As soon as people have more money to spend, landlords increase rent.
Renting is one of the biggest scams this generation has convinced itself into falling for.
I wasn't able to afford to buy a house until I was over 50 years old, it took a global pandemic, a complete shutdown of the economy, and working from home for multiple years to bank the cash to make it happen.
People don't rent because they CHOOSE to.
How much was your house?
Listed for $374,000, but I had to bid up to $390,000 to get it.
Yeah, you didn't have to spend anywhere near that much.
But you wanted to, so you did.
To buy a house where I live, that's a bargain!
Yeah, there are plenty of other places you can live though.
There are, but you can't make a living there.
It's all proportional.
Let's say you want to live in a low cost of living state:
You aren't buying a $175K house making $12.54 an hour. It's not happening.
Good maths but do it again with median, not average
You need to use median household income, not per capita. It's $49,111 in Mississippi according to your source.
The ratio of home price to household income is typically between 4 and 5 in the US, so the median family should be able to afford the median house in Mississippi.
Household income is absolutely not the right metric to use here, because it'll always be proportional to the cost of the house out of necessity.
For example, if the cost of a house goes up relative to individual income, then more people in the family need to start working more hours, and more people live with roommates.
Household income stays proportionally the same, always, but individual income shows you how much people are struggling.
No, it's not the right metric. Which is why people don't use it.
Imagine you make $160K and buy the nicest house you can afford with that income.
Then you get married, and your spouse makes $100K. Your household income has increased to $260K, which means you can afford an even nicer house.
Your per capita income has decreased to $130K. By your logic, you can't afford a nicer house. In fact, with a second income you might no longer be able to afford your current house. That's nonsense.
When multiple people live in a house they all have the opportunity to contribute to paying for it. Some may contribute a lot, some (like children) may contribute nothing. The house you can afford depends on the total amount everyone contributes, aka household income.
if the cost of a house goes up
This doesn't make sense. The cost of a house is fixed when you buy it. It won't ever go up while you live there.
People didn't used to need a second income to afford a house. Now they do.
Household income doesn't show that change. Individual income does.
"If you want to move to a shithole, you can get a good deal on a house" is not the persuasive argument you think it is.
EDIT: Just so you know where this person is coming from, they've moved on to talk about how fascism isn't so bad from a "global perspective" and being anti-fascist is just "tribalism."
That's because it's not my argument. You're being reddit-brained again.
Yeah, there are plenty of other places you can live though.
Sure sounds like your argument to me. But do tell us the non-shithole places you can live where houses are less than $300,000.
Places with median home prices under 300K and Democrats in state government:
Buffalo, NY
Rochester, NY
Michigan
(Since you live in IN, you don't need me to tell you that Michigan is a pretty nice state to live in).
I live in Michigan. Most of the houses below 300k are either so far out in the sticks you can barely even get Internet, or they're in dangerous and very run down areas.
There are a few nice places listed at 250k, but they sell instantly and for quite a bit above what they're listed at, so it's not like you can actually get one of them.
@jordanlund already linked saying the average price for a home is 170k in Mississppi, and even that isn't necessary to find a nice place.
My house was only $60k and it's 1,200 sqft and 10 minutes from a hospital.
The real issue here is your entitlement. You think you're 'too good' to live in places that many others do because you think you're better than them.
Well, if you're so much better than them then pay up, lol. The problem with you people is that you think you're entitled to live in expensive places, but you're not actually valuable enough to society to have a salary that can pay for them. Then you want other people to foot the bill so you can continue to have more than those living in what you deem 'shitholes.'
You'd come across as more genuine if you just admitted it. But you won't. Nobody wants to acknowledge their entitlement, lol.
Do those places have even remotely comparable work, laws, or amenities? Because yeah you can buy a dirt cheap house 5 mountains from the nearest city in rural Tennessee, but it’s a terrible place to live and you won’t be able to find work.
That’s not a crazy price, that’s like outskirts of reasonably sized city price.
This generation? Fucking Romans were complaining about high rent for shitty apartments over 2000 years ago. Don't be a dumbass.
Right... and no generation since has ever seen the value of owning property, right? Lol.
Mark Twain was right. It's easier to fool someone than to convince them they'd been fooled.
See how mad people get in this comment section when someone points out they're being taken for a ride? One person even said they won't get off the ride if it isn't "easy." Lol.
Supply and demand. You're not exempt from them.
Right... and no generation since has ever seen the value of owning property, right? Lol.
Are you under the impression that modern renters are choosing to rent instead of own?
60% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck making saving for a down payment impossible for over half the country, and with rates being what they are, mortgages are expensive af.
People are renting because it's the only way to live, not because they think it's neat. People are getting upset at you not because you're pointing out that rent is a scam, but because you're implying it's the fault of the victims
Quoting someone much smarter than you doesn't enhance your unintelligible argument. It makes it dramatically worse.
Oh boy, we got one.
slaps forehead wait I can just buy a house? What a solution!! So easy!
You are being sarcastic but a lot of people who are convinced they can't afford it actually could afford to own the place they rent and have just never crunched the numbers.
Before the rate hike this was probably true, but most areas haven't adjusted to people having about 100k less buying power.
I never said it would be easy.
Do you only do things if they are easy?
I make about $75k a year, but to afford a $700k house (which is a "reasonable" price) near my city (Seattle), I'd have to make $150k per year. The only affordable houses are two hours' drive away, and there are no "starter" homes to buy. I can skrimp and save for the rest of my life (and I am). But unless I get a huge raise (and I'm already above the median national income), buying a house is impossible. Not just hard, economically impossible.
Have you tried just making more money?
Jeez, you poors are just so lazy.
(I really wish this weren't needed, but I think it is) \s
I'm also in Seattle and it's bad out here. I was looking at townhouses last year before the rates went up but couldn't get a mortgage because of a limited amount of work experience since getting my second degree during the pandemic. I was actually surprised that I could have afforded a decent townhouse in like Edmonds or Shoreline until the rates shot up - going from 3.5% to 7% adds something like $1000 a month in interest on a $400k mortgage. Then I realized I have never lived alone before and wasn't sure if buying a place was the best way to try that out lol. Average rent in Seattle right now though is like $2300-$2400 a month which is close to 50% of the take-home income of someone making $100,000 per year. It's insane.
lol yeah dude, I convinced myself to rent
I mean, you live in a major city so yeah.
You're probably never going to leave major cities, nor are you ever going to own property in them.
Yeah. You convinced yourself to rent.
I live in rural Iowa wtf are you talking about? We rent out here too!
I actually am paying off my trailer, though, so someday I could maybe put this on a piece of rural property somewhere and do remote work or something? But like, I never chose this shit - I just stayed where I grew up and got a factory job when my neurosis and undiagnosed dysphoria caused me to flunk out of college. I guess I could go squat in the woods though lol
Its pretty insane we don't invest in our cities anymore when they're the powerhouse of the economy. Not to mention they're a way better use of land than suburbs and rural living. You can find affordable places in Tokyo and so many other cities worldwide that dwarf ours in almost every metric. Cities really aren't the problem, they are actually the potential solution if we change our policies around them and attempt to catch up with countries like Japan.
Hold on everyone, this 17 year old is gonna explain why we're all idiots
Because it's a bullshit narrative. Cost of living keeps going up. But inflation doesn't count rent, groceries, or gas.
For what it's worth gas has come down quite a bit the last few weeks.
Rent is going to go up as long as it's able.
As soon as people have more money to spend, landlords increase rent.
Renting is one of the biggest scams this generation has convinced itself into falling for.
I wasn't able to afford to buy a house until I was over 50 years old, it took a global pandemic, a complete shutdown of the economy, and working from home for multiple years to bank the cash to make it happen.
People don't rent because they CHOOSE to.
How much was your house?
Listed for $374,000, but I had to bid up to $390,000 to get it.
Yeah, you didn't have to spend anywhere near that much.
But you wanted to, so you did.
To buy a house where I live, that's a bargain!
Yeah, there are plenty of other places you can live though.
There are, but you can't make a living there.
It's all proportional.
Let's say you want to live in a low cost of living state:
https://www.ramseysolutions.com/real-estate/cheapest-states-to-live-in
Mississippi.
OK, I don't know why anyone would want to live there, but sure, let's look at the numbers.
https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/MS/BZA115221
Per capita income in past 12 months (in 2021 dollars), 2017-2021 - $26,807
Persons in poverty, percent - 19.1%
https://www.zillow.com/home-values/34/ms/
"The average Mississippi home value is $174,932."
You aren't buying a $175K house making $12.54 an hour. It's not happening.
Good maths but do it again with median, not average
You need to use median household income, not per capita. It's $49,111 in Mississippi according to your source.
The ratio of home price to household income is typically between 4 and 5 in the US, so the median family should be able to afford the median house in Mississippi.
Household income is absolutely not the right metric to use here, because it'll always be proportional to the cost of the house out of necessity.
For example, if the cost of a house goes up relative to individual income, then more people in the family need to start working more hours, and more people live with roommates.
Household income stays proportionally the same, always, but individual income shows you how much people are struggling.
No, it's not the right metric. Which is why people don't use it.
Imagine you make $160K and buy the nicest house you can afford with that income.
Then you get married, and your spouse makes $100K. Your household income has increased to $260K, which means you can afford an even nicer house.
Your per capita income has decreased to $130K. By your logic, you can't afford a nicer house. In fact, with a second income you might no longer be able to afford your current house. That's nonsense.
When multiple people live in a house they all have the opportunity to contribute to paying for it. Some may contribute a lot, some (like children) may contribute nothing. The house you can afford depends on the total amount everyone contributes, aka household income.
This doesn't make sense. The cost of a house is fixed when you buy it. It won't ever go up while you live there.
People didn't used to need a second income to afford a house. Now they do.
Household income doesn't show that change. Individual income does.
Yeah, my house was only $60k. 1,200 square foot. Wasn't the best deal I could get, but I'm satisfied with my purchase.
I was also looking at houses in a similar price range in Mississippi.
You don't "need" to spend 'average price' for a nice house. You choose to because you want the luxuries that cause the price to go up.
"If you want to move to a shithole, you can get a good deal on a house" is not the persuasive argument you think it is.
EDIT: Just so you know where this person is coming from, they've moved on to talk about how fascism isn't so bad from a "global perspective" and being anti-fascist is just "tribalism."
That's because it's not my argument. You're being reddit-brained again.
Sure sounds like your argument to me. But do tell us the non-shithole places you can live where houses are less than $300,000.
Places with median home prices under 300K and Democrats in state government:
(Since you live in IN, you don't need me to tell you that Michigan is a pretty nice state to live in).
I live in Michigan. Most of the houses below 300k are either so far out in the sticks you can barely even get Internet, or they're in dangerous and very run down areas.
There are a few nice places listed at 250k, but they sell instantly and for quite a bit above what they're listed at, so it's not like you can actually get one of them.
@jordanlund already linked saying the average price for a home is 170k in Mississppi, and even that isn't necessary to find a nice place.
My house was only $60k and it's 1,200 sqft and 10 minutes from a hospital.
The real issue here is your entitlement. You think you're 'too good' to live in places that many others do because you think you're better than them.
Well, if you're so much better than them then pay up, lol. The problem with you people is that you think you're entitled to live in expensive places, but you're not actually valuable enough to society to have a salary that can pay for them. Then you want other people to foot the bill so you can continue to have more than those living in what you deem 'shitholes.'
You'd come across as more genuine if you just admitted it. But you won't. Nobody wants to acknowledge their entitlement, lol.
Yes. Mississippi. Notoriously not a shithole.
Do those places have even remotely comparable work, laws, or amenities? Because yeah you can buy a dirt cheap house 5 mountains from the nearest city in rural Tennessee, but it’s a terrible place to live and you won’t be able to find work.
That’s not a crazy price, that’s like outskirts of reasonably sized city price.
This generation? Fucking Romans were complaining about high rent for shitty apartments over 2000 years ago. Don't be a dumbass.
Right... and no generation since has ever seen the value of owning property, right? Lol.
Mark Twain was right. It's easier to fool someone than to convince them they'd been fooled.
See how mad people get in this comment section when someone points out they're being taken for a ride? One person even said they won't get off the ride if it isn't "easy." Lol.
Supply and demand. You're not exempt from them.
Are you under the impression that modern renters are choosing to rent instead of own?
60% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck making saving for a down payment impossible for over half the country, and with rates being what they are, mortgages are expensive af.
People are renting because it's the only way to live, not because they think it's neat. People are getting upset at you not because you're pointing out that rent is a scam, but because you're implying it's the fault of the victims
Quoting someone much smarter than you doesn't enhance your unintelligible argument. It makes it dramatically worse.
Oh boy, we got one.
slaps forehead wait I can just buy a house? What a solution!! So easy!
You are being sarcastic but a lot of people who are convinced they can't afford it actually could afford to own the place they rent and have just never crunched the numbers.
Before the rate hike this was probably true, but most areas haven't adjusted to people having about 100k less buying power.
I never said it would be easy.
Do you only do things if they are easy?
I make about $75k a year, but to afford a $700k house (which is a "reasonable" price) near my city (Seattle), I'd have to make $150k per year. The only affordable houses are two hours' drive away, and there are no "starter" homes to buy. I can skrimp and save for the rest of my life (and I am). But unless I get a huge raise (and I'm already above the median national income), buying a house is impossible. Not just hard, economically impossible.
Have you tried just making more money?
Jeez, you poors are just so lazy.
(I really wish this weren't needed, but I think it is) \s
I'm also in Seattle and it's bad out here. I was looking at townhouses last year before the rates went up but couldn't get a mortgage because of a limited amount of work experience since getting my second degree during the pandemic. I was actually surprised that I could have afforded a decent townhouse in like Edmonds or Shoreline until the rates shot up - going from 3.5% to 7% adds something like $1000 a month in interest on a $400k mortgage. Then I realized I have never lived alone before and wasn't sure if buying a place was the best way to try that out lol. Average rent in Seattle right now though is like $2300-$2400 a month which is close to 50% of the take-home income of someone making $100,000 per year. It's insane.
lol yeah dude, I convinced myself to rent
I mean, you live in a major city so yeah.
You're probably never going to leave major cities, nor are you ever going to own property in them.
Yeah. You convinced yourself to rent.
I live in rural Iowa wtf are you talking about? We rent out here too!
I actually am paying off my trailer, though, so someday I could maybe put this on a piece of rural property somewhere and do remote work or something? But like, I never chose this shit - I just stayed where I grew up and got a factory job when my neurosis and undiagnosed dysphoria caused me to flunk out of college. I guess I could go squat in the woods though lol
Its pretty insane we don't invest in our cities anymore when they're the powerhouse of the economy. Not to mention they're a way better use of land than suburbs and rural living. You can find affordable places in Tokyo and so many other cities worldwide that dwarf ours in almost every metric. Cities really aren't the problem, they are actually the potential solution if we change our policies around them and attempt to catch up with countries like Japan.
Hold on everyone, this 17 year old is gonna explain why we're all idiots