Texas, Ohio, Illinois, Indiana, Florida, Arizona, Georgia, Iowa, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Arkansas, Minnesota, Nevada, South Carolina, Tennessee, Alabama, Rhode Island, New Jersey, Oklahoma, Kansas, North Carolina, Utah, Missouri, Idaho, West Virginia, Colorado, Mississippi and New Hampshire.
You excluded the most important part of that sentence. The part that explains the law:
The states that have passed legislation making it illegal for state agencies to work with companies that boycott Israel include…
There’s no law stopping you as a citizen from boycotting, or recommending boycotting a business. This law targets business boycotts exclusively.
I guess business owners and government workers, who are all citizens themselves, don’t have Constitutional rights any more. Yay?
You can act and voice your opinion as a private citizen, even if you own a business or work for the government. The law affects state funding from businesses that boycott investments.
The state may not penalize people for free speech. Are you arguing that exempting people from state work for exercising protected free speech does not count as penalizing?
Where did it say that in the article? I must’ve missed it.
That’s literally what the whole article is about…? Did you miss it because you didn’t read the article?
Here’s the key bit…
The states that have passed legislation making it illegal for state agencies to work with companies that boycott Israel…
That is the State penalizing free speech and free expression, and is therefore Unconstitutional.
Right. It states that the companies that boycott Israel will be ineligible for working with a state agency. A business is not the same as a citizen.
I’m not agreeing with the law, by the way. I’m just pointing out how it’s not unconstitutional.
The Citizens United vs FEC states clearly and unambiguously that a business is to be treated as an individual where Constitutional rights are concerned. That ruling was a pretty big deal, I’m surprised you didn’t know about it.
... exempting people from state work for exercising protected free speech ...
that's not correct, you are still allowed to have a voice as an individual.
However it does prevent you or your highest level boss from speaking positively about BDS using their company (and companies are people).
ALSO it puts pressure on the work environment to not be out of line and talk about it.
"states where boycotting Israel is illegal" is a sensationalist lie. The article says what these laws actually do
have passed legislation making it illegal for state agencies to work with companies that boycott Israel
So it's all about contracts. That's still bad but it's nowhere near as bad as the headlines implies. A law making it illegal to boycott Israel would be laughably unconstitutional.
I think laughably unconstitutional seems to be what the scotus is on track to say is perfectly ok, so I think it’s the constitution that is laughable at this point.
I'd be shocked if such a law even made it to the supreme court before being struck down
That’s just it, they can be struck down by lower courts and still make it to the Supreme Court with sufficient funding. And then the Supreme Court can just be like, “Nope, we’re cool with shitting on the Constitution.”
you are right, if PayPal, Stripe and MasterCard did the same thing, the effects would be way worse!
::: spoiler older draft
I interpenetrated the bill to mean, "if an organization (doesn't matter what it is, waste management, orphanage, tax collector, money pit, whatever...) endorses the BDS political policy in any way, (say, a banner on their website) they will be cut off from government money".
I assume your company can be as pro-Israel as you want it to be.
If I'm wrong, let me know.
:::
We're not gonna make it... are we?
It's in your nature to destroy yourselves.
I'd like to share a revelation I've had during my time here. It came to me when I tried to classify your species. I realized that you're not actually mammals. Every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You move to another area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet. You are a plague, and we are the cure.
I don't know. Can you really classify us as just a virus or cancer? Aren't they known for only destruction and sadness?
What about all the joy, happyness, and good we've broight to the universe. Sure, it may not be as prevalent but there's small good deeds happening all around. Not just random people helping other random people, but beautiful pieces of art, songs that millions sing, books people remember and talk about, video games that bring far apart friends closser together, sports, dancing, DnD, pets, flower gardens, the list goes on.
Yes we consume too much, but we're no ALL bad. Parasites perhaps, but not full blown viruses IMHO
Thanks mr Smith.
Stand up and sing that bit about the land of the free
"What? The land of the free?
Whoever told you that is your enemy"
Zack de la Rocha
(That's the part you meant, right?)
Weird. All I saw on the map was fascism. Let me get my readers. Huh, still fascism.
How do you make enforce deciding not to buy from somewhere illegal?
It's a free speech matter. You are allowed to not buy stuff, you aren't allowed to say you aren't buying stuff because of a boycott.
Edit: just to be clear, I'm not defending the policy, I'm just explaining how it works, which is also, probably, the best way to fight it.
That is not how it works. Boycotting Israel will prevent your company from getting state contracts.
have passed legislation making it illegal for state agencies to work with companies that boycott Israel
If people don't speak up what's the difference between a boycott and other business considerations?
The point is that the boycott law applies to businesses, not individual citizens. You won’t be charged for boycotting as an individual or posting your boycott recommendations for others to see.
You won't get charged as a business either, you'll just be ineligible for state contacts. It's really weird that the headline considers that "illegal"
Correct. I’m just clarifying for the concerned commenters.
have passed legislation that allows the government to penalize citizens for Constitutionally protected free speech, something it is not allowed to do
Fixed it.
Seems illegal to ban this. Do lawmakers not know the law?
have passed legislation making it illegal for state agencies to work with companies that boycott Israel
Companies and business owners have a right to free speech. These laws deliberately penalize free speech. Ergo, these laws are wildly and brazenly Unconstitutional.
These laws restrict government agencies, not businesses. The Constitution does not include an implicit right to be hired as a state contractor.
Hired or not based on merits… or more likely, the lowest bid and nothing else. By automatically and systemically excluding anyone based on exercise of their free speech, the government is behaving in a punitive manner towards citizens based on speech, which is a violation of their First Amendment rights.
This is very simple. If you still don’t get it, think of it this way… citizens may discriminate against one another based on actions, behaviors, or words… that is freedom of association… but the government may never, ever do this. If government agents just happened to never use boycotters, that could be hand-waved (unless they slipped up and admitted they do it)… but by enshrining it in law, they violate the First Amendment rights of any person or business that is (or could be) exempted/penalized in such a way.
Fuckin' amen, Randy.
Texas, Ohio, Illinois, Indiana, Florida, Arizona, Georgia, Iowa, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Arkansas, Minnesota, Nevada, South Carolina, Tennessee, Alabama, Rhode Island, New Jersey, Oklahoma, Kansas, North Carolina, Utah, Missouri, Idaho, West Virginia, Colorado, Mississippi and New Hampshire.
You excluded the most important part of that sentence. The part that explains the law:
There’s no law stopping you as a citizen from boycotting, or recommending boycotting a business. This law targets business boycotts exclusively.
I guess business owners and government workers, who are all citizens themselves, don’t have Constitutional rights any more. Yay?
You can act and voice your opinion as a private citizen, even if you own a business or work for the government. The law affects state funding from businesses that boycott investments.
The state may not penalize people for free speech. Are you arguing that exempting people from state work for exercising protected free speech does not count as penalizing?
Where did it say that in the article? I must’ve missed it.
That’s literally what the whole article is about…? Did you miss it because you didn’t read the article?
Here’s the key bit…
That is the State penalizing free speech and free expression, and is therefore Unconstitutional.
Right. It states that the companies that boycott Israel will be ineligible for working with a state agency. A business is not the same as a citizen.
I’m not agreeing with the law, by the way. I’m just pointing out how it’s not unconstitutional.
Not to be that person, but in the USA, companies are people.
The Citizens United vs FEC states clearly and unambiguously that a business is to be treated as an individual where Constitutional rights are concerned. That ruling was a pretty big deal, I’m surprised you didn’t know about it.
that's not correct, you are still allowed to have a voice as an individual. However it does prevent you or your highest level boss from speaking positively about BDS using their company (and companies are people). ALSO it puts pressure on the work environment to not be out of line and talk about it.
"states where boycotting Israel is illegal" is a sensationalist lie. The article says what these laws actually do
So it's all about contracts. That's still bad but it's nowhere near as bad as the headlines implies. A law making it illegal to boycott Israel would be laughably unconstitutional.
I think laughably unconstitutional seems to be what the scotus is on track to say is perfectly ok, so I think it’s the constitution that is laughable at this point.
I'd be shocked if such a law even made it to the supreme court before being struck down
That’s just it, they can be struck down by lower courts and still make it to the Supreme Court with sufficient funding. And then the Supreme Court can just be like, “Nope, we’re cool with shitting on the Constitution.”
you are right, if PayPal, Stripe and MasterCard did the same thing, the effects would be way worse!
::: spoiler older draft I interpenetrated the bill to mean, "if an organization (doesn't matter what it is, waste management, orphanage, tax collector, money pit, whatever...) endorses the BDS political policy in any way, (say, a banner on their website) they will be cut off from government money". I assume your company can be as pro-Israel as you want it to be. If I'm wrong, let me know. :::
We're not gonna make it... are we?
It's in your nature to destroy yourselves.
I'd like to share a revelation I've had during my time here. It came to me when I tried to classify your species. I realized that you're not actually mammals. Every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You move to another area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet. You are a plague, and we are the cure.
I don't know. Can you really classify us as just a virus or cancer? Aren't they known for only destruction and sadness?
What about all the joy, happyness, and good we've broight to the universe. Sure, it may not be as prevalent but there's small good deeds happening all around. Not just random people helping other random people, but beautiful pieces of art, songs that millions sing, books people remember and talk about, video games that bring far apart friends closser together, sports, dancing, DnD, pets, flower gardens, the list goes on.
Yes we consume too much, but we're no ALL bad. Parasites perhaps, but not full blown viruses IMHO
Thanks mr Smith.
Stand up and sing that bit about the land of the free
Zack de la Rocha
(That's the part you meant, right?)
Weird. All I saw on the map was fascism. Let me get my readers. Huh, still fascism.
How do you make enforce deciding not to buy from somewhere illegal?
It's a free speech matter. You are allowed to not buy stuff, you aren't allowed to say you aren't buying stuff because of a boycott.
Edit: just to be clear, I'm not defending the policy, I'm just explaining how it works, which is also, probably, the best way to fight it.
That is not how it works. Boycotting Israel will prevent your company from getting state contracts.
If people don't speak up what's the difference between a boycott and other business considerations?
The point is that the boycott law applies to businesses, not individual citizens. You won’t be charged for boycotting as an individual or posting your boycott recommendations for others to see.
You won't get charged as a business either, you'll just be ineligible for state contacts. It's really weird that the headline considers that "illegal"
Correct. I’m just clarifying for the concerned commenters.
Fixed it.
Seems illegal to ban this. Do lawmakers not know the law?
Companies and business owners have a right to free speech. These laws deliberately penalize free speech. Ergo, these laws are wildly and brazenly Unconstitutional.
These laws restrict government agencies, not businesses. The Constitution does not include an implicit right to be hired as a state contractor.
Hired or not based on merits… or more likely, the lowest bid and nothing else. By automatically and systemically excluding anyone based on exercise of their free speech, the government is behaving in a punitive manner towards citizens based on speech, which is a violation of their First Amendment rights.
This is very simple. If you still don’t get it, think of it this way… citizens may discriminate against one another based on actions, behaviors, or words… that is freedom of association… but the government may never, ever do this. If government agents just happened to never use boycotters, that could be hand-waved (unless they slipped up and admitted they do it)… but by enshrining it in law, they violate the First Amendment rights of any person or business that is (or could be) exempted/penalized in such a way.
How deep is israel in US' ass exactly?
Balls deep
"Boycotting israel" =/= "opposing a genocide"
Also "Boycotting israel" =/= "anti semitism"
It depends on if it's one of the rallies where they chant about "death to Jews" or not....
yes, the relationship is sloppier than we would want to believe, but its nowhere close to unrelated.
More than I expected! Wow!
Stay awesome Vermont!
how the hell does one boycott a country
Don’t buy exports from that country. Don’t visit that country. Pressure local businesses to not export there. Etc.