If we can just get through this election then we can start worrying about the next election.
If Biden wins, we'll never have to worry about either trump or Biden running again.
And if Trump wins, we'll never have to worry about anyone ever running again.
But that'll be the least of our problems
Are you sure we won't have to worry about Trump running again? Because I am absolutely not.
If we're lucky, heart disease will take care of the issue by then.
Also drywall can only sustain so much ketchup
🤞
I think the implication is he'll be in prison. Setting aside whether that's a safe bet or not, I can totally see an 80-something trump making campaign ads from a prison cell. He won't really have anything better to do at that point.
Edit: typo
Even if he isn't in prison or dead by then his cognitive decline will be too much for even the most addled magas to ignore.
@mipadaitu
Trump will never stop running again. Whether he wins or not
There's only one way to ensure he doesn't ruin our lives and our country. Only one way to secure our democracy and safety, and I'll leave that to your imagination. I will say no more.
The rapture comes and Trump is included since he's God gift to democracy?
Uhh...yeah, sure
Trump running for POTUS 2028....
The problems and divisions that those two men represent aren't going to go away when they do.
ThEY'Re BoTh tHe SaMe
I didn't say that. I didn't say they're the same, I don't think they're the same. Go put words in someone else's mouth.
As per moderator request, a unique comment for you. Enjoy.
Typically, when someone asserts "both sides are the same," it's often from a Democratic-leaning conservative perspective, seeking to discredit critics of the Democratic Party. While acknowledging similarities between these 2 capitalist parties, there are significant distinctions. Encouraging a broader range of viewpoints would be more beneficial. Instead of just criticizing, inviting dissenting voices to participate actively and propose solutions would be more productive. Shifting away from first-past-the-post voting enables more accurate representation and minimizes the spoiler effect, a reform already implemented at the state level in Maine and Alaska. However, Republicans are opposing alternative electoral systems. Rather than continuing to use voting methods favored by Republicans, embracing multiple political parties ensures wider representation and engagement, benefiting citizens and the Democratic Party alike. Enhanced voter participation leads to more democratic outcomes. So, what prevents Democratic-led states from prioritizing electoral reform? Let's take action and advocate for change within our states to ensure better representation and competition among candidates, striving for genuine representation without excuses.
The next election being local and State, not just President. I want us to carry the momentum and really start upping the pressure and pushing the candidates we need. Together.
Does anybody know which election wasn't "the most important election in history"?
Obama 2012. Sure Romney would've sucked ass but he probably would've just fumbled the whole thing comically instead of actively undoing democracy.
Good thing Hillary beat Trump in 2016 or Democracy would have already ended.
You nearly got a coup, so I guess thanks Hillary for saving the democracy and the US people from the communist Bernie. /s
I mean, this is the first where a genuine threat of fascism was on the table. I don’t see things getting pulled back any time soon. I think the orange criminal made too many bad behaviors ok and there’s no going back. We’re gonna crumble, the only question is how soon.
Don't get me wrong, I agree with you that things are in a dire state, and this might genuinely be the most important election in history. But I don't see it ever getting better - as it stands right now, the Republican party will only continue getting crazier and more extreme, until there are no more elections. The system is fundamentally broken, and there needs to be some fundamental fix to off this wild ride.
Ranked Choice Voting with more political parties could be one such fix. It would allow for better representation on both sides (actual leftists on the left, and people on the right who aren't quite as despicable as is currently the case).
But I don’t see it ever getting better - as it stands right now, the Republican party will only continue getting crazier and more extreme, until there are no more elections.
Them continually getting stomped in elections until they don't hold any meaningful power anymore would make them eventually have to moderate. I don't know that that's what will happen, as we seem to be stuck in the American cycle of dismay with the ruling party turning into support for the out-of-power party no matter how terrible the out-of-power party is.
But what I think it would look like is like what happened to Democrats trying to grab the Presidency during the Reagan era. They got stomped enough times in a row nationally that they basically had to change their party platform to appeal to Reagan voters.
But what's the likelihood of that happening? The Republican voter base lives in an alternative world, with alternative news and alternative media - and they are working hard on perpetuating that through indoctrination, both in the education system and through religion.
There have been so many points over the last couple of years where no rational person could keep supporting them, yet their base has grown or stayed the same. Their last president literally attempted a coup, yet there's a good chance he'll be re-elected. And even if he's not, and he dies in the next couple of years - his fascist movement will not end with him.
But what’s the likelihood of that happening?
I'm not sure. I wouldn't bet on it either and don't think it's very likely to happen. They may have found a bridge too far for even their voters with the abortion ban stuff though. Theirs is an exceedingly unpopular opinion, and the more action they take to make abortion completely illegal without even exemptions for shit like rape and incest, the more I think they'll find themselves unelectable.
And even if he’s not, and he dies in the next couple of years - his fascist movement will not end with him.
I agree with the rest of what you're saying, however, on this point I have a difference of opinion.
I don't think fascism is an easily organized type of government. In my view, it's essentially a cult of personality in politics and a single autocrat is essential to its continued function. It's a type of retro-fitted monarchy where you have "dear leader" installed at the top and he cannot be removed except through death or exile.
One of the major problems with monarchies, autocracies, and even the mob (and sometimes business) is succession plans. These forms of organization can be stable for a while, but they tend to fall apart entirely or fizzle out at least somewhat once the central figure goes into the ground.
The Republican Party largely would've preferred to move on from Donald Trump probably as soon as he lost in 2020, but the populist dynamics are not allowing it to happen. "His base" is still his. Your Rons Desantis and your Nikkis Haley are no match for his cult of personality.
If he were to die, the people who voted for him that outlived him would still be alive, but I think they'd have a large amount of difficulty finding another leader to follow in exactly the same way. They'd likely split in their support for other leaders and their "movement" would be greatly damaged as a result.
If we can just get through this election then we can start worrying about the next election.
If Biden wins, we'll never have to worry about either trump or Biden running again.
And if Trump wins, we'll never have to worry about anyone ever running again.
But that'll be the least of our problems
Are you sure we won't have to worry about Trump running again? Because I am absolutely not.
If we're lucky, heart disease will take care of the issue by then.
Also drywall can only sustain so much ketchup
🤞
I think the implication is he'll be in prison. Setting aside whether that's a safe bet or not, I can totally see an 80-something trump making campaign ads from a prison cell. He won't really have anything better to do at that point.
Edit: typo
Even if he isn't in prison or dead by then his cognitive decline will be too much for even the most addled magas to ignore.
@mipadaitu
Trump will never stop running again. Whether he wins or not
There's only one way to ensure he doesn't ruin our lives and our country. Only one way to secure our democracy and safety, and I'll leave that to your imagination. I will say no more.
The rapture comes and Trump is included since he's God gift to democracy?
Uhh...yeah, sure
Trump running for POTUS 2028....
The problems and divisions that those two men represent aren't going to go away when they do.
ThEY'Re BoTh tHe SaMe
I didn't say that. I didn't say they're the same, I don't think they're the same. Go put words in someone else's mouth.
As per moderator request, a unique comment for you. Enjoy.
Yeah, 2028 will see a new fascist running against an even more rightward corporate neoliberal.
The next election being local and State, not just President. I want us to carry the momentum and really start upping the pressure and pushing the candidates we need. Together.
Does anybody know which election wasn't "the most important election in history"?
Obama 2012. Sure Romney would've sucked ass but he probably would've just fumbled the whole thing comically instead of actively undoing democracy.
Nah, that one also was the most important one:
https://www.politico.com/story/2012/03/the-most-important-presidential-election-ever-074188
Good thing Hillary beat Trump in 2016 or Democracy would have already ended.
You nearly got a coup, so I guess thanks Hillary for saving the democracy and the US people from the communist Bernie. /s
I mean, this is the first where a genuine threat of fascism was on the table. I don’t see things getting pulled back any time soon. I think the orange criminal made too many bad behaviors ok and there’s no going back. We’re gonna crumble, the only question is how soon.
Don't get me wrong, I agree with you that things are in a dire state, and this might genuinely be the most important election in history. But I don't see it ever getting better - as it stands right now, the Republican party will only continue getting crazier and more extreme, until there are no more elections. The system is fundamentally broken, and there needs to be some fundamental fix to off this wild ride.
Ranked Choice Voting with more political parties could be one such fix. It would allow for better representation on both sides (actual leftists on the left, and people on the right who aren't quite as despicable as is currently the case).
Them continually getting stomped in elections until they don't hold any meaningful power anymore would make them eventually have to moderate. I don't know that that's what will happen, as we seem to be stuck in the American cycle of dismay with the ruling party turning into support for the out-of-power party no matter how terrible the out-of-power party is.
But what I think it would look like is like what happened to Democrats trying to grab the Presidency during the Reagan era. They got stomped enough times in a row nationally that they basically had to change their party platform to appeal to Reagan voters.
But what's the likelihood of that happening? The Republican voter base lives in an alternative world, with alternative news and alternative media - and they are working hard on perpetuating that through indoctrination, both in the education system and through religion.
There have been so many points over the last couple of years where no rational person could keep supporting them, yet their base has grown or stayed the same. Their last president literally attempted a coup, yet there's a good chance he'll be re-elected. And even if he's not, and he dies in the next couple of years - his fascist movement will not end with him.
I'm not sure. I wouldn't bet on it either and don't think it's very likely to happen. They may have found a bridge too far for even their voters with the abortion ban stuff though. Theirs is an exceedingly unpopular opinion, and the more action they take to make abortion completely illegal without even exemptions for shit like rape and incest, the more I think they'll find themselves unelectable.
I agree with the rest of what you're saying, however, on this point I have a difference of opinion.
I don't think fascism is an easily organized type of government. In my view, it's essentially a cult of personality in politics and a single autocrat is essential to its continued function. It's a type of retro-fitted monarchy where you have "dear leader" installed at the top and he cannot be removed except through death or exile.
One of the major problems with monarchies, autocracies, and even the mob (and sometimes business) is succession plans. These forms of organization can be stable for a while, but they tend to fall apart entirely or fizzle out at least somewhat once the central figure goes into the ground.
The Republican Party largely would've preferred to move on from Donald Trump probably as soon as he lost in 2020, but the populist dynamics are not allowing it to happen. "His base" is still his. Your Rons Desantis and your Nikkis Haley are no match for his cult of personality.
If he were to die, the people who voted for him that outlived him would still be alive, but I think they'd have a large amount of difficulty finding another leader to follow in exactly the same way. They'd likely split in their support for other leaders and their "movement" would be greatly damaged as a result.
That’s what they said last time.
Time to vote local in 2025!