YSK how to deal with questions about gaps in your employment.

Dismal@lemmy.world to You Should Know@lemmy.world – 429 points –

Why YSK: Interviewers like to weed out people who have gaps in their employment history for myriad nonsensical reasons. If you remember that this is all just a game to the employer, you can play to win.

Fill the gaps with a story about a failed foray into entrepreneurship in a related field.

I had a massive gap and this worked gangbusters after six months of constant rejection. The gap was caused by my mother's health rapidly deteriorating, and my sense of responsibility to care for her - which became a full time job until she passed.

After that, I went through the dehumanizing experience of dozens of interviews where I was asked about the gap. Describing why I took the time out of the workforce was hard enough - adding insult to injury was the homogenous reactions among all interviewers. You could watch them mentally write me off in real time, and then go through the motions before sending me off to wait for a "the organization has interviewed several great candidates" email.

It occurred to me that instead of baring my pain for callous interviewers, what they'd rather hear about was a "go-getter" whose spirit has been broken enough to come crawling back to the rat race. So I concocted a story about a failed attempt at being an entrepreneur in their industry.

Lo, and behold - After I stopped telling the truth and started telling people about Vandelay Industries` mighty struggle to remain solvent due to market forces, I found myself with three offers in the same number of weeks.

The difference in interviewers` whole demeanor between "took care of dying mother," and "had to see if I could get Vandelay Industries off the ground while I was young enough to be able to recover from a failure" was night and day.

Read about failed startups. Rehearse.

Everybody lies in the corpo-world. Lie better.

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This is great advice, coming from someone who pondered using the "Mother was really sick and had to manage her illness and passing" excuse if I ever went back, as it was true for me too. (I'm sorry for your loss, it's a really painful life transition, I know.)

I ended up taking a slightly different approach. I worked in IT project management before I retired early. My LinkedIn resume shows me currently employed as an "IT consultant" and will until I decide I need another job or I kick it.

I'll put on "waste management consultant" because technically its what the human body kind of is...

If you're a graphic designer or something similar, the gaps can always be filled with "freelance designer"

Honestly, a lot of people lie or at least embellish during the hiring process. Hell, company can mislead you about the company culture, scope of responsibilities, and room for advancement. So, it really is in your best interest to put forward the best version of yourself, even if it involves filling in the gaps a bit, as long as it is within reason.

I have worked in a hiring position in the past. How many times do you think the company actually checked or attempted to confirm certifications or degrees? It didn't happen.

So yes, do what you have to do to get the job. So long as the job gets done well and everyone is happy.

I'm very sorry for your loss.

Appreciated. This happened many years ago, so I'm used to my new normal.

I posted this here because I was going through my exported posts/comments from reddit, and realized that I have a ton of intellectual property that I feel can be shared with others without their involvement.

I had to lie to get jobs too. I left home at 16 and worked full time through high school/college to support myself. After getting my degree, I watched as all my classmates got good paying jobs while I didn't. Eventually after 20 or so interviews I lost my cool and asked why I was getting turned down. "Well, we don't want a laborer handling our accounting records. Maybe work as a receptionist or executive assistant for a few years to prove you're capable of office work?".

So I started lying. I took all of my previous work history off my resume and advertised myself as a fresh college grad. It worked... At first. Once I started talking about basic work things in the interview they knew I was lying and wouldn't go further. So I took a different tactic: lie about my unofficial title being higher than what a background check would say, but "admitting" that I couldn't get promoted because I was a nepo hire.

Oddly enough that worked REALLY well. Everyone loved the idea that I got jobs through connections instead of my own hard work. They loved that I walked, talked, and dressed like someone who breezed through life. My only guess is that I came off as one of the "popular kids" and they wanted me at their table. In just a month I had a dozen offers across the industry.

I absolutely agree with you. If you're trying to dig yourself out of unemployment or poverty, lie, lie LIE! Interviews are notoriously bad at determining whether or not you're a good employee. Do everything you can to play into people's biases and let them fill in the blanks.

This is interesting. I'm gonna have to tell some of my friends looking for work about this one. It's gross as heck that it works but whatever I guess.

Never tell the truth in an interview. Tell them what they want to hear.

As someone who is taking a break from the workforce to care for a baby (lol childcare costs), I’m already struggling to not feel shame when I admit it to acquaintances. I’ll definitely be bullshitting if/when I come back.

You don't even really need to bs it that much.

"For thr last years I have held a really important position at a small company, working with logistic, settlements, transport, and economics. I have grate experience working under a lot of stress and can handle it with grate care. I have been the go to person for all important tasks and I have handled them within time and budget. I am a excellent spider in the web and can have many balls in the air without problem."

With a bit creativity writing parenting can sound like a lot jobs, just change the text up a bit to fit what you are looking for.

I don't know what industry you're in but I'm sorry this happened. The same happened to me and I found a job within two weeks; my hiring manager told me that I had excellent values.

It's always good to hear that there are still people who see fair treatment!

Your field can make a difference, but I think it really depends on the breadth of your skillset, timing, luck and location if you're an office drone.

This happened to me several years ago, and the conditions weren't the best because I had recently decided to change careers. I had low experience in my chosen field, but it ended up being worth the pain.

Doing well now, and the combination of career experience opened a lot of doors. Mom would be proud! :)

I work for government, and not in the US... People genuinely appreciate different things and understand people aren't productivity machines.

Wow, that's fucked. Not that you're recommending this, but that it's necessary at all.

Generally speaking, HR/talent acquisition teams have very little accountability with regards to their processes and treatment of candidates. Usually most candidates have very little recourse to provide feedback on the process, and HR/talent acquisition have very little interest in speaking with candidates about the process for improvement.

What ultimately happens therefore is candidates tell HR/talent acquisition what the latter wants to hear, and the latter group of people don't usually have the cognizance to realize that their own biases and perceptions cloud their process.

It's "necessary" in so far as the entire system is corrupted to the core. That's why knowing someone is so much more powerful -- knowing someone skips a lot of this process.

On top of justifying your employment gaps, laying through your fucking teeth is a mighty effective tactic in job interviews in general.

You have the experience they're looking for. Where did you get it? Toys r us, sears, choose any company that went bankrupt. List your friend (coach them on what to say) as your manager at that place.

You love overtime when it's necessary. You don't have anyone at home waiting for you so if there's work to do you're happy to get a bigger paycheck instead of being bored all night. It doesn't matter if it's true because that guy told you "we don't ask for overtime often, we work well". Both of you were lying, it's fine.

You need a certification from a bullshit company like AWS or Azure (not actually useful certs like forklift mind you, please do stay secure). Don't fucking pay for it, tell them you had the opportunity to follow the classes but we're too busy with work to pass the exam! Sure you don't have the paper to show for it but you know what you're talking about! And you're such a great candidate why would you like to them about that?

Lie through your teeth everytime you get the chance, because they're doing it too. Worse case scenario? They find out and never call you back. Oh no! The thing they were going to do if you didn't lie!

I do this for every job lol. It always worked out and after they hire you, its much harder to fire you for their petty reasons.

Just say you signed an NDA /s

I unironically pondered this approach, but came to the realization that the background checkers would still see a gap. (And that it wouldn't create intrigue as much as it would frustrate the interviewer.)

Hey, if it makes the interviewers life just a little bit worse, isn’t that what really counts?

How is the import/export business these days?

yeah, uh ya know uh trade and stuff

OPEC and tariffs and pareto efficiency

I've twice now just claimed to be employed, and refused to give a reference because I didn't want to fuck up my job if I didn't take the new offer. Worked both times.

I've only ever had one company call any of my references lmao

My current job is the only one that ever has

I know because the first one is my wife, who was actually my boss for a while

On the way home from the interview HR called her, she was in the car with me lol

Wow, you actually fucked your boss!

I started an LLC a few years ago for a couple hundred bucks and I use that to fill the necessary gaps in the same way you're referencing.

I didn't start an LLC, but have told many employers that I did, and it's worked well. It is insane how people worship "small business owners" in this culture.

Yeah, mine actually expired a long time ago, but nobody checks that.

I just said the truth that my Dad had cancer and I went home to spend time with him and then take care of things after his death (1y gap). Kinda annoying how they still ask me that even 8 years later, but at least there is usually some sort of apology or regret after I tell them.

I don‘t know why it didn‘t work for you, maybe it only works on compassionate people and I got lucky. Good advice though, no need to be truthful in interviews.

I've also seen people say, "that portion of my career is covered by a non-disclosure agreement". This one has varying levels of success.

I feel like this would be highly dependent on your resume.

Might catch some looks if your work experience is mostly Dennys and Walmart and you're trying to hide a six month gap behind an NDA.

Might be catchin looks but Momma din’t raise no snitch; I signed an NDA bitch

Nah, no "gaps" need to be explained at all. What even is a gap? It takes easily from weeks to months and even years sometimes to find employment and that's not something for the worker to grovel for.

5-year break from working? That can even be a life goal and not a gap.

I think the real reason employers don't want people with large gaps is because they don't want people who can afford to take that much time off. It scares them knowing that their threats of termination aren't going to work.

Maybe not so much "can afford", but "are willing to".

For all we know OP was living in abject poverty while taking care of their mum, but still making that choice. In that scenario, they couldn't afford, but still did.

Appreciate your idealism, but this is the ugly new reality in the US if you're not adequately situated to tell them to pound sand.

There are very few people in that position, and they gotta eat. The economy is bad, but it's trending toward perpetual dogshit for an overwhelming majority.

The bigger the company, the more I find that they rely on desperation to keep costs low because they can take it a bit further than they used to.

Believe me.. I once had the opportunity to take a year off. It was glorious, and I'lL f'N dO iT aGaIn.

yes but sometimes they're trying to find people who fit a preconceived notion of "who they want to work with." They may use phrases like "team player" or whatnot. They want someone who is like them. I mean, I can understand the motivation behind that approach but I don't think it's the best way forward.

yeah they want someone who is like them, and i am definetly not like this. so it is very good to receive a "No" from this type of workplace

Yeah I think that's true as well. I don't want to make broad statements because situations vary; is it better to try to fake the fit into those jobs OR are people better off skipping and moving to the next lead.

aye, there's the rub.
I've adopted the Sour Grapes philosophy over the past few years : if they didn't want to hire me then they're obviously a bunch of stupid fucks who don't know quality when they see it, which means I wouldn't want to work with them in the first place. but I say that from a position of already having a job. That philosophy doesn't help someone trying to find a first job or trying to get back into the workforce after an extended absence.

I prefer the tactic "I signed a non-disclosure agreement" - I can't talk about it because of that NDA

I wouldn't suggest this approach. I've signed many NDA's and none of them preclude you from stating the name of your employer and the dates of your employment. If someone said this to me while I'm on a hiring committee I would assume they are lying.

Why are you asking them about their gaps????

Great advice. I've also had success with embellishing the truth, or even just putting a positive spin on the truth. I didn't leave my last job to look after a dying relative, I was a freelance on-call PA working 12 hour days. I wasn't forced to leave my home and spend my life-savings driving cross-country to live with an old friend who was kind enough to let me stay with them and only asked I help out at a soup kitchen they work at, I was expanding my mind with travel, networking, and filling my free time volunteering for a local charity whose goals I felt strongly about.

It helps get you in for an interview. Although in my location jobs are fairly easy to come by these days, which wasn't always the case.

Everyone says it's a great idea, but I'd say these counterpoints:

  • If you're going for any type of "business manager, sales or leadership" role, failing at a startup isn't a winning look. Yes, I know it's normal to fail at startups and later succeed, I've done it, it's true, but it's still selling a loss rather than selling a win.

  • You better be well-prepared to completely describe that failed startup and why it didn't work out.Ideally you can describe well the lessons learned from it, and how they could have been overcome with better luck, circumstances and another chance

  • It's just lying and not great, I'd rather polish whatever the truth is than making something up.

eh, granted you dont do dumb shit like falsifying documents and are ready to back up your nonsense somehow theres barely an issue with lying during interviews

as seen from examples like the post, companies dont apply often apply much morality, so dont bother doing so either

This is actually really helpful. I had been telling people I was caring for a sick family member because that seemed more palatable than the truth that I just had plenty of savings and didn’t want to spread Covid to people I live with who have high comorbidity factors. Then those people got forced to return to work.

I’ll just tell them I was trying to start up a freelance career instead.

Make sure you play up that it failed, though.

From experience, if you interview for jobs as a successful freelancer, it may not go so well because they think you don't "need" the money.

I really hate how it's "frowned upon" to take a few months to rest and recuperate after working for a number of years. I'm usually honest about why there's a 1–2-month gap.

If they don't take me because of this, then so be it, probably not a good company to work for.

Absolutely wild and extremely accurate advice. Hats off to you-- and extremely sorry for your loss. Baring the pain is hard, and harder to lie about.

HR knows everyone lies, but really it's a thing about how to market yourself... and we all know marketing's mostly wading through vaguely legal BS anyway. Any proper white collar job these days wants a golden goose employee that eats crap and craps gold-- them's the works.

Adding onto the YSK, any personal project can be properly spun into a good employee gap as long as you can at least back it up. Podcast, github project, spin up an LLC, started selling porcelain dolls locally or something. If you're no good at spinning up a story, just being able to make the person on the other end of the line believe that you have 1. a fast capacity to learn, 2. are flexible with learning, and 3. are willing to take extreme duress and go-gettering, it gives you a bit more rope to work with than otherwise.

Again, sorry for your loss. One can only wish we lived in a world where even the slightest employment gap wasn't looked at with a microscope. Hopefully with the years we might live in a world where this lessens. The HR at my current company I consider pretty solid, hopefully the 'european model' spreads.

How tenacious are the background check companies? Here's one that says they identify gaps not professionally-accounted for?

The #1 red flag to an employer is "I don't NEED a job." before my VA pension got bumped to 100%, I was looking for a bs job to keep busy and you could see the switch in their head flip everytime when I'd explain "I'm retired, I'm not scrambling for money I'm looking for a good fit."

Employers lose their gdamn minds if you aren't exploitable. They know that means if I schedule time off for a trip or concert, I'm not going to cancel with two days notice to cover some shift. They know it means I'm not going to stand for 3 managers blaming my entry level ass for their mistakes and/or incompetence. It's garbage and really speaks to the core of capitalism.