That's the point of Non-Proliferation Treaty, it's to prevent another race for Weapon of Mass Destruction. If anything Iran should stop getting one.
And the entire idea of nuclear non-proliferation is dead in the water for the foreseeable future, as a direct result of the full and complete abrogation of the Budapest Memorandum by all signatories except for the country that was the subject of the agreement (Ukraine). They surrendered their nukes in exchange for (what the Ukrainians thought were) ironclad agreements from all sides that their territorial integrity would be backstopped by three nuclear powers.
That didn’t pan out as expected for Ukraine. In 2014, the global response (and more importantly, the response from the signatories who weren’t executing a semi-stealthy invasion in Ukraine) did pretty much nothing, and that lack of robust response led directly to the more active phase of the Ukrainian War from February 24, 2022 onwards.
As an immediate result of the signatories (and the rest of the world) doing almost nothing back in 2024 2014 - and furthermore, unless the signatories, and all of Ukraine’s allies in general, stop pussy-footing around and actually provide a level of military aid that makes an actual long-term strategic difference - NOBODY is going to take the “give us your nukes and we’ll protect you” deal ever again. It’s been proven to be complete and utter bullshit. Moreover, if Ukraine still had nukes, Russia would never have chanced a nuclear response by invading them.
All the Budapest Memorandum, the failure to enforce its structures, and the Ukraine invasion and war have accomplished at this point is to prove that nuclear weapons are, in fact, the final word in territorial integrity and national security. An adversary will NOT invade you if one of the possible responses is “we will turn your cities to glass”.
Nuclear winter fell way back in the pack, but it's catching up to Climate Change, AI, and biological weapons as humanity's self inflicted doom.
Damn, I was rooting for Skynet.
I'd deploy skynet tomorrow if I could. At least there's a chance we win and there's few enough people afterwards. Plus it'd be some epic history. Way better than "so they were selfish dumb assholes and made their own planet uninhabitable?" If some other sentient race comes along.
i mean, if we suffer a nuclear winter.... it would probably solve the AI problem... the (current) climate change problem, and, uh, a lot of the other problems as we no longer care about shit like having TP on the shelves or what color the new car is gonna be.
Sounds a lot like the cure for crying.
Maybe a few sprinkles of Matrix?
I almost wish for a nuclear winter. On account of patrolling the Mojave so much...
And if Iran and Saudi Arabia get nukes, then Turkey will get nukes. And if Turkey gets nukes, then unless there is an EU army, Greece will want to get nukes.
Pretty sure there are NATO nukes sitting in Turkey already.... it's like the whole reason everyone pretends they aren't a circus run by a toddler pounding the table to print more money as economic policy.
Ukraine is the only country to every voluntarily disarm their nuclear arsenal. Now invaded by Russia. Turkey gets to wave their dicks around and make demands at the big boy table despite being a complete joke of a country. I honestly can't blame countries wanting to develope or obtain nuclear weapons anymore....
And South Africa.
Fun fact: South Africa didn't give up nukes based on some moral objection. They did it because the apartheid government was disbanding, and they didn't want people of melanin to have nukes. Racism for the win?
Let's not forget Libya.
That. Was. A. Mistake.
Pretty sure there are NATO nukes sitting in Turkey already
Those are US controlled nukes. And the US doesnt have the best relation with Turkey atm. They are there now, gone tomorrow. Turkey cant rely on american nukes. If other regional powers have nukes, they need to have nukes. And if Turkey has nukes, then Greece needs to have nukes for selfprotection.
Turkey gets to wave their dicks around and make demands at the big boy table despite being a complete joke of a country.
They have the 2nd biggest military in NATO, after the US, an immensely important geographical location and they are a regional power(along with Iran and Saudi Arabia).
We will all go together when we go
What a comforting thought that is to know.
EDIT: "Who's next" is more accurate though.
Until then, I'll be poisoning pigeons in the park
One nuke is useless if everyone knows you only have one
Not completely. Especially in the case of middle eastern countries, a capital strike would ensure the dissolution of the state.
Turkey doesn't need nukes because it's part of the strongest defensive alliance in the history of mankind. That's enough deterrent for anyone who isn't in that alliance.
NATO's is not going to be part of Turkey's geopolitical schemes. Nukes are needed in order to be on an even footing with the other regional powers(which will also have nukes). Even if Saudi Arabia/Iran never intend to nuke Turkey, they will be at an advantage.
Hard power translates to soft power. And if your regional opponents have nukes and you dont have nukes, you will be at a significant soft power disadvantage.
Btw Turkey is building its first nuclear power plant, with help from Russia. Saudi Arabia also intends to build nuclear power plants soon. Thats the first step to creating a nuclear weapon.
The crown Prince of Saudi should get a nuke up his ass.
Jokes on you, he likes it
MBS = Mr Bomb Squeezer
Male Butt Stuff.
He's too busy blowing cocaine up it to fit the nuke, meanwhile his people would be mutilated or killed for doing drugs or drinking alcohol which the entire royal family is also doing.
I wouldn't be against the Saudi royal family getting a nuke, if you know what I mean
"Dear KSA, as a gift we are sending a nuke..."
"Oh that's nice, how very kind!"
"It will arrive in approximately 10 minutes by air..."
"Wow by airmail too!"
"...At mach 4"
"wait....."
It's just assured destruction now
Woooo
Neither of those countries should have nukes. Crazy enough to use them. Of course, I also think no country should have nukes.
There's always a bigger stick, right?
Neither of them should get one.
Nukes are like icecream then.
A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. How about a nice game of chess?
Is this crown prince bone saw?
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Saudi Arabian Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman said on Wednesday that if Iran acquired a nuclear weapon, his country would seek to do the same.
“If they get one, we have to get one,” bin Salman said in an interview with Fox News’s Bret Baier, adding that it would be necessary “for security reasons, and for balancing power in the Middle East, but we don’t want to see that.”
The Crown Prince warned of the dangers of nuclear weapons and said, “We are concerned of any country getting a nuclear weapon,” when asked about Iran in particular.
He suggested trying to get nuclear weapons in general is a fruitless endeavor, since deploying them is equivalent to declaring war on the world.
On Tuesday, Iranian President Ebrahim Raisi said that the United States must “demonstrate in a verifiable fashion” that it intends to return to the 2015 nuclear deal, from which former President Trump withdrew in 2018.
The Biden administration was in talks with Iran to restart the agreement last year, but discussions fell through and the United States has not indicated an interest in reengaging in discussions.
The original article contains 251 words, the summary contains 187 words. Saved 25%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Makes sense if you think about it. Most sensible countries ultimately want to return to the 2015 deals and progress from there.
The crown Prince of Saudi should get a nuke up his ass.
It's hard to believe that 1950s Sci Fi is still fucking relevant to today's world. if y'all haven't ever, go watch The Day the Earth Stood Still (not the remake, the OG black and white from 1952. The remake deserves the George Lucas Holiday Special Treatment.) The movie is a cult classic and is still relevant to today's world as a criticism of nuclear weapons (if not nuclear energy,) and Mutually Assured Destruction.
And for some 70s sci-fi: Colossus: The Forbin Project.
Speculation on nukes and AI but not in the Skynet way.
Replying again…. Thanks for the movie tip. That was a spectacular one.
Note to self: when connecting super powerful thinking computer to nukes… make sure to include some kind of failsafe. A purely physical one that cannot be undone…
Vaguely reminds me of war games in some aspects.
Glad to hear you liked it. The movie went in a direction I didn't expect and was very, very interesting.
The movie "Eagle Eye" took a lot of plot points from this one.
Aaaand speaking of failsafe, not sci-fi but if you want some gripping military nuclear drama, Fail Safe (1964) is one of my favorites. It's not a horror movie in any traditional way but it sure terrified me more than any horror movie ever did (it actually gave me a nightmare).
I feel like Colossus could do with a sequel or two. I hate to mention it because I'm still quite pissed at the marvel-ization of sci fi. ("OH, it's got space ships."...) but, they could definitely round it out with a sequel coming up maybe ten years later or so?
explore the need for freedom and for order. some what more recent, dealing more with VR and such is the 13th Floor.
oh. and the movie that gave me random nightmares as a kid? E.T. yup. But I was like... seven or eight when I first saw it? Still gives me the heebiejeebies, though... which is strange because I first binge watched Star Trek TOS when I was the same age. (the coolest uncle ever had the FULL star trek collection of VHS. I may have found it and got to Trouble with Tribbles before anyone noticed- and then it was my Uncle, who was like "oh. this is my favorite episode! rewind it while I go make popcorn." they ... didn't see either of us for the rest of the weekend.)
I will have to give that a watch!
Edit: found it streamable at archive.org
How about neither of you religo-fascists get one, and if you try, you get glassed?
Why are American religo-fascists allowed so many? They only want 1 you big meanie! /s but only a little
Nothing on our planet has the enthalpy and matter control required to glass the crust into silicate dioxide crystals. I would know I have the idea.
Pakistan to who got them and then proceeded to shoot themselves in the foot:
How about nobody gets one?
That's the point of Non-Proliferation Treaty, it's to prevent another race for Weapon of Mass Destruction. If anything Iran should stop getting one.
And the entire idea of nuclear non-proliferation is dead in the water for the foreseeable future, as a direct result of the full and complete abrogation of the Budapest Memorandum by all signatories except for the country that was the subject of the agreement (Ukraine). They surrendered their nukes in exchange for (what the Ukrainians thought were) ironclad agreements from all sides that their territorial integrity would be backstopped by three nuclear powers.
That didn’t pan out as expected for Ukraine. In 2014, the global response (and more importantly, the response from the signatories who weren’t executing a semi-stealthy invasion in Ukraine) did pretty much nothing, and that lack of robust response led directly to the more active phase of the Ukrainian War from February 24, 2022 onwards.
As an immediate result of the signatories (and the rest of the world) doing almost nothing back in
20242014 - and furthermore, unless the signatories, and all of Ukraine’s allies in general, stop pussy-footing around and actually provide a level of military aid that makes an actual long-term strategic difference - NOBODY is going to take the “give us your nukes and we’ll protect you” deal ever again. It’s been proven to be complete and utter bullshit. Moreover, if Ukraine still had nukes, Russia would never have chanced a nuclear response by invading them.All the Budapest Memorandum, the failure to enforce its structures, and the Ukraine invasion and war have accomplished at this point is to prove that nuclear weapons are, in fact, the final word in territorial integrity and national security. An adversary will NOT invade you if one of the possible responses is “we will turn your cities to glass”.
Nuclear winter fell way back in the pack, but it's catching up to Climate Change, AI, and biological weapons as humanity's self inflicted doom.
Damn, I was rooting for Skynet.
I'd deploy skynet tomorrow if I could. At least there's a chance we win and there's few enough people afterwards. Plus it'd be some epic history. Way better than "so they were selfish dumb assholes and made their own planet uninhabitable?" If some other sentient race comes along.
i mean, if we suffer a nuclear winter.... it would probably solve the AI problem... the (current) climate change problem, and, uh, a lot of the other problems as we no longer care about shit like having TP on the shelves or what color the new car is gonna be.
Sounds a lot like the cure for crying.
Maybe a few sprinkles of Matrix?
I almost wish for a nuclear winter. On account of patrolling the Mojave so much...
And if Iran and Saudi Arabia get nukes, then Turkey will get nukes. And if Turkey gets nukes, then unless there is an EU army, Greece will want to get nukes.
Pretty sure there are NATO nukes sitting in Turkey already.... it's like the whole reason everyone pretends they aren't a circus run by a toddler pounding the table to print more money as economic policy.
Ukraine is the only country to every voluntarily disarm their nuclear arsenal. Now invaded by Russia. Turkey gets to wave their dicks around and make demands at the big boy table despite being a complete joke of a country. I honestly can't blame countries wanting to develope or obtain nuclear weapons anymore....
And South Africa.
Fun fact: South Africa didn't give up nukes based on some moral objection. They did it because the apartheid government was disbanding, and they didn't want people of melanin to have nukes. Racism for the win?
Let's not forget Libya.
That. Was. A. Mistake.
Those are US controlled nukes. And the US doesnt have the best relation with Turkey atm. They are there now, gone tomorrow. Turkey cant rely on american nukes. If other regional powers have nukes, they need to have nukes. And if Turkey has nukes, then Greece needs to have nukes for selfprotection.
They have the 2nd biggest military in NATO, after the US, an immensely important geographical location and they are a regional power(along with Iran and Saudi Arabia).
We will all go together when we go
What a comforting thought that is to know.
EDIT: "Who's next" is more accurate though.
Until then, I'll be poisoning pigeons in the park
One nuke is useless if everyone knows you only have one
Not completely. Especially in the case of middle eastern countries, a capital strike would ensure the dissolution of the state.
Turkey doesn't need nukes because it's part of the strongest defensive alliance in the history of mankind. That's enough deterrent for anyone who isn't in that alliance.
NATO's is not going to be part of Turkey's geopolitical schemes. Nukes are needed in order to be on an even footing with the other regional powers(which will also have nukes). Even if Saudi Arabia/Iran never intend to nuke Turkey, they will be at an advantage.
Hard power translates to soft power. And if your regional opponents have nukes and you dont have nukes, you will be at a significant soft power disadvantage.
Btw Turkey is building its first nuclear power plant, with help from Russia. Saudi Arabia also intends to build nuclear power plants soon. Thats the first step to creating a nuclear weapon.
The crown Prince of Saudi should get a nuke up his ass.
Jokes on you, he likes it
MBS = Mr Bomb Squeezer
Male Butt Stuff.
He's too busy blowing cocaine up it to fit the nuke, meanwhile his people would be mutilated or killed for doing drugs or drinking alcohol which the entire royal family is also doing.
I wouldn't be against the Saudi royal family getting a nuke, if you know what I mean
"Oh that's nice, how very kind!"
"Wow by airmail too!"
"wait....."
It's just assured destruction now Woooo
Neither of those countries should have nukes. Crazy enough to use them. Of course, I also think no country should have nukes.
There's always a bigger stick, right?
Neither of them should get one.
Nukes are like icecream then.
A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. How about a nice game of chess?
Is this crown prince bone saw?
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Saudi Arabian Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman said on Wednesday that if Iran acquired a nuclear weapon, his country would seek to do the same.
“If they get one, we have to get one,” bin Salman said in an interview with Fox News’s Bret Baier, adding that it would be necessary “for security reasons, and for balancing power in the Middle East, but we don’t want to see that.”
The Crown Prince warned of the dangers of nuclear weapons and said, “We are concerned of any country getting a nuclear weapon,” when asked about Iran in particular.
He suggested trying to get nuclear weapons in general is a fruitless endeavor, since deploying them is equivalent to declaring war on the world.
On Tuesday, Iranian President Ebrahim Raisi said that the United States must “demonstrate in a verifiable fashion” that it intends to return to the 2015 nuclear deal, from which former President Trump withdrew in 2018.
The Biden administration was in talks with Iran to restart the agreement last year, but discussions fell through and the United States has not indicated an interest in reengaging in discussions.
The original article contains 251 words, the summary contains 187 words. Saved 25%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Makes sense if you think about it. Most sensible countries ultimately want to return to the 2015 deals and progress from there.
The crown Prince of Saudi should get a nuke up his ass.
History's rhyming again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdtAFIl2jhc&t=20
It's hard to believe that 1950s Sci Fi is still fucking relevant to today's world. if y'all haven't ever, go watch The Day the Earth Stood Still (not the remake, the OG black and white from 1952. The remake deserves the George Lucas Holiday Special Treatment.) The movie is a cult classic and is still relevant to today's world as a criticism of nuclear weapons (if not nuclear energy,) and Mutually Assured Destruction.
And for some 70s sci-fi: Colossus: The Forbin Project.
Speculation on nukes and AI but not in the Skynet way.
Replying again…. Thanks for the movie tip. That was a spectacular one.
Note to self: when connecting super powerful thinking computer to nukes… make sure to include some kind of failsafe. A purely physical one that cannot be undone…
Vaguely reminds me of war games in some aspects.
Glad to hear you liked it. The movie went in a direction I didn't expect and was very, very interesting.
The movie "Eagle Eye" took a lot of plot points from this one.
Aaaand speaking of failsafe, not sci-fi but if you want some gripping military nuclear drama, Fail Safe (1964) is one of my favorites. It's not a horror movie in any traditional way but it sure terrified me more than any horror movie ever did (it actually gave me a nightmare).
I feel like Colossus could do with a sequel or two. I hate to mention it because I'm still quite pissed at the marvel-ization of sci fi. ("OH, it's got space ships."...) but, they could definitely round it out with a sequel coming up maybe ten years later or so?
explore the need for freedom and for order. some what more recent, dealing more with VR and such is the 13th Floor.
oh. and the movie that gave me random nightmares as a kid? E.T. yup. But I was like... seven or eight when I first saw it? Still gives me the heebiejeebies, though... which is strange because I first binge watched Star Trek TOS when I was the same age. (the coolest uncle ever had the FULL star trek collection of VHS. I may have found it and got to Trouble with Tribbles before anyone noticed- and then it was my Uncle, who was like "oh. this is my favorite episode! rewind it while I go make popcorn." they ... didn't see either of us for the rest of the weekend.)
I will have to give that a watch! Edit: found it streamable at archive.org
How about neither of you religo-fascists get one, and if you try, you get glassed?
Why are American religo-fascists allowed so many? They only want 1 you big meanie! /s but only a little
Nothing on our planet has the enthalpy and matter control required to glass the crust into silicate dioxide crystals. I would know I have the idea.
Pakistan to who got them and then proceeded to shoot themselves in the foot:
Evil vs. Evil
I don't think he understands how this works.
Where is Venom Snake when you need him?