go around. I debunk one thing, you pivot to another, I call you out, and you circle back to claim number one. Fun times.
Yeah it's almost like there's a list of points that all culminate into the broader accusation. You didn't debunk shit. You didn't link shit. You made a claim, cited fuck all, and expected me to go "Oh okay, you're right!". My position is based off the behavior of Israel as it's being reported. Yours is based off "some articles I read said so". Provide something worth locking in on or fuck off.
I merely pointed out your argumentation style. You never asked for sources. Why is it my job to teach you all media literacy. I'm happy to provide sources, but based on your rhetoric I can tell you're already ingrained in your position and no amount of sources will change your position. It's like Lemmy is half full of children that just repeat clickbait headlines and never actually read past the link titles. It's exhausting.
It's only cyclical if you think the pro Palestinian voice here supports Hamas too.
Isreal is committing genocide against the Palestinian people, for the also despicable actions of the terrorist group in charge.
And while the Palestinian people may be partially responsible for Hamas being in charge, it's far more complicated than that, as foreign powers including Isreal itself had a large part of putting Hamas in power and keeping them there. And Isreal is definitely responsible for a lifetime of oppression that breeds support for extremism.
No this sexual assault story definitely proves it after all the other ones were debunked. We have no incentive to believe israel consistently lies about these stories to manufacture consent for Genocide.
So convenient to bring it up 120 days after her release after the last batch of israeli rape accusations started to die down. Now they can start screaming for Hamas rape again while starving Gaza.
If only israel didn't weaponize false rape accusations to manufacture consent for Genocide fifty times this would be a lot easier to believe.
TIL you should be over being raped and kidnapped after 4 months.
Not changing the story to gradually worsen every month sure helps credibilty.
This woman did not say she was raped btw.
Not saying the story consistently is precisely a sign that the trauma is actually real. Human brains actually work like that.
that article doesn't claim she was raped
Sexually assaulted under gunpoint vs raped is splitting hairs, imo.
Not a woman myself but I think there's a difference between getting groped and what most people would think of with the term 'raped'
You don’t compare in trauma therapy, it’s an unwise road to travel.
But you do in assessing proper reaction and punishment to the perpetrator. The wording used to the victim is a thin ice to thread and can be a lot different, completely for good reasons. The wording used to put the perpetrator on trial, especially if it appeals to the jury via public awareness, needs to be very specific, and any deviations from using exact words with right connotations is either used to lighten the crime or make it more vile than it perceptible is.
Yup exactly which is why I think what is happening in Gaza is the completely proper reaction to thousands of Israelis being slaughtered in their beds, babies raped and burned alive, and mother's beheaded in front of their daughters.
Oh, but she's Israeli, so this is just lies, right guys? Right?
Good call. I hate dumb strawman arguments. Can't win this argument so let's build one I can!
This image is a little bit undercut by the comma directly below it making that actual argument.
No we just don't really give a shit because yeah, no shit a terrorist insurgency mistreated their hostages. It changes absolutely nothing. Really sucks for her, sorry it happened, hope she gets help, fuck Israel.
Hell yes this is exactly the kind of cyclical no thought violent logic we need to keep that conflict going for another hundred years!!
Oh, no you misunderstand, plenty of thought in what I said.
Israel created Hamas without a care in the world, ground Palestine to their knees, kicked them while they were down, and the moment they collected enough spit to put it in Israel's face by making rockets out of the crumbling pipes they can't get materials to fix, Israel went mask off. Started nothing short of a genocide with virtually no opposition. So while Hamas treating their hostages poorly is sad, it's also expected. Want to know what caught even me off guard? Israel has killed more Israeli hostages than Hamas has.
Absolutely go fuck yourself with a soldering iron then pass the message to Israel.
How do you know this?
What caught me off guard was that Hamas attacked military targets (not exclusively though) and the total amount of children killed on Oct 7 (including Israeli friendly fire) was 36. Israel has destroyed 70% of Gaza's residential areas and killed over 13,000 children. 13,000 children! It seems the label "terrorist" was applied to the wrong side, especially when you consider the current situation in Rafah. Over a million people, starving, traumatized, not knowing when the next attack is coming and completely unable to defend themselves or even find a safe place. It's unconscionable.
Reports like this, of which I'm sure there'd be more if the IDF didn't kill the reporters.
Hamas are definitely closer to insurgents but are definitely still terrorists. Yes, pushed there by justifiable reasons, but we shouldn't become disillusioned. They're not good guys, but they are still the result of inhumane and brutal treatment.
Israel did not create Hamas. This is a silly distillation of facts.
Their actions did and they were caught giving Hamas money. Stop lying to yourself and everyone else.
You know, I kept hearing about this a while back so I was curious and I looked it up. Turns out it never was "israel gave hamas money". Turns out Israel was funding certain on the ground initiatives that later folded into Hamas. It's never so black and white, is it? I strongly encourage people to read beyond the headlines of what they read online.
Fuck me, I bet you believe Israel earnestly is trying to hit Hamas bases under every hospital and school. Or maybe that all 13,000 children they've killed were actually Hamas leaders.
Without Hamas, they have no scapegoat to wipe out Palestine. It's never black and white, is it?
Never said that, but nice pivot.
Yeah you're just trying to shoo away the fact Israel funded a terrorist group as a scapegoat for a genocide. Didn't think it was a stretch.
Aaand we're back to point #1. It's like a circular merry go around. I debunk one thing, you pivot to another, I call you out, and you circle back to claim number one. Fun times.
Yeah it's almost like there's a list of points that all culminate into the broader accusation. You didn't debunk shit. You didn't link shit. You made a claim, cited fuck all, and expected me to go "Oh okay, you're right!". My position is based off the behavior of Israel as it's being reported. Yours is based off "some articles I read said so". Provide something worth locking in on or fuck off.
I merely pointed out your argumentation style. You never asked for sources. Why is it my job to teach you all media literacy. I'm happy to provide sources, but based on your rhetoric I can tell you're already ingrained in your position and no amount of sources will change your position. It's like Lemmy is half full of children that just repeat clickbait headlines and never actually read past the link titles. It's exhausting.
It's only cyclical if you think the pro Palestinian voice here supports Hamas too.
Isreal is committing genocide against the Palestinian people, for the also despicable actions of the terrorist group in charge.
And while the Palestinian people may be partially responsible for Hamas being in charge, it's far more complicated than that, as foreign powers including Isreal itself had a large part of putting Hamas in power and keeping them there. And Isreal is definitely responsible for a lifetime of oppression that breeds support for extremism.
No this sexual assault story definitely proves it after all the other ones were debunked. We have no incentive to believe israel consistently lies about these stories to manufacture consent for Genocide.
So convenient to bring it up 120 days after her release after the last batch of israeli rape accusations started to die down. Now they can start screaming for Hamas rape again while starving Gaza.
If only israel didn't weaponize false rape accusations to manufacture consent for Genocide fifty times this would be a lot easier to believe.
TIL you should be over being raped and kidnapped after 4 months.
Not changing the story to gradually worsen every month sure helps credibilty.
This woman did not say she was raped btw.
Not saying the story consistently is precisely a sign that the trauma is actually real. Human brains actually work like that.
that article doesn't claim she was raped
Sexually assaulted under gunpoint vs raped is splitting hairs, imo.
Not a woman myself but I think there's a difference between getting groped and what most people would think of with the term 'raped'
You don’t compare in trauma therapy, it’s an unwise road to travel.
But you do in assessing proper reaction and punishment to the perpetrator. The wording used to the victim is a thin ice to thread and can be a lot different, completely for good reasons. The wording used to put the perpetrator on trial, especially if it appeals to the jury via public awareness, needs to be very specific, and any deviations from using exact words with right connotations is either used to lighten the crime or make it more vile than it perceptible is.
Yup exactly which is why I think what is happening in Gaza is the completely proper reaction to thousands of Israelis being slaughtered in their beds, babies raped and burned alive, and mother's beheaded in front of their daughters.
you should be able to provide a credible story.