The way they phrase the reasoning in their proposal is just disgusting! Like "Users want advertisers to be happy, and advertisers need ...", as if it's all about what users want.
If you're still using Chrome... What was it like hitting retirement age before 2008?
Jokes aside, Chrome really is the bottom of my list in the last several years. I've gotten the best functionality out of Firefox in the last while. Anyone else different?
I've been using Firefox since forever. It had its downs, but generally I'm happy with it. And with Multi account containers they've made sure I stay for life, it saves so much time.
How do multi-account containers differ from Chrome profiles?
Being able to have different containers in the same window?
Plus you can make certain sites always automatically open in their designated container, even if you followed a link. You can keep sites know for spying away from your logged in identity. You can have your banking and other important sites in another container for extra defense in depth.
Thanks. Not something I'd want to do (I like my work and personal tabs in totally separate windows) but obviously that's just personal preference.
It's pretty useful at work because I can separate the about riddled with sales trackers from asking for quotes from my "how do I do X" profile. It can change the results a fair bit. On one I'll get tons of Enterprise professional services, the other recommends a lot of FOSS results.
I tried to use Firefox for work but I had to log into multiple AWS accounts at the same time, which I didn’t think was possible. It’s easy with profiles in the chromium browsers, trying to remember if I tried it in Firefox now
It's easier in Firefox with containers. You can use multiple aws accounts on the same profile but different containers. I've tried to migrate to blink based browsers for various reasons, but this is what keeps me coming back to Firefox!
Firefox even has tab sandboxes now. So you can even run personal aws on one tab and business aws in another. They will have their own sandboxes so won't collide.
I'm stuck with chrome for work because everyone wants their integrated Google Workplace services to operate seamlessly (and because that's what's approved in our security P&P).
If it doesn’t work with other WebKit or chrome-based browsers, then we’re back to “extend and extinguish” and your company should run as far away from that locked-in garbage as fast as possible.
I do a lot of casting from my desktop to the Chromecast connected to my TV. I have not been able to successfully cast from Firefox. I would love to find a solution though.
Interesting, any experiences with this? How well does it work?
I use it quite often and it works very well. Though I use it primarily for YouTube, so I'm not sure how well it works on other sites. I think once I've tried it on Netflix (it worked) and a few times for just casting some videos somewhere on the internet.
Thanks!
I preferred Brave but I'm side-eyeing it the more news that comes out about Chromium.
I've been trying to switch to Firefox but the tab groups suck and I rely on that pretty heavily so I'm stuck in chromium. Every tab group thing I've tried on Firefox is just worse.
I use Firefox at home, but at work I use Edge as we use Microsoft for a lot of services. It's actually surprisingly not bad ha ha.
If only Firefox rendered my CSS exactly the same like in Chrome. I don't know if they fixed it but last time developing a web site in FF was real annoying because when I made it look just right in FF some minor things were slightly off in Chrome so I had to keep going back and forth.
I don't work in hardly anything touching a front end, but shouldn't you support all major browsers for your rendering? So, checking it in several browsers all the time.
I totally get the difference between should and do, so honestly asking. There is shit I should do, and there is shit that there is time to do. Checking all browsers on all updates may not be it.
This proposal absolutely infuriates me. This is making it so that you won't be able to browse the web unless you are using "approved" hardware on an "approved" OS with an "approved" browser. You will have no freedom to control your computing. Even if your browser is open source it will barely matter because you won't be able to patch it, you will need to run the approved binaries.
Fuck off and let me use the software I want.
This is SafetyNet from Android. You won't be able to access your bank, your movies, your anything unless you are using hardware and software that is controlled by billion dollar corporations.
This is the problem:
Exactly how the rest of the world feels about this is not necessarily relevant, though. Google owns the world's most popular web browser, the world's largest advertising network, the world's biggest search engine, the world's most popular operating system, and some of the world's most popular websites. So really, Google can do whatever it wants. Other projects like Chrome's "Privacy Sandbox" ad platform and the adblock-limiting manifest V3 have been universally panned, but Google has kept right on trucking with the projects. There have been some small project tweaks and delays, but Google keeps marching forward.
If the theory that consumers are rational actors were true, then the world would simply switch to a new "most popular web browser" etc anf Google's hegemony would end.
Unfortunately that's not how the world really works and plenty of people will sit there obediently being milked of their data and influenced in their behaviour.
Maybe they shouldn’t own all that stuff. It’s Microsoft Explorer all over again.
Not keen on following these awful proposals. It feels like there's a persistent trend of making the internet shiter than it was beforehand. I get alphabet has a vetted interest in ads and user data, but if they're going to push for this tracking approach I guess it'll be back to fix Firefox again
Consider switching now. Your continued usage is contributing to the user numbers they see reported that gives them the confidence to pull this shit in the first place.
Silicon Valley Hubris. These companies got too big and act as if we don't have choices. Web is still built on open standards no matter what. These are all attempts to graft on closed patterns on open infrastructure.
It worked with the media DRM that currently exists in browsers.
if they’re going to push for this tracking approach I guess it’ll be back to fix Firefox again
If they will? They will. They are.
Time to follow through on your words. I expect a reply written using Firefox.
Advertisement is a fucking syphilis, a cancer and a gangrene combined.
Don't tell me what to watch what to visit
Fortunately, there are other good browsers that don't follow this bullshit. I'm lucky that I haven't seen ads in ages (and I absolutely don't miss them). Websites/Services should just find different ways to monetize their work, ads are the worst way IMHO (collecting data, promoting often useless consumption in a world where we need to reduce consumption, annoying etc.).
Are there other browsers? Most of them use Google's engine so presumably they'll have to bow down to this decision. Firefox and Safari are the only independent engines but Safari can't be used on non-Apple devices and Mozilla is funded by Google.
Now, granted, the whole reason Google funds Mozilla is to be able to show they have competition, so forcing WebDRM on Firefox would play against that. But it's their move to make if they feel like weathering an EU investigation is worth it.
Yeah the whole situation is a little bit fucked, Google has too much power (over Mozilla) and browser engines in general.
But I'm optimistic about the open source community, e.g. brave integrates their own ublock compatible rewrite (in Rust ^^) into chromium. So I think sooner or later there are patched/forked chromiums and if Mozilla indeed makes the move towards WebDRM then also Firefox forks.
I really hope servo under the umbrella of the Linux Foundation proves to be a viable alternative in the future, that's a little bit more independent than Firefox.
This is fucking sick. What is going on with the tech giants this year?! Twitter, reddit, YouTube...
They're not getting the sweet funding they used to so now they actually have to be profitable.
Yep. They are ordinary businesses now, and must seek every increasing profits via squeezing.
The innovation era of big tech is over. The internet is just another utility over which ads must be pumped.
People forget that cable was ad-free went it first started rolling out.
Yeah, and the advertising market is only so big. Showing a user hundreds of ads still only makes them buy maybe one product they don't actually need. The profits from that one product are the maximum amount of money to pay for all those ads.
So, if Google shoves more ads down our throats, that means other companies get less money for the ads they show and so have to increase the number of shown ads, too. Even though this still likely won't make users actually buy more products.
It's an arms race and the loser is the user just getting thousands of useless ads.
They used to be "Don't be evil" now they're the most evil company, absolutely crazy.
All they did was add a . to it. How tough can that be? Don't. Be Evil
A part of me is kind of looking forward to it. It may be the breaking point to finally reduce my internet usage and get to implementing the Digital Minimalism, because I feel so strongly against this kind of bullshit that I refuse to use any website that keeps telling me what I can and can't do. Once I don't have control over what sites I want to support with ads, or what sites can track me and collect data about me - I will simply stop using it.
I've been slowly getting used to the reduced user experience caused by privacy-focused approach. Reddit and Youtube has taught me to just look elsewhere instead of logging in when prompted, LibreFox has got me used to having to relog-in every time i switch tabs due to containers and cookie autodelete, and the subscription bullshit for every smart product has taught me to reflash and self-host devices I can, so I already have a NAS and pretty comfy infrastructure ready.
But I still get drawn to some social networks, or end up mindlessly procrastrinating by browsing the web. This will finally be something not under my control (I tried Cold Turkey - it never lasted long) that will keep me out of the internet for good. It doesn't really add much value to my life, blog posts and youtube tutorials have been reduced to absolute basics without any value, most of them now even AI generated. If I want to learn something about a topic, it's hard to find actually interresting content that isn't the same basics tutorial for dummies made for people without attention span who don't want details, but just to feel like they are doing something smart with their time.
Now that I think about, it's been a long time since I've actually found something of value on the internet, the discussions here on Lemmy are one of the last few things that I find interesting to engage with. But I'm too used to it to be able to quit on my own accord, and this may just be the push I need, to finally go all-in into the Digital Minimalism.
The way they phrase the reasoning in their proposal is just disgusting! Like "Users want advertisers to be happy, and advertisers need ...", as if it's all about what users want.
If you're still using Chrome... What was it like hitting retirement age before 2008?
Jokes aside, Chrome really is the bottom of my list in the last several years. I've gotten the best functionality out of Firefox in the last while. Anyone else different?
I've been using Firefox since forever. It had its downs, but generally I'm happy with it. And with Multi account containers they've made sure I stay for life, it saves so much time.
How do multi-account containers differ from Chrome profiles?
Being able to have different containers in the same window?
Plus you can make certain sites always automatically open in their designated container, even if you followed a link. You can keep sites know for spying away from your logged in identity. You can have your banking and other important sites in another container for extra defense in depth.
Thanks. Not something I'd want to do (I like my work and personal tabs in totally separate windows) but obviously that's just personal preference.
It's pretty useful at work because I can separate the about riddled with sales trackers from asking for quotes from my "how do I do X" profile. It can change the results a fair bit. On one I'll get tons of Enterprise professional services, the other recommends a lot of FOSS results.
When did they implement the containers?
2016
I tried to use Firefox for work but I had to log into multiple AWS accounts at the same time, which I didn’t think was possible. It’s easy with profiles in the chromium browsers, trying to remember if I tried it in Firefox now
It's easier in Firefox with containers. You can use multiple aws accounts on the same profile but different containers. I've tried to migrate to blink based browsers for various reasons, but this is what keeps me coming back to Firefox!
Firefox even has tab sandboxes now. So you can even run personal aws on one tab and business aws in another. They will have their own sandboxes so won't collide.
@astraeus @Quill7513
firefox -PI never stopped using Firefox
I'm stuck with chrome for work because everyone wants their integrated Google Workplace services to operate seamlessly (and because that's what's approved in our security P&P).
If it doesn’t work with other WebKit or chrome-based browsers, then we’re back to “extend and extinguish” and your company should run as far away from that locked-in garbage as fast as possible.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish
I do a lot of casting from my desktop to the Chromecast connected to my TV. I have not been able to successfully cast from Firefox. I would love to find a solution though.
https://github.com/hensm/fx\_cast/releases
Interesting, any experiences with this? How well does it work?
I use it quite often and it works very well. Though I use it primarily for YouTube, so I'm not sure how well it works on other sites. I think once I've tried it on Netflix (it worked) and a few times for just casting some videos somewhere on the internet.
Thanks!
I preferred Brave but I'm side-eyeing it the more news that comes out about Chromium.
I've been trying to switch to Firefox but the tab groups suck and I rely on that pretty heavily so I'm stuck in chromium. Every tab group thing I've tried on Firefox is just worse.
I use Firefox at home, but at work I use Edge as we use Microsoft for a lot of services. It's actually surprisingly not bad ha ha.
If only Firefox rendered my CSS exactly the same like in Chrome. I don't know if they fixed it but last time developing a web site in FF was real annoying because when I made it look just right in FF some minor things were slightly off in Chrome so I had to keep going back and forth.
I don't work in hardly anything touching a front end, but shouldn't you support all major browsers for your rendering? So, checking it in several browsers all the time.
I totally get the difference between should and do, so honestly asking. There is shit I should do, and there is shit that there is time to do. Checking all browsers on all updates may not be it.
This proposal absolutely infuriates me. This is making it so that you won't be able to browse the web unless you are using "approved" hardware on an "approved" OS with an "approved" browser. You will have no freedom to control your computing. Even if your browser is open source it will barely matter because you won't be able to patch it, you will need to run the approved binaries.
Fuck off and let me use the software I want.
This is SafetyNet from Android. You won't be able to access your bank, your movies, your anything unless you are using hardware and software that is controlled by billion dollar corporations.
This is the problem:
If the theory that consumers are rational actors were true, then the world would simply switch to a new "most popular web browser" etc anf Google's hegemony would end.
Unfortunately that's not how the world really works and plenty of people will sit there obediently being milked of their data and influenced in their behaviour.
Maybe they shouldn’t own all that stuff. It’s Microsoft Explorer all over again.
Not keen on following these awful proposals. It feels like there's a persistent trend of making the internet shiter than it was beforehand. I get alphabet has a vetted interest in ads and user data, but if they're going to push for this tracking approach I guess it'll be back to fix Firefox again
Consider switching now. Your continued usage is contributing to the user numbers they see reported that gives them the confidence to pull this shit in the first place.
Silicon Valley Hubris. These companies got too big and act as if we don't have choices. Web is still built on open standards no matter what. These are all attempts to graft on closed patterns on open infrastructure.
It worked with the media DRM that currently exists in browsers.
If they will? They will. They are.
Time to follow through on your words. I expect a reply written using Firefox.
Advertisement is a fucking syphilis, a cancer and a gangrene combined. Don't tell me what to watch what to visit
Fortunately, there are other good browsers that don't follow this bullshit. I'm lucky that I haven't seen ads in ages (and I absolutely don't miss them). Websites/Services should just find different ways to monetize their work, ads are the worst way IMHO (collecting data, promoting often useless consumption in a world where we need to reduce consumption, annoying etc.).
Are there other browsers? Most of them use Google's engine so presumably they'll have to bow down to this decision. Firefox and Safari are the only independent engines but Safari can't be used on non-Apple devices and Mozilla is funded by Google.
Now, granted, the whole reason Google funds Mozilla is to be able to show they have competition, so forcing WebDRM on Firefox would play against that. But it's their move to make if they feel like weathering an EU investigation is worth it.
Yeah the whole situation is a little bit fucked, Google has too much power (over Mozilla) and browser engines in general. But I'm optimistic about the open source community, e.g. brave integrates their own ublock compatible rewrite (in Rust ^^) into chromium. So I think sooner or later there are patched/forked chromiums and if Mozilla indeed makes the move towards WebDRM then also Firefox forks.
I really hope servo under the umbrella of the Linux Foundation proves to be a viable alternative in the future, that's a little bit more independent than Firefox.
This is fucking sick. What is going on with the tech giants this year?! Twitter, reddit, YouTube...
They're not getting the sweet funding they used to so now they actually have to be profitable.
Yep. They are ordinary businesses now, and must seek every increasing profits via squeezing.
The innovation era of big tech is over. The internet is just another utility over which ads must be pumped.
People forget that cable was ad-free went it first started rolling out.
Yeah, and the advertising market is only so big. Showing a user hundreds of ads still only makes them buy maybe one product they don't actually need. The profits from that one product are the maximum amount of money to pay for all those ads.
So, if Google shoves more ads down our throats, that means other companies get less money for the ads they show and so have to increase the number of shown ads, too. Even though this still likely won't make users actually buy more products. It's an arms race and the loser is the user just getting thousands of useless ads.
They used to be "Don't be evil" now they're the most evil company, absolutely crazy.
All they did was add a . to it. How tough can that be? Don't. Be Evil
A part of me is kind of looking forward to it. It may be the breaking point to finally reduce my internet usage and get to implementing the Digital Minimalism, because I feel so strongly against this kind of bullshit that I refuse to use any website that keeps telling me what I can and can't do. Once I don't have control over what sites I want to support with ads, or what sites can track me and collect data about me - I will simply stop using it.
I've been slowly getting used to the reduced user experience caused by privacy-focused approach. Reddit and Youtube has taught me to just look elsewhere instead of logging in when prompted, LibreFox has got me used to having to relog-in every time i switch tabs due to containers and cookie autodelete, and the subscription bullshit for every smart product has taught me to reflash and self-host devices I can, so I already have a NAS and pretty comfy infrastructure ready.
But I still get drawn to some social networks, or end up mindlessly procrastrinating by browsing the web. This will finally be something not under my control (I tried Cold Turkey - it never lasted long) that will keep me out of the internet for good. It doesn't really add much value to my life, blog posts and youtube tutorials have been reduced to absolute basics without any value, most of them now even AI generated. If I want to learn something about a topic, it's hard to find actually interresting content that isn't the same basics tutorial for dummies made for people without attention span who don't want details, but just to feel like they are doing something smart with their time.
Now that I think about, it's been a long time since I've actually found something of value on the internet, the discussions here on Lemmy are one of the last few things that I find interesting to engage with. But I'm too used to it to be able to quit on my own accord, and this may just be the push I need, to finally go all-in into the Digital Minimalism.