Lemmy.world Rammy Statement
We recently received a message from a concerned Rammy user regarding their instance not having an active admin team.
We have made attempts to contact the Rammy admins, which other instance admins have tried as well, to determine their current status. Due to their admins being absent and their unmoderated content growing in numbers, we will defederate from Rammy. If and when this situation changes, we will be happy to reevaluate our approach. It should be noted that any instances that have abandoned admin teams will be defederated.
how does that work - I mean, who's paying the bills for the instance if it's unmoderated? weird
Maybe it's not actually abandoned. Just providing plausible deniability that way.
It's running an older version of Lemmy, so it's not being updated.
How much bandwidth/resource do you need? If you had a 4core nas, running unraid and a gigabit connection for example
Could you set this up and nearly forget about it?
Rammy is running 0.18.0 which still has the bloated postgres database issue, so storage should be ramping up real fast. It is still technically possible to forget about it, don't get me wrong. I was merely pointing out it is not the only possibility.
Sorry I wasn't questioning you, was just genuinely curious and it got me thinking.
Could somebody set an instance up on a nes or home server, forget about it and it becomes completely rogue? At what point would any instance defederate if they never updated too?
I think that in order to run Lemmy you'd need at least a PlayStation.
Nah mate, PS2 at minimum, and only with a fresh memory card
No worries, I took no offense.
Technically yes one could, absolutely. No disputing that. Automatic defederation is not a thing afaik, so it would stay federated.
I run a script daily on my instance to defederate suspicious instances (no post but thousands of users for example) but not everybody does.
It's not necessarily super expensive for someone who wants to host an instance, whether it's at home or via server providers. Hosting a GOOD and high-traffic instance might cost more but still any nerd with disposable income can do it if they want.
that instance is full to the brim of crazies who have lost all grip on reality. they feel nothing but hate
Lemmys that have been touched by the Warp and fallen into Chaos.
It got really bad just over the past two days. I'm not sure if it's a raid from some right wing troll farm, or what it is. Defederation makes things easy though
Yeah but defed has an issue where it might just lead to bigger echo chambers for the users.
Don't like this view, defed the instance and so and so forth. I think defed should only be used for last resort action like in this case an awful lot of spam. Just because their political views are left, right or center shouldn't be used as reason for defed.
What about how these assholes were harassing LGBTQ+ users with hate? Defederation was called for and urgently needed. That behavior is indefensible and breaks site rules.
Not really an issue. If you want to see this content from defederated instances that everyone else finds obnoxious or disruptive, then you can either browse from an instance that doesn’t defederate that content, or spin up your own personal instance to browse from. It’s easy to move to a different instance. Your choice.
What makes it possible right wing and not just a troll farm? Sincerely curious why make the divide and note.
EDIT: I checked it out, I see the issue with Rammy. And yes, there is a lot of spam/hate fest, it's not that all right wings are extremist just as much as "left wing" isn't all extremist. We're all people in the end and imo we shouldn't let it divide everything further by labels and stereotyping.
It's the same people from exploding heads that are in these threads. They circumvent the defederation by taking over another instance.
Who are those guys? They posted a thread on my instance trying to get people over to exploding heads... They don't seem to have all their horses in the stable, if you know what I mean.
Nazis. And while bot the sharpest pencil in the box, they'll keep coming.
And defederation is necessary to stop more recruitment/indoctrination of the lowest common denominator, who are very susceptible to appeals to emotional reasoning and propoganda techniques.
I'm fresh to lemmy so know very little in relation. But put that way makes more sense. Group of known trolls who move one to another to degrade and break the network.
Isn't it possible to enable an automod feature for keywords or something across lemmy? I would image that would help.
Not across instances every instance has to define those themselves.
We have an automod bot that is being developed by @Rooki@lemmy.world that would take care of a lot of these issues though.
Hi there, what do the symbols before and after your username mean? I'm in Jerboa. I see silhouettes of orange and pink shields?
Moderator and Admin badges
I love how 2 people downvoted you for that answer! Haha what the hell?..
It's like they see the admin badge and reactionary downvote.
Well I know at least one of them is downvoting almost everything I post. I PM'd if they wanted to talk about it :D
Probably a butthurt toxic user from a defederated instance..
idk at this point I don't want to associate with some people. Being divided sucks but being united might actually be worse.
Not just that; at this point it's impossible to dismiss that State-sponsored actors are a thing and must be considered in our threat models. If an instance is unmoderated, be sure for-profit trolls will arrive and start wreaking havoc there.
Mmmm
Idk man I’m not convinced it’s the theory’s fault and not the implementation.
In other words, if people were more respectful of each other and were more understanding of the difference between real objective truths and subjective opinions, it wouldn’t be so bad. However with how high the stakes are for a lot of these various discussion points I can’t blame them and people want to do the right thing and fight loyally for their own side which translates to aggression for most (sadly)
Idk man bein a human is complex
I would not support uniting with those trolls in any way. I had not even looked at it beforehand. I agree that being divided sucks. But I think it's important to remember that there are still good people out there, even if we don't agree on everything. We need to find ways to come together and work towards a better future, even if it's not always easy.
If I create a social media account and identify as left-leaning, I am bombarded with extremist right-wing content. The opposite is true if I identify as right-leaning. This has ruined social media for me, which is why I immediately blocked the news and political communities on Lemmy.
I do not identify as either left-wing or right-wing. I share views that are generally considered to be down the middle. This is true for the majority of people I know, who used to be called independents but now undecided. I guess thats why when an entire group is called out, it rubs me the wrong way.
So I actually used to be in exactly your position. Policies used to be much more subjective. Urban planning? Financial stuff? Foreign policy? These are complicated questions with varying answers from not just different parties but different politicians. But things have changed recently. I feel like that's actually a major part of the issues here that people are overlooking. People on the left jump on change faster overall so they've realized what's happened to the right before the people who usually vote for the right have.
I don't like blaming an entire group either but I've been pushed to believe it's currently necessary. Being an independent isn't about always choosing a compromise between the two extreme positions, it's about deciding for yourself what policies are the most reasonable. Assuming your own views don't change, this means that if one party moves further away from the middle, their views won't align with your own as much. This can happen to both parties, but in my case I feel that the right has moved much further away from my views than the left has in the same period of time, so while I agree that the best position is somewhere in the middle of extreme right and left, that's currently closer to the left for me and the right has begun to take positions that I find indefensible. If they swung back to where they were a decade ago things might be different.
Nah, you’re not gonna muddy these waters, the right by far outweighs in terms of extremists.
They’re literally conservative religious people. It isn’t rocket science just look at the Middle East
Muddy what waters? Maybe see more of my replies for context.
Who are we talking about "They’re literally conservative religious people", as in the rammy trolls or everyone right leaning? Because I already agreed the 20secs I saw the homepage it was unmodded, uncensored crazies.
Where does the middle east come in here, you say it like I'm already supposed to know. I also said, I block news and politics, left other social networks because of all the politics.
I started this as in, why divide and basically make tribes like "Anyone in a different party is bad". And I never said left or right was worse, I said I've had the bad luck from coming across both but that don't mean all left or all right is all bad...
Sure I can clarify!
So when you said “why does it have to be a right leaning and not some other side” and then said in your edit that not all of one side is bad - it eludes to your point being (from what I understand) “it wasn’t right to assume it was conservatives”
I’m arguing that they are largely responsible for extremism and are likely correlated to strict conservative religious upbringings. I then provided an example of the Middle East and terrorism in general correlating (in this case directly) with strict, dominant religious upbringings (I made this last term up, I just mean religions that expressly condone other religions)
Could you link where I said “why does it have to be a right leaning and not some other side” such as you quoted, I didn't mean to put it that way, because my point is I hate sides, especially bad apples poisoning the whole barrel (left or right). What I said was:
And in regards to my edit, I explained in one reply that I'm new here (https://lemmy.world/comment/2127411). And now I see I probably should've added that in my edit as well that I was coming at this literally being fresh to lemmy with no history and trying to understand why ppl were bashing all right wing with this group. After this reply https://lemmy.world/comment/2126263 I had more background on the fact that it is a known group that does this often.
However, I have still defended that correlating a bad group (as I agreed with multiple times) that is part of a large group makes the whole group bad, I don't believe is a good way of looking at it imo.
It’s not necessarily going to be an accurate judgment but it is likely that you will be correct if predicting (that means purely predicting, not taking any real action or indirect action, only guesses) which is what the commenter you responded to was doing.
Generalization when used to prejudge someone’s character and taking action, especially serious action is very bad. But predicting the responsible party of an openly hateful and vile event based off previous events is just fine. It should not ever be labeled as fact without evidence however.
Don’t worry about being new, it’s all good we’re just havin a discussion. The quote I did originally was supposed to be by understood summary of what you were saying but I only said that for the second point I made and didn’t go back to fix it - sorry about that
I didn't look to much into it. I don't want to see that sort of content.
Though not many people the right are trolls, the trolls are very loud. And on Rammy.
Yeah, I don't blame you. It didn't take more than 20 seconds on the homepage for me to leave. Those posters are by far extremist, conspiracy nuts.
Nah, call the alt-right extremists out for what they are. Tankies too.
If you're a reasonable conservative, you shouldn't feel called out by condemnation of the extremists.
Thank you for the update, seems like a reasonable approach
Unfortunate but very much necessary to stop the spread of their hatred. This is why it's important to have a team of admins, so that it's less likely that the person running the server doesn't just disappear one day and they can continue maintaining it even if the main person isn't there. Maybe if you're an individual instance you can't afford to hire a team of people, but you could get a group of friends together and have all of you work together to run it, think of it like a group passion project it's important to make sure that something like this doesn't end up abandoned otherwise it can cause problems for others if people start abusing it.
I know a lot of people are in doubt about how bad it is, but I went there and I looked at it and it's honestly terrible worse than the Donald on Reddit (if anyone can remember that) we don't want to rehost that kind of stuff on this server, we don't want to be associated with those kinds of people, it's not worth it. They can still have their free speech on their platform, just not on our server and we don't have to put up with it.
Yes they can keep their hate on their own instances but they are not welcome in our house. Keep reporting these extremists wether they are right of left wing - because it's a never-ending fight.
It’s interesting that they have their own instance, but can’t stand the fact that they got defederated, and have to keep finding ways to get that sweet attention they crave.
That's why it is important that everyone keeps reporting these things.
Question here. If a user suscribed to world wants to keep seing content from that instance, cant he just suscribe to some subs over there? I'm still trying to figure that part out. I'm on ml but can see some content from world.
No, you will not see content from Rammy on LW. If you want to interact with both you'll need to have an account on an instance that federates both. I'm sure there are some out there, and if not starting your own is an option.
And this, I feel, is one of the biggest issues with Lemmy...and unfortunately one that I could easily see being its Achilles Heel and ultimate undoing as a viable, sustainable model in the long term.
I think it's one of the best things about it.
neigh. I think its one of the best.
Want ot make sure your instance is up, and is predictable and federated? Heres a guide
Roll your own
Dont troll or be a dick and you wont get deferated. Bigger instances have better things to worry about
As it sits things like the downtime, the porn spam to random@kbin, the federation drama have left me largely unaffected. I get to see what I want based on my subs and nothing more. If someone is trolling me I can even ban them and still see content, without their comments or contributions.
Im not reliant on a large corp to decide im worthy. I get to have downtime on my clock. etc.
As a user of lemmy.ml you don't have to worry about what Lemmy.world defederates from. You'll still see Lemmy.World content and lemmy.ml will pull directly from other instances on its own
That's not what they asked though.
The question wasn't that self-centered, it was asking if a user from an instance that defederated from another instance could still access content from the defederated instance through a direct manual subscription.
Fair enough!
Never even heard of it, but good looking out!
Good
No, no, no. Clearly Rammy needs the enlightened guidance of Dot World. We must anschluss Rammy into the Greater Dot World.
So much drama I see on lemmy in one month than reddit in 10 years.
Time for me to leave Lemmy.world for good.
Are we at an airport?
Airplane to Fuckville leaving at 9am.
And nothing of value was lost
Neither the person who contacted you was a real user of that instance, nor their "concern" was legitimate.
Congrats. You got successfully manipulated. And opened yourself up for further future manipulations.
what are you talking about? 2 seconds on that instance and youll see hate speech and bigotry. this wasnt even mentioned in this post, only that they are defederating due to a lack of an admin team. personally, i would agree to defederating for either of these reasons. in this case we have both. if you dont see a problem with that instance as it is currently, you are part of the problem and should leave too.
The instance in question was practically dead before this stupid thread gave it attention.
I'll bet you money that concerned user didn't exist 3 day ago.
Instance admins should learn how to be smarter, and not give manipulators small wins, alas, they will come back for bigger ones.