[Question] to Linux from Windows as a daily driver

Crabhands@lemmy.ml to Linux@lemmy.ml – 54 points –

My plan is to buy an NVMe today, install linux as a dual boot, but use linux as a daily driver, to see if it meets my needs before committing to it.

My main needs are gaming, local AI (stable diffusion and oobabooga), and browser stuff.

I have experience with Mint (recently) and Ubuntu (long ago). Any problems with my plan? Will my OS choice meet my needs?

Thanks!

68

Thank you to everyone's support. I did not expect as much support as you all provided. I'm happy to announce a huge success! Ubuntu is installed, I've overcome several hurdles, and have a few more to go. I'll try to post in next week to summarize my progress and challenges.

If you use Steam for gaming, then probably most games will work either directly or through a specific Proton version (you can set this in Steam). Games that won't run are most 3rd-party launcher games and games that intentionally use ring 0 spyware.

The biggest problem you'll encounter with mint in particular is that multiple monitor support can be... hit or miss, other than that, gaming on Linux has been very good for a while now and it's only getting better. Unless you are really into valorant or destiny 2, pretty much all of your games on steam, epic games and all other stores should just work

In my opinion in modern computing I'd rather be on a "faster" releasing distro such as Fedora, Arch Linux. Modern hardware depends constant patches to the kernel to keep up with new sleep management changes and improvements to the GPU stack etc.

Currently running Fedora 38 on my Thinkpad and it's wicked fast. Definitely my favorite distro at the moment.

I use debian for gaming and light LLM workloads and it's been serving me quite well. Really like KDE.

Are you using Bookworm? I had trouble getting sddm on it to use system resolution. Normally I would ignore that but I only installed it on a VM so I could record an intro for my stream of Debian booting into the gaming.

I haven't updated my machine yet because I have no experience with wayland or pipewire and Nvidia with gaming. I was also interested if it's pretty decent with games and nvidia yet.

I am. SDDM should work properly out of the box, maybe it's a wierd issue with virtualization?

Wayland is pretty much plug and play if you install xwayland (with the exception of OBS studio which used to be wierd about Wayland surfaces, I think that's fixed now). Pipe wire has been working fine for me.

I use AMD though, so ymmv with Nvidia.

Yes, I thought it might be a weird sddm bug so I installed gdm and configured that too with the same result. Next option is to try a different distribution.

Gaming on Linux is absolutely possible, but you have to have the right mindset for it. Put it in its own category. There are games that work on XBOX, there are games that work on PS4, there are Games that work on Windows, there are games that work on Linux. There is significant overlap between all of these, with many games working on all the platforms. Some games work better on some platforms than they do on others.

If you go at this with the mindset that you are going to play all your favorite Windows games on Linux, you will be as disappointied as if you got a PS5 to play Zelda and Animal Crossing. But if you instead go into it with the mindset "this is a gaming platform with thousands of games I can play on it, I'll play the games that work on this platform" you will find that gaming on Linux is a perfectly adequate gaming platform.

This is the way.

Unfortunately, if you don't already know the answers it's more a question of experience before you'll understand them.

When I started with Ubuntu I couldn't do dualboot, so it was hard. It got better with each update, but my beloved Gnome2 desktop was threatened and Ubuntu went on to Unity - KDE sucked, so I jumped over to Linux Mint with Cinnamon desktop.

Whilst it was great, I had terrible issues getting software - PPA's are often suited to Ubuntu and not Mint... so in the end I tried installing Arch, failed twice, then got a Manjaro (Cinnamon) ISO and tried that for a few days, got some snapshots (rsync to my HDD) and then figured it's not a big deal to install KDE, as it's easy enough to go back.

KDE was so much better by then (about 5 years back) that I'm stuck with Manjaro KDE - having access to the AUR to install stuff is awesome, and flatpaks work at the flick of a settings switch too.

Dual-booting gives you the luxury of (if you wanna play Genshin Impact) having the option to boot into your game OS but also the ability to install games on your Linux OS and decide which one runs best on your hardware.

Everyone has such varied 'needs' that your question is impossible to answer - you must just suck it and see.

For the last two, it will more than enough. Gaming tho, it depends. If you wants emulator, Linux is THE emulator OS. For Windows game tho, if you are planning to play older game, Linux is better than Windows. Period. For newer games, like 'just-release-game', it is not ideal. Free to play multiplayer games, especially outside of Steam/Valve, forget it.

To piggy-back off this, take stock of your current favorite games and do some searching to find out how those have worked out for others. ProtonDB is a great resource for games on Steam. Outside Steam it can often be done, but can be a headache.

I will typically try a game on Linux first, but keep Windows around and will just boot into that if I cant get up and running pretty quick. Don't have time to deal with the tinkering all day haha

Gaming is the only area where things might get tricky at all, every other area will pretty much just be a matter of getting used to different UIs.

Whether or not you find it sufficient for your gaming needs depends mostly on what types of games you play. If you're always playing just the newest AAA titles, you might have some trouble, but there are a whole shitload of great titles that work perfectly on linux, and more are being added/ported every day.

As far as distro goes, I think Mint is a good choice for what you describe, you could also try one of the gaming specific distros, but my understanding is that those are generally overkill unless you're making a gaming box

you should be fine. gaming is dead simple with steam + proton

if you wanna torrent games, it'll be a bit more involved but still doable

the AI stuff should work just fine, you just wanna make sure you go for a distro with good hardware support

Nothing wrong with it. Here's a website to help you choose the distro: https://distrochooser.de/

Personally, for gaming, I'd recomment Mint or Ubuntu. Probably your hardware will be supported. There's also Pop!OS, which seems to be completely gaming related as well as SteamOS, but I've never used them.

You can run a hardware probe from the live USB to see how well the distro handles your hardware too
https://linux-hardware.org/

It just recommended elementary OS to me and that's the next one I was going to try, lol.

I've got Nobara installed and it has shit the bed for whatever reason. Was way too unstable for me as well. Also, support is lacking there. A lot of hostile attitudes in response to any questions I had.

My main needs are gaming

Most gaming needs, you'll have to check protondb to see if you'd be comfortable not being able to play certain games. (games not on steam, you can look to Lutris for community made installers)
While Gold and Silver means games require slight setup (setup is usually explained by user-reports), Platinum means you're good out of the box, Borked means no chance, you especially want to watch out if your game has an Anti-Cheat (and read the latest user-reports on the game if you're truly desperate to see if things changed in the last week, like sometimes something like Gundam Evolution quietly enables the linux option in EasyAntiCheat)
If you have a steamaccount, you can log in to get the list of games that you already own on that account to easily see their ratings

local AI

Guides are straightforward, you just have to worry about whether you have nvidia or amd

browser stuff

no issues

I started almost 2 years ago with PopOS. Today I still use it on my brand new PC too where I play games and do stuff.

Gaming depends on your game choice. It gets better every year, but gaming is always the category that Windows slightly wins on. Everything else is dramatically easier in linux.

Ubuntu (or variants) is always a solid option. Apt is just the best (imo) packaging system, and since Ubuntu is #1 in popularity, you're more likely to get support for issues there than any other linux variant.

I read this earlier and you convinced me to try Ubuntu. Initially not a fan of the way it looked, but customization seems limitless. It's been less than 10 hours, but it's already starting to look like 'mine'. I'm sure that will evolve plenty in time.

Keep in mind that OP never mentioned what kind of geaphics card they have. From what I'm aware, updating Nvidia drivers on Ubuntu is still an awful experience

Maybe I've just been lucky, but I haven't had any bad experiences updating nvidia drivers.

I haven't had Nvidia issues in Ubuntu since the aughts. Optimus OTOH, is even worse on Linux than Windows.

I had to update my drivers a few months ago, and it was awful for me. Granted, I started having issues after a power outage, but just updating the drivers shouldn't have been as hard as it was

I recommend to Install windows on its own drive. I had Windows one time do something to the EFI partition and I wasn’t able to boot linux after. I have heard of people having a separate EFI partitions for linux and windows to avoid this problem.

Sorry what i meant was the NVMe will be used only for Linux. My existing HD with Windows will be untouched. No partitions needed.

When you install a dual boot system, Linux installs a grub loader. This asks you what you want to boot - windows or Linux.

Microsoft doesn't place nicely with grub and I've found many occasions when a windows update mysteriously disabled it, and you can only then boot into windows.

If you only want to test the interface and see if you get in with it, you could create a Linux live usb. It'll be the same but the os speed will take a hit booting from usb, so just be aware.

Been a while since I had the problem, but then been a while since I even wanted to boot windows anyway...

https://itsfoss.com/no-grub-windows-linux/

Be careful when dual booting. I've had to manually rebuild my partition tables way too many times because Windows doesn't like to play nice. That was dual booting from the same disk though so ymmv with a dedicated nvme.

Perhaps look at distros that support gaming put of the box like Nobara or Pop-OS, my personal goto is Manjaro running KDE with Wayland display manager as it feels quite fast and snappy. But being an arch based distro mean you'd have to do a bit of tinkering (Which isn't really that hard tbh) then you can tell people "BTW I use Arch" heh heh

Mint user here, did the switch years ago and never came back. Steam with Proton makes gaming easy, and for games not on Steam, you can look at Lutris (played WoW like that with no problems).

My only experience with AI is tensorflow, but interfacing with Nvidia cards is easier on Linux than Windows, since I ended up needing to use WSL anyway.

The only browser stuff that might get annoying is Pearson exams, if you ever need to do any. They really don't like Linux users.

If you like Linux use Linux and make it your home. But expecting gaming to be as easy as Windows just isn’t going to happen.

i dual boot Ubuntu and Windows 10.

Havent had issues much, even done upgrades of each. Ubuntu updates do sometimes trip out Bitlocker and prompt for a recovery key.

I have the same use case. Ubuntu for most things. Windows for gaming only.

I even do this with an eGPU. Ubuntu does well with it using X11 (not wayland) but requires reboots to connect/disconnect the pcie channels. Windows is better at it but struggles with USB enumerations on occaison.

I installed a dual boot Win/Linux Mint back in 2016, over the next 5 years, I believe I booted Windows twice. The only issue I ever had was some Excel macros from work weren't compatible with LibreOffice Calc. I ended up installing Office using Wine as a workaround. When I upgraded to Mint 21.1, I removed the dual boot. Linux just works. And works. And works.

Dual-boot is the way to go TBH, especially with a NVME drive, even if you land on Linux as your daily driver

Reboot and switching OS if needed for compatibility is only a 30 second or less process.

Yes exactly. I switched BIOS to load ubuntu, and it's working perfectly! I needed to flip back to windows for some info and it was a breeze to reboot between both.

I did a similar thing when starting out with KDE neon, but I found having windows annoying as it would keep breaking Linux's bootloader (grub) randomly because Microsoft is an asshole.

On my laptop, I ended up removing the windows disk altogether, and it's a much nicer experience.

Dual boot might be necessary at first, but if you can just boot Linux and use a windows vm on it, that would probably be a better idea.

Can windows also break grub on gpt or only legacy mbr?

From experience windows only seems to screw grub If they're installed on the same drive, I use seperate drives for windows/Linux and haven't noticed any issues

I used seperate drives, and installed Windows and Linux seperately before connecting them to the same pc, but I still had the problem.

If you want to daily drive linux, I recommend just installing only linux and commit to it for a bit. If you dual boot you may just find that you end up booting into windows and dont go back.

also recommend considering a rolling release distro. idk about Ai stuff but for games, a rolling release is almost always better.

Mint is pretty lightweight so I’d almost argue that you have room to install a heavier distro if your PC is fairly high spec’d.

I've been using Linux as a daily driver for a couple decades. Home and work (before retirement). Unless your work has some fucked up Windows-only requirement, there is no reason Linux won't meet your needs.

Looks good enough for me. Even simply a browser + a single board computer + any "standard" Linux installation can be good enough as is for gaming/"browser stuff" if you don't mind limiting your gaming collection to a handful few of... 200(?) that changes every now and then by your gaming overlords. And yes, I'm talking about XCloud.

I'd suggest Pop!_OS (Ubuntu-based) or Manjaro (Arch-based) as easy-to-pick-up distros with good gaming support out-of-the-box. Mint is nice for beginners as well but I have no idea if you need to tinker to get gaming working well.

I made the permanent switch from Windows four years ago. First to elementary OS but I found it severely lacking for gaming purposes and also for my power user needs. After a year of cursing and banging my head against the wall I switched to Pop!_OS for a couple of years. It was pretty great for everything I needed, including gaming. Except that I had constant problems with updating the proprietary Nvidia drivers to the point I once had to reinstall the entire OS to get my display to show up again. And also a lot of audio problems. It was a huge learning experience though!

I decided to try out Manjaro last summer and have been very happy with it since! I only booted back to Pop twice (just to check and copy some configs) before wiping its drive clean and never looking back. Pretty much everything just seems to work, especially gaming and the Nvidia drivers!

Garuda Linux and then VanillaOS when Orchid is out and you're a little more familiar with the system. :)

depending on your needs try WSL2 instead of dual booting. I've been linux or macos for quite a while in daily work as a programmer and kinda dig on WSL2 in Windows, particularly Win11 with the improved terminal. add Docker in the mix and there's nothing you can't do in that kind of environment that you'd be looking to do in a dedicated Linux boot...again dependin on what youre doing i guess.

Largely yes, but I have found WSL2 can kinda trip over itself a little bit when it tries to do serial stuff, sometimes.

USB device access and whatnot kind of works, but it can be a bit sketch.

Can’t have WSL without Windows Pro.

Would rather avoid spending $100 just to enable virtual machines.

WSL is available on Windows Home.
You're thinking about HyperV, not the "Virtual Machine Platform", the former require Pro+, and the latter is available on all (needs to be enabled), and is what enabled WSL, Docker, VirtualBox in HyperV.

Bad naming IMO and misused by many vendors.

You wont know for sure until you try. the main sticking point for gaming on linux is anti-cheat, so if you play a lot of games with that then you may run into some trouble. otherwise ProtonDB is your friend. Most games these days are pretty easy to get up and running.

A lot of AI tools are developed on linux anyway so you shouldn't encounter too many problems there.

Browsers are no problem at all. I recommend Firefox

the main sticking point for gaming on linux is anti-cheat

This really needs to be emphasised, #1 reason for proton to not work is this. Depending on the games OP wants to run, there will be issues.

libreoffice is also a good browser and you can brag that you have a light blue browser icon that no one else has

I think Jumuta is referring to LibreWolf, a fork of Firefox with some hardening pre-applied. I use it on machines on which I don't want to spend time configuring my browser.

...well except for chromium which has a blue icon which some may consider light blue