And it fucking blows now. You don't get shit but ads.
They’re somehow WORSE than duckduckgo nowadays like how? You were the search leader, people used DDG for privacy reasons but they passed you??? Did you forget why you’re a company? It’s because you were the best fucking search engine ever and you decided to sell that title for ads or some shit. Incredible how Google fell off the fucking side of a mountain they themselves built!
Yes, but have you considered, line must go up?
For me it went from "great" to "usable" over the course of a decade or so, and then from "usable" to "worthless" over the course of six months. It's a remarkably awful trajectory.
And DuckDuckGo lacks basic stuff such as keyword exclusion. (It's my main search engine for the last few years after Startpage got bought, but lacking keyword exclusion sucks!)
you can -something , but it isn't full exclusion. It's generally been good enough for me. I agree the full fat version would be nice.
So far I haven't had any luck with -something "soft" exclusions either.
Yea I bailed after they nerfed exclusions and whatnot but not like the others are slam dunks
Is ddg actually good now? I remember it feeling nearly useless waay back when it was first hitting the scene. Might have to give it a shot again
I'm not a power user, but I've used DDG exclusively for a while now and I often forget that I'm using it. I'd say it's a pretty seamless transition nowadays.
You actually get the results you are looking for without the sponsored links. Sometimes you end up searching for reddit results but that's every search engine.
Not kagi. I haven’t specified Reddit once since switching to kagi. It really is that much better than DDG and Google.
I only use Google if DDG can't find what I'm looking for. Usually Google doesn't either if DDG can't so lately I've been giving up after the DDG results. I can't stand Google anymore. The first page of results is just ads and the next page is all irrelevant nonsense.
It's pretty wild how Google search has degraded. The push for SEO has really ruined useful results.
Kagi is even better than DDG. Google is absolutely horrendous.
It’s interesting, but $120 a year is just too much for me.
The lowest plan is only $54 a year and it’s most definitely worth it for the results.
300 searches a month is just way too little for my usage
When you use 1/10th the searches because you get it all in the very first query your usage goes wayyyy down. even then, you aren't limited to 300 searches. you can go over, you just pay per search. and even with that if you can't do that then just default to DDG then. I found DDG to be terrible, not at all better than Bing by itself, so Kagi was something I tried and immediately fell in love with. It just works. And I don't have to worry about any of my data going anywhere at all, to any advertisers for anything, or for tracking, etc.
I've done 418 searches today and it's still noon. That's ~1254 a month. Even if my searches went down by 90% I'd still be 4.18 times over.
... Kagi was something I tried and immediately fell in love with. It just works.
Does it also work with very specific technical searches? Could it for example search for the behavior of atol when it encounters an alphabetical character? Neither Google, Bing nor DuckDuckGo provide me with an answer. Google doesn't even show cppreference in the top 5.
Sorry I’m having trouble understanding what you’re asking for. You’ve done 418 searches in a single day? That would be 12958 a month so I’m not sure I’m reading your comment correctly.
Does it also work with very specific technical searches?
That’s pretty much exactly what I use it for.
Could it for example search for the behavior of when it encounters an alphabetical character?
I’m not sure what you’re asking here.
My comment wasn’t that clear. 1254 is with a 90% reduction and the example question about atol’s behavior was just an example. I looked it up earlier that day but was unable to find it using Google.
atol is a C/C++ function that takes in a char pointer and returns a long. I was trying to figure out if it would gracefully stop when it encountered non-numeric characters, if it would skip them or if it would cause undefined behavior.
Yeah it's so bad, the auto predictions dont even make sense any more.
the auto predictions always give me more words than i need, so i have to type normally, like it wasn't there, or select, hope it doesn't load, and delete the extra words
And when i go to click on an auto prediction it changes it at the last damn second too. That drives me mad
This is my beef with basically all modern interfaces. Stuff changes and moves with just enough of a delay to cause me to miss click. Autocomplete changing recommendations on phones, UI elements shifting on web pages, etc.
I thought i was getting old. I mean, i am, but this just enough delay miss-clicks make me feel even older
This has been something so frustrating that nobody seems to talk about. They really need to provide autofill that only adds the one next word, rather than two or three. Because otherwise, the autofill becomes useless.
And they want to force us to whitelist youtube from adblockers.
I dunno on one side we have Google trying to wreck the entire internet and have their ads in your face 95 percent of the time.
On the other side is Microsoft who won't leave you the hell alone when pushing they're shit tiers programs and steal defaults on a weekly basis.
To me the only solution is ruling both companies monopolys and fining them to hell and breaking them up. Both are out of control and ruining computing and the Internet.
Google could be broken up into
search
chrome / gsuite
YouTube
gcloud
ads
android.
And I'm sure more
MS
windows / office
azure
xbox
bing
..I'm too tired to keep going lol
If those had to all survive independently and couldn't leech off profits of the parent organization we could have true competition. Instead you just need one super-profitable arm of a company than loss-lead your way into other verticals and out-compete everyone else because you don't have to turn a profit, at least while the competition is still clinging on.
Ads are a core component of how search makes money. They're also a core component of how YouTube makes money.
Ads are what Google makes money with. That's their core business. I would argue most of what they offer is just a different way of either delivering you ads or farming your data for...ads.
A lot of those are still too big - Google ads basically just compete with facebooks. The two control the marketplace between ad buyers and sellers - too much power
YouTube itself is far too powerful too - it's one of the biggest platforms on top of the default video hosting service, giving them far too much control via the algorithm
Microsoft's Xbox isn't a big deal, but the sheer number of publishers again gives them control over a marketplace
What we need is to force them to rent out the network at cost, the way we do with cell phone providers. Force them to host buy/sell offers at cost, and serve ads with a limited amount of profit
Plus, they're too big even then - companies with that much money or control over discourse are a threat to democracy, full stop
It's a very messy situation we find ourselves in, but it's only going to get worse the longer we let it fester
Xbox specifically could be broken up into studios, publishers, and consoles.
They would probably have gsuite and gcloud be one but yes.
And in the meantime, become a farmer! /s
(you'd still have John Deere problems...)
They should have invested in their potential, their search engines. It's getting shittier almost daily.
Makes you wonder if they just stopped paying they'd have 23 billion more and I wonder what they'd lose in market share. If it is less than 23 bil it makes sense to just not pay.
Good question, but I guess it's all speculative anyways
Bing seems a lot worse now than before the pandemic as well
It's become easier than ever to spam out websites and spam content. It's a plague on the web and I'm not sure what the cure is.
*To stifle competition
FTFY
Relying on people's apathy is a business model with eras of success. Most people have never changed a setting other than dark mode, and even then that's probably your average superuser.
you are actually onto something. When Neeva went under, they were a paid search engine, they made a post explain why. The hardest part was getting people to pay a monthly sub, but getting them to change the settings
This validates my stubborn commitment to DuckDuckGo, ty
Which defaults to Bing, to whom ddg sends all your queries. I use ddg.
Crazy that it's cheaper to do that than it is to build a product that can find recipe blogs that aren't also novels.
I happily pay $10 a month for Kagi and it’s freaking great.
I’m never going back to Google.
This feels like google when google was new. I’ve been using the summarizer more and reading the articles I send it to understand how it works. It definitely has its use cases
You pay for a search engine? You have a subscription to a search engine? I'm I understanding that right?
It is a search engine right? My brain is struggling with this.
Is there something about search engines, as opposed to other online services, that makes you expect them to be free?
I suppose there is. At least that is the bias I hold.
Personally i find $10 a month to be too expensive, but don't we all pay for search engines in a way? With Google you don't pay directly but with your information and by getting influenced in your behaviour (e.g. to buy something from someone who in return pays google for advertisement).
Quite true
Kagi gang nyaaa 💕
same
I wish Kagi considers regional pricing.
Hopefully the antitrust trial will end up telling Google they cannot pay anybody for preference of their browser. That would be the best outcome.
The MO of current "market leaders" is not to compete but gatekeep.
I'd gladly switch back to Google if they paid me a million dollars.
how is that not anti-competitive behaviour?
Antitrust was just a nice idea. It's kinda dead. Will remain dead unless we can purge corruption from politics. For some reason, most politicians seem averse to this idea.
Luckily the party driven and heavily influential political roles are filled with diverse representatives from every walk of life and aren't largely built around the same support circles and ideals that have already been entrenched for generations. With millions of citizens, its normal for the same handful of families to remain in power, with the exception of some rich celebrities who can win the popularity polls.
Everything is fine.
As long as the rich can get more money. That's what is most important.
You forgot to put “for some reason” in italics for extra sarcasm
It isn't the default search engine on my browser. I'm using Kagi at the moment.
What the hell is a kagi
Paid, ad-free, privacy focused search engine
SearxNG for me
When you installed the browser and typed something other than a web address in the big white bar on the top, where did it go?
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Even if it’s easy to switch browsers or platforms or search engines, the one that appears when you turn it on matters a lot.
Google obviously agrees and has paid a staggering amount to make sure it is the default: testimony in the trial revealed that Google spent a total of $26.3 billion in 2021 to be the default search engine in multiple browsers, phones, and platforms.
It was made public after a debate earlier in the week between the two sides and Judge Amit Mehta over whether the figure should be redacted.
(Apple’s outsize percentage of the total is why that particular deal has been such a focus of the first weeks of the trial.)
Until now, these numbers have been closely held secrets, leaving competitors and analysts to speculate about exactly what it’s worth to Google to be the near-universal default choice.
He also said that he sees Yelp and Amazon as competitors and that, in such a hot market, Google has to do everything it can to stay relevant and compete.
The original article contains 519 words, the summary contains 174 words. Saved 66%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Approximately 16% of their revenue or 29% of their profit. I'd take that tradeoff any day.
Awesome. Google is my favourite search engine for privacy 🥰😍😌
And it fucking blows now. You don't get shit but ads.
They’re somehow WORSE than duckduckgo nowadays like how? You were the search leader, people used DDG for privacy reasons but they passed you??? Did you forget why you’re a company? It’s because you were the best fucking search engine ever and you decided to sell that title for ads or some shit. Incredible how Google fell off the fucking side of a mountain they themselves built!
Yes, but have you considered, line must go up?
For me it went from "great" to "usable" over the course of a decade or so, and then from "usable" to "worthless" over the course of six months. It's a remarkably awful trajectory.
And DuckDuckGo lacks basic stuff such as keyword exclusion. (It's my main search engine for the last few years after Startpage got bought, but lacking keyword exclusion sucks!)
you can -something , but it isn't full exclusion. It's generally been good enough for me. I agree the full fat version would be nice.
So far I haven't had any luck with -something "soft" exclusions either.
Yea I bailed after they nerfed exclusions and whatnot but not like the others are slam dunks
Is ddg actually good now? I remember it feeling nearly useless waay back when it was first hitting the scene. Might have to give it a shot again
I'm not a power user, but I've used DDG exclusively for a while now and I often forget that I'm using it. I'd say it's a pretty seamless transition nowadays.
You actually get the results you are looking for without the sponsored links. Sometimes you end up searching for reddit results but that's every search engine.
Not kagi. I haven’t specified Reddit once since switching to kagi. It really is that much better than DDG and Google.
I only use Google if DDG can't find what I'm looking for. Usually Google doesn't either if DDG can't so lately I've been giving up after the DDG results. I can't stand Google anymore. The first page of results is just ads and the next page is all irrelevant nonsense.
It's pretty wild how Google search has degraded. The push for SEO has really ruined useful results.
Kagi is even better than DDG. Google is absolutely horrendous.
It’s interesting, but $120 a year is just too much for me.
The lowest plan is only $54 a year and it’s most definitely worth it for the results.
300 searches a month is just way too little for my usage
When you use 1/10th the searches because you get it all in the very first query your usage goes wayyyy down. even then, you aren't limited to 300 searches. you can go over, you just pay per search. and even with that if you can't do that then just default to DDG then. I found DDG to be terrible, not at all better than Bing by itself, so Kagi was something I tried and immediately fell in love with. It just works. And I don't have to worry about any of my data going anywhere at all, to any advertisers for anything, or for tracking, etc.
I've done 418 searches today and it's still noon. That's ~1254 a month. Even if my searches went down by 90% I'd still be 4.18 times over.
Does it also work with very specific technical searches? Could it for example search for the behavior of
atolwhen it encounters an alphabetical character? Neither Google, Bing nor DuckDuckGo provide me with an answer. Google doesn't even show cppreference in the top 5.Sorry I’m having trouble understanding what you’re asking for. You’ve done 418 searches in a single day? That would be 12958 a month so I’m not sure I’m reading your comment correctly.
That’s pretty much exactly what I use it for.
I’m not sure what you’re asking here.
My comment wasn’t that clear. 1254 is with a 90% reduction and the example question about
atol’s behavior was just an example. I looked it up earlier that day but was unable to find it using Google.atolis a C/C++ function that takes in a char pointer and returns a long. I was trying to figure out if it would gracefully stop when it encountered non-numeric characters, if it would skip them or if it would cause undefined behavior.Yeah it's so bad, the auto predictions dont even make sense any more.
the auto predictions always give me more words than i need, so i have to type normally, like it wasn't there, or select, hope it doesn't load, and delete the extra words
And when i go to click on an auto prediction it changes it at the last damn second too. That drives me mad
This is my beef with basically all modern interfaces. Stuff changes and moves with just enough of a delay to cause me to miss click. Autocomplete changing recommendations on phones, UI elements shifting on web pages, etc.
I thought i was getting old. I mean, i am, but this just enough delay miss-clicks make me feel even older
This has been something so frustrating that nobody seems to talk about. They really need to provide autofill that only adds the one next word, rather than two or three. Because otherwise, the autofill becomes useless.
Google doesn't work anymore.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
Google doesn't work anymore.
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
And they want to force us to whitelist youtube from adblockers.
I dunno on one side we have Google trying to wreck the entire internet and have their ads in your face 95 percent of the time.
On the other side is Microsoft who won't leave you the hell alone when pushing they're shit tiers programs and steal defaults on a weekly basis.
To me the only solution is ruling both companies monopolys and fining them to hell and breaking them up. Both are out of control and ruining computing and the Internet.
Google could be broken up into
MS
..I'm too tired to keep going lol
If those had to all survive independently and couldn't leech off profits of the parent organization we could have true competition. Instead you just need one super-profitable arm of a company than loss-lead your way into other verticals and out-compete everyone else because you don't have to turn a profit, at least while the competition is still clinging on.
Ads are a core component of how search makes money. They're also a core component of how YouTube makes money.
Ads are what Google makes money with. That's their core business. I would argue most of what they offer is just a different way of either delivering you ads or farming your data for...ads.
A lot of those are still too big - Google ads basically just compete with facebooks. The two control the marketplace between ad buyers and sellers - too much power
YouTube itself is far too powerful too - it's one of the biggest platforms on top of the default video hosting service, giving them far too much control via the algorithm
Microsoft's Xbox isn't a big deal, but the sheer number of publishers again gives them control over a marketplace
What we need is to force them to rent out the network at cost, the way we do with cell phone providers. Force them to host buy/sell offers at cost, and serve ads with a limited amount of profit
Plus, they're too big even then - companies with that much money or control over discourse are a threat to democracy, full stop
It's a very messy situation we find ourselves in, but it's only going to get worse the longer we let it fester
Xbox specifically could be broken up into studios, publishers, and consoles.
They would probably have gsuite and gcloud be one but yes.
And in the meantime, become a farmer! /s (you'd still have John Deere problems...)
They should have invested in their potential, their search engines. It's getting shittier almost daily.
Makes you wonder if they just stopped paying they'd have 23 billion more and I wonder what they'd lose in market share. If it is less than 23 bil it makes sense to just not pay.
Good question, but I guess it's all speculative anyways
Bing seems a lot worse now than before the pandemic as well
It's become easier than ever to spam out websites and spam content. It's a plague on the web and I'm not sure what the cure is.
*To stifle competition FTFY
Relying on people's apathy is a business model with eras of success. Most people have never changed a setting other than dark mode, and even then that's probably your average superuser.
you are actually onto something. When Neeva went under, they were a paid search engine, they made a post explain why. The hardest part was getting people to pay a monthly sub, but getting them to change the settings
This validates my stubborn commitment to DuckDuckGo, ty
Which defaults to Bing, to whom ddg sends all your queries. I use ddg.
Crazy that it's cheaper to do that than it is to build a product that can find recipe blogs that aren't also novels.
I happily pay $10 a month for Kagi and it’s freaking great.
I’m never going back to Google.
This feels like google when google was new. I’ve been using the summarizer more and reading the articles I send it to understand how it works. It definitely has its use cases
You pay for a search engine? You have a subscription to a search engine? I'm I understanding that right?
It is a search engine right? My brain is struggling with this.
Is there something about search engines, as opposed to other online services, that makes you expect them to be free?
I suppose there is. At least that is the bias I hold.
Personally i find $10 a month to be too expensive, but don't we all pay for search engines in a way? With Google you don't pay directly but with your information and by getting influenced in your behaviour (e.g. to buy something from someone who in return pays google for advertisement).
Quite true
Kagi gang nyaaa 💕
same
I wish Kagi considers regional pricing.
Hopefully the antitrust trial will end up telling Google they cannot pay anybody for preference of their browser. That would be the best outcome.
The MO of current "market leaders" is not to compete but gatekeep.
I'd gladly switch back to Google if they paid me a million dollars.
how is that not anti-competitive behaviour?
Antitrust was just a nice idea. It's kinda dead. Will remain dead unless we can purge corruption from politics. For some reason, most politicians seem averse to this idea.
Luckily the party driven and heavily influential political roles are filled with diverse representatives from every walk of life and aren't largely built around the same support circles and ideals that have already been entrenched for generations. With millions of citizens, its normal for the same handful of families to remain in power, with the exception of some rich celebrities who can win the popularity polls.
Everything is fine.
As long as the rich can get more money. That's what is most important.
You forgot to put “for some reason” in italics for extra sarcasm
It isn't the default search engine on my browser. I'm using Kagi at the moment.
What the hell is a kagi
Paid, ad-free, privacy focused search engine
SearxNG for me
When you installed the browser and typed something other than a web address in the big white bar on the top, where did it go?
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Even if it’s easy to switch browsers or platforms or search engines, the one that appears when you turn it on matters a lot.
Google obviously agrees and has paid a staggering amount to make sure it is the default: testimony in the trial revealed that Google spent a total of $26.3 billion in 2021 to be the default search engine in multiple browsers, phones, and platforms.
It was made public after a debate earlier in the week between the two sides and Judge Amit Mehta over whether the figure should be redacted.
(Apple’s outsize percentage of the total is why that particular deal has been such a focus of the first weeks of the trial.)
Until now, these numbers have been closely held secrets, leaving competitors and analysts to speculate about exactly what it’s worth to Google to be the near-universal default choice.
He also said that he sees Yelp and Amazon as competitors and that, in such a hot market, Google has to do everything it can to stay relevant and compete.
The original article contains 519 words, the summary contains 174 words. Saved 66%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Approximately 16% of their revenue or 29% of their profit. I'd take that tradeoff any day.
Awesome. Google is my favourite search engine for privacy 🥰😍😌