Maybe the great filter is the misuse of apostrophes?
Maybe the great filter is crabs dragging others down to their level.
Even at loss of limb, those who escape are the 144000, sent to show others the way?
Hell of a shower thought, Mr. Sagan.
Can't say I'd ever get a shower erection with that thought. /tmi
Not my proudest fap
Cleansing as a pretentious melancholic.
The the DNA brick wall we've been climbing is exactly that.
You've reminded me of some of my favorite hip hop lyrics of all time. If you never heard Eyedea before he died (27 club, I think?), Eyedea had Eminem level potential. Fucking incredible lyricist. If this tickles your fancy, go peep the album First Born.
I think the evolution of multicellular life is most likely to be the great filter, since it took the longest to develop on earth.
We tend to focus on distance from it's star and size to determine a planet's habitability, but one of the most distinctive things about Earth is that it is essentially a two-planet system with the moon. The ratio of planet size to orbital object is pretty unique. The moon has all kinds of benefits, like tides and deflecting objects from Earth.
Then there's the magnetosphere, which Mars doesn't have and look what happened to it. And Jupiter’s massive size and gravitational influence play a crucial role in protecting Earth from extraterrestrial objects, including comets and asteroids.
Even with all that the Earth might never have developed intelligent life.
I don't think that's an "if" at all. I firmly believe that that's exactly it.
The same behaviours that we needed to evolve are harmful now that we've reached a potential "post-scarcity" stage.
To put it more bluntly, the drive to compete for resources in order to survive is what made us the dominant species. Now that post-scarcity is essentially upon us, our nature is to create artificial scarcity in order to satiate that drive for competition. And it will be the ultimate end of us.
These are pretty much the thoughts I had.
What if the great filter is our love of carbs?
Hey, carbs are awesome.
Leave the flying spaghetti monster out of this.
May you be touched by his noodley appendage.
I like the idea that the Great Filter is really just civilizations turning inward. Like they all get to a point where they realize that space travel is just really not viable and so they stop looking to explore the universe or find other life. Instead they turn to virtual worlds to prolong their existence with what resources they have available in their own star systems. Not even Dyson spheres or anything, they just go into digital hibernation and live out the rest of their lifetimes in a fabricated paradise for however long they can. Maybe they're able to use drugs/genetics/whatever to slow time down to a crawl where it feels like they live thousands of years within a normal lifespan.
For Outer Wilds fans, basically:
::: spoiler spoiler
Owlks
:::
Then we would start 'behavorial sink' and slowly decline in population. Someone else mentioned Calhoun and his rat utopia the other day and I looked it up. It seems like we are going through our version of behavioral sink.
Like uploads? If so, couldn't they have all this fun while slowly traveling the universe?
"We're sorry to interrupt everyone's simulation, but we're happy to remind you that you're a person on a spaceship and we just found something interesting!"
Then we better hurry the fuck up before we make it impossible to live on the planet.
In the grand scale of the universe we aren't even a blip, any "permanent" damage we cause will be reversed over hundreds of thousands or millions of years after we've wiped ourselves out.
And even if there was some kind of damage that couldn't be reversed, the next cycle of life would just adapt to whatever the issue is
I'm not really worried about the planet. I'm worried about us.
I mean the earth has already survived having the first moon crash into it, as well as a giant meteor that caused an ice age. We have t quite gotten to that level, yet.
It's something people don't realize. We may be a scourge on the Earth, but we're still nowhere even near the top of the list of worst things to happen to this planet.
As the other reply brought up, Theia crashing into Earth. Flood basalt events. The Chicxulub impact.
We may be able to cause some real awful shit, but we still are nothing compared to what the forces of nature can produce. And just to clarify, I'm not saying this to in any way downplay the seriousness of climate change, or that we should do nothing about it.
Been seeing a lot of "mass extinctions are fine, earth will recover" bullshit lately, it's making me suspicious that this is the next big oil psyop.
Oh yeah it's all good, I just talked about millions of years of recovery and the extinction of humans, but yeah I'm a shill for big oil.
What are you smoking? I want some
Yeah "earth will recover once all humans die" doesn't make me any less worried for humanity.
Humanity aside, exterminating thousands of species of animals is just bad, not for any practical effect it has on humanity or "nature" but just because it, in itself, is morally bad.
The argument I've heard is that new species will evolve to fill new niches and one day earth will host the same biodiversity again.
I can't say I find that one anymore convincing. I'm with you on this, it's pretty gross how blasé some people are about dragging countless other species into extinction along with us.
I've seen it a lot recently.
Person 1: nature will recover, but humanity will go extinct.
Person 2: actually, humanity won't go extinct [list of information about humanity's resiliency]
Person 1 (or 3rd party reading): oh cool, not that big a deal then
Lost in this discussion: mass extinctions bad
I don't know if this theory has a proper name but I have seen it multiple times.
If a species has the ability to push their technology to the point they could become a space faring species, that technology will destroy the civilization before it can get there
That is basically The Great Filter theory the OP was referring to.
Yeah I guess I didn't read very carefully
It may depend on the rate they get to that point. Add in a dense energy source that's suddenly available and the rise of tech may be lethal. Perhaps the lucky ones don't have something like petroleum so their species matures long before they ruin their world.
Back up...dude with a 10th grade level understanding of biology and chemistry coming through with a question...
So carbon-based life forms can, under the right circumstances, decompose into long chains of hydrocarbons like Petroleum.
Does that mean silicon-based life forms under the right circumstances would break down into hydrosilicates like caulk?
I don't know about the end result under the same extremes. I do know that silicon life, while not impossible, it's probably unlikely. Silicon does parallel carbon in some ways including a similar location on the periodic chart (which is why it got attention from scifi writers), but the issue is simply silicon is nowhere near as "greedy" as carbon bonds.
But it is a big universe.
<3
Reminds me of my thoughts after reading "Why Buddhism is True" by Robert Wright. If you haven't read it before I highly recommend it.
So we all just happily go back to living in forest?
Return to monkee
It was a bad idea to get out of the oceans if you ask me.
Return to sea-monkee?
The thing is we could largely retain all our advances and live in a more fecund environment. A large portion of our pollution is unnecessary and tied to whatever you call this global economic system / social paradigm we've backed ourselves into. It's only either or between forest and urban blight because we've made it so
So like, we all just give up as a species? Sounds unlikely.
Think of Star Trek as an analogy.
The Archers, Pikes, Kirks succeeded by being bold and daring, confronting dangers, fighting to survive. The Siskos and Burnhams instigated war on a galactic scale. They were violent, reactive, risk takers
a couple centuries later, the Picards confronted greater obstacles but with reason, compassion, self-sacrifice. If Kirk had faced Q, that would have been the great filter, but Picard succeeded as a human evolved past his violent reactions
I've never watched Star Trek.
I know, heresy for lemmy.
I also use windows and not linux (though I plan on switching when I get time to learn linux)
Wow, it’s like talking to an Alien ….. while I do occasionally use Windows, my main laptop is OSX, my home servers are Raspian and Suse and at work I use Red Hat, Debian and whatever Amazon Linux is, and my media consumption is Linux or iOS
I mean there are multiple proposed filters.
Suppose yours is correct. What is this humanity's nature you speak of?
Bravery? Foolishness? Wisdom? Violence? Greed?
What what of those attributes haven't we already overcome time and again?
It's much more probable that everyone out there is attentively listening to signals instead of radically changing their own mental processes. Or not
Wtf kinda world are you living in where humanity has overcome foolishness, violence, and greed?
I think they meant for five minutes because if you won, you won right?
Exactly. Everyone thought nuclear war might be one of the great filters but we survived the Cold War. Nuclear weapons are no longer a concern, right? Right?
I mean I don't see people practice nuclear drills anymore so yeah
Sounds like little but it's a lot and it compounds
I mean same as yours I hope? People do that daily, hope you grow to notice it. It's nice when you do
Maybe the great filter is the misuse of apostrophes?
Maybe the great filter is crabs dragging others down to their level.
Even at loss of limb, those who escape are the 144000, sent to show others the way?
Hell of a shower thought, Mr. Sagan.
Can't say I'd ever get a shower erection with that thought. /tmi
Not my proudest fap
Cleansing as a pretentious melancholic.
The the DNA brick wall we've been climbing is exactly that.
You've reminded me of some of my favorite hip hop lyrics of all time. If you never heard Eyedea before he died (27 club, I think?), Eyedea had Eminem level potential. Fucking incredible lyricist. If this tickles your fancy, go peep the album First Born.
Eyedea & Abilities - Man vs Ape
.
.
.
.
.
.
Do you have other song recommendations with larger than life topics like this ?
I don't listen to hip-hop but I like the theme of this one.
I recommend the album, Eyedea & Abilities - first born
The dive part 1 and 2 will blow your mind. And the song Read Wiped in Blue has some lyrics that are relevant today:
Another of his, A Murder of Memories, about war/PTSD.
Thank you !
Yes
RIP eyedea
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
Eyedea & Abilities - Man vs Ape
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
I think the evolution of multicellular life is most likely to be the great filter, since it took the longest to develop on earth.
We tend to focus on distance from it's star and size to determine a planet's habitability, but one of the most distinctive things about Earth is that it is essentially a two-planet system with the moon. The ratio of planet size to orbital object is pretty unique. The moon has all kinds of benefits, like tides and deflecting objects from Earth.
Then there's the magnetosphere, which Mars doesn't have and look what happened to it. And Jupiter’s massive size and gravitational influence play a crucial role in protecting Earth from extraterrestrial objects, including comets and asteroids.
Even with all that the Earth might never have developed intelligent life.
I don't think that's an "if" at all. I firmly believe that that's exactly it.
The same behaviours that we needed to evolve are harmful now that we've reached a potential "post-scarcity" stage.
To put it more bluntly, the drive to compete for resources in order to survive is what made us the dominant species. Now that post-scarcity is essentially upon us, our nature is to create artificial scarcity in order to satiate that drive for competition. And it will be the ultimate end of us.
These are pretty much the thoughts I had.
What if the great filter is our love of carbs?
Hey, carbs are awesome.
Leave the flying spaghetti monster out of this.
May you be touched by his noodley appendage.
I like the idea that the Great Filter is really just civilizations turning inward. Like they all get to a point where they realize that space travel is just really not viable and so they stop looking to explore the universe or find other life. Instead they turn to virtual worlds to prolong their existence with what resources they have available in their own star systems. Not even Dyson spheres or anything, they just go into digital hibernation and live out the rest of their lifetimes in a fabricated paradise for however long they can. Maybe they're able to use drugs/genetics/whatever to slow time down to a crawl where it feels like they live thousands of years within a normal lifespan.
For Outer Wilds fans, basically: ::: spoiler spoiler Owlks :::
Then we would start 'behavorial sink' and slowly decline in population. Someone else mentioned Calhoun and his rat utopia the other day and I looked it up. It seems like we are going through our version of behavioral sink.
Like uploads? If so, couldn't they have all this fun while slowly traveling the universe?
"We're sorry to interrupt everyone's simulation, but we're happy to remind you that you're a person on a spaceship and we just found something interesting!"
Then we better hurry the fuck up before we make it impossible to live on the planet.
In the grand scale of the universe we aren't even a blip, any "permanent" damage we cause will be reversed over hundreds of thousands or millions of years after we've wiped ourselves out.
And even if there was some kind of damage that couldn't be reversed, the next cycle of life would just adapt to whatever the issue is
I'm not really worried about the planet. I'm worried about us.
I mean the earth has already survived having the first moon crash into it, as well as a giant meteor that caused an ice age. We have t quite gotten to that level, yet.
It's something people don't realize. We may be a scourge on the Earth, but we're still nowhere even near the top of the list of worst things to happen to this planet.
As the other reply brought up, Theia crashing into Earth. Flood basalt events. The Chicxulub impact.
We may be able to cause some real awful shit, but we still are nothing compared to what the forces of nature can produce. And just to clarify, I'm not saying this to in any way downplay the seriousness of climate change, or that we should do nothing about it.
Been seeing a lot of "mass extinctions are fine, earth will recover" bullshit lately, it's making me suspicious that this is the next big oil psyop.
Oh yeah it's all good, I just talked about millions of years of recovery and the extinction of humans, but yeah I'm a shill for big oil.
What are you smoking? I want some
Yeah "earth will recover once all humans die" doesn't make me any less worried for humanity.
Humanity aside, exterminating thousands of species of animals is just bad, not for any practical effect it has on humanity or "nature" but just because it, in itself, is morally bad.
The argument I've heard is that new species will evolve to fill new niches and one day earth will host the same biodiversity again.
I can't say I find that one anymore convincing. I'm with you on this, it's pretty gross how blasé some people are about dragging countless other species into extinction along with us.
I've seen it a lot recently.
Person 1: nature will recover, but humanity will go extinct.
Person 2: actually, humanity won't go extinct [list of information about humanity's resiliency]
Person 1 (or 3rd party reading): oh cool, not that big a deal then
Lost in this discussion: mass extinctions bad
I don't know if this theory has a proper name but I have seen it multiple times.
If a species has the ability to push their technology to the point they could become a space faring species, that technology will destroy the civilization before it can get there
That is basically The Great Filter theory the OP was referring to.
Yeah I guess I didn't read very carefully
It may depend on the rate they get to that point. Add in a dense energy source that's suddenly available and the rise of tech may be lethal. Perhaps the lucky ones don't have something like petroleum so their species matures long before they ruin their world.
Back up...dude with a 10th grade level understanding of biology and chemistry coming through with a question...
So carbon-based life forms can, under the right circumstances, decompose into long chains of hydrocarbons like Petroleum.
Does that mean silicon-based life forms under the right circumstances would break down into hydrosilicates like caulk?
I don't know about the end result under the same extremes. I do know that silicon life, while not impossible, it's probably unlikely. Silicon does parallel carbon in some ways including a similar location on the periodic chart (which is why it got attention from scifi writers), but the issue is simply silicon is nowhere near as "greedy" as carbon bonds.
But it is a big universe.
<3
Reminds me of my thoughts after reading "Why Buddhism is True" by Robert Wright. If you haven't read it before I highly recommend it.
So we all just happily go back to living in forest?
Return to monkee
It was a bad idea to get out of the oceans if you ask me.
Return to sea-monkee?
The thing is we could largely retain all our advances and live in a more fecund environment. A large portion of our pollution is unnecessary and tied to whatever you call this global economic system / social paradigm we've backed ourselves into. It's only either or between forest and urban blight because we've made it so
Why not?
Hey OP, here is some serious DD you might like
I didn't understand the question. What is a "great filter"?
No BS, seriously don't know and want to.
https://youtu.be/UjtOGPJ0URM
This covers it pretty well.
If you want a very short version: a hypothetical eventuality in the technological advancement of intelligent life, as to limit their existence.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/UjtOGPJ0URM
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
So like, we all just give up as a species? Sounds unlikely.
Think of Star Trek as an analogy.
I've never watched Star Trek.
I know, heresy for lemmy.
I also use windows and not linux (though I plan on switching when I get time to learn linux)
Wow, it’s like talking to an Alien ….. while I do occasionally use Windows, my main laptop is OSX, my home servers are Raspian and Suse and at work I use Red Hat, Debian and whatever Amazon Linux is, and my media consumption is Linux or iOS
I mean there are multiple proposed filters.
Suppose yours is correct. What is this humanity's nature you speak of?
Bravery? Foolishness? Wisdom? Violence? Greed?
What what of those attributes haven't we already overcome time and again?
It's much more probable that everyone out there is attentively listening to signals instead of radically changing their own mental processes. Or not
Wtf kinda world are you living in where humanity has overcome foolishness, violence, and greed?
I think they meant for five minutes because if you won, you won right?
Exactly. Everyone thought nuclear war might be one of the great filters but we survived the Cold War. Nuclear weapons are no longer a concern, right? Right?
I mean I don't see people practice nuclear drills anymore so yeah
Sounds like little but it's a lot and it compounds
I mean same as yours I hope? People do that daily, hope you grow to notice it. It's nice when you do