So far every website owner I've had issues with has been a billionaire capitalist, I'll give the communists a shot.
If your point is that they're pro-CCP, you'll probably get your point across better by calling them "tankies" than "communists." I identify as a communist, but I'd be first in line to say "fuck tankies."
Ok, what in the world is the eli5 version of a tankie?
Stalin and Mao were good actually, the CCP has never done a bad thing ever, and Russia should roll over Europe with their invincible tanks, because the west is bad, therefore anyone who disagrees with the west is flawless.
That may be an uncharitable exaggeration, but surprisingly not by very much.
Oh dear lol
Originally, a "tankie" was a Stalin apologist, but in more modern times, it's come to mean just authoritarian communist. I don't think it's a self-applied term. More a derisive term used by anti-authoritarian leftists.
The anti-authoritarian communists tend to call themsleves anarchists, anarcho-communists, anarcho-syndicalists, left libertarians, etc. And they'd strongly tend not to have anything good to say about Stalin, Mao, or the CCP.
(There are right-wingers who call themselves "anarchists" or "anarcho-capitalists" or "voluntarists" or "minarchists" or "Libertarians" (note the capital "L") or whatever, but they have pretty much nothing to do with the hard-left-wing anarchist movement that they appropriated the terms "anarchist" and "libertarian" from.)
Ok, just don't kill people in reeducation camps
I've lived in a communist country before. It's not really an issue for me.
Do you believe in "removing" people who are "unfit for society" or the execution of enemy's of the state (ei journalists)
You seem to be confusing communism and dictatorships.
You need a authoritarian oppression and mass propaganda to keep communism in line. Farms will fall to product enough food and you need to hide the reason for the failure from the people
Communism is not eugenics. I also would love to see who specifically you are saying was executed. Just calling someone a journalist doesn't automatically mean they are good people who do good things. Be specific if you're going to make an argument.
True but they execute anyone who dares to say anything other than the official media
You seem to have no idea what communism is. You're just spouting classic anti-communist propaganda. I'd recommend doing some unbiased research.
Meanwhile, I'm happy to support the communists who give us a platform the users are in charge of, instead of a capitalist who earns money off the back of free labor from it's users
Do you have any specific examples of this you want to reference, any specific states that you're talking about when you say "they" ?
Like Julian Assange? Yeah, that's deplorable.
This seems to be a particularly American concern, presumably dating back to the McCarthy era. Tye real question is: are they Tankies?
Sometimes the best tech people are weird as hell. This might be one of those cases.
Although I did hear that they censor content critical of china, which sucks.
I saw this rumor spread quickly and I want to check it out by myself. Is there any reference you could share?
One of the things I appreciate about them is their openness with people who disagree. In that very thread one of the comments by a dev and admin on lemmy.ml: “If you would have left those posts stay on your instance, that’s fine! We’re not demanding that you moderate according to our standards.”
Thank you, that was a very informative read.
I'll wait and see how this topic unravels in the future. Wishing the devs will state more firmly their position.
censor content critical of China
This is exactly my point. China is authoritarian and has commited war crimes against people who it doesnt't like. It also arrests journalists as enemies of the state.
I'm not saying the west is completely perfect but China is much worse
Anti-authoritarian communism is a thing. I think mostly the issue folks here in this thread are taking with you is equating communism with authoritarianism. And I don't think anyone in this thread is pro-China or defending censoring content critical of China. Quite the opposite in fact.
But communism doesn't work. All countries that implement communism have restrictions on free speech to hide the fact that it is a broken system.
The reason communism doesn't work is because people have no incentives to work. You can complain about the evils of the corporate empires but they at least have a motivation to improve even if that is sometimes at the expense of the people
Let me just jump in real quick and provide some info without supporting any side.
You're referring to the authoritarian communism, and yes, none of it worked, and again yes, it's the only one that really happened in our history.
What you're missing is that the other person is referring to the lower left quadrant of the political compass, or libertarian socialist quadrant. And no, libertarian is referring here to the lack of or very week and non focused (with a lot of people in it) government.
For a great breakdown of the political compass I recommend Wendigoon's video on the topic.
That's all I'm gonna say here, have a pleasant day and a good watch if you do decide to click on that link.
Also water is wet. The devs' political views are not important to me, the software they make is more important. "Separate the art from the artist."
True they start telling you how China is doing wonders for its people.
I disagree politicly with many people on reddit. I don't care if you disagree but it does bother me when they are following a dead idolology.
I also don't like lemmy.ml being as big as it is. We need to seperate the power of development from the power of administration
Also the devs expressed support for people creating more mainstream liberal instances. That's the reason why there are recommended instances at Join-Lemmy.
That seems bad for the ecosystem as a whole.
And? Are you concerned they're going to break into your house and depose the bourgeoisie because you followed a community on their instance?
Yeah. I don't understand this. Lemmy is an open source software and there are many instances to use. Hell, lemmy.ml is even pushing people away from their instance - that doesn't sound like people promoting lemmy to advance their ideology.
Don't agree with the devs' POV, use a different instance. I'm not socialist/communist and I'm perfectly fine using lemmy. I've talked to the devs and they've been nice and polite, and I haven't really encountered any lemmy.ml content trying to poison my mind. Lol. We even stayed on reddit even after fucking jailbait, the Donald, etc. fiasco.
I mean... Open source and federation are the perfect representation of the ideas of communism...
Um not really
This meme, again?!
I do not understand the argument. Are you implying that being communist automatically pins you in the pro CCP?
My country is socialist. My family is socialist. All my friends are socialists. I love socialism.
By following the same logic, does that mean that I am considered a Nazis lover?
No but many of the lemmy.ml founders embrace communism without evening considering how many people have been killed under that banner.
When I first heard about the communism I assumed that the were just far left socialists. It turns out they straight up worship communist leader
What banner? Are you under the impression that communism is some kind of monolith? If you're referring to the soviet union say that, or China, or whoever else you're specifically accusing of mass murder. The term communism refers to hundreds of different political ideologies and many different countries. Many of whom have next to nothing to do with each other.
And almost all of them have killed millions
I'm going to sound like a broken record but can you specify who you are talking about?
Anti west propaganda
How is asking you to be specific with your arguments "anti west propaganda"?
I'm mostly referring to the moderation of lemmy.ml only promoting pro communist ideas. They actively remove all noncommunist content
And all the communists in this thread arguing with you hate the regimes that have killed millions (including the ones that have embraced the term "communist" like the CCP and Stalin's USSR) as much as you do.
you're saying that as if it's a bad thing! especially as long as they just develop and stay out of pushing certain content, then I couldn't care less. now if they were tankies on the other hand, that I would mind!
This. It's one things to disagree politically. It's another to think violence is an acceptable means of conveying that belief.
Their memes community is now full of post about how it's ok to kill capitalists and other hatefull bullshit and no admin seems to care.
Also their comics community is now just spam of extremly hateful comics from one of the admins.
They are the same in my book
So are the devs. Actually, they're the same people. And you wanna know something else, they also run lemmygrad.
So how is this relevant at all, I fail to see.
Good. We need more communists representing their ideas in open forums. I’d be more concerned if they were capitalists. That’s just Reddit 2.0.
That's terrifying
Seriously?
Yes
just a quick thought on up/down votes on the OPs post.
my personal take... just because I think the content of a post is inflammatory or outright wrong, does not mean it deserves an insta-downvote.
every post and thread is a chance to share constructive dialogue. if the thread goes off the rails, I hand out downvotes liberally. If it is actually informative or interesting, I hand out upvotes - even if I disagree with a particular argument.
I have learned to spot idiots much more easily by watching the dialogue of a post develop and participating -- without doing the "it hurt my feelings, downvote!" thing.
So far every website owner I've had issues with has been a billionaire capitalist, I'll give the communists a shot.
If your point is that they're pro-CCP, you'll probably get your point across better by calling them "tankies" than "communists." I identify as a communist, but I'd be first in line to say "fuck tankies."
Ok, what in the world is the eli5 version of a tankie?
Stalin and Mao were good actually, the CCP has never done a bad thing ever, and Russia should roll over Europe with their invincible tanks, because the west is bad, therefore anyone who disagrees with the west is flawless.
That may be an uncharitable exaggeration, but surprisingly not by very much.
Oh dear lol
Originally, a "tankie" was a Stalin apologist, but in more modern times, it's come to mean just authoritarian communist. I don't think it's a self-applied term. More a derisive term used by anti-authoritarian leftists.
The anti-authoritarian communists tend to call themsleves anarchists, anarcho-communists, anarcho-syndicalists, left libertarians, etc. And they'd strongly tend not to have anything good to say about Stalin, Mao, or the CCP.
(There are right-wingers who call themselves "anarchists" or "anarcho-capitalists" or "voluntarists" or "minarchists" or "Libertarians" (note the capital "L") or whatever, but they have pretty much nothing to do with the hard-left-wing anarchist movement that they appropriated the terms "anarchist" and "libertarian" from.)
Ok, just don't kill people in reeducation camps
I've lived in a communist country before. It's not really an issue for me.
Do you believe in "removing" people who are "unfit for society" or the execution of enemy's of the state (ei journalists)
You seem to be confusing communism and dictatorships.
You need a authoritarian oppression and mass propaganda to keep communism in line. Farms will fall to product enough food and you need to hide the reason for the failure from the people
Communism is not eugenics. I also would love to see who specifically you are saying was executed. Just calling someone a journalist doesn't automatically mean they are good people who do good things. Be specific if you're going to make an argument.
True but they execute anyone who dares to say anything other than the official media
You seem to have no idea what communism is. You're just spouting classic anti-communist propaganda. I'd recommend doing some unbiased research.
Meanwhile, I'm happy to support the communists who give us a platform the users are in charge of, instead of a capitalist who earns money off the back of free labor from it's users
Do you have any specific examples of this you want to reference, any specific states that you're talking about when you say "they" ?
Like Julian Assange? Yeah, that's deplorable.
This seems to be a particularly American concern, presumably dating back to the McCarthy era. Tye real question is: are they Tankies?
Sometimes the best tech people are weird as hell. This might be one of those cases.
Although I did hear that they censor content critical of china, which sucks.
I saw this rumor spread quickly and I want to check it out by myself. Is there any reference you could share?
This was shared shortly before the first Reddit wave: https://lemmy.world/comment/43639
One of the things I appreciate about them is their openness with people who disagree. In that very thread one of the comments by a dev and admin on lemmy.ml: “If you would have left those posts stay on your instance, that’s fine! We’re not demanding that you moderate according to our standards.”
Thank you, that was a very informative read.
I'll wait and see how this topic unravels in the future. Wishing the devs will state more firmly their position.
This is exactly my point. China is authoritarian and has commited war crimes against people who it doesnt't like. It also arrests journalists as enemies of the state.
I'm not saying the west is completely perfect but China is much worse
Anti-authoritarian communism is a thing. I think mostly the issue folks here in this thread are taking with you is equating communism with authoritarianism. And I don't think anyone in this thread is pro-China or defending censoring content critical of China. Quite the opposite in fact.
But communism doesn't work. All countries that implement communism have restrictions on free speech to hide the fact that it is a broken system.
The reason communism doesn't work is because people have no incentives to work. You can complain about the evils of the corporate empires but they at least have a motivation to improve even if that is sometimes at the expense of the people
Let me just jump in real quick and provide some info without supporting any side. You're referring to the authoritarian communism, and yes, none of it worked, and again yes, it's the only one that really happened in our history.
What you're missing is that the other person is referring to the lower left quadrant of the political compass, or libertarian socialist quadrant. And no, libertarian is referring here to the lack of or very week and non focused (with a lot of people in it) government.
For a great breakdown of the political compass I recommend Wendigoon's video on the topic. That's all I'm gonna say here, have a pleasant day and a good watch if you do decide to click on that link.
Also water is wet. The devs' political views are not important to me, the software they make is more important. "Separate the art from the artist."
True they start telling you how China is doing wonders for its people.
I disagree politicly with many people on reddit. I don't care if you disagree but it does bother me when they are following a dead idolology.
I also don't like lemmy.ml being as big as it is. We need to seperate the power of development from the power of administration
Also the devs expressed support for people creating more mainstream liberal instances. That's the reason why there are recommended instances at Join-Lemmy.
That seems bad for the ecosystem as a whole.
And? Are you concerned they're going to break into your house and depose the bourgeoisie because you followed a community on their instance?
Yeah. I don't understand this. Lemmy is an open source software and there are many instances to use. Hell, lemmy.ml is even pushing people away from their instance - that doesn't sound like people promoting lemmy to advance their ideology.
Don't agree with the devs' POV, use a different instance. I'm not socialist/communist and I'm perfectly fine using lemmy. I've talked to the devs and they've been nice and polite, and I haven't really encountered any lemmy.ml content trying to poison my mind. Lol. We even stayed on reddit even after fucking jailbait, the Donald, etc. fiasco.
I mean... Open source and federation are the perfect representation of the ideas of communism...
Um not really
This meme, again?!
I do not understand the argument. Are you implying that being communist automatically pins you in the pro CCP?
My country is socialist. My family is socialist. All my friends are socialists. I love socialism.
By following the same logic, does that mean that I am considered a Nazis lover?
No but many of the lemmy.ml founders embrace communism without evening considering how many people have been killed under that banner.
When I first heard about the communism I assumed that the were just far left socialists. It turns out they straight up worship communist leader
What banner? Are you under the impression that communism is some kind of monolith? If you're referring to the soviet union say that, or China, or whoever else you're specifically accusing of mass murder. The term communism refers to hundreds of different political ideologies and many different countries. Many of whom have next to nothing to do with each other.
And almost all of them have killed millions
I'm going to sound like a broken record but can you specify who you are talking about?
Anti west propaganda
How is asking you to be specific with your arguments "anti west propaganda"?
I'm mostly referring to the moderation of lemmy.ml only promoting pro communist ideas. They actively remove all noncommunist content
And all the communists in this thread arguing with you hate the regimes that have killed millions (including the ones that have embraced the term "communist" like the CCP and Stalin's USSR) as much as you do.
Its kind of funny
Over 26 million people from ex Soviet states were killed in world war 2 fighting facism. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties_of_the_Soviet_Union
Exactly my point
This is exactly my point
Thank fuck! I love communists
you're saying that as if it's a bad thing! especially as long as they just develop and stay out of pushing certain content, then I couldn't care less. now if they were tankies on the other hand, that I would mind!
This. It's one things to disagree politically. It's another to think violence is an acceptable means of conveying that belief.
Their memes community is now full of post about how it's ok to kill capitalists and other hatefull bullshit and no admin seems to care. Also their comics community is now just spam of extremly hateful comics from one of the admins.
They are the same in my book
So are the devs. Actually, they're the same people. And you wanna know something else, they also run lemmygrad.
So how is this relevant at all, I fail to see.
Good. We need more communists representing their ideas in open forums. I’d be more concerned if they were capitalists. That’s just Reddit 2.0.
That's terrifying
Seriously?
Yes
just a quick thought on up/down votes on the OPs post.
my personal take... just because I think the content of a post is inflammatory or outright wrong, does not mean it deserves an insta-downvote.
every post and thread is a chance to share constructive dialogue. if the thread goes off the rails, I hand out downvotes liberally. If it is actually informative or interesting, I hand out upvotes - even if I disagree with a particular argument.
I have learned to spot idiots much more easily by watching the dialogue of a post develop and participating -- without doing the "it hurt my feelings, downvote!" thing.