TLDR: Dogs use body language. smell etc to gauge wether another dog is friend or foe. When a barrier (like a fence etc) stops this assessment, they go straight to aggression as a defence/protection measure.
My guess is it a similar thing in humans.
We are stripped of our usual communication and threat assessment of the other person we would have in a normal encounter. We can't see their face, their body language etc etc. So if someone is prone to anxiety and/or aggression (two sides of the same coin), they jump straight to "That driver is a cunt who did that on purpose and to spite me".
Edit: This is also why I think online discussions so often turn into insult ridden shit fests.
anxiety and aggression combo is so interesting and makes sense explaining past interactions with people
BECAUSE YOU WON'T MOVE OVER TO THE RIGHT FUCKING LANE!!!!!
STOP DRIVING 55 IN THE LEFT LANE ON A ROAD WITH A 65 SPEED LIMIT.
GO WHEN THR FUCKING LIGHT TURNS GREEN.
WHEN TRAFFIC SPEEDS UP. YOU SPEED UP TOO.
USE YOUR FUCKING TURN SIGNAL.
Those that don’t drive in the right-most free lane when not passing should be ticketed. Maybe that would help.
It's already state law here. Doesn't seem to help much.
I think a big part of it is that driving is inherently dangerous (you're in a metal box going much faster than you're capabale of going yourself, your health and finances are at stake) and frustrating (waiting in traffic, people making mistakes).
All those things put people on edge and cause them to act out
You see, most people (myself included) subliminally think that their car is an extension of their personal space. You can see this by looking at your nearest neighboring car during a red light stop. The amount of people doing things usually reserved for their bedrooms are astronomical because our subconscious thought we're in a safe when we're inside our cars except for everybody can see that you're picking your nose in all of its glory.
So when you merge a little bit too late or you use your high beam several times, the person on the receiving end might interpret that as an encroachment of their personal space and react accordingly. During my experience as a road user, you can predict how ragey a person is based on the personalization that a person does to their car. The isolation wrought by the recent pandemic doesn't really help because it made some people forget how to empathize with another human being.
I masturbated and peed into a bottle while doing 80mph up the M5 high on acid once.
I'd like to clarify I didn't cum, pee. I had to stop mid-wank to pee in the bottle cos being high was making it take so long. Also I drank th ebottle of pee afterwards cos well, high.
I wouldn't recommend drinking dark yellow, fresh pee - no matter how high you are - it doesn't taste great.
This is my call to leave Lemmy for the day. See you guys on Monday.
finally, an interesting story on here! the righteousness was getting mundane, and i needed someone to share an honest, shameful experience with...err... no shame. thank you for being so forthcoming, and i hope you're doing better
Because I can't see through these god damn LED headlights this F150/Silverado is using to blind the fuck out of my as it barrels down the road to hang out on my ass in the right lane because someone in the left lane is going to slow.
Because either the person they're raging at is a moron that doesn't know how to drive, or they're a moron that doesn't know how to drive and nothing is ever their fault.
The second one is also essentially the first.
In summary, it's because they think they were wronged (it doesn't matter if it actually was like this), thus they believe to have to dish out "justice".
No, sometimes other people really are morons that don't know how to drive. Thats not to say that road rage is right, just that it is understandable how it sometimes happens.
Lots of good suggestions here, including the difficulty in communicating inherent to being in a car.
I think another important factor is that driving itself is stressful. Surveys of commuters consistently show that people who walk or cycle have the highest satisfaction with their commute, while motorists ranks somewhere from the middle to the bottom (i.e., either ahead of or behind people who use public transport), depending on the study.
When you put people in a stressful situation where it's difficult to communicate, inevitably some people lose their temper.
Some people are just permanently about to lose it.
Back when I had this issue, it was because I had a stressful job, and all I want to do is go home but you get people on these winding ass country roads who don't know them so they go 20 under!!
Now I just get mad if someone is stupid and almost hits me.
This is an interesting discussion. I’ve had a few loonies rage at me. How do you handle when drivers follow you way too close, like if you have to brake they might rear-end your car? I’ve had this happen a few times and it’s never because I’m driving under the limit, I usually speed moderately at 20% over. My solution has been to ease my foot off the accelerator to slowly slow down to give them a hint. Some catch on and back off, others get aggressive.
Edit: I should note that speeding up isn’t always possible because in some cases I’m behind someone else at a safe distance.
Yes. You have to adjust your speed so you have time to react for both you and the tailgater.
They have very good brakes and reaction times in Austria, because pretty much every car tailgates there, even if they don't go very fast after passing you.
Take your foot off the gas and let the car coast. It will slow down gradually and they will be forced to brake.
Turn your hazard lights on.
Flash your hazards on and off a couple of times.
Move over and let them pass if it's safe and viable to do so (you are in the passing lane and there is a slow lane to merge into etc).
Don't brake check them. It can cause you to be partially at fault in a fair number of places if there's an accident as a result,and even if your insurance doesn't consider an accident your fault, that doesn't protect you in the event that the other party decides to sue.
Instead of brake checking, flash the rear fog lights.
A red light coming on often makes them think you're braking.
Flashers should be amber. But of course that's not mandatory in the US.
seeing your car as an extension of yourself – it’s not “your car hit my car”, it’s “you hit me!”
disassociation – not seeing the other drivers as humans, just seeing their cars
willingness to conflate minor inconveniences with being the victim, being oppressed
For me its when I see a driver who is driving unexpectedly. Like speeding in areas with kids. Or driving at high speeds anywhere.
roadways are build for a certain speed so we can anticipate oncoming traffic. Like lights are programmed to allow a block of traffic to go then a break so cars turning can complete the turn between the break. if some asshole fucks it up by hammering the gas they will end up in between the blocks making it harder for all the cars to complete their turn since they now have to wait.
Someone said 'reading intention' which is a big part too. I can't read intention of drivers who are selfishly doing what they want.
it's the realization that traffic could be better and safer if it wasn't for certain drivers
In congested cities if you don't enter the intersection when its not completely clear then you'll have to wait ~40 minutes for a chance to go across. Waymo's riders have that as one of the biggest frustrations. Then theres a gridlock behind them.
There's no winning with cars.
Inattention, selfishness, and an inflated belief in driving ability both of self and of other drivers.
People don't pay attention to the vehicles around them or what they're doing. As a reault they often are caught off guard by the maneuvers of other vehicles and this in conjunction with the other two things I mentioned makes them angry because it adds stress to the situation.
People believe their driving is better than it is (especially seasoned drivers). They either expect that everyone should be as good as they are at driving. Or as good as they think they are at driving. And when it turns out that this is not the case (that they are not good at driving or that others are not good at driving) this adds stress to the situation. This is ego.
Selfishness is just that. And it happens with pretty much every driver on the road though they are loathe to admit it. The driving experience as a whole is all about them. Where they're going. What they want. How fast.
they want to go and in what lane. Whether they want to allow someone to merge. Whether they want to allow someone to pass. Whether they want to wait for a light or wait for someone to turn or wait in traffic etc. As a result they often do less than legal things because they feel confident in the fact that what they are doing and where they are going is important and therefore more important than other drivers on the road. They sincerely believe they are more important or that other drivers are less important and they act selfishly and with a sense of entitlement as a result. This also adds stress to the situation. However, of the three this is the main reason people become so unreasonable and angry.
A combination of selfishness, self righteousness/ego, and distracted driving (inattention) causes people to react to perceived, imagined, or actual slights of any kind on the road with malice and anger that is undue or unreasonable given most road situations. And considering that cars are heavy machinery and can do a lot of damage and be deadly to other drivers, people often jump to conclusions about the people they share the road with, especially when they do things like merge with no signal, cut others off, speed unnecessarily, or manuever in a way that seems erratic. Driving is a high stress activity. And that magnifies and exacerbates the problems the other three things I mentioned cause.
i mean a big part of it is just the fact that cars are so inherently bad as a form of transport that 5 of them meeting at an intersection results in people having to stop and wait, which obviously results in frustration because you're constantly blocked with no way of even turning around.
compare this to a bike where you're never really blocked unless you're in a pedestrian area, and even then you can just turn around and leave and pick a different route.
It's easy to get really frustrated with driving when you have to waste so much of your life sitting still in a metal box.
It's a daily prison we all put ourselves in and (in the US) we don't have a choice.
Entitlement and a lack of empathy.
Cars are brain poison and they turn people evil.
I try to keep my zen while driving, and mostly I just suffer from road depression instead of rage. I get road depression because driving forces you to interact with many people, and you begin to realize the high fraction of people with serious mental impairment.
I try to put myself in their shoes, but the most charitable explanations for some driving behaviors are i) distraction - usually from cell phones - and ii) not thinking about the consequences of a behavior on others.
One of my pet peeves is drivers who perpetually drive on the right edge (for right side driving countries) of the lane / in the bike lane. When someone in front of them turns right to leave the road, they do not know how to go around them because the left side of the lane is a no-go zone. That means the whole lane has to stop. When they stop at a red light, no cars can pass them on the right to make a legal turn. They might acknowledge this by pulling forward more, as if that helps. Then when they get to the next intersection, the same thing happens again! Like, HAVE YOU NEVER TURNED RIGHT ON A RED YOURSELF? DO YOU NOT KNOW YOU SHOULD GET AS FAR LEFT AS POSSIBLE IN THE RIGHT LANE WHEN COMING TO A RED LIGHT? HOW DO YOU FUNCTION IN THE WORLD WHILE SO BLISSFULLY UNAWARE?
Oops. Lost my zen.
I'm too British to understand
Just flip left and right. But not the pedals. Brake is still on the left. And don't flip the windshield wiper and turn indicator sticks. Unless in Oz.
Because none of you fuckers can drive a sharp stick up a duck's ass.
Really?
I always think the road ragers are the ones that can’t actually drive. They drive like idiots then lose their shit when called out on it or if they put themselves in a bad situation.
They always seem to think they’re the best drivers on the road though 🤔
I dunno. I lost my shit on someone just today who literally pulled into my lane (coming toward me) to skip the line to turn. Literally just pulled out in front of me from an oncoming lane and kept coming until I stopped and leaned on the horn flashing my lights. There was nowhere for me to go. This type of thing has killed people in the past. Especially in poor visibility. There was literally no reason to do what this person did and I hadn't done anything wrong. There was no where for me to pull off to even avoid the collision if this person kept coming.
Perhaps you're correct about some road ragers, but generally I don't get angry until something gets dangerous for me because someone else is being unreasonable and potentially harmful.
Everyone thinks they're the best driver on the road. That's statistically proven. But generally people who drive more often or are seasoned drivers become complacent over time. Meaning almost no one is as good a driver as they think. Entitlement/ego, and distracted driving also play a big role and I'm way more likely to believe most road rage incidents are actually two egos coming to a head after both people are at fault than just one reckless driver vs someone else who wasn't in any way in the wrong.
Have you heard of barrier aggression in dogs?
TLDR: Dogs use body language. smell etc to gauge wether another dog is friend or foe. When a barrier (like a fence etc) stops this assessment, they go straight to aggression as a defence/protection measure.
My guess is it a similar thing in humans.
We are stripped of our usual communication and threat assessment of the other person we would have in a normal encounter. We can't see their face, their body language etc etc. So if someone is prone to anxiety and/or aggression (two sides of the same coin), they jump straight to "That driver is a cunt who did that on purpose and to spite me".
Edit: This is also why I think online discussions so often turn into insult ridden shit fests.
anxiety and aggression combo is so interesting and makes sense explaining past interactions with people
This video illustrates it well
(loud barking warning)
BECAUSE YOU WON'T MOVE OVER TO THE RIGHT FUCKING LANE!!!!!
STOP DRIVING 55 IN THE LEFT LANE ON A ROAD WITH A 65 SPEED LIMIT.
GO WHEN THR FUCKING LIGHT TURNS GREEN.
WHEN TRAFFIC SPEEDS UP. YOU SPEED UP TOO.
USE YOUR FUCKING TURN SIGNAL.
Those that don’t drive in the right-most free lane when not passing should be ticketed. Maybe that would help.
It's already state law here. Doesn't seem to help much.
I think a big part of it is that driving is inherently dangerous (you're in a metal box going much faster than you're capabale of going yourself, your health and finances are at stake) and frustrating (waiting in traffic, people making mistakes).
All those things put people on edge and cause them to act out
You see, most people (myself included) subliminally think that their car is an extension of their personal space. You can see this by looking at your nearest neighboring car during a red light stop. The amount of people doing things usually reserved for their bedrooms are astronomical because our subconscious thought we're in a safe when we're inside our cars except for everybody can see that you're picking your nose in all of its glory.
So when you merge a little bit too late or you use your high beam several times, the person on the receiving end might interpret that as an encroachment of their personal space and react accordingly. During my experience as a road user, you can predict how ragey a person is based on the personalization that a person does to their car. The isolation wrought by the recent pandemic doesn't really help because it made some people forget how to empathize with another human being.
I masturbated and peed into a bottle while doing 80mph up the M5 high on acid once.
I'd like to clarify I didn't cum, pee. I had to stop mid-wank to pee in the bottle cos being high was making it take so long. Also I drank th ebottle of pee afterwards cos well, high.
I wouldn't recommend drinking dark yellow, fresh pee - no matter how high you are - it doesn't taste great.
This is my call to leave Lemmy for the day. See you guys on Monday.
finally, an interesting story on here! the righteousness was getting mundane, and i needed someone to share an honest, shameful experience with...err... no shame. thank you for being so forthcoming, and i hope you're doing better
Because I can't see through these god damn LED headlights this F150/Silverado is using to blind the fuck out of my as it barrels down the road to hang out on my ass in the right lane because someone in the left lane is going to slow.
Because either the person they're raging at is a moron that doesn't know how to drive, or they're a moron that doesn't know how to drive and nothing is ever their fault.
The second one is also essentially the first.
In summary, it's because they think they were wronged (it doesn't matter if it actually was like this), thus they believe to have to dish out "justice".
No, sometimes other people really are morons that don't know how to drive. Thats not to say that road rage is right, just that it is understandable how it sometimes happens.
Lots of good suggestions here, including the difficulty in communicating inherent to being in a car.
I think another important factor is that driving itself is stressful. Surveys of commuters consistently show that people who walk or cycle have the highest satisfaction with their commute, while motorists ranks somewhere from the middle to the bottom (i.e., either ahead of or behind people who use public transport), depending on the study.
When you put people in a stressful situation where it's difficult to communicate, inevitably some people lose their temper.
Some people are just permanently about to lose it.
Back when I had this issue, it was because I had a stressful job, and all I want to do is go home but you get people on these winding ass country roads who don't know them so they go 20 under!!
Now I just get mad if someone is stupid and almost hits me.
This is an interesting discussion. I’ve had a few loonies rage at me. How do you handle when drivers follow you way too close, like if you have to brake they might rear-end your car? I’ve had this happen a few times and it’s never because I’m driving under the limit, I usually speed moderately at 20% over. My solution has been to ease my foot off the accelerator to slowly slow down to give them a hint. Some catch on and back off, others get aggressive.
Edit: I should note that speeding up isn’t always possible because in some cases I’m behind someone else at a safe distance.
Yes. You have to adjust your speed so you have time to react for both you and the tailgater.
They have very good brakes and reaction times in Austria, because pretty much every car tailgates there, even if they don't go very fast after passing you.
Take your foot off the gas and let the car coast. It will slow down gradually and they will be forced to brake.
Turn your hazard lights on.
Flash your hazards on and off a couple of times.
Move over and let them pass if it's safe and viable to do so (you are in the passing lane and there is a slow lane to merge into etc).
Don't brake check them. It can cause you to be partially at fault in a fair number of places if there's an accident as a result,and even if your insurance doesn't consider an accident your fault, that doesn't protect you in the event that the other party decides to sue.
Instead of brake checking, flash the rear fog lights.
A red light coming on often makes them think you're braking.
Flashers should be amber. But of course that's not mandatory in the US.
Rear window washer. Gives them a spray. Also you can slow down with cruise control
For me its when I see a driver who is driving unexpectedly. Like speeding in areas with kids. Or driving at high speeds anywhere.
roadways are build for a certain speed so we can anticipate oncoming traffic. Like lights are programmed to allow a block of traffic to go then a break so cars turning can complete the turn between the break. if some asshole fucks it up by hammering the gas they will end up in between the blocks making it harder for all the cars to complete their turn since they now have to wait.
Someone said 'reading intention' which is a big part too. I can't read intention of drivers who are selfishly doing what they want.
it's the realization that traffic could be better and safer if it wasn't for certain drivers
In congested cities if you don't enter the intersection when its not completely clear then you'll have to wait ~40 minutes for a chance to go across. Waymo's riders have that as one of the biggest frustrations. Then theres a gridlock behind them.
There's no winning with cars.
Inattention, selfishness, and an inflated belief in driving ability both of self and of other drivers.
People don't pay attention to the vehicles around them or what they're doing. As a reault they often are caught off guard by the maneuvers of other vehicles and this in conjunction with the other two things I mentioned makes them angry because it adds stress to the situation.
People believe their driving is better than it is (especially seasoned drivers). They either expect that everyone should be as good as they are at driving. Or as good as they think they are at driving. And when it turns out that this is not the case (that they are not good at driving or that others are not good at driving) this adds stress to the situation. This is ego.
Selfishness is just that. And it happens with pretty much every driver on the road though they are loathe to admit it. The driving experience as a whole is all about them. Where they're going. What they want. How fast.
they want to go and in what lane. Whether they want to allow someone to merge. Whether they want to allow someone to pass. Whether they want to wait for a light or wait for someone to turn or wait in traffic etc. As a result they often do less than legal things because they feel confident in the fact that what they are doing and where they are going is important and therefore more important than other drivers on the road. They sincerely believe they are more important or that other drivers are less important and they act selfishly and with a sense of entitlement as a result. This also adds stress to the situation. However, of the three this is the main reason people become so unreasonable and angry.
A combination of selfishness, self righteousness/ego, and distracted driving (inattention) causes people to react to perceived, imagined, or actual slights of any kind on the road with malice and anger that is undue or unreasonable given most road situations. And considering that cars are heavy machinery and can do a lot of damage and be deadly to other drivers, people often jump to conclusions about the people they share the road with, especially when they do things like merge with no signal, cut others off, speed unnecessarily, or manuever in a way that seems erratic. Driving is a high stress activity. And that magnifies and exacerbates the problems the other three things I mentioned cause.
i mean a big part of it is just the fact that cars are so inherently bad as a form of transport that 5 of them meeting at an intersection results in people having to stop and wait, which obviously results in frustration because you're constantly blocked with no way of even turning around.
compare this to a bike where you're never really blocked unless you're in a pedestrian area, and even then you can just turn around and leave and pick a different route.
It's easy to get really frustrated with driving when you have to waste so much of your life sitting still in a metal box.
It's a daily prison we all put ourselves in and (in the US) we don't have a choice.
Entitlement and a lack of empathy.
Cars are brain poison and they turn people evil.
I try to keep my zen while driving, and mostly I just suffer from road depression instead of rage. I get road depression because driving forces you to interact with many people, and you begin to realize the high fraction of people with serious mental impairment.
I try to put myself in their shoes, but the most charitable explanations for some driving behaviors are i) distraction - usually from cell phones - and ii) not thinking about the consequences of a behavior on others.
One of my pet peeves is drivers who perpetually drive on the right edge (for right side driving countries) of the lane / in the bike lane. When someone in front of them turns right to leave the road, they do not know how to go around them because the left side of the lane is a no-go zone. That means the whole lane has to stop. When they stop at a red light, no cars can pass them on the right to make a legal turn. They might acknowledge this by pulling forward more, as if that helps. Then when they get to the next intersection, the same thing happens again! Like, HAVE YOU NEVER TURNED RIGHT ON A RED YOURSELF? DO YOU NOT KNOW YOU SHOULD GET AS FAR LEFT AS POSSIBLE IN THE RIGHT LANE WHEN COMING TO A RED LIGHT? HOW DO YOU FUNCTION IN THE WORLD WHILE SO BLISSFULLY UNAWARE?
Oops. Lost my zen.
I'm too British to understand
Just flip left and right. But not the pedals. Brake is still on the left. And don't flip the windshield wiper and turn indicator sticks. Unless in Oz.
Because none of you fuckers can drive a sharp stick up a duck's ass.
Really?
I always think the road ragers are the ones that can’t actually drive. They drive like idiots then lose their shit when called out on it or if they put themselves in a bad situation.
They always seem to think they’re the best drivers on the road though 🤔
I dunno. I lost my shit on someone just today who literally pulled into my lane (coming toward me) to skip the line to turn. Literally just pulled out in front of me from an oncoming lane and kept coming until I stopped and leaned on the horn flashing my lights. There was nowhere for me to go. This type of thing has killed people in the past. Especially in poor visibility. There was literally no reason to do what this person did and I hadn't done anything wrong. There was no where for me to pull off to even avoid the collision if this person kept coming.
Perhaps you're correct about some road ragers, but generally I don't get angry until something gets dangerous for me because someone else is being unreasonable and potentially harmful.
Everyone thinks they're the best driver on the road. That's statistically proven. But generally people who drive more often or are seasoned drivers become complacent over time. Meaning almost no one is as good a driver as they think. Entitlement/ego, and distracted driving also play a big role and I'm way more likely to believe most road rage incidents are actually two egos coming to a head after both people are at fault than just one reckless driver vs someone else who wasn't in any way in the wrong.