Why does patreon even need to be an app? What value does the app bring that the website can't deliver?
There are a lot of people out there that will not use a website and only use an app for things. I'm willing to bet there's some users of patreon on ios that don't even know there is a website.
lots of people caught mobile brain rot
Ah, damn.
Is it? A native mobile application (not a web view/PWA) will always be massively better as a user experience than anything a website can provide.
People who use apps do so because they've learned from experience that an app is far better UX than the website version, and they're not always right, but they're not wrong most of the time.
If anything, web apps are the real modernity brainrot.
It goes even beyond that.
With a dedicated app, you go into the store and install it and then you have it in your apps that you then can place everywhere.
With a website, you need to have the browser, navigate to that website each time. And yes, you could put a link to that website on your home screen as well but not many user are probably aware of that being an option.
I know that but I still would prefer a dedicated app because it is easier to manage and use more features of my phone. For example, I just tried it on my android phone and the link to a website always opened a new tab in my Firefox.
Then I can manage the notifications of that app depending on what I want it to notify me about.
I can't do that specifically for a single app or website in a browser.
On the other hand, I also wouldn't want to miss a website because I am not always on my phone and, in some cases, it is way more annoying to do something over the phone because I am just not used to it (like writing this comment). Doing that over a website version that I can access on my PC is much easier and convenient.
OnlyFans doesn't have an app but they're still in business. We must educate people about not relying on apps for everything.
It doesn't have an app because it can't, not because it wouldn't benefit from it.
I would argue Patreon cannot have an app on the App Store as it would cause them to mess up their (and the users') business models... 30% is huge !!! I am baffled by why they would bend to Apple instead of upgrading their website.
definitely. i know so many people from my school who’s iphone home screen is just… pages full of apps. we’re talking 40+ apps on average. they always say it’s weird how i use a website for almost everything, and then
they complain about their storage space :/
I tend to use whatever has the best user experience. I don't use a browser for lemmy as an example.
I use lemmy on browser because lemmy apps seem too confusing to me lol
Notifications of new content are nice.
There's this ancient standard called email
There's also web push. You can send push notifications straight to someone's browser, no need for a dedicated app anymore. Not sure if patreon has implemented this, but they could if they wanted to.
RSS is better suited for this.
Email 🤮
Bad enough I have to use that shit at work, I'm not using it unless I absolutely have to.
EDIT: holy shit I didn't expect this to get downvotes. What's the reason?
As if anyone doesn't immediately unsubscribe from email notifications or totally ignore them.
Then why do they want app notifications ? It's even worse than email, all those red squares with numbers and sounds drive me insane, and i can not keep a particular piece of content with me for later re-reading (like i can archive an email). If people just unsubscribe from emails they do not want to receive, and spam those that keep invading, the mail box will be functional in no time, and people can also just create a 2nd email and download a 2nd email app for hobbys and news (several have a gmail and a hotmail at least).
You'd have to ask them. In my opinion, app notifications are ephemeral. I can dismiss them and I don't care. While emails should be important. I don't want to soft through a bunch of useless junk when I'm looking for important stuff like bank statements or whatever.
you can just create different emails for different uses bro. I keep a official email for important stuff, and several emails for newsletters and others (which i don't care to look through, its just a magazine).
While that's true, and not a bad idea, I'm not gonna check an email for notifications on who replied to posts and stuff like that.
Huh? That's not what I was talking about. Email at work is hell, no notifications, no accounts could ever kill more souls than CCing.
Does this mean Patreon too will have two tiers of billing system: standard billing via the Web and slightly higher prices if done in app. I think if one purchases a YouTube Premium membership in app on iOS, it costs more than when done via the site.
Yes, that's exactly what they're doing. If you have a Patreon, you must choose between increasing patreon price on Apple specifically compared to Android and Web, or you can keep the price the same, in which case you will earn less from users using iOS in-app purchase
Unfortunately, I think you hit the nail on the head. Apple knows this too. Also, unfortunate for those Apple-sheep 🙄
Background play of exclusive podcasts for one thing. I suppose that might be possible in a browser but playing media from a media player app instead of a browser is certainly going to be a better experience.
Just offer file downloads. I swear the society is regressing technologically speaking (not aiming at you OP)
Every podcast I support on Patreon provides a link that you can plug into your podcatcher to subscribe. I don’t need the Patreon app to listen to the podcast then, just Pocket Casts or whatever I’m using for all my podcasts.
Even the video links are YouTube links.
I don’t doubt that the app makes life easier in some ways, but the website works just fine.
The main shows definitely that is the case for me as well - but there are also Patreon exclusive audio releases that don't go out on the rss feed for Morning, Somewhere for instance. I also follow shows with exclusive video releases on Patreon that don't ever go to YouTube and I still get the benefit of a dedicated media app with background play.
They should just take the route BandCamp takes and tell you to go to the website to make purchases
For some reason, some developers get away with it... But that practice is specifically prohibited by Apple. Maybe the exception is for app developers that had a pre-existing deal before the rule went into effect or something, but directing users out of the app and into a web browser will get your app update denied. If Patreon were in a position to make that deal, they probably wouldn't be catching hell like this from Apple in the first place.
PWA should be the way. As long as the website is mobile responsive, PWA should be preferred in cases like this.
It's because they are unable to develop a website that isn't crap.
They lost it in the EU, but did it change for the rest of the world? Can't really read from the article what region they are talking about.
They'll hinge their position on the least good faith interpretation of EU's anticompetitive lawsuits, and why wouldn't they, they make more money in between these lawsuits than they pay EU for breaking the rules.
Grats to Patreon and/or the EU for the easy payday🎉
Hold up (fta):
By this November, all creators can only offer a subscription-based plan on iOS as the app store doesn't support other formats, such as first-of-the-month or per-creation plans. As a result, Patreon is rolling out a 16-month-long migration process that will shift all memberships to subscriptions by November 2025. At that point, subscription-based plans will be the only option available, unfortunately proving Apple's far-reaching power.
I'm unclear on what this means: is Patreon eliminating first-of-the-month and per-creation plans on ALL platforms? Or just on Apple platforms?
THIS is why we hate Apple. Their bullshit affects EVERYONE. There is no "don't like it don't use it" with these people.
Seems like it's a backend change and they're removing per creation entirely. Got an email from one of the creators I follow about getting suggestions on how to restructure their tiers for the new system. My guess is it would be tricky to setup a way to have creators do android/web tiers and apple tiers, not to mention confusing. And of course they can't just pull a Spotify and have a pop-up that says 'sorry you must use the web to subscribe' on iPhones.
Because using a web browser is soo 1994
They removed this feature from web browsers too. Not just the app.
Hmm. Maybe they were finding it hard to manage and just found the perfect excuse.
Maybe they are planning on starting subscription scams like other companies.
Who knows. I just know to stay away from automated payments.
Easy solution: the app only redirects you to the website via browser intent.
That is no good with Apple policy.
App cannot tell user that they get better deal anywhere.
So wait, Apple effectively mandates that users of their store lie to their users? Wonder if that's something that can be tackled legally.
From my understanding, thats also very much not allowed on the app store, and is something they check for.
Get this, they don't allow that either. There are multiple clips from LTT talking about dumb things like this that Apple doesn't allow
Apple needs to be regulated
Apple needs to perish
Why don't they just do what Kindle does? Say that you can no longer subscribe from the application and to subscribe from the site?
Apple has explicit rules against redirecting customers to other sites for payment. I think they have a special deal with Amazon for that wording.
Fuck Apple. They deserve 0%.
Why does patreon even need to be an app? What value does the app bring that the website can't deliver?
There are a lot of people out there that will not use a website and only use an app for things. I'm willing to bet there's some users of patreon on ios that don't even know there is a website.
lots of people caught mobile brain rot
Ah, damn.
Is it? A native mobile application (not a web view/PWA) will always be massively better as a user experience than anything a website can provide.
People who use apps do so because they've learned from experience that an app is far better UX than the website version, and they're not always right, but they're not wrong most of the time.
If anything, web apps are the real modernity brainrot.
It goes even beyond that.
With a dedicated app, you go into the store and install it and then you have it in your apps that you then can place everywhere.
With a website, you need to have the browser, navigate to that website each time. And yes, you could put a link to that website on your home screen as well but not many user are probably aware of that being an option.
I know that but I still would prefer a dedicated app because it is easier to manage and use more features of my phone. For example, I just tried it on my android phone and the link to a website always opened a new tab in my Firefox.
Then I can manage the notifications of that app depending on what I want it to notify me about.
I can't do that specifically for a single app or website in a browser.
On the other hand, I also wouldn't want to miss a website because I am not always on my phone and, in some cases, it is way more annoying to do something over the phone because I am just not used to it (like writing this comment). Doing that over a website version that I can access on my PC is much easier and convenient.
OnlyFans doesn't have an app but they're still in business. We must educate people about not relying on apps for everything.
It doesn't have an app because it can't, not because it wouldn't benefit from it.
I would argue Patreon cannot have an app on the App Store as it would cause them to mess up their (and the users') business models... 30% is huge !!! I am baffled by why they would bend to Apple instead of upgrading their website.
definitely. i know so many people from my school who’s iphone home screen is just… pages full of apps. we’re talking 40+ apps on average. they always say it’s weird how i use a website for almost everything, and then they complain about their storage space :/
I tend to use whatever has the best user experience. I don't use a browser for lemmy as an example.
I use lemmy on browser because lemmy apps seem too confusing to me lol
Notifications of new content are nice.
There's this ancient standard called email
There's also web push. You can send push notifications straight to someone's browser, no need for a dedicated app anymore. Not sure if patreon has implemented this, but they could if they wanted to.
RSS is better suited for this.
Email 🤮
Bad enough I have to use that shit at work, I'm not using it unless I absolutely have to.
EDIT: holy shit I didn't expect this to get downvotes. What's the reason?
As if anyone doesn't immediately unsubscribe from email notifications or totally ignore them.
Then why do they want app notifications ? It's even worse than email, all those red squares with numbers and sounds drive me insane, and i can not keep a particular piece of content with me for later re-reading (like i can archive an email). If people just unsubscribe from emails they do not want to receive, and spam those that keep invading, the mail box will be functional in no time, and people can also just create a 2nd email and download a 2nd email app for hobbys and news (several have a gmail and a hotmail at least).
You'd have to ask them. In my opinion, app notifications are ephemeral. I can dismiss them and I don't care. While emails should be important. I don't want to soft through a bunch of useless junk when I'm looking for important stuff like bank statements or whatever.
you can just create different emails for different uses bro. I keep a official email for important stuff, and several emails for newsletters and others (which i don't care to look through, its just a magazine).
While that's true, and not a bad idea, I'm not gonna check an email for notifications on who replied to posts and stuff like that.
Huh? That's not what I was talking about. Email at work is hell, no notifications, no accounts could ever kill more souls than CCing.
Does this mean Patreon too will have two tiers of billing system: standard billing via the Web and slightly higher prices if done in app. I think if one purchases a YouTube Premium membership in app on iOS, it costs more than when done via the site.
Yes, that's exactly what they're doing. If you have a Patreon, you must choose between increasing patreon price on Apple specifically compared to Android and Web, or you can keep the price the same, in which case you will earn less from users using iOS in-app purchase
Unfortunately, I think you hit the nail on the head. Apple knows this too. Also, unfortunate for those Apple-sheep 🙄
Background play of exclusive podcasts for one thing. I suppose that might be possible in a browser but playing media from a media player app instead of a browser is certainly going to be a better experience.
Just offer file downloads. I swear the society is regressing technologically speaking (not aiming at you OP)
Every podcast I support on Patreon provides a link that you can plug into your podcatcher to subscribe. I don’t need the Patreon app to listen to the podcast then, just Pocket Casts or whatever I’m using for all my podcasts.
Even the video links are YouTube links.
I don’t doubt that the app makes life easier in some ways, but the website works just fine.
The main shows definitely that is the case for me as well - but there are also Patreon exclusive audio releases that don't go out on the rss feed for Morning, Somewhere for instance. I also follow shows with exclusive video releases on Patreon that don't ever go to YouTube and I still get the benefit of a dedicated media app with background play.
They should just take the route BandCamp takes and tell you to go to the website to make purchases
For some reason, some developers get away with it... But that practice is specifically prohibited by Apple. Maybe the exception is for app developers that had a pre-existing deal before the rule went into effect or something, but directing users out of the app and into a web browser will get your app update denied. If Patreon were in a position to make that deal, they probably wouldn't be catching hell like this from Apple in the first place.
PWA should be the way. As long as the website is mobile responsive, PWA should be preferred in cases like this.
It's because they are unable to develop a website that isn't crap.
A functional user experience?
EU to the rescue?
I thought Apple lost this war already?
A few times. But the old man don't seem to learn.
They lost it in the EU, but did it change for the rest of the world? Can't really read from the article what region they are talking about.
They'll hinge their position on the least good faith interpretation of EU's anticompetitive lawsuits, and why wouldn't they, they make more money in between these lawsuits than they pay EU for breaking the rules.
Grats to Patreon and/or the EU for the easy payday🎉
Hold up (fta):
I'm unclear on what this means: is Patreon eliminating first-of-the-month and per-creation plans on ALL platforms? Or just on Apple platforms?
THIS is why we hate Apple. Their bullshit affects EVERYONE. There is no "don't like it don't use it" with these people.
Seems like it's a backend change and they're removing per creation entirely. Got an email from one of the creators I follow about getting suggestions on how to restructure their tiers for the new system. My guess is it would be tricky to setup a way to have creators do android/web tiers and apple tiers, not to mention confusing. And of course they can't just pull a Spotify and have a pop-up that says 'sorry you must use the web to subscribe' on iPhones.
Because using a web browser is soo 1994
They removed this feature from web browsers too. Not just the app.
Hmm. Maybe they were finding it hard to manage and just found the perfect excuse.
Maybe they are planning on starting subscription scams like other companies.
Who knows. I just know to stay away from automated payments.
Easy solution: the app only redirects you to the website via browser intent.
That is no good with Apple policy.
App cannot tell user that they get better deal anywhere.
So wait, Apple effectively mandates that users of their store lie to their users? Wonder if that's something that can be tackled legally.
From my understanding, thats also very much not allowed on the app store, and is something they check for.
Get this, they don't allow that either. There are multiple clips from LTT talking about dumb things like this that Apple doesn't allow
Apple needs to be regulated
Apple needs to perish
Why don't they just do what Kindle does? Say that you can no longer subscribe from the application and to subscribe from the site?
Apple has explicit rules against redirecting customers to other sites for payment. I think they have a special deal with Amazon for that wording.
stop using apple products people
Glad I only use the website