I mean, it's not very cool if the good people living here have to suffer for it. Wishing for collapse isn't progressive or leftist - it's just defeatist.
Wishing for the collapse of the current system is very leftist. In fact, you objectively can't be considered leftist if you support anything about the imperialist, colonialist, capitalist US system. There are zero redeeming features about our nation. It should die.
I'd prefer gradual reform over collapse. Less shocking to our culture/economy that way I think.
Yeah well gradual reform is right-wing liberal propaganda that makes marginalized groups suffer even more for our own privilege. It doesn't work.
Just to be clear if you had a magic button that would result in guaranteed gradual reform if you pressed it. And not pressing it would result in collapse.
You would press the button, right?
I would kill the person who was forcing me to push such an absurd button. I'd celebrate the death of any nation that supported the button's existence
How do you feel about democracies? Like say it post collapse and revolution. You ended up on top. Would you create a democracy?
This may come as an absolute shock, but this is a post gleefully celebrating the idea of the downfall of a genocidal regime
If you want to discuss anarchist theory, there are much better forums for that than 196. Too many libs here.
So you don't feel safe answering my question. I won't force an answer.
I don't think this is the right place, no
There are liberals and even overt racists present in this thread
After reading a bit. It seems like a Democratic system. I didn't get the details but assuming the people who are appointed to the councils are voted upon. And voting happens within the councils. Then I would say yeah the system is Democratic.
Anarchism could be considered the most democratic system in the world, even if we don't tend to apply that term
Conversely, since it by definition requires the absence of hierarchies, we wouldn't have a situation where we are compelled to oppress marginalized groups, no matter how popular the idea may be (I'm thinking here for example of how US liberals say our president has "no choice" but to imprison immigrants and participate in genocide just because there are enough racists that agree we should oppress these groups)
I could go on, but I'm going to shut up now before someone pops out of a well
We are a "first past the post" electoral system. That alone should disillusion you of hope for any change through voting.
Biden is "the most progressive president we've ever had." This is probably sadly true, which again shows that anyone who cares about marginalized groups should hope for the collapse of such an outrageously atrocious system.
Collapse is best. We should work towards collapse.
Edit: Autocorrect sucks donkey ass
i don't think the left wing is best positioned to take power if there was a collapse
i think a collapse would bring the us significantly more right wing
It's never how it works. See, we get a century or so of dictatorships, with each new guy overthrowing the previous and promising to be better, and failing to be.
Somewhere along the line (because for some reason we won't do this in advance) intellectuals will in secret start developing some rules for a public-run government (democracy or sortition are popular), but no political leader or revolutionary leader will be actually willing to try them (because they like the power), until absolutely everyone is tired of the wars and coups because absolutely everyone has close friends and relatives they had to put into the cold ground.
And then the new Communist / Socialist / Anarchist / Whatever United States will rise, since the point is to be able to change the rules without someone shooting someone else.
Which is what happens when either the legislature, executive or courts collapse into corruption and seize power. The four boxes of liberty are a warning the first three (soapbox, ballot box, jury box) are all that keep the ammunition box closed and unused.
Yeah we're a nation of shit people overall. All the more reason collapse is best overall. I'm willing to suffer and die if it means Palestinians and immigrants can be spared
but if the right wing took power of america's arsenal i think more Palestinians and immigrants would die
Better make sure you support the lefties then if you don’t want a nazi government. Liberals have historically proven themselves to support nazis over leftists during a revolution, I hope you will do differently if you actually believe what you say.
Let's give the land back to the Native Americans then! Surely they can't do worse than our inherently corrupt, atrocious system, right?
Certainly if we are "first past the post" and our biggest hope for change and "most progressive" president is a bigoted genocidaire, we're better with them in charge, agreed?
certainly sir right you are
but, just one more thing
i don't think a group of people that the state has spent centuries stamping out are in a position to successfully hold together a country as wide-spread and diverse as the united states, so i feel like just handing it over with no other intervention is as good as a free for all, and i think that just leads to a right wing takeover
Yikes, so you oppose returning the land to Native groups for the sake of holding together a nation that is objectively more racist and genocidal than Nazi Germany. Yikes.
That's not what they're saying. They say that if you gave land back right now, you'd have massive violence against natives and likely other marginalized people by the fascists that have been building militias for years now. A revolution needs popular support, and I just don't see that at the moment.
Voting will also not change that. But neither will not voting, at least not for the better. Treat it like a chore, like you're taking out the trash. That won't clean your house, but if you don't, you're gonna live in filth before long.
Liberals think that voting is the end of politics, but that's where the actual work begins. Organize your workplace, your local community and with marginalized people. Build the support needed to tear this fucked up, cruel and callous system down. So when the collapse comes, fascism will not win. The people will.
i believe i said i oppose returning the land to native groups with a completely hands-off approach because it would most likely lead to a right-wing uprising within the country, which would ultimately strip said native groups of their newly held rights anyway
Look i read a lot of your stuff and agree with a bunch of it and disagree with a bunch which is fine but NEVER downplay the terrors nazi Germany caused again. You don't know shit about anything if you think the US is more genocidal and racist than nazi Germany. The US is a shit country with a broken system that lets you choose between trash and a dumpster fire but holy shit was Nazi Germany bad. You seem to be from the US so maybe you don't get taught a lot about it.
Yes, the US is complicit in genocide but there's levels to it. The Germans were worse, they'd tell you to pack all your important belongings if you were a Jew or anyone else on their list of undesirables. Then they'd throw you in a train after taking all your important belongings you so neatly sorted for them so they don't have to put big effort into searching your place for riches. You'd get treated as an animal in a container and brought to a camp, split up from your family. At this point your fate almost certainly was death. You'd get put to work. Near constant work with not enough food to sustain your body so you'd slowly decrease more and more day after day until you die. You might also get your still alive body experimented on in full pain by doctors. If the camp was already too full for new arrivals (as they didn't just go after their own population but they waged war all over and put more and more people in camps) or if they just felt like it they'd put you down like an animal, be it gas chambers or other methods.
Like i get that the prison system in the US is ethnically targeted slavery and the US has and had their fingers in a lot of fucked up shit but don't ever use fucking nazi Germany for your hyperbole again.
We're set to collapse regardless, because our sitting president refuses to stop committing genocide and border fascism, so it doesn't really matter whether we like it or not, now does it? America is dying.
Personally, I think that's best. Death to America.
You haven't seen liberal Democrats stating that Biden is the most progressive president we've ever had? It's a very common sentiment in liberal spaces like reddit, 4chan, and lemmy.world
Give an example in a top 5% subreddit.
I don't use reddit. Check any news or political community on lemmy.world, and you're sure to find it
The only results I get are your words plus 1 other. Please provide a link to your search results.
I don't know what to tell you. I didn't save links, and I'm not going to subject myself to the toxic news and politics communities on .world. I've seen everything of those places I need to see.
If you visit them long enough, you'll definitely see users calling Biden "the most progressive president we've had," often with lots of links that ... don't exactly support their thesis
Wishing for the collapse of the current system is very leftist
And see the imperialist, colonialist, capitalist China and Russia rise to wreck the world as they see fit just like how USA do? How very leftist of you.
How is it different when the USA does it?
A true anti-fascist opposes the acts, not the nation.
Nationalism is fascism.
No different, Just like hiding behind leftist agenda while pushing your anti-us one is no different than the right-wing trying to hide their fascism while pretend to do it for the people. Also you get someone who's not even trying to hide their intention if US collapse.
I've always been quite open about supporting the downfall of genocidal regimes, including the US
A leftist US citizen has no control over the Chinese or Russian government. Excusing your own country’s crimes because other countries do it as well is a wild stance and a disingenuous attempt to distract people from taking action. You are responsible for your own government.
"Wishing for the collapse of the current system is very leftist." - 16 upvotes, 0 downvotes.
And y'all wonder why people don't take the left seriously.
Hi friend, you seem to be* confused. Blahaj has downvotes disabled, so the count is almost always going to be zero. The only downvotes you may potentially see come from your own server.
I know in this case you might be upset that this person has 0 downvotes, but the reason Blahaj has them disabled is because bigots often use them to shutdown, and try and hide, trans people's comments and posts. Even when they are not saying anything controversial.
"The reason people support genocide, fascism, and capitalism is because of posts on 196" -You
The right was never going to support anti-fascism regardless of what the left does or says.
“Millions of people will suffer because capitalists! uwu ✌️✌️🌈⭐️🤣🤣🤣🤣”
And op is saying some shit about just giving governing to natives, but those would be the first people to suffer hard in a collapse. They just want people to hurt.
Accelerationism is a bigoted ideology that seeks to pit the minority against the majority during a state of economic and political collapse. It looks okay in a vacuum and on paper, but the reality is that in the event of widespread instability sociopaths would almost certainly seek power by convincing the majority population that it's minorities are the root of all their problems. You now have a second Holocaust on your hands.
Furthermore, I'm almost certain that it is spread by Nazis seeking to harness the left's hatred of the West in order to achieve their goal of "cleansing the white race" because I've observed that accelerationism is extremely popular with Nazis. They believe that a collapse will allow them to exterminate anyone they believe to be degenerate or inferior without being impeded. The extreme left, like always, is getting suckered into believing in a post-crash utopia and is helping them spread their disgusting ideology.
Sir, you are almost certainly a Nazi or a Nazi's unwitting cockholster. That makes me extremely disappointed because I know you didn't used to be like this.
You wanna make a real change? That means you have to actually get out from behind your PC and start targeting common "issues". You have to tackle the "problems" that the US is facing head-on. None of this cowardly, keyboard-warrior bullshit where you simp for some kind of fake, Nazi-inspired utopia and hope that something better will replace the US when the US collapses (spoilers: it'll only get worse). You have to actually take matters into your own hands.
You won't though, because you don't actually care, you just want to watch the world burn. You've drunk your flavor aid and now you're dying and can't see straight. Your mind has been poisoned to the point where you can't see the harm that your rhetoric threatens or who your rhetoric actually serves. As such, I'm not interested in arguing with you because I know you've convinced yourself that you're right and as such, nothing I can say will convince you otherwise. I'm more concerned about others following you while believing they're somehow doing good.
I'm not a sir, I'm not an accelerationist, and I actually do care. Unlike these fucking self-absorbed liberals, I care about groups like Palestinians, immigrants, and the many, many demographics we exploit for our well-being. I'm sorry you libs don't give a rat's ass.
No one believes that you actually believe any of that.
If someone can't believe that anti-fascists exist, then I'm not sure what to tell you
We believe anti-fascists exist and are extremely important. You just seem to be an idiot.
"Opposing a fascist nation is idiotic" -definitely an anti-fascist /s
Brilliant take. What's it like being a reactionary with leftist aesthetics? Does Putin pay you for this comrade or is it all of your own volition?
"Everyone to the left of Reagan is a Russian psyop/bot"
I'm getting a blackout on my neoliberal bingo card today!
You come up with an unusual opinion, people answer with counter arguments, and rather than explaining your position you come back with one liners that bring nothing to the discussion.
Do you have an example where the downfall of a society was beneficial to its citizens? In the last thousand years? More than one, so we can see that it's generally a good thing?
It's beneficial to the world if a genocidal regime that also virtually enslaves people in the global south collapses :3
So, you don't.
Alrighty then.
I don't? News to me
It's interesting you seem to think that exploitation will... Slow down?
Lol
The downfall of a genocidal regime would certainly help
Do you think it's downfall would be brought down by someone better?
This is depressingly naive...
It's enough for me just to smile happily at the idea of the downfall of a horrible genocidal state that has brought nothing but oppression and destruction in its wake :3
This is like being happy an evil company is going under while the CEO and their cronies have already taken their golden parachute on the next project.
Like... Nothing's changed. The entity is not a person. Nothing has been stopped. If anything they were just allowed to get away with it, while the suffering of everyone affected remains.
You're allowed to be happy, but you're naive to think this is the end of anything... Or even a push in a positive direction. No one's going to let you have that narrative when it's presented openly.
"We can't be happy Jeffrey Dahmer's gone because there are other serial killers afoot"
Inequivalent. Jeffrey Dahmer was an individual. My argument was on organizations that the guilty individuals had already left.
Oh, I'd celebrate their demise as well. If Amazon collapsed right now, it would be awesome.
See previous comment about golden parachutes and implosion of organization.
Yours is the same logic used to sue companies instead of people.
This is feeling petulant so I'm taking my step out now. Hope you find the joy you're looking for, but seeing as you noted earlier that you live in the USA and noting the instance you're posting from, I suspect you know all about what will be coming around the corner for trans people should the states be allowed to implode on itself.
Yeah, surely the state-sanctioned oppression of trans people will worsen if the fascist state collapses /s
collapse
Yeah ... it almost certainly won't. The world's largest economy and millitary will still be unmatched, except now they're under the control of mask-off christofascists. They're evil, but unfortunately they're not stupid.
Everyone in the free world will be in for a bad time to varying degrees. I can promise you the new regime won't be isolationists.
Yikes
Yikes indeed (scroll down for USAmerica defenders)
Dolphins and rainbows? What kind of LSD has OP been taking? Yeah, America is a hypocrite, and its politicians are liars who selectively apply "justice". American exceptionalism DOES indeed seem like a joke, and it is arguably far from the best Western or "democratic" country, but what country would OP say is the model we should all follow? OP, you obviously hate the USA. What country is the best in your opinion? I hate shit countries, but I sure as fuck would rather eat this shit over the shit I see in some countries.
I'm anarchist, so this is a hard question to answer
All states will devolve into fascism. The USA is just a lot more egregious than most, and it's very obvious that the world would be much better off were it to die.
If you think a collapse (and somehow having the indigenous take control through some mysterious force of the Abrahadraba) is anarchism, then you clearly don't know what that actually means.
I say this not as an anarchist,but as a baseline good person: Death to the USA
Your posting power is unmatched
o7 Thank you
I was foolish to think I could just post this though without attracting flies
This is what the phrase "can't see past their nose" looks like. OP has correctly identified a problem, and identified the fault. They just haven't internalized the wide reaching effects of a total dismantling.
This is not something that's going to be good for people like you're hoping. This is going to hurt a lot, and if history is to believed it won't be replaced by the people who share your views. It'll be another future fascist government.
Almost like it's a post on 196 celebrating the idea of the collapse of a genocidal regime
I swear debatelords are beside themselves if they are asked to let people enjoy things
You're going to have difficulty finding an audience to sit there and listen to you celebrate something that will actively bring more suffering to others than the current status quo.
Yeah the 70% of people here who support border fascism would probably not be too happy if their shit nation collapsed, it's true
I'm saying I'd be happy to see this genocidal state die
Self imploding genocidal states are not generally replaced by better people.
Haven't really seen you address this anywhere and it gives the appearance that your intentionally arguing in bad faith.
I'm not arguing at all. I'm celebrating the idea of a horrible nation that's brought nothing but harm collapsing.
I have ideas, but I certainly wouldn't try to engage in a thread like this that's filled with pearl-clutching American liberals and even overt racists.
"Everyone that disagrees with me is bad"
You're in your own home instance. If the vast majority is disagreeing with you and your home instance has nothing to say you might consider reevaluating your position.
I've been told the majority of people believe we should be supporting Israel and committing border fascism, so I'm not too interested in what the majority of USAmericans think. Yet another reason to smile while thinking about its collapse
It'd be nice if we didn't kill the world when we do, but we will. And if the empires that are eager to snap up the corpse weren't demonstrably worse.
So I suppose you oppose the United States of America then, since its very existence is destroying the world
So once again, my post
It is better than the conditions 50% of the planet's populace live in, even if at least 10% of that was caused by the USA. If you have a collapse, you'll get at least partially what's shown in Civil War (2024).
Better because it relies on the suffering and exploitation of those in the global south, so again: See post
The world will be better off without the USA
Edit: That's a bullshit movie BTW. It's like a redditor's ignorant idea of what would happen.
Unless you propose that nearly every nation in the world collapse, the global south would be further exploited to fill the vacuum created by the hole in exports of electrical machinery, which all developing and above nations need.
I mean, it's not very cool if the good people living here have to suffer for it. Wishing for collapse isn't progressive or leftist - it's just defeatist.
Wishing for the collapse of the current system is very leftist. In fact, you objectively can't be considered leftist if you support anything about the imperialist, colonialist, capitalist US system. There are zero redeeming features about our nation. It should die.
I'd prefer gradual reform over collapse. Less shocking to our culture/economy that way I think.
Yeah well gradual reform is right-wing liberal propaganda that makes marginalized groups suffer even more for our own privilege. It doesn't work.
Just to be clear if you had a magic button that would result in guaranteed gradual reform if you pressed it. And not pressing it would result in collapse.
You would press the button, right?
I would kill the person who was forcing me to push such an absurd button. I'd celebrate the death of any nation that supported the button's existence
How do you feel about democracies? Like say it post collapse and revolution. You ended up on top. Would you create a democracy?
This may come as an absolute shock, but this is a post gleefully celebrating the idea of the downfall of a genocidal regime
If you want to discuss anarchist theory, there are much better forums for that than 196. Too many libs here.
So you don't feel safe answering my question. I won't force an answer.
I don't think this is the right place, no
There are liberals and even overt racists present in this thread
Here's some reading for you
After reading a bit. It seems like a Democratic system. I didn't get the details but assuming the people who are appointed to the councils are voted upon. And voting happens within the councils. Then I would say yeah the system is Democratic.
Anarchism could be considered the most democratic system in the world, even if we don't tend to apply that term
Conversely, since it by definition requires the absence of hierarchies, we wouldn't have a situation where we are compelled to oppress marginalized groups, no matter how popular the idea may be (I'm thinking here for example of how US liberals say our president has "no choice" but to imprison immigrants and participate in genocide just because there are enough racists that agree we should oppress these groups)
I could go on, but I'm going to shut up now before someone pops out of a well
Liberals themselves have told me:
We are a "first past the post" electoral system. That alone should disillusion you of hope for any change through voting.
Biden is "the most progressive president we've ever had." This is probably sadly true, which again shows that anyone who cares about marginalized groups should hope for the collapse of such an outrageously atrocious system.
Collapse is best. We should work towards collapse.
Edit: Autocorrect sucks donkey ass
i don't think the left wing is best positioned to take power if there was a collapse
i think a collapse would bring the us significantly more right wing
It's never how it works. See, we get a century or so of dictatorships, with each new guy overthrowing the previous and promising to be better, and failing to be.
Somewhere along the line (because for some reason we won't do this in advance) intellectuals will in secret start developing some rules for a public-run government (democracy or sortition are popular), but no political leader or revolutionary leader will be actually willing to try them (because they like the power), until absolutely everyone is tired of the wars and coups because absolutely everyone has close friends and relatives they had to put into the cold ground.
And then the new Communist / Socialist / Anarchist / Whatever United States will rise, since the point is to be able to change the rules without someone shooting someone else.
Which is what happens when either the legislature, executive or courts collapse into corruption and seize power. The four boxes of liberty are a warning the first three (soapbox, ballot box, jury box) are all that keep the ammunition box closed and unused.
Yeah we're a nation of shit people overall. All the more reason collapse is best overall. I'm willing to suffer and die if it means Palestinians and immigrants can be spared
but if the right wing took power of america's arsenal i think more Palestinians and immigrants would die
Better make sure you support the lefties then if you don’t want a nazi government. Liberals have historically proven themselves to support nazis over leftists during a revolution, I hope you will do differently if you actually believe what you say.
Let's give the land back to the Native Americans then! Surely they can't do worse than our inherently corrupt, atrocious system, right?
Certainly if we are "first past the post" and our biggest hope for change and "most progressive" president is a bigoted genocidaire, we're better with them in charge, agreed?
certainly sir right you are
but, just one more thing
i don't think a group of people that the state has spent centuries stamping out are in a position to successfully hold together a country as wide-spread and diverse as the united states, so i feel like just handing it over with no other intervention is as good as a free for all, and i think that just leads to a right wing takeover
Yikes, so you oppose returning the land to Native groups for the sake of holding together a nation that is objectively more racist and genocidal than Nazi Germany. Yikes.
That's not what they're saying. They say that if you gave land back right now, you'd have massive violence against natives and likely other marginalized people by the fascists that have been building militias for years now. A revolution needs popular support, and I just don't see that at the moment.
Voting will also not change that. But neither will not voting, at least not for the better. Treat it like a chore, like you're taking out the trash. That won't clean your house, but if you don't, you're gonna live in filth before long.
Liberals think that voting is the end of politics, but that's where the actual work begins. Organize your workplace, your local community and with marginalized people. Build the support needed to tear this fucked up, cruel and callous system down. So when the collapse comes, fascism will not win. The people will.
sorry sir i don't believe i said that
i believe i said i oppose returning the land to native groups with a completely hands-off approach because it would most likely lead to a right-wing uprising within the country, which would ultimately strip said native groups of their newly held rights anyway
Look i read a lot of your stuff and agree with a bunch of it and disagree with a bunch which is fine but NEVER downplay the terrors nazi Germany caused again. You don't know shit about anything if you think the US is more genocidal and racist than nazi Germany. The US is a shit country with a broken system that lets you choose between trash and a dumpster fire but holy shit was Nazi Germany bad. You seem to be from the US so maybe you don't get taught a lot about it. Yes, the US is complicit in genocide but there's levels to it. The Germans were worse, they'd tell you to pack all your important belongings if you were a Jew or anyone else on their list of undesirables. Then they'd throw you in a train after taking all your important belongings you so neatly sorted for them so they don't have to put big effort into searching your place for riches. You'd get treated as an animal in a container and brought to a camp, split up from your family. At this point your fate almost certainly was death. You'd get put to work. Near constant work with not enough food to sustain your body so you'd slowly decrease more and more day after day until you die. You might also get your still alive body experimented on in full pain by doctors. If the camp was already too full for new arrivals (as they didn't just go after their own population but they waged war all over and put more and more people in camps) or if they just felt like it they'd put you down like an animal, be it gas chambers or other methods. Like i get that the prison system in the US is ethnically targeted slavery and the US has and had their fingers in a lot of fucked up shit but don't ever use fucking nazi Germany for your hyperbole again.
We're set to collapse regardless, because our sitting president refuses to stop committing genocide and border fascism, so it doesn't really matter whether we like it or not, now does it? America is dying.
Personally, I think that's best. Death to America.
...ah. here it is.
That Biden part is a strawman
I’ve seen a lot of libs say that on lemmy.
You haven't seen liberal Democrats stating that Biden is the most progressive president we've ever had? It's a very common sentiment in liberal spaces like reddit, 4chan, and lemmy.world
Give an example in a top 5% subreddit.
I don't use reddit. Check any news or political community on lemmy.world, and you're sure to find it
The only results I get are your words plus 1 other. Please provide a link to your search results.
I don't know what to tell you. I didn't save links, and I'm not going to subject myself to the toxic news and politics communities on .world. I've seen everything of those places I need to see.
If you visit them long enough, you'll definitely see users calling Biden "the most progressive president we've had," often with lots of links that ... don't exactly support their thesis
And see the imperialist, colonialist, capitalist China and Russia rise to wreck the world as they see fit just like how USA do? How very leftist of you.
How is it different when the USA does it?
A true anti-fascist opposes the acts, not the nation.
Nationalism is fascism.
No different, Just like hiding behind leftist agenda while pushing your anti-us one is no different than the right-wing trying to hide their fascism while pretend to do it for the people. Also you get someone who's not even trying to hide their intention if US collapse.
I've always been quite open about supporting the downfall of genocidal regimes, including the US
A leftist US citizen has no control over the Chinese or Russian government. Excusing your own country’s crimes because other countries do it as well is a wild stance and a disingenuous attempt to distract people from taking action. You are responsible for your own government.
"Wishing for the collapse of the current system is very leftist." - 16 upvotes, 0 downvotes.
And y'all wonder why people don't take the left seriously.
Hi friend, you seem to be* confused. Blahaj has downvotes disabled, so the count is almost always going to be zero. The only downvotes you may potentially see come from your own server.
I know in this case you might be upset that this person has 0 downvotes, but the reason Blahaj has them disabled is because bigots often use them to shutdown, and try and hide, trans people's comments and posts. Even when they are not saying anything controversial.
"The reason people support genocide, fascism, and capitalism is because of posts on 196" -You
The right was never going to support anti-fascism regardless of what the left does or says.
Lemmy's gonna lemmy
Worked out great for the KPD in 1930s Germany...
Yeah. And asinine.
“Millions of people will suffer because capitalists! uwu ✌️✌️🌈⭐️🤣🤣🤣🤣”
And op is saying some shit about just giving governing to natives, but those would be the first people to suffer hard in a collapse. They just want people to hurt.
Accelerationism is a bigoted ideology that seeks to pit the minority against the majority during a state of economic and political collapse. It looks okay in a vacuum and on paper, but the reality is that in the event of widespread instability sociopaths would almost certainly seek power by convincing the majority population that it's minorities are the root of all their problems. You now have a second Holocaust on your hands.
Furthermore, I'm almost certain that it is spread by Nazis seeking to harness the left's hatred of the West in order to achieve their goal of "cleansing the white race" because I've observed that accelerationism is extremely popular with Nazis. They believe that a collapse will allow them to exterminate anyone they believe to be degenerate or inferior without being impeded. The extreme left, like always, is getting suckered into believing in a post-crash utopia and is helping them spread their disgusting ideology.
Sir, you are almost certainly a Nazi or a Nazi's unwitting cockholster. That makes me extremely disappointed because I know you didn't used to be like this.
You wanna make a real change? That means you have to actually get out from behind your PC and start targeting common "issues". You have to tackle the "problems" that the US is facing head-on. None of this cowardly, keyboard-warrior bullshit where you simp for some kind of fake, Nazi-inspired utopia and hope that something better will replace the US when the US collapses (spoilers: it'll only get worse). You have to actually take matters into your own hands.
You won't though, because you don't actually care, you just want to watch the world burn. You've drunk your flavor aid and now you're dying and can't see straight. Your mind has been poisoned to the point where you can't see the harm that your rhetoric threatens or who your rhetoric actually serves. As such, I'm not interested in arguing with you because I know you've convinced yourself that you're right and as such, nothing I can say will convince you otherwise. I'm more concerned about others following you while believing they're somehow doing good.
I'm not a sir, I'm not an accelerationist, and I actually do care. Unlike these fucking self-absorbed liberals, I care about groups like Palestinians, immigrants, and the many, many demographics we exploit for our well-being. I'm sorry you libs don't give a rat's ass.
No one believes that you actually believe any of that.
If someone can't believe that anti-fascists exist, then I'm not sure what to tell you
We believe anti-fascists exist and are extremely important. You just seem to be an idiot.
"Opposing a fascist nation is idiotic" -definitely an anti-fascist /s
Brilliant take. What's it like being a reactionary with leftist aesthetics? Does Putin pay you for this comrade or is it all of your own volition?
"Everyone to the left of Reagan is a Russian psyop/bot"
I'm getting a blackout on my neoliberal bingo card today!
You come up with an unusual opinion, people answer with counter arguments, and rather than explaining your position you come back with one liners that bring nothing to the discussion.
Do you have an example where the downfall of a society was beneficial to its citizens? In the last thousand years? More than one, so we can see that it's generally a good thing?
It's beneficial to the world if a genocidal regime that also virtually enslaves people in the global south collapses :3
So, you don't.
Alrighty then.
I don't? News to me
It's interesting you seem to think that exploitation will... Slow down?
Lol
The downfall of a genocidal regime would certainly help
Do you think it's downfall would be brought down by someone better?
This is depressingly naive...
It's enough for me just to smile happily at the idea of the downfall of a horrible genocidal state that has brought nothing but oppression and destruction in its wake :3
This is like being happy an evil company is going under while the CEO and their cronies have already taken their golden parachute on the next project.
Like... Nothing's changed. The entity is not a person. Nothing has been stopped. If anything they were just allowed to get away with it, while the suffering of everyone affected remains.
You're allowed to be happy, but you're naive to think this is the end of anything... Or even a push in a positive direction. No one's going to let you have that narrative when it's presented openly.
"We can't be happy Jeffrey Dahmer's gone because there are other serial killers afoot"
Inequivalent. Jeffrey Dahmer was an individual. My argument was on organizations that the guilty individuals had already left.
Oh, I'd celebrate their demise as well. If Amazon collapsed right now, it would be awesome.
See previous comment about golden parachutes and implosion of organization.
Yours is the same logic used to sue companies instead of people.
This is feeling petulant so I'm taking my step out now. Hope you find the joy you're looking for, but seeing as you noted earlier that you live in the USA and noting the instance you're posting from, I suspect you know all about what will be coming around the corner for trans people should the states be allowed to implode on itself.
Yeah, surely the state-sanctioned oppression of trans people will worsen if the fascist state collapses /s
Yeah ... it almost certainly won't. The world's largest economy and millitary will still be unmatched, except now they're under the control of mask-off christofascists. They're evil, but unfortunately they're not stupid.
Everyone in the free world will be in for a bad time to varying degrees. I can promise you the new regime won't be isolationists.
Yikes
Yikes indeed (scroll down for USAmerica defenders)
Dolphins and rainbows? What kind of LSD has OP been taking? Yeah, America is a hypocrite, and its politicians are liars who selectively apply "justice". American exceptionalism DOES indeed seem like a joke, and it is arguably far from the best Western or "democratic" country, but what country would OP say is the model we should all follow? OP, you obviously hate the USA. What country is the best in your opinion? I hate shit countries, but I sure as fuck would rather eat this shit over the shit I see in some countries.
I'm anarchist, so this is a hard question to answer
All states will devolve into fascism. The USA is just a lot more egregious than most, and it's very obvious that the world would be much better off were it to die.
If you think a collapse (and somehow having the indigenous take control through some mysterious force of the Abrahadraba) is anarchism, then you clearly don't know what that actually means.
I say this not as an anarchist,but as a baseline good person: Death to the USA
Your posting power is unmatched
o7 Thank you
I was foolish to think I could just post this though without attracting flies
This is what the phrase "can't see past their nose" looks like. OP has correctly identified a problem, and identified the fault. They just haven't internalized the wide reaching effects of a total dismantling.
This is not something that's going to be good for people like you're hoping. This is going to hurt a lot, and if history is to believed it won't be replaced by the people who share your views. It'll be another future fascist government.
Almost like it's a post on 196 celebrating the idea of the collapse of a genocidal regime
I swear debatelords are beside themselves if they are asked to let people enjoy things
You're going to have difficulty finding an audience to sit there and listen to you celebrate something that will actively bring more suffering to others than the current status quo.
Yeah the 70% of people here who support border fascism would probably not be too happy if their shit nation collapsed, it's true
I'm saying I'd be happy to see this genocidal state die
Self imploding genocidal states are not generally replaced by better people.
Haven't really seen you address this anywhere and it gives the appearance that your intentionally arguing in bad faith.
I'm not arguing at all. I'm celebrating the idea of a horrible nation that's brought nothing but harm collapsing.
I have ideas, but I certainly wouldn't try to engage in a thread like this that's filled with pearl-clutching American liberals and even overt racists.
"Everyone that disagrees with me is bad"
You're in your own home instance. If the vast majority is disagreeing with you and your home instance has nothing to say you might consider reevaluating your position.
I've been told the majority of people believe we should be supporting Israel and committing border fascism, so I'm not too interested in what the majority of USAmericans think. Yet another reason to smile while thinking about its collapse
It'd be nice if we didn't kill the world when we do, but we will. And if the empires that are eager to snap up the corpse weren't demonstrably worse.
So I suppose you oppose the United States of America then, since its very existence is destroying the world
So once again, my post
It is better than the conditions 50% of the planet's populace live in, even if at least 10% of that was caused by the USA. If you have a collapse, you'll get at least partially what's shown in Civil War (2024).
Better because it relies on the suffering and exploitation of those in the global south, so again: See post
The world will be better off without the USA
Edit: That's a bullshit movie BTW. It's like a redditor's ignorant idea of what would happen.
Unless you propose that nearly every nation in the world collapse, the global south would be further exploited to fill the vacuum created by the hole in exports of electrical machinery, which all developing and above nations need.
Why not collapse Russia first?
Do not forget about every other empire like russia and china.
We could whatabout all day long
Locking this. ~70 reports from 3 people (two of them the same person) is abuse of the reporting system. Also lots of bad faith arguing going on.
"We're only gonna die of our own arrogance. That's why we might as well take our time."
Recommend watching Civil War