Trump's Plans If He Returns To The White House Include Deportation Raids, Tariffs And Mass Firings
huffpost.com
So it looks like Trump has read the fascist playbook or something. I'm not surprised. I am concerned.
Edit: After thinking about it, I guess I am surprised that he can read.
And nearly half of the voters in the US think, “yeah that’s who I want leading my country.” This includes half of my extended family (the math at least checks out).
I will never understand the sheer lack of independent and critical thinking in the US. I get that the underfunded education system, the complete takeover of editorial news outlets which have never put forth actual news, and the inability for most people to shut up long enough to listen to reason, are just a very small number of examples of why America is in the state that it is; but at the end of the day, can’t people at least see evil when it’s speaking evil things to them? Is this what they truly want — a dictator who has used them, who doesn’t represent them at all, and who will do everything possible to rip apart the bonds of democracy?
Why are people so easily brainwashed?
Lack of education. If your people had learned about Hitler in school (how he came to power and not just how the glorious allies under AMERICAN leadership won the war), they would have recognized the playbook of the Republicans and Trump especially long ago.
This isn't it. I was raised conservative in a red state. People are aware of the Nazis, they can explain how to use critical thinking and why critical thinking is important, and they even have awareness that racism and oppression by wealthy elites of politically powerless poor folk is a problem. How can they reach conclusions that disregard everything I just mentioned? The same way that many lawyers and professors become right-wing despite their education and fact-finding skills.
They have faith that the ideas they have based their worldview on are correct and work backwards from that conclusion. Whatever their motivation for uncritical belief of some fundamental premise doesn't matter because their whole ego and sense of self is tied up with those concepts being true. They don't have political conversations, just opportunities to re-assert some cliche perhaps dressed up by some poetic philosophical language so that other who happen to identify with those beliefs will know that they're on the correct side. Cognitive dissonance is so pronounced they would almost always avoid it entirely rather than work through it at a certain point. Some I've spoken to are aware that their philosophy is full of contradictions, so their defense is to consider it normal to have contradictory beliefsand demonstrate this by pointing them out from other partisan hacks. They didn't reason themselves into their beliefs, reason is only to find a credible way their beliefs are correct.
The really irritating part is that they'd see your second paragraph there and say "they get it! The damn left just works backwards from their convictions. They don't think about anything, they just feel it!"
They'd read all that and say "not me, you." and they'd be partially correct as obviously some on the left do the same thing.
It can definitely be frustrating, and I see this tendency as a similar projection to what I mentioned about admitting to holding contradictory beliefs by suggesting it's the norm across politics to hold contradictory beliefs. Because the other side is secretly a lying, election stealing, authoritarian, fascist party they have license to be the same to remain competitive. It doesn't matter that there's a lack of evidence for that to be the case since their enemies are so cunning, manipulative, and reasonable sounding. If someone is good at making a reasonable argument opposed to your belief, they are an agent of the enemy there to brainwash you.
In pressing some of these beliefs I've had all kinds of interesting rebuttals. I've learned that all academics studying Climatology throughout the entire world are in on a conspiracy to promote the "climate change" hoax to enrich themselves at the expense of only American conservatives who are the only people on earth to know the truth. When I pointed out the living situation of the average academic, it turns out I'm brainwashed. Someone honestly told me that. After providing a list of resources to support my argument, I've also heard that all publicly available data in general is all falsified to promote leftism. Real information might be found at the library if they ever get the time to find their source and get back to me. You only have to experience the charade so many times before you see in black and white that these beliefs are part of group identity rather than the product of forming an individual opinion. There isn't a debate happening, it's just me trying to include as much objective data in our conversation as I can find while they dismiss everything to protect their fragile worldview. I often change my opinion based on new information, even sometimes from conservatives if the objective data they came across happened to support their worldview in some way. The only times I've managed to get through conservative opinions is when it's a young person realizing how much they've been lied to. I was that young person once.
There are plenty of idiot liberals around because there are parts of the country where you can fall into that belief system without ever having to think about anything. These individuals will become conservative the moment they hear the right rhetoric. There are of course plenty of liberals who understand their own beliefs who I have had good and productive conversations with of course. A conservative who understands their own beliefs is someone you really need to watch your back around because they are the ones inventing and perpetuating conservative delusions for their own benefit.
The most recent On The Media podcast has a section about this (Trump reporting and why people don't get it that he's stupid, crazy AND evil) that I feel like didn't go far enough. They have a guest talking who literally says "The journalists aren't doing their job, to inform the public." I wanted to respond "NO, they ARE doing their job. Their job isn't to inform the public, it's to make $$$ by creating content that maximizes consumer engagement, while pushing narratives that appeal to their CEOs and shareholders. They're doing EXACTLY their job. THAT'S the problem."
So what's the solution to this? Publicly funding journalism nearly no-strings attached so that they have guaranteed income and can better focus on actual news?
But then that creates a conflict in interest when the story involves the funder.
It might create that potential, but if done properly, there can be independence.
In Canada, the CBC regularly reports on things that show the government of the day in a negative light.
Same with the BBC in the UK.
Research Hitler's rise to power and also the rise of fascism generally. Also look up "boiled frog"
Also maybe read this TL;DR: by GPT. I think the big thing is people feel powerless to stop him. Also nobody wants him to be a martyr. There are plenty others, some worse, that would take his place.
Ask a 1930s German adult. Fear. Whether it be a crashing economy, immigration, whatever. If you can get the fear hooks in them, you can absolutely get people to vote against their interests.
That seems so obvious, but as someone not inclined to succumb to fear, it’s never on my mind as a motivator.
Thank you for that insightful thought. I appreciate your mindfulness of that. I suppose it seems so easy for me to be able to look in from the outside and bang on the windows screaming at the top of my lungs about the danger of this narcissistic wannabe Hitler, but only to find out just how soundproof the house is on the inside in such a fog of fear and lies.
It’s a shame that millions of people are unable to divorce their fear from their cognition and ambition. I can only hope they wisen up at some point.
It's scary how he isn't even subtle about it either. Even less subtle than his previous plans to overthrow the government (and I'm in Australia, and it wasn't even subtle with the limited US political media here)
It's a bit concerning as an Australian since we're cosying right up to America with this AUKUS BS that Labor is continuing (I understand why, but I don't agree).
Yeah.. Honestly, I get the AUKUS thing, but I really wish we weren't wasting so much money on Military.
Honestly though, as of late, I've been voting greens..
Last time he was going to let us all die from covid.
This time he is actively going to hunt and kill us all.
Welcome to squid games bitches!!
(p.s. this orange kunt will never be president again)
I sincerely hope and wish you are correct. But last I heard he was ahead in the polls. 😱
The democrats really should have gone with a new face rather than Biden round 2.
Put AOC up there tomorrow and she will win.
Keep Biden up there and he will lose.
Just shows how the voice and the vote of the people doesn't matter.
The Party does what The Party does.
AOC is not yet eligible to be president.
Correct, but by election day, she will be.
And my guess is they are going to push her to run in 2028.
All the "news" and "polls" are so full of it. When we are close to election time, we will have a better measure. Polls this far away are just conjecture.
Last three election cycles were predicted to be red waves that never materialized. Get out and vote.
Maybe we should follow Trump's advice from 2016 and explore the second amendment option.
Biden is funding genocide and is working in creating mechanisms that allow him to do so behind closed doors.
He has also made a few limp wristed pushes for things he has not delivered on, but if he is renewed, he has said he wants to TRY to do some of the things he promised some more.
To repeat, Biden funding of the genocide of Palestine sailed through with massive success.
Democrats need to find something better to offer. Fast.
Biden is still the best choice. People will vote for him until they can't.
Indeed. Need to vote all democrat down the ticket (hopefully with good choices in primaries) for the moment to preserve American democracy and freedom. Once the current fascist/authoritarian push is in the rear view mirror, then we can work on better choices.
This is Biden's last chance at a second term, he will not try again if he loses to Trump. Trump on the other hand will probably keep trying until he is dead, in prison, or his health in old age drags him down; Here's hoping Biden wins this one, and by 2028 Trump's health will be in decline/prevent him from running.
The problem is "for the moment to preserve American democracy and freedom" winds up being every election, unless a genuine leftward push is made at some point down the line.
If that leftward push never happens, every election is a choice between temporarily halting fascism, and allowing fascism to metastasize.
The "left" does not control enough of the government to make a serious leftward push. All they can currently manage is halting the advance.
Vote down the line.
Yes, mimic your enemy. Don't oppose your enemy.
Sadly, the way the game is set up, if you don't vote for one of the two parties then you are essentially splitting the vote and creating a void in which the party you never wanted to win will now certainly win. It's the only way to play with the rules we currently have.
Yes, it is a broken system.
Stop humoring the broken system.
What's your alternative? Unless there's a successful January 6th equivalent the options are humoring the system and making progress as best you can or reject the system and maybe engage in resultless protests while letting fascists take over the system. At that point your options become be a fascist or die.
You can't prevent fascism through Democracy, because fascism does not rely on Democracy to come into power.
Fascism happens through violent seizure of power, and it can only be prevented or defeated through violence.
The fact that rhetoric has turned to, "if Republicans ever win again, they'll actualize a fascist takeover" just shows that we recognize that however many laws or constitutional protections we put in place do not matter; if they did, it wouldn't matter if Republicans got back in power, because the guardrails would constrain them.
But we all know that they'll disregard those guardrails in order to seize power. Sadly, no one wants to accept the answer about what path that leaves us, and people will keep desperately voting as SCOTUS and the GOP Congress lay the groundwork for a full-scale right-wing takeover. Because in a 2-party system, it's simply a matter of time before control flips.
Yeah, that simply gives the vote to who you oppose. In fact this is the same propaganda that Russia pushed leading up to the 2016 elections. It's how Trump won in the first place. Makes me very suspect of your motives.
Why do you people keep perpetuating that lie?
Show me how my unused vote magically adds to someone I didn't use it on.
No. My unused vote represents the disenfranchised.
Your cast vote will represent a genocidal maniac.
Stop playing make believe. Be a grown up. Live in reality.
Dude it's basic math.
If person a gets 20 votes and person b gets 19 votes and if you were going to vote for person b then didn't, person a wins instead of ties. Do that on a major scale to one party and you get a party that will never win again.
So I don't know where you get off on pretending I'm playing make believe. It makes me think you have to resort to these adhoc attacks because your stance is super weak and you know it.
You are making shit up. 1 plus 0 DOES NOT EQUAL 2.
Here is how the actual math works. Red Fascist gets 20 votes, Blue Fascist gets 19 votes if blue party has abandoned their liberal ideals in favor for "lesser evil" progressive fascism and I'm the only one who refuses to vote for genocide. That means the voting record is:
Model 1
Red Fascist: 20 votes
Blue Fascist: 19 votes
Disenfranchised voters: 1
If the people stop believing your made up bullshit, then they too could decide to stop voting for the death of America, stop voting for fascism, stop voting for genocide, etc.
Then the voting record is:
Model 2
Red Fascist: 10 votes
Blue Fascist: 10 votes
Disenfranchised voters: 20
Voter turnout is a massive factor in establishing the political ethos of the person in office. A person sitting on 98% turnout can say "I represent America" and has much better odds of pushing whatever genocide or tax break for billionaires they want.
A person sitting on a 50% turnout is going to have "you don't represent the people" hurled at them at every turn, and they will have a much harder time sending another funding package to the genocide.
Under Model 1, neither fascist has anything to worry about. They have the world by the balls, their overlords are happy, and regardless of which cover the overlords put on their actions (red or blue), they will get their payout. Nothing changes. The whole system continues to decay.
Under Model 2, the fascists have a big problem. The world can see that the people don't approve, the people see that the people don't approve. Now there is fire on the heels of the fascists, and they might need to consider actually not being evil sometimes to encourage more people to vote again.
Even under a third model:
Model 3
Red Fascist: 20 votes
Blue Fascist: 10 votes
Disenfranchised voters: 10
After a really shitty 4 years, the Blue Fascists now have a reason to stop being fucking fascists to get the 10 disenfranchised voters back. They have incentive to actually combat the Red Fascists by trying to be GOOD instead of lesser evil.
Let me destroy your argument with one fact. We've already had 50% voter turnout. It's how we got Bush Sr. No one is going to care if you don't vote. In fact no one said to Bush Sr he didn't represent the people. So you should look into some of the things you're saying first. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_turnout_in_United_States_presidential_elections
Yes, and that was because the people wanted Gary Hart, but the DNC decided to install Dukakis instead.
Exactly like Hilary/Bernie, except at least for Gary Hart, there was some drama in the news to pin the decision on. For Hilary/Bernie, it was simply that Hilary is one of the overlords in the DNC.
So you are just highlighting a great point where the DNC didn't listen to their constituents and paid the price. Good conscientious liberals refused to vote for the "lesser evil". They wanted their solid candidate to vote for.
It motivated the Democrats to get strong on climate, social service, and fighting AGAINST genocide, and that's how we got the Clinton/Gore years (some of the best years in moderate history).
It worked. We saw actual improvement. Then we got complacent again and Democrats are now funding genocide.
Time to do it again.
Argument perfectly in-tact if not stronger.
You sound like a child.
Hi @lolcatnip, we have one rule on Beehaw: Be(e) Nice. If you disagree with another user feel free to express why, but low effort, drive-by insults aren't really in the spirit of this instance.
You sound like a boomer.
Thanks for saying it so clearly.
People would rather vote for the slow death of America than the fast death of America.
People. You don't need to vote for the death of America. You have that choice.
They conditioned you to think you must support evil.
We can still show that we don't support evil.
Are you talking about protesting by not voting or wasting a vote on a 3rd party? Without ranked choice voting, the only good spot for that is primaries and small local elections. The lesser of two evils is still the lesser of two evils. Life will be a hell of a lot worse for tons of people if the former guy wins again.
The problem is that eventually the GOP is going to win a presidential election. In a 2-party system, it's an eventuality, no ifs, ands, or buts.
Unless we radically reshape our government, that GOP fascist takeover being planned for now IS going to happen, but Democrats aren't even talking about that, they're just trying to cling to the broken status quo for as long as they can.
There is no way a third-party candidate wins in our system. It's simply not possible and to vote for one is to split the party vote. Look what happened with the Bull-Moose party. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1912_United_States_presidential_election The rules haven't changed since so this is all you could expect from trying to get people to switch. You'd hand it over to Trump.
Right, and that is why I'm not saying to vote for a third party.
I am saying don't vote.
Stop humoring a broken system.
That's not a solution and the same result as voting for a third party. No one in America is going to care that you didn't vote.
And you're going to turn to the GOP, who is willing to deport you to the ME even if you are a natural born American? Good luck with that.
And keep in mind, the GOP position on the Hamas terrorist attacks is to give Israel all the arms and funding they want.
*concentration camps
Sauce: https://apnews.com/article/trump-policies-agenda-election-2024-second-term-d656d8f08629a8da14a65c4075545e0f
Thank you kind person.
Bill Burr in the background! Wonder when his wife flipped off Trump? I hope she doesn't apologize, I'll be disappointed.
Did he talk about this on his podcast or something?
Not that I know of. There is a video where you can see Nia flipping off Trump. It was at the UFC event on Saturday.
Is there supposed to be an article attached to this? All I'm getting is an image. I mean, I know trump has been threatening a lot of stuff, but I was curious if there were any specific examples of what he was planning or if this was just a general statement.
IIRC there's a big ultraconservative group that is discussing and proposing what should be done come a R President in 2024. Apparently, this article is talking about that one. I don't remember the name of the group.
https://apnews.com/article/election-2024-conservatives-trump-heritage-857eb794e505f1c6710eb03fd5b58981
I couldn't find any mention of this thread's headline through my browser's find function
Project 2025
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/bc-us-election-2024-trump-second-term_n_65513c02e4b0c9f24660aa6e
Still learning how to Lemmy. Thought I could have an article link and an image at the same time.
F.
So thats where Vivek got that idea from
More words please. I'm interested.
Still waiting for the adults to enter the room.
I feel ya. All this just lends to increased dispair. Kierkegaard would be disappointed.
where sauce
https://apnews.com/article/trump-policies-agenda-election-2024-second-term-d656d8f08629a8da14a65c4075545e0f
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/bc-us-election-2024-trump-second-term_n_65513c02e4b0c9f24660aa6e
Still learning how to Lemmy. Thought I could have an article link and an image at the same time.
F.
You can, just include the article link or the image in the body.
Yeah, like that
Dang. Thought that was Bill Burr in the lower right
It's a ufc fight. I think it's him.
He doesn't look too happy.
Ohhh, thank you. Thought this was a Trump rally or some sort
I miss little details like that all the time. In the article, the photo is captioned. I didn't read the caption till someone mentioned it looked like burr was there. I love the look on his face.