For the shoplifting thing, it depends which store it is. Big chain grocery store? Yeah, I couldn't care less what someone takes. Small single owner shop? Fuck you for stealing from that guy. Those stores struggle enough just trying to compete with the Walmarts of the world.
Stealing food? I didn't see shit.
Absolutely yes, but also, choose your targets. Walmart ain't gonna miss it. The local bodega will.
People who shoplift are only considering a single factor: what's the likelihood this store ends up caring and puts me in jail eventually.
Turns out, plenty of stores will NEVER stop you provided you dont exceed a certain dollar amount or try to walk off with large appliances.
Its not hard to find a stores policy around theft and prevention.
Its a coincidence that big box stores are stolen from more, not a moral thing.
When the food is multiple grocery bags full of steaks I'm a little less inclined to a charitable view.
That said, I'm still not going to do anything about it. Intervening on the behalf of a grocery store is insane, even if I were opposed to what's happening. Not my monkeys, not my circus.
"Gotta eat to live, gotta steal to eat, otherwise we'd get along!"
Riffraff! Street rat! I don't buy that!
If only they'd look closer…
Would they see a poor boy?
No, siree
They'd find out there's so much more to me
Wal mart is still the one and only store I used to steal from back in 90’s. Had to wear umbro shorts since they had that webbing in them and then grab a few CDs and beads to make necklaces that I would sell. By the time I got to high school I was over the shop lifting thing.
Much like pirating Nintendo games, it is morally correct to shoplift from Walmart, assuming you have the skill to get away with it.
Plus it was the only way I could get CDs with explicit lyrics like Rage Against the Machine
Most stores don't stop you. The security guards are just there for the police report and a description. That said, if you get recognized coming back to the same store, they will call the cops.
If there's a police report, you didn't get away with it unless you're never going to that store again. Which is probably not usually the case.
Wait, is sleeping in your car illegal???
In Burgerland? Ofc!
Freedom rains!
"Freedom is always the freedom of the rich" – Ayn Rand, I guess
I don't think it's illegal in Germany.
In many cities in the US, not only is it illegal, they will charge you with DUI if you appear at all intoxicated, and the keys to the car were at all available to you. Available in this case can mean that you were in the back seat sleeping and the keys were in the front console, or one of the front seats. Don't even think about running your car to stay warm/cool.
Is that whole sobriety test thing real in the US? Like, stand on one leg and recite the alphabet etc? I've seen it on TV but always thought it was pretty stupid. In the UK the police have breath-tested for drink driving since 1967.
Depends. Smaller townships without regular access to a breathalyzer, yes. Or cops trying to get you to admit that you are intoxicated.
I walked a straight line while touching my nose because the cop smelled alcohol in the car (rightly so, my wife, then gf, was smashed). Took about 10 seconds for him to go "So obviously that's all her, have a good night!".
So yes, it does happen.
Oh they do both. And you can get what they call a DWI (Driving While Impaired) just on the basis of the circus act in some states. So the breath test comes back at say, .037, which is well within the legal limit. The cop can charge you with DWI anyways based on your bad balance.
Forget the bad balance. All the cop has to put in his report is the language they were taught. The suspect had red, glassy eyes when I approached. They might as well drag and drop these statements or just have them written by LLM.
It's real, and it's totally based on the officer's gut feelings. Hell breathalyzers over analyze over 70% of the time. The entirety of the war on drugs and the tools to combat drunk driving are not entirely based in science
tools to combat drunk driving are not entirely based in science
To the point that the accuracy of breathalyzers has been challenged so many times in CA that it's to the point that if the cops in CA have you breathe into a machine and that machine returns a number that would constitute a DUI if that were your BAC then it's a DUI, regardless of what the machine actually does or whether the number in question is actually connected to your real BAC in any way.
It's all really just an excuse by the popo to book you. Which is why you should always ask for the breathalyzer if you really weren't drinking.
Huh, didn't know in the field blood tests were a thing. Guess you learn something new everyday. I wonder if those tests are specifically for alcohol or if they also test a variety of other drugs like THC?
They aren't, but they are much more reliable than breathalyzer. Take the ride to the station or the hospital. A cab ride back to your car is cheaper than a DUI
Everyone should know that depending on your jurisdiction, refusal of the breathalyzer can result in automatic six month suspension of license. Regardless of results.
it's real, and it does work pretty well.
We also do the breathalyzer, or blood draws, but those are a little more involved, and if you can't do a field sobriety test then you definitely as hell can't drive a fucking car lmao.
So fuck anyone with mobility problems then huh?
you think those people are required to do them? One of the primary tests doesn't even require you to move. 50% of the other two are literally counting.
And like i said, you can just hit them with the blow test? Or blood like i mentioned, that's a particularly good one.
In some states refusing the circus act is an automatic DUI. Even if you ask for a blood test. We have the technology to just do away with it. And dyslexic people can drive just fine while fucking up the numbers and alphabet. It just needs to go.
that is pretty silly, though idk much about the specifics of it, really it should only mean you get arrested/detained, it shouldn't be possible to charge you with something that isnt proven.
It shouldn't. And yet it is. That's not even the worst use of that though. Cops can beat you up and arrest you for resisting arrest at any time. And that generally comes with jail time.
well i mean resisting arrest is quite literally illegal, so that would make sense, considering that if you're evading arrest, you probably have a reason to be doing so.
Though you also have to resist arrest for that one to happen. Otherwise it's unlawful use of force.
Sure. Technically. In reality they can literally just punch you and arrest you.
in reality they can roll up to you and tell you that you're under arrest, which means you have to comply legally. The actual proceedings of being arrested and charged take place later, so that's where that would be disputed.
If you were to resist, that's literally illegal. Therefore police have the right to use reasonable force against you (which is often defined as a proportion of your resistive force)
If you don't resist, and they do use force on you, there is almost definitely a case that you can hold against them for unreasonable force.
No but it is illegal to park in most places after hours. You will get hit with trespassing.
In what sort of un-free shitehole is that a law?!?
Large swaths of the US
And I'm also guessing most other parts of the world.
No, not really
So there are no trespassing laws in other countries?
There are no we-passionately-hate-poor-and-or-homeless-persons-and-want-to-make-them-suffer-as-much-as-we-can laws in the spirit of that culture of the USA, no
In the civilised world, there are laws to the opposite, in fact.
In Switzerland, access to lakes and rivers is guaranteed by law, for everyone (even poor people! Imagine that) even, and especially, if that means walking on land owned by someone else, private or not.
In Sweden, people can even roam the entire country freely, by law.
It would be cool if we had those laws in the usa too. I don't know why you are phrasing it in a way that makes it seem like I hate my fellow poor people though.
It's not you specifically, it's the culture
In the US it isn't even usually trespassing, it is specifically illegal to sleep in your car, even on public property.
That's where tents belong, though. It's called camping.
I thought people only went glamping nowadays.
No, people only post glamping to social media. Plenty of people still go camping.
i genuinely can't believe there are laws around sleeping in vehicles these days. You want me to pack up and fuck off after a day? Fine, i'll do that, i can live with that. Fuck you for making it illegal though. Actual bullshit.
I only lie to three people. Cops, judges, and my parents.
I remember being told that an adult could sleep in a car, but with a child, sleeping in a car is considered "endangerment". Doubly so if you're a CIS gender male with a female child.
This was a Texas CPS social worker. We just had a flood and were brainstorming ideas for temporary shelter for folks.
Totally!.... At the home Depot if someone shoplifts a drill, tell them where the drill bits are. Chances are they won't be able to come back to home Depot again for a while. They might as well have all they need.
Why not buy some under water drills and an underwater propulsion device then go down to the marina and sink some expensive yatchs? How about slashing some police tires?
Why not study an industry you wanna take down and figure out how? Or gather an online flash mob and invade a conservative website or institution. How about running for office at your local council? Or sending letters to good and bad politicians saying what you think. Contact the media about something you believe but make sure it's the right level for what you're saying.
Or go read some leftwing theory.
Some of that is adventurism, so I would say organizing comes first. Sinking yachts does little without a mass leftist movement to take advantage of the damage.
Theory is great too, it makes your practice sharper.
And we pay to keep them homeless between shit charities with stocked boards making $100k yearly, ER visits, and arrests/enforcement.. This system of capitalism is totally ducked build dense affordable housing, and watch America become actually great again.
I never snitch, ever. If my neighbour was a serial killer, I'd just move instead of calling the cops.
i'd give him a shopping list...
What if they're shoplifting at my store?
Then direct them to Walmart because your owner-operated store with no employees is too rare already.
I know people who are shoplifting for "fun" or for "the thrill". They don't even care about the items and they definitely don't care about the shop owner. They just do it when they see the chances.
Unless it's a small business, I don't care about the shop owner, either.
Won't anyone think of the shareholders!
Many will, but I won't be among them!
Gas Station Encounters is a great channel to see shoplifters in action.
Pays 100$ for gas, 50$ worth of scratch tickets, 20$ worth of soda
Steals a 50¢ candy bar
Some people are just... lmao
But who are we to judge when shoplifting is appropriate or not? Also, if you are shoplifting to spite the capitalist system, you are doing society a favor. If you are shoplifting in a small self-owned store that is struggling itself, this would be less than ideal. But all other large corporate-owned shops are ethically OK to shoplift imo.
But who are we to judge when shoplifting is appropriate or not?
Seems like that's the whole post.
Yes, but the person I was commenting on judged people who were shoplifting for "fun"
I sleep outside just because sometimes. So anyways homeless people don't exist right?
I guess it depends on what you're shoplifting and who you're stealing from.
Like, stealing a gaming rig from a mom-and-pop style PC building/repair shop wouldn't be okay
To me, shop lifting is taking small value items.
What you described is, to me, theft.
IANAL
Here's the deal: as long as you're not being an asshole about doing any of these things, I'll probably overlook it.
Start acting a fool however, and I'll have the cops come collect you.
Precisely correct.
I'm just a tool of my own design.
I never saw so many people shoplifting when I worked at Hy-vee.
For the shoplifting thing, it depends which store it is. Big chain grocery store? Yeah, I couldn't care less what someone takes. Small single owner shop? Fuck you for stealing from that guy. Those stores struggle enough just trying to compete with the Walmarts of the world.
Stealing food? I didn't see shit.
Absolutely yes, but also, choose your targets. Walmart ain't gonna miss it. The local bodega will.
People who shoplift are only considering a single factor: what's the likelihood this store ends up caring and puts me in jail eventually.
Turns out, plenty of stores will NEVER stop you provided you dont exceed a certain dollar amount or try to walk off with large appliances.
Its not hard to find a stores policy around theft and prevention.
Its a coincidence that big box stores are stolen from more, not a moral thing.
When the food is multiple grocery bags full of steaks I'm a little less inclined to a charitable view.
That said, I'm still not going to do anything about it. Intervening on the behalf of a grocery store is insane, even if I were opposed to what's happening. Not my monkeys, not my circus.
"Gotta eat to live, gotta steal to eat, otherwise we'd get along!"
Riffraff! Street rat! I don't buy that! If only they'd look closer… Would they see a poor boy? No, siree They'd find out there's so much more to me
Wal mart is still the one and only store I used to steal from back in 90’s. Had to wear umbro shorts since they had that webbing in them and then grab a few CDs and beads to make necklaces that I would sell. By the time I got to high school I was over the shop lifting thing.
Much like pirating Nintendo games, it is morally correct to shoplift from Walmart, assuming you have the skill to get away with it.
Plus it was the only way I could get CDs with explicit lyrics like Rage Against the Machine
Most stores don't stop you. The security guards are just there for the police report and a description. That said, if you get recognized coming back to the same store, they will call the cops.
If there's a police report, you didn't get away with it unless you're never going to that store again. Which is probably not usually the case.
Wait, is sleeping in your car illegal???
In Burgerland? Ofc!
Freedom rains!
"Freedom is always the freedom of the rich" – Ayn Rand, I guess
I don't think it's illegal in Germany.
In many cities in the US, not only is it illegal, they will charge you with DUI if you appear at all intoxicated, and the keys to the car were at all available to you. Available in this case can mean that you were in the back seat sleeping and the keys were in the front console, or one of the front seats. Don't even think about running your car to stay warm/cool.
Is that whole sobriety test thing real in the US? Like, stand on one leg and recite the alphabet etc? I've seen it on TV but always thought it was pretty stupid. In the UK the police have breath-tested for drink driving since 1967.
Depends. Smaller townships without regular access to a breathalyzer, yes. Or cops trying to get you to admit that you are intoxicated.
I walked a straight line while touching my nose because the cop smelled alcohol in the car (rightly so, my wife, then gf, was smashed). Took about 10 seconds for him to go "So obviously that's all her, have a good night!".
So yes, it does happen.
Oh they do both. And you can get what they call a DWI (Driving While Impaired) just on the basis of the circus act in some states. So the breath test comes back at say, .037, which is well within the legal limit. The cop can charge you with DWI anyways based on your bad balance.
Forget the bad balance. All the cop has to put in his report is the language they were taught. The suspect had red, glassy eyes when I approached. They might as well drag and drop these statements or just have them written by LLM.
It's real, and it's totally based on the officer's gut feelings. Hell breathalyzers over analyze over 70% of the time. The entirety of the war on drugs and the tools to combat drunk driving are not entirely based in science
To the point that the accuracy of breathalyzers has been challenged so many times in CA that it's to the point that if the cops in CA have you breathe into a machine and that machine returns a number that would constitute a DUI if that were your BAC then it's a DUI, regardless of what the machine actually does or whether the number in question is actually connected to your real BAC in any way.
It's all really just an excuse by the popo to book you. Which is why you should always ask for the breathalyzer if you really weren't drinking.
Blood test, not breathalyzer.
https://dmcantor.com/blog/dui-breathalyzer-false-reading
Huh, didn't know in the field blood tests were a thing. Guess you learn something new everyday. I wonder if those tests are specifically for alcohol or if they also test a variety of other drugs like THC?
They aren't, but they are much more reliable than breathalyzer. Take the ride to the station or the hospital. A cab ride back to your car is cheaper than a DUI
Everyone should know that depending on your jurisdiction, refusal of the breathalyzer can result in automatic six month suspension of license. Regardless of results.
it's real, and it does work pretty well.
We also do the breathalyzer, or blood draws, but those are a little more involved, and if you can't do a field sobriety test then you definitely as hell can't drive a fucking car lmao.
So fuck anyone with mobility problems then huh?
you think those people are required to do them? One of the primary tests doesn't even require you to move. 50% of the other two are literally counting.
And like i said, you can just hit them with the blow test? Or blood like i mentioned, that's a particularly good one.
In some states refusing the circus act is an automatic DUI. Even if you ask for a blood test. We have the technology to just do away with it. And dyslexic people can drive just fine while fucking up the numbers and alphabet. It just needs to go.
that is pretty silly, though idk much about the specifics of it, really it should only mean you get arrested/detained, it shouldn't be possible to charge you with something that isnt proven.
It shouldn't. And yet it is. That's not even the worst use of that though. Cops can beat you up and arrest you for resisting arrest at any time. And that generally comes with jail time.
well i mean resisting arrest is quite literally illegal, so that would make sense, considering that if you're evading arrest, you probably have a reason to be doing so.
Though you also have to resist arrest for that one to happen. Otherwise it's unlawful use of force.
Sure. Technically. In reality they can literally just punch you and arrest you.
in reality they can roll up to you and tell you that you're under arrest, which means you have to comply legally. The actual proceedings of being arrested and charged take place later, so that's where that would be disputed.
If you were to resist, that's literally illegal. Therefore police have the right to use reasonable force against you (which is often defined as a proportion of your resistive force)
If you don't resist, and they do use force on you, there is almost definitely a case that you can hold against them for unreasonable force.
No but it is illegal to park in most places after hours. You will get hit with trespassing.
In what sort of un-free shitehole is that a law?!?
Large swaths of the US
And I'm also guessing most other parts of the world.
No, not really
So there are no trespassing laws in other countries?
There are no we-passionately-hate-poor-and-or-homeless-persons-and-want-to-make-them-suffer-as-much-as-we-can laws in the spirit of that culture of the USA, no
In the civilised world, there are laws to the opposite, in fact.
In Switzerland, access to lakes and rivers is guaranteed by law, for everyone (even poor people! Imagine that) even, and especially, if that means walking on land owned by someone else, private or not.
In Sweden, people can even roam the entire country freely, by law.
It would be cool if we had those laws in the usa too. I don't know why you are phrasing it in a way that makes it seem like I hate my fellow poor people though.
It's not you specifically, it's the culture
In the US it isn't even usually trespassing, it is specifically illegal to sleep in your car, even on public property.
I have so many questions.
That's where tents belong, though. It's called camping.
I thought people only went glamping nowadays.
No, people only post glamping to social media. Plenty of people still go camping.
i genuinely can't believe there are laws around sleeping in vehicles these days. You want me to pack up and fuck off after a day? Fine, i'll do that, i can live with that. Fuck you for making it illegal though. Actual bullshit.
I only lie to three people. Cops, judges, and my parents.
I remember being told that an adult could sleep in a car, but with a child, sleeping in a car is considered "endangerment". Doubly so if you're a CIS gender male with a female child. This was a Texas CPS social worker. We just had a flood and were brainstorming ideas for temporary shelter for folks.
Totally!.... At the home Depot if someone shoplifts a drill, tell them where the drill bits are. Chances are they won't be able to come back to home Depot again for a while. They might as well have all they need.
Why not buy some under water drills and an underwater propulsion device then go down to the marina and sink some expensive yatchs? How about slashing some police tires?
Why not study an industry you wanna take down and figure out how? Or gather an online flash mob and invade a conservative website or institution. How about running for office at your local council? Or sending letters to good and bad politicians saying what you think. Contact the media about something you believe but make sure it's the right level for what you're saying.
Or go read some leftwing theory.
Some of that is adventurism, so I would say organizing comes first. Sinking yachts does little without a mass leftist movement to take advantage of the damage.
Theory is great too, it makes your practice sharper.
And we pay to keep them homeless between shit charities with stocked boards making $100k yearly, ER visits, and arrests/enforcement.. This system of capitalism is totally ducked build dense affordable housing, and watch America become actually great again.
I never snitch, ever. If my neighbour was a serial killer, I'd just move instead of calling the cops.
i'd give him a shopping list...
What if they're shoplifting at my store?
Then direct them to Walmart because your owner-operated store with no employees is too rare already.
I know people who are shoplifting for "fun" or for "the thrill". They don't even care about the items and they definitely don't care about the shop owner. They just do it when they see the chances.
Unless it's a small business, I don't care about the shop owner, either.
Won't anyone think of the shareholders!
Many will, but I won't be among them!
Gas Station Encounters is a great channel to see shoplifters in action.
Some people are just... lmao
But who are we to judge when shoplifting is appropriate or not? Also, if you are shoplifting to spite the capitalist system, you are doing society a favor. If you are shoplifting in a small self-owned store that is struggling itself, this would be less than ideal. But all other large corporate-owned shops are ethically OK to shoplift imo.
Seems like that's the whole post.
Yes, but the person I was commenting on judged people who were shoplifting for "fun"
I sleep outside just because sometimes. So anyways homeless people don't exist right?
I guess it depends on what you're shoplifting and who you're stealing from.
Like, stealing a gaming rig from a mom-and-pop style PC building/repair shop wouldn't be okay
To me, shop lifting is taking small value items.
What you described is, to me, theft.
IANAL
Here's the deal: as long as you're not being an asshole about doing any of these things, I'll probably overlook it.
Start acting a fool however, and I'll have the cops come collect you.
Precisely correct.
I'm just a tool of my own design.
I never saw so many people shoplifting when I worked at Hy-vee.