or ADH-Wheee! if you really want to put a positive spin on it.
I like “Executive Function Disorder” as it actually describes the underlying issue and not just the symptoms that other people can see.
This is what I would vote for if there was a vote on it.
It's a disorder in our society, because it require you to do task you've been ask to do, but if you would just live your life I don't think you would call it a disorder, more like a different way of processing tasks
(edit) I'm not saying that changing your environment would resolve the problem, since I'm under medication I can clearly do more things on my free/personal time than before. Hmmm yeah, I kinda lost the track of my thoughts now, can discard as it's an edit. stop.
Well, in the wild, if you couldn't concentrate on one thing long enough to hunt/gather/fish, then you wouldn't eat, and would weed yourself out of the gene pool.
It's the other way around - ADHD exists because there's a bunch of cool stuff worth noticing in nature. Not everyone in the tribe needed to concentrate on fishing.
It's the same with colorblind people. Just one colorblind person is at a disadvantage, but while hunting they might notice the animal camouflaged for normal color vision. In a tribe, the different perspective is helpful.
Russell Barkley, the worlds leading expert on ADHD (as far as I can tell) has a video where he shows that this is not likely to be true.
Rather, the continued presence of ADHD in our gene pool has to do with how many factors genetic factors can cause it, and basically the mutation rate causing ADHD is now balanced with the rate that we die off without reproducing.
Do you have a link?
Lol, I responded to your message, and then went to look for the links to add. But my meds hadn't kicked in yet, and I got distracted.
These 2 videos are him discussing this topic, be warned, they're 20 and 15 minutes.
Personally I find his delivery and information engaging enough to watch, but only somtimes.
I saw a notification and read half your comment, but then you deleted it.
Did you end up watching the vid and changing your mind? It’s been a minute since I watched it, and also only caught part of your comment, so I don’t know if your concerns were addressed.
Except we would be the ones hyperfocusing on making that fucking fire that Steve gave up onto after 2h of trying, or we would stay up late to keep the tribe safe when everyone else starts to fall asleep. A lot of the disfunction is just an incompatibility with our current lifestyle.
if you would just live your life I don't think you would call it a disorder, more like a different way of processing tasks
The more I learn about ADHD, the less I see it as a disorder. I see it more as a personality trait. Unfortunately most of our society is based on people not having that personality trait, making it harder to fit in.
On the other hand, if you're lucky enough to find a lifestyle that fits your personality type, that personality type is actually very helpful, the opposite of a disorder.
As someone with ADHD I'd describe the experience more like profound boredem with everything in life. You seek obsession because you can't generate excitement for normal activities on your own
There are very few videos games I can play because of this. I love gaming, but finding one that I like is extremely challenging.
Same, dude. Recently it's been Skyrim for me. Started it up on a whim for the umpteenth time and have sunk 80ish hours into a save file again and have rented a PS VR to try Skyrim VR. Aside from Overwatch, that's the only game I currently see myself playing regularly lol
starfield you may also enjoy alr have 40 hours into the game
Omg same re: skyrim
If I'm playing with my friends the excitement of making jokes and having fun is enough for me. But if I'm alone no game brings me joy if it's not my current hyper fixation.
Or ones that I like too much, see my 15 year addiction to WoW. So many little dopamines to find!
If I didn't have to do life, I'd just play wow
I imagine myself in old age in a retirement home playing wow all day
But once you find one that hits that hyperfixation itch, ohhhh maaaaaan.
For me it's gotta be the right level of challenge. I want to like the loop in Souls games but can't get past the frustration. Hollow Knight, however, was just right and I loved it.
Other things that work for me is the Factorio style- especially Satisfactory because when you fuck up you don't need to tear it all down and rebuild.
Feel this pretty hard. I tend to like the ones with a really good tactile feedback. Anything with tight melee combat gets a gold star from me. (Fury is probably one of my favorite games of all time)
I just saw someone on Reddit who claimed this profound boredom with everything was why they didn't have ADHD. Apparently the list of symptoms they were reading did not accurately describe the depths of ADHD boredom, and they thought their boredom was a worse breed that indicated some far worse mental problem.
Had to tell 'em.
I have no hobbies I enjoy longer than about a month except gaming, and even then I still get like a month mileage out of each game. I can't hold a job because every time I start a new one it's like a ticking timebomb in my brain until I can't handle it anymore. Even if the job is easy and the people are nice. Something about the repetitive schedule and saying/hearing/doing the same thing every day brings me to a near panic attack level of restlessness and anxiety.
Oh my god this is so accurate.
I'm barely on the spectrum, and I can only imagine what it must feel like to have full ADHD.
Whenever I read a description from someone with ADHD I can almost always 100% relate to that experience, but whenever I read something from "professional" source I start thinking I might not have it and just killed my attention span with social media consumption...
Buddy if you are waiting for a Sign, this is it. It'll never get more concrete than this message I'm typing for you right now. Having a lot of doubts is common. It wasn't truly real for me until I started medication.
My broad advice is to find a good psychiatrist (and don't be afraid to switch if you aren't happy) and dig as deep as possible for evidence both for and against. Go in with confidence that you have ADHD symptoms, but keep an open mind since there are alternative explanations. A diagnosis of "no you don't have ADHD it's actually ____" is also important information to know, and you will regret letting it drag out if you do have ADHD.
Unrelated anecdote:
I was driving one time, and got lost in my city. I drove a church. Their billboard read:
Lost? Come in and ask for directions! As in the spiritual kind.
Anyway, I decided to drive on, and get progressively more lost. I decide to turn around. I make my way back to the church, and on the reverse side of the billboard:
Need a sign from god? This could be it!
So I stopped and asked for directions...
I'm probably undiagnosed inattentive. I'm also not one to make a statement like that lightly.
I'm notorious among my social circle for diving down rabbitholes and sending them endless mental lint articles. I wish I could turn it off sometimes.
Turning it off is why I cling to weed since I first tried it. It dulls the noise and allows for a single line of thought to come through unobstructed, in my case.
Honestly, my thoughts bounce around like an angry bee in a coffee can. It sucks.
Thank you for that metaphor. I love it.
This is the same for me. Comes with downsides too, but I've found weed incredibly valuable for.. not really controlling or prompting hyperfocus states, but definitely a strong catalyst.
Still don't really feel in control over which single line of interest gets the focus, but at least it's not everything.
It's kinda crazy sometimes, how I notice I've been thinking the same thought for minutes. I don't think I have ADHD, but probably ADD, my mind is just all over the place through the day, but after a bowl it all just calms down. Kinda like a group of people organizing into a queue.
add has been reclassified as ADHD
same it seems like about the only thing that has actually helped I've tried a couple meds and they either make me feel like shit or don't do anything except for when the weed brings you down a rabbit hole and your ADHD goes with it then your fucked but other then that it's great
I even told my doctor it's been one of the main reasons I continue to smoke other than how it also makes my body feel pretty good (like walking on clouds; no aches or pains or at least dulled aches and pains). He still gave me some anxiety meds, but they are only for when I'm actively having an anxiety attack. I have never taken one, though. I've never been unable to have access to weed since getting that prescription, which prevents me having anxiety attacks to begin with. The only time I've had an anxiety attack while on weed, I had gotten some gnarly ass sativa, got hella baked on it, and then unexpectedly had to go to the welfare office and talk to government people which made me paranoid AF and have an attack right outside before going in. 🤣
The show I'm a Virgo has a character who's superpower is basically adhd. She moves extremely fast and is constantly bored. I identify deeply with Flora, especially at work. I struggle with boredom and unstructured time, so I do like twice as much work as most of my coworkers. I'm routinely sales lead without really trying. I thrive on the busy days that most people find overwhelming.
This might sound silly but I'm trying to attract someone who told me in the past they have ADHD. Should I be doing anything differently?
Leave out a few pieces of cheese, and sit very quietly. If the cheese doesn't work, try cookies, they tend to attract most things
Lol, but to answer the question seriously you might need to be slightly more direct than with someone who can focus through a whole conversation. It really depends on the person and the severity of their symptoms, but in general just trust your instincts. People w/ ADHD aren't known for hiding how they feel haha
you might need to be slightly more direct than with someone who can focus through a whole conversation
ah yeah, this is what I was wondering about! I had heard that before and thought maybe I was being too subtle this whole time.
People w/ ADHD aren’t known for hiding how they feel
They often compliment my hair and what I'm wearing but won't go further than that. One time I complimented their hair and they blushed HARD. Like put their head down and looked a little embarrassed. Like maybe they only want to compliment me and not the other way around?
Some things that might explain the intense blushing:
a) anxiety is comorbid with ADHD. What this means is that if they do have ADHD/ADD then is it highly likely they also have some sort of generalized anxiety.
b) if this person is amab then any sort of compliment is going to send them over the moon. amab individuals rarely get the same romantic attention that afab's do. So it's entirely possible they simply didn't know how to respond to that situation (I still remember the first time a person complimented me)
All of this is to say it sounds like you have a good handle on the situation but you might want to consider slowly ramping up the obviousness of your intents and watch how they respond. Obviously do whatever you are comfortable with, but it is probably a good idea to try and take the lead in this situation (but again, trust your instincts)
I think they are amab but they ride the androgyny line pretty hard so I can't really tell.
I started wearing a trans flag necklace and noticed they started really warming up to me once they saw it. Last time I was around them they made it a point to stand very close to me to tell me something so you're right - I think I just need to ramp up my interest in them so they notice more.
Take a genuine interest in their obsessions. Not a performative "I want you to see I like this for you" but a real "I've been going out and doing this on my own for the past few weeks/months and I want to talk about it"
You do actually have to do it, they'll spot your bullshit before you speak it.
It's so crazy you brought this up. I've been accused of faking interest in the past when I wasn't and was actually doing the thing on my own.
My last ex did this a lot actually. Great example - he started watching Columbo so I took an interest and also started watching it. Then he like got upset? Told me not to be interested in it at one point?
I had another guy do this too but with hip hop and he waited until we were like two years into the relationship to accuse me of not really being into old school hip hop? Like why. I was literally living with the guy and he would come in the room where I would be listening to stuff on my own. Hell I still listen to Three 6 Mafia and Digital Underground. I even knew about Digital Underground before I ever met him. Like it was such an outlandish claim that I was faking an interest.
I never once faked anything but I've gone out with numerous guys who pull this shit for some reason. The only thing that makes sense is they were trying to fuck with my head on purpose.
Now I focus on myself more cause it seems pointless to be interested in things other people are.
Sorry, that's a shared experience with others as well, minus the obsession
I think attention modulation disorder.. I have the longest AND the shortest attention span ever. I might not finish typing this but also I'll research black holes unblinkingly for 16 hours.
And then forget all of it when you go to talk to someone about it.
I hate my brain.
Oh, but on a positive note. I’ve been able to go back and rewatch my favorite shows like every season is brand new except for a few episodes that really really stood out to me.
The biggest impact from my adhd is actually a shorter than average short term memory span. Mine was found to be about 8.5 second, with the average humans being 18.
My long term memory is fine, probably better than most but it's getting stuff in there that's the issue.
Edit: short not shirt
I remember things from my early early childhood. My older sister doesn't remember shit from back then. She has no idea what our forst apartment looked like and when we moved and all that. I remember everything.
But when i put my screwdriver somewhere, 4 seconds later, the screwdriver might as well not exist anymore.
I seriously remember breastfeeding. I remember sleeping in a crib beside my brother. I can close my eyes and tour every place I spent time as a child.
And like your sister, my brother remembers none of it. I’ll bring up something that meant a lot to me and he always replies the same, “I don’t remember that time.”
Like this one weekend. We rented Turner and Hooch, We’re Back: A Dinosaur Story, and Fern Gully. We intended to stay up and watch them so we pulled out the bed from the couch and instead talked until we fell asleep. We got up early and watched all three. My brother was nuts about the character Batty and wanted everything Robin Williams was in after that. He went around all day saying “are you sure? Are you positive? Only fools are positive.” I seen the cartoons only once and I still remember character names and plot lines.
I tear up thinking about that morning. Him, “I wish I could remember it.” And that’s his answer for all of it.
Now ask me what I did two days ago. My answer will be the same as his for what we were doing then. I legit can’t remember past yesterday.
I'm in the same boat. What generally works for me is writing it down and learning from physical books. For whatever reason those two things combined help get things past the poor short term and into the long term storage
Yeah writing down is a big help, I think it's too do with multiple things. You have to focus more on what you're actually writing. As well as you have chance for multiple memories, the thinking itself, think of writing it, actually writing it, the muscle memory of writing it, and then reading it again afterwards.
Yea exactly. And part of it too is if you're taking notes and get kinda distracted in the middle the "lost thought" is right there on the page so picking back up is easier
Nothing like having to constantly remind yourself about things so you don’t forget, even little things like transcribing a measurement or something, or sit immobilized over a pending event because you don’t want to do anything that might distract you from engaging in said thing. Having to re-read things several times to keep it in short term memory and then having to check that yes, indeed, you did it right, and then check a couple more times to remember that yes, you did check it, and it’s still right.
Fffuuuhhh…. hate that.
Nah should be Dopamine attention variability executive disorder(I'm misremembering it I'm sure somehow). Otherwise known as DAVE
It was a meme on tt trying to rename it and people used a audio from something else that said that. It's been so long I forgot about it until seeing this. I'll have to search it up
Yeah, I’ll call it whatever Dr. Russell Barkley says to call it.
Jesus, take the wheel!
...no, not like that!
Aka if you didn't want me to fidgety in this box, don't put me in a box, dipshit
Hello fellow cubicle mouse
Everyone else is boring af - syndrome
Given they are both mediated by dopamine signaling this actually makes sense?
What about just 'Wheeeeeee!'?
La
I don't even think it should be labeled as a disorder. Or at least people should be more aware of what a disorder means. It doesn't necessarily mean there is anything wrong with the person. The behavior just happens to not be suitable for the particular environment they are in and causes difficulties. If you change environments to one that allows that behavior to no longer be a problem then they no longer have a disorder.
You clearly don’t understand ADHD.
This is how a mental disorder is medically defined. What are you suggesting?
That you don’t understand ADHD.
You don't understand. It's only a mental disorder because we have built environments for people that are not suitable for everybody. It's possible that there may not exist an environment that makes any mental disorder not be a problem, but ADD and ADHD in my opinion is not one of them. Many countries don't recognize these as a mental disorders because they haven't built a society that causes problems for people with ADD or ADHD.
As someone with ADD I find it a bit ridiculous that because I can't pay absolute attention on something I'm uninterested in while stuck in a room unable to leave that I have a mental disorder. The problem doesn't lie with me, but with the environment I am in. But alas, that is just how a mental order is defined.
So much to unpick here, and so little inclination to bother. Like many with ADHD, I’m sick of dealing with the constant disinformation and toxic positivity that surrounds this condition - and which you’re contributing to.
If you think ADHD is about attention, then you really still don’t get it. Go and watch Dr Russell Barkley’s videos on YouTube. There’s a seminar about 2.5 hours long that is well worth the time.
I might need some more education apparently, so the seminar you're talking about is this one ?
Environmental factors can certainly exacerbate mental disorders like ADHD, but they are not the sole cause. Just because there are countries that don't recognize mental disorders as well as others just means they are not up to snuff.
What you described in your second paragraph is just being bored. Not being able to focus on uninteresting topics in a poor environment is standard for most people.
I'm going to support what the person you responded to said, you don't know what ADHD is.
Environmental factors? Cause? You have completely misunderstood. This is just a discussion of semantics.
I'm curious what you would change about (Western?) society to make ADHD manageable like it apparently already is in "many countries," in concrete well defined terms. Not sure how society could negate the emotional regulation issues that frequently come with ADHD. I would also emphasize there's a distinction between "a society where people with ADHD can function" and "a society perfectly suited for people with ADHD."
I'm sensing that ADHD is a label thrust upon you, and if you feel you function fine without any sort of treatment it's probably not accurate. It's also now occurring to me how hilariously easy it would be to troll any sort of mental health issue. Depression isn't a disorder it's just SADNESS coming from MODERN SOCIETY and we just need to uncheck the CAUSE DEPRESSION box in society's configuration.
I find it a bit ridiculous that because I can’t pay absolute attention on something I’m uninterested in while stuck in a room unable to leave that I have a mental disorder.
If that's all you think ADD and ADHD are, then I'm with the other guy...you don't understand ADHD.
Sounds like you stopped learning about this in the 90s. It's not even "labelled" as ADD anymore because it doesn't truly grasp the scope of the disorder.
You're a primitive human in the wild. You're hunting, tracking the prey for a long time. You get distracted and start doing something else. You die. Perhaps even your entire family may starve. This is why it's a disorder across very different environments. It can affect the person's ability to cope across extremely different environments.
Likewise, if you have impulse control problems with your ADHD, you might not be able to prevent yourself from making a noise or movement at the wrong time, scaring off the prey or getting the attention of a predator (like a lion). Well, there goes your survival once again.
Tldw: worse outcomes in education, relationships, careers, automobile safety, finance. So all you have to do is not be in school, drive, be in a relationship (romantic or not), have a career, have credit, etc. Your suggestion that it's just the environment and all we have to do is change how finance, the job market, education, and human relationships work and get fully self driving cars right now is not only woefully uninformed but also such a massive undertaking to the point of being a joke.
I suggested no such thing. You are coming to wild conclusions on your own. Please read it again more carefully. I have in no way suggested that it is possible to change the environment.
If you change environments to one that allows that behavior to no longer be a problem then they no longer have a disorder.
This you?
Where in this sentence is it implied that it is possible let alone easily doable to change the environment? Using an "if" conditional implies a hypothetical and nothing more. You people are being nonsensical and looking to be angry for reason beyond comprehension at this point.
I don't even think it should be labeled as a disorder... If you change environments to one that allows that behavior to no longer be a problem then they no longer have a disorder.
So you don't think it should be labeled a disorder because doing something that you are now claiming is you never said "possible let alone easily doable" fixes it?
Please clarify exactly why you don't think it should be called a disorder. You seem to be rapidly backpedaling about what you did or didn't say without actually backing up your point, just whining that any mistake on your part is a misunderstanding on mine. You have an opportunity to clarify instead of whine, explicitly. So go ahead, clarify why it shouldn't be a disorder.
I have dealt with ADD and a problem called misophonia my entire life. I'll stick with misophonia for now since it is easier to summarize. This is a very real difference with my mind that can be thought of as "not normal" among the majority. Specific sounds cause what can be described as an anxiety attack for me. This is completely out of my control and no amount of logical reasoning can make my body stop behaving this way. Even when I know for certain there is nothing wrong with that sound and I shouldn't be so annoyed with it. Regardless, it has caused me a lot of trouble being able to function in modern society where I can't avoid being around these specific sounds. When something different with your mind starts to cause significant problems functioning in society is when we label something as a mental disorder. This is literally the definition of a mental disorder. Now imagine for a moment there was an environment that didn't have any of these sounds that cause me problems. Or how about an environment with no sounds at all? The difference with my mind would never even have an opportunity to present itself and thus would never even be known. Therefore it can be said that I don't have a mental disorder in this environment. It is likely not possible for most mental disorders to have any feasible change environment that could make it not difficult to exist in that environment. I've made no such claims and that is an entirely a fabrication of yours.
The crux of the problem I am getting at is that the way people think of mental disorders is from an ableist perspective. That there is something wrong with the person themselves for the way they were born. This is merely a problem of semantics and definitions as I have said many times.
In the future please stop being so rude and intentionally misinterpreting intent. You give off the impression of a very rude person with ableist points of view which is rather uncool.
You're damn right I'm being rude to somebody that says my very real disorder shouldn't be recognized because if we were in an environment that doesn't exist we'd be ok, so it doesn't really count . Well, I live in a real place that I can't control and I have very real maladaptations to it. There is absolutely something wrong with me that will likely shorten my life and make it worse in a number of ways. Pretending that those outcomes don't exist or erasing the struggle of the people with ADHD, including your own, by saying it doesn't deserve to be classified as a disorder is erasure and ableist. I'm not misinterpreting your point, it's just a bad point.
TIL I'm not poor because in a different environment (where money doesn't exist) I'm fine!
One person with ADHD to you: you're wildly misunderstanding or you're trolling. There is no alternative here.
They are not suggesting ADHD should not be recognized as something we deserve accomodations for. They are saying the exact opposite on a true but unrealistic level. They are saying it's only a problem that requires accomodations because of the way the world runs on neurotypical ideas and generally under neurotypical leadership. Everything.
Neurotypical folks will never question the 9-5 because it works for them. But it's a problem for them if you can't maintain working schedules.
They will never understand the constant executive challenges we face, so they cannot relate to our struggles. They don't care enough to empathize, so it's an ironic character judgement against you.
Finding a job that even tickles your interest is hard. Finding leadership that gets it is very difficult. Making it through the screening process to the interview can be almost impossible. But that's just how things are, right?
The environmental problem is neurotypical dominance at every level of life from the top down and the expectations you will held to by default as a direct result of that. The ease with which you are brushed off is a result of the combination of those unfair expectations, their lack of understanding, and the connotation of "disorder." It makes you a problem not worth considering to them.
The desire for freedom from the expectation of working like a robot on a rigid schedule doing something that doesn't interest you in the slightest, is probably universal. Sure.
There are plenty of ADHD folks who are able to outperform neurotypical peers when they have a suitable environment. They typically have quite a few accomodations being made by empathetic leadership to create the mental space they need. In my own case, this meant a near complete disregard for when working hours occur, judgements based on results as opposed to daily stand-ups and reports, and completely bypassing hierarchies of communication to limit people's access to pulling me out of hyperfocus.
Not like overwhelming people with needlessly repetitive information stretched out over long periods of time littered with small talk and nonsense doesn't have value, it's just completely counter to what the ADHD brain needs to work.
The almost complete lack of alternatives which align to your natural cycles and focus states is a social failing to recognize that you are not disordered at all. You just do not have viable options so they slapped disordered on you and make you jump through fees and hoops for accomodations. Because this is America: one size fits all or you're broken.
So here you are, demanding they close your cage and keep you in there. (which is a shitty band-aid you appear to recognize is the best we've got)
Since changing the world in that way (suggested by Izzy) is impossible, it is trolling everyone to suggest that the problem isn't real because if the environment were changed it wouldn't be a problem. It's a hypothetical fantasy and should have been stated as such. It's a shallow excuse to argue to invalidate the experiences of others. An attempt to lessen how seriously this disorder is seen. It is so precisely written and constructed to do this, that it seems quite impossible to have been an accident. Basic composition classes in college struggle to teach people to do this on purpose so clearly and succinctly.
No, genuinely, you're reading it wrong and taking it personally because others already started the downvote train. Yes what they suggest isn't immediately realistic, but it's easily achievable if people actually wanted to do it.
Like are you under the belief that all of our social structures were borne out of the natural order of the universe - entirely immutable and incapable of change?
Is it truly not possible in your mind that we are arbitrarily subjecting ourselves to unnecessary cruelty for the comfort of people who think change can't happen?
They never said the problem isn't real. They said the way society is structured is what make it manifest as a problem because society is not equipped to accommodate you as you deserve. You don't deserve to be treated as a broken individual, you deserve to not have an unjustly difficult life because of something you were born with. Giving it a negative connotation label as a disorder affects the way people (without a clinical understanding of the word) behave toward you. The label is enhancing the harm you face and would be the first step toward altering the public understanding of ADHD.
you're wildly misunderstanding or you're trolling.
Yeah, blocking you, too. That's not the start to a good faith conversation.
I understand. I disagree. I refuse to pretend ADHD would be great in some magical land. It would still suck. I would still be tired all the time. I would still have many symptoms that have no upside. I would still want it gone.
Ok troll
Looks like @Skiv must be @Izzy on a second user account.
I have to assume you are trolling at this point. Please go away if you are going to be an asshole. You are completely fabricating nonsense on your own which makes me feel like you are just making fun of people with conditions. This is directly against the rules.
It most certainly is a disorder. Makes everything in my life more challenging.
You have misunderstood what has been said. It's more challenging because society has built an environment that is not suitable for you and many others. This is just a matter of semantics and how to attribute fault with definitions. It's not your fault who you are is not suitable for the way things are. It's the way things are that are not suitable for you.
We aren't neurotypical, that's really all there is to it. Doesn't really have anything to do with how society is structured.
That might the gist of it, but it definitely has everything to do with how the environment is structured. There might be no other feasible way to structure the environment though.
Not really, though. Rigid structure helps with ADHD, but only when someone else is enforcing the structure. Prepubescent kids with ADHD aren't typically capable of maintaining their own structure. They aren't neurotypical, it's more than distraction and energy, they have a functioning issue. They can't tune out all the stimulus that normal brains do, and because of it they miss a lot of social cues that help with development.
My son has ADHD and no amount of reorienting our family environment would help him - he could (and has) literally be in a bare concrete room with nothing but his thoughts and get distracted and slam his hands together making exploding/punching sounds for hours, where a typical kid would get bored in seconds.
I feel like rigid structure is when my ADHD gets worse...
By the same logic paraplegics aren't disabled because they just aren't in an environment suitable for physically disabled people.
While societal changes can help, there is plenty that environment can't fix.
A set of conditions becomes a disorder when they have a significant negative impact on a person. It's the difference between "oh I'm so OCD giggle"and "if I don't flip the light switch exactly four times, someone will die". Even under perfect conditions, there are still negative impacts.
Declassifying it only hurts patients as then insurance and society at large world be given no reason to cut a little slack (for lack of a faster description).
you're like almost getting at the social model of disability, but framing it in a way that invalidates people's lived experiences of having a brain that works fundamentally differently from the norm.
I'm not doing any such thing. Everyone has just had some weird misunderstanding. The topic of the thread is about putting a positive spin on the term and I am agreeing to that as it is something I personally deal with. I find that the term "disorder" has an unfair negative connotation and could possibly be called something else. Preferably with a more positive connotation that doesn't imply there is something wrong being born this way. If that isn't possible then people should at least understand the medical definition of what a disorder is to help remove the negative connotation.
The response has been disturbing to say the least. Considering how ridiculous some people have been I have to assume negative intent of trolling and ableism.
Try to keep in mind how many redditors are now on lemmy.
They get emotional and want to fight over semantics and anecdotes constantly especially when they realize they've assumed intent incorrectly. They only know how to double down. It's not their fault.
They're only hearing "your problem isn't real" because they're not listening.
"Disorder" can be seen negatively. That is fair. However, if you use a milder term than "disorder", then it is even harder for people to take ADHD seriously as a real thing. This is already a challenge, and using a less serious word would make it worse.
I like “Executive Function Disorder” as it actually describes the underlying issue and not just the symptoms that other people can see.
This is what I would vote for if there was a vote on it.
It's a disorder in our society, because it require you to do task you've been ask to do, but if you would just live your life I don't think you would call it a disorder, more like a different way of processing tasks
(edit) I'm not saying that changing your environment would resolve the problem, since I'm under medication I can clearly do more things on my free/personal time than before. Hmmm yeah, I kinda lost the track of my thoughts now, can discard as it's an edit. stop.
Well, in the wild, if you couldn't concentrate on one thing long enough to hunt/gather/fish, then you wouldn't eat, and would weed yourself out of the gene pool.
It's the other way around - ADHD exists because there's a bunch of cool stuff worth noticing in nature. Not everyone in the tribe needed to concentrate on fishing.
It's the same with colorblind people. Just one colorblind person is at a disadvantage, but while hunting they might notice the animal camouflaged for normal color vision. In a tribe, the different perspective is helpful.
Russell Barkley, the worlds leading expert on ADHD (as far as I can tell) has a video where he shows that this is not likely to be true.
Rather, the continued presence of ADHD in our gene pool has to do with how many factors genetic factors can cause it, and basically the mutation rate causing ADHD is now balanced with the rate that we die off without reproducing.
Do you have a link?
Lol, I responded to your message, and then went to look for the links to add. But my meds hadn't kicked in yet, and I got distracted.
These 2 videos are him discussing this topic, be warned, they're 20 and 15 minutes. Personally I find his delivery and information engaging enough to watch, but only somtimes.
Is ADHD Good for Something? ADHD as an Adaptation - Part I
Is ADHD Good for Something? ADHD as an Adaptation - Part II
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/watch?v=kRrvUGjRVsc
https://piped.video/watch?v=ORq8VNIjDRA
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source, check me out at GitHub.
@slotos@feddit.nl
I saw a notification and read half your comment, but then you deleted it.
Did you end up watching the vid and changing your mind? It’s been a minute since I watched it, and also only caught part of your comment, so I don’t know if your concerns were addressed.
I’m always open to constructive discussion .
Except we would be the ones hyperfocusing on making that fucking fire that Steve gave up onto after 2h of trying, or we would stay up late to keep the tribe safe when everyone else starts to fall asleep. A lot of the disfunction is just an incompatibility with our current lifestyle.
The more I learn about ADHD, the less I see it as a disorder. I see it more as a personality trait. Unfortunately most of our society is based on people not having that personality trait, making it harder to fit in.
On the other hand, if you're lucky enough to find a lifestyle that fits your personality type, that personality type is actually very helpful, the opposite of a disorder.
As someone with ADHD I'd describe the experience more like profound boredem with everything in life. You seek obsession because you can't generate excitement for normal activities on your own
There are very few videos games I can play because of this. I love gaming, but finding one that I like is extremely challenging.
Same, dude. Recently it's been Skyrim for me. Started it up on a whim for the umpteenth time and have sunk 80ish hours into a save file again and have rented a PS VR to try Skyrim VR. Aside from Overwatch, that's the only game I currently see myself playing regularly lol
starfield you may also enjoy alr have 40 hours into the game
Omg same re: skyrim
If I'm playing with my friends the excitement of making jokes and having fun is enough for me. But if I'm alone no game brings me joy if it's not my current hyper fixation.
Or ones that I like too much, see my 15 year addiction to WoW. So many little dopamines to find!
If I didn't have to do life, I'd just play wow
I imagine myself in old age in a retirement home playing wow all day
But once you find one that hits that hyperfixation itch, ohhhh maaaaaan.
For me it's gotta be the right level of challenge. I want to like the loop in Souls games but can't get past the frustration. Hollow Knight, however, was just right and I loved it.
Other things that work for me is the Factorio style- especially Satisfactory because when you fuck up you don't need to tear it all down and rebuild.
Feel this pretty hard. I tend to like the ones with a really good tactile feedback. Anything with tight melee combat gets a gold star from me. (Fury is probably one of my favorite games of all time)
I just saw someone on Reddit who claimed this profound boredom with everything was why they didn't have ADHD. Apparently the list of symptoms they were reading did not accurately describe the depths of ADHD boredom, and they thought their boredom was a worse breed that indicated some far worse mental problem.
Had to tell 'em.
I have no hobbies I enjoy longer than about a month except gaming, and even then I still get like a month mileage out of each game. I can't hold a job because every time I start a new one it's like a ticking timebomb in my brain until I can't handle it anymore. Even if the job is easy and the people are nice. Something about the repetitive schedule and saying/hearing/doing the same thing every day brings me to a near panic attack level of restlessness and anxiety.
Oh my god this is so accurate. I'm barely on the spectrum, and I can only imagine what it must feel like to have full ADHD.
Whenever I read a description from someone with ADHD I can almost always 100% relate to that experience, but whenever I read something from "professional" source I start thinking I might not have it and just killed my attention span with social media consumption...
Buddy if you are waiting for a Sign, this is it. It'll never get more concrete than this message I'm typing for you right now. Having a lot of doubts is common. It wasn't truly real for me until I started medication.
My broad advice is to find a good psychiatrist (and don't be afraid to switch if you aren't happy) and dig as deep as possible for evidence both for and against. Go in with confidence that you have ADHD symptoms, but keep an open mind since there are alternative explanations. A diagnosis of "no you don't have ADHD it's actually ____" is also important information to know, and you will regret letting it drag out if you do have ADHD.
Unrelated anecdote:
I was driving one time, and got lost in my city. I drove a church. Their billboard read:
Lost? Come in and ask for directions! As in the spiritual kind.
Anyway, I decided to drive on, and get progressively more lost. I decide to turn around. I make my way back to the church, and on the reverse side of the billboard:
Need a sign from god? This could be it!
So I stopped and asked for directions...
I'm probably undiagnosed inattentive. I'm also not one to make a statement like that lightly. I'm notorious among my social circle for diving down rabbitholes and sending them endless mental lint articles. I wish I could turn it off sometimes.
Turning it off is why I cling to weed since I first tried it. It dulls the noise and allows for a single line of thought to come through unobstructed, in my case.
Honestly, my thoughts bounce around like an angry bee in a coffee can. It sucks.
Thank you for that metaphor. I love it.
This is the same for me. Comes with downsides too, but I've found weed incredibly valuable for.. not really controlling or prompting hyperfocus states, but definitely a strong catalyst.
Still don't really feel in control over which single line of interest gets the focus, but at least it's not everything.
It's kinda crazy sometimes, how I notice I've been thinking the same thought for minutes. I don't think I have ADHD, but probably ADD, my mind is just all over the place through the day, but after a bowl it all just calms down. Kinda like a group of people organizing into a queue.
add has been reclassified as ADHD
same it seems like about the only thing that has actually helped I've tried a couple meds and they either make me feel like shit or don't do anything except for when the weed brings you down a rabbit hole and your ADHD goes with it then your fucked but other then that it's great
I even told my doctor it's been one of the main reasons I continue to smoke other than how it also makes my body feel pretty good (like walking on clouds; no aches or pains or at least dulled aches and pains). He still gave me some anxiety meds, but they are only for when I'm actively having an anxiety attack. I have never taken one, though. I've never been unable to have access to weed since getting that prescription, which prevents me having anxiety attacks to begin with. The only time I've had an anxiety attack while on weed, I had gotten some gnarly ass sativa, got hella baked on it, and then unexpectedly had to go to the welfare office and talk to government people which made me paranoid AF and have an attack right outside before going in. 🤣
The show I'm a Virgo has a character who's superpower is basically adhd. She moves extremely fast and is constantly bored. I identify deeply with Flora, especially at work. I struggle with boredom and unstructured time, so I do like twice as much work as most of my coworkers. I'm routinely sales lead without really trying. I thrive on the busy days that most people find overwhelming.
This might sound silly but I'm trying to attract someone who told me in the past they have ADHD. Should I be doing anything differently?
Leave out a few pieces of cheese, and sit very quietly. If the cheese doesn't work, try cookies, they tend to attract most things
Lol, but to answer the question seriously you might need to be slightly more direct than with someone who can focus through a whole conversation. It really depends on the person and the severity of their symptoms, but in general just trust your instincts. People w/ ADHD aren't known for hiding how they feel haha
ah yeah, this is what I was wondering about! I had heard that before and thought maybe I was being too subtle this whole time.
They often compliment my hair and what I'm wearing but won't go further than that. One time I complimented their hair and they blushed HARD. Like put their head down and looked a little embarrassed. Like maybe they only want to compliment me and not the other way around?
Some things that might explain the intense blushing:
a) anxiety is comorbid with ADHD. What this means is that if they do have ADHD/ADD then is it highly likely they also have some sort of generalized anxiety.
b) if this person is amab then any sort of compliment is going to send them over the moon. amab individuals rarely get the same romantic attention that afab's do. So it's entirely possible they simply didn't know how to respond to that situation (I still remember the first time a person complimented me)
All of this is to say it sounds like you have a good handle on the situation but you might want to consider slowly ramping up the obviousness of your intents and watch how they respond. Obviously do whatever you are comfortable with, but it is probably a good idea to try and take the lead in this situation (but again, trust your instincts)
I think they are amab but they ride the androgyny line pretty hard so I can't really tell.
I started wearing a trans flag necklace and noticed they started really warming up to me once they saw it. Last time I was around them they made it a point to stand very close to me to tell me something so you're right - I think I just need to ramp up my interest in them so they notice more.
I do hope they like cheese as much as I do.
Relevant SMBC
Take a genuine interest in their obsessions. Not a performative "I want you to see I like this for you" but a real "I've been going out and doing this on my own for the past few weeks/months and I want to talk about it"
You do actually have to do it, they'll spot your bullshit before you speak it.
It's so crazy you brought this up. I've been accused of faking interest in the past when I wasn't and was actually doing the thing on my own.
My last ex did this a lot actually. Great example - he started watching Columbo so I took an interest and also started watching it. Then he like got upset? Told me not to be interested in it at one point?
I had another guy do this too but with hip hop and he waited until we were like two years into the relationship to accuse me of not really being into old school hip hop? Like why. I was literally living with the guy and he would come in the room where I would be listening to stuff on my own. Hell I still listen to Three 6 Mafia and Digital Underground. I even knew about Digital Underground before I ever met him. Like it was such an outlandish claim that I was faking an interest.
I never once faked anything but I've gone out with numerous guys who pull this shit for some reason. The only thing that makes sense is they were trying to fuck with my head on purpose.
Now I focus on myself more cause it seems pointless to be interested in things other people are.
Sorry, that's a shared experience with others as well, minus the obsession
I think attention modulation disorder.. I have the longest AND the shortest attention span ever. I might not finish typing this but also I'll research black holes unblinkingly for 16 hours.
And then forget all of it when you go to talk to someone about it.
I hate my brain.
Oh, but on a positive note. I’ve been able to go back and rewatch my favorite shows like every season is brand new except for a few episodes that really really stood out to me.
The biggest impact from my adhd is actually a shorter than average short term memory span. Mine was found to be about 8.5 second, with the average humans being 18.
My long term memory is fine, probably better than most but it's getting stuff in there that's the issue.
Edit: short not shirt
I remember things from my early early childhood. My older sister doesn't remember shit from back then. She has no idea what our forst apartment looked like and when we moved and all that. I remember everything.
But when i put my screwdriver somewhere, 4 seconds later, the screwdriver might as well not exist anymore.
I seriously remember breastfeeding. I remember sleeping in a crib beside my brother. I can close my eyes and tour every place I spent time as a child.
And like your sister, my brother remembers none of it. I’ll bring up something that meant a lot to me and he always replies the same, “I don’t remember that time.”
Like this one weekend. We rented Turner and Hooch, We’re Back: A Dinosaur Story, and Fern Gully. We intended to stay up and watch them so we pulled out the bed from the couch and instead talked until we fell asleep. We got up early and watched all three. My brother was nuts about the character Batty and wanted everything Robin Williams was in after that. He went around all day saying “are you sure? Are you positive? Only fools are positive.” I seen the cartoons only once and I still remember character names and plot lines.
I tear up thinking about that morning. Him, “I wish I could remember it.” And that’s his answer for all of it.
Now ask me what I did two days ago. My answer will be the same as his for what we were doing then. I legit can’t remember past yesterday.
Hey you have the same thing as Marilu Henner!
https://www.brainandlife.org/articles/actress-marilu-henner-has-a-highly-superior-autobiographical-memory-a#:~:text=Actress%20Marilu%20Henner%20has%20a,Take%20April%2030%2C%201980.
I hate it when I forget about my shirt
I'm in the same boat. What generally works for me is writing it down and learning from physical books. For whatever reason those two things combined help get things past the poor short term and into the long term storage
Yeah writing down is a big help, I think it's too do with multiple things. You have to focus more on what you're actually writing. As well as you have chance for multiple memories, the thinking itself, think of writing it, actually writing it, the muscle memory of writing it, and then reading it again afterwards.
Yea exactly. And part of it too is if you're taking notes and get kinda distracted in the middle the "lost thought" is right there on the page so picking back up is easier
Nothing like having to constantly remind yourself about things so you don’t forget, even little things like transcribing a measurement or something, or sit immobilized over a pending event because you don’t want to do anything that might distract you from engaging in said thing. Having to re-read things several times to keep it in short term memory and then having to check that yes, indeed, you did it right, and then check a couple more times to remember that yes, you did check it, and it’s still right.
Fffuuuhhh…. hate that.
Nah should be Dopamine attention variability executive disorder(I'm misremembering it I'm sure somehow). Otherwise known as DAVE
Cue the "God >!FUCKING!< DAMMIT DAVE" Audio lol
Dave's not here man
Sorry should've posted what it was referencing
I miss that ref, could somebody elaborate?
It was a meme on tt trying to rename it and people used a audio from something else that said that. It's been so long I forgot about it until seeing this. I'll have to search it up
Found it, this is it
Or DDD, dopamin deficiency disorder
Yeah, I’ll call it whatever Dr. Russell Barkley says to call it.
Jesus, take the wheel!
...no, not like that!
Aka if you didn't want me to fidgety in this box, don't put me in a box, dipshit
Hello fellow cubicle mouse
Everyone else is boring af - syndrome
Given they are both mediated by dopamine signaling this actually makes sense?
What about just 'Wheeeeeee!'?
La
I don't even think it should be labeled as a disorder. Or at least people should be more aware of what a disorder means. It doesn't necessarily mean there is anything wrong with the person. The behavior just happens to not be suitable for the particular environment they are in and causes difficulties. If you change environments to one that allows that behavior to no longer be a problem then they no longer have a disorder.
You clearly don’t understand ADHD.
This is how a mental disorder is medically defined. What are you suggesting?
That you don’t understand ADHD.
You don't understand. It's only a mental disorder because we have built environments for people that are not suitable for everybody. It's possible that there may not exist an environment that makes any mental disorder not be a problem, but ADD and ADHD in my opinion is not one of them. Many countries don't recognize these as a mental disorders because they haven't built a society that causes problems for people with ADD or ADHD.
As someone with ADD I find it a bit ridiculous that because I can't pay absolute attention on something I'm uninterested in while stuck in a room unable to leave that I have a mental disorder. The problem doesn't lie with me, but with the environment I am in. But alas, that is just how a mental order is defined.
So much to unpick here, and so little inclination to bother. Like many with ADHD, I’m sick of dealing with the constant disinformation and toxic positivity that surrounds this condition - and which you’re contributing to.
If you think ADHD is about attention, then you really still don’t get it. Go and watch Dr Russell Barkley’s videos on YouTube. There’s a seminar about 2.5 hours long that is well worth the time.
I might need some more education apparently, so the seminar you're talking about is this one ?
https://piped.video/watch?v=YSfCdBBqNXY?si=Wpr0koBLjoV6CF_o
Environmental factors can certainly exacerbate mental disorders like ADHD, but they are not the sole cause. Just because there are countries that don't recognize mental disorders as well as others just means they are not up to snuff.
What you described in your second paragraph is just being bored. Not being able to focus on uninteresting topics in a poor environment is standard for most people.
I'm going to support what the person you responded to said, you don't know what ADHD is.
Environmental factors? Cause? You have completely misunderstood. This is just a discussion of semantics.
I'm curious what you would change about (Western?) society to make ADHD manageable like it apparently already is in "many countries," in concrete well defined terms. Not sure how society could negate the emotional regulation issues that frequently come with ADHD. I would also emphasize there's a distinction between "a society where people with ADHD can function" and "a society perfectly suited for people with ADHD."
I'm sensing that ADHD is a label thrust upon you, and if you feel you function fine without any sort of treatment it's probably not accurate. It's also now occurring to me how hilariously easy it would be to troll any sort of mental health issue. Depression isn't a disorder it's just SADNESS coming from MODERN SOCIETY and we just need to uncheck the CAUSE DEPRESSION box in society's configuration.
If that's all you think ADD and ADHD are, then I'm with the other guy...you don't understand ADHD.
Sounds like you stopped learning about this in the 90s. It's not even "labelled" as ADD anymore because it doesn't truly grasp the scope of the disorder.
You're a primitive human in the wild. You're hunting, tracking the prey for a long time. You get distracted and start doing something else. You die. Perhaps even your entire family may starve. This is why it's a disorder across very different environments. It can affect the person's ability to cope across extremely different environments.
Likewise, if you have impulse control problems with your ADHD, you might not be able to prevent yourself from making a noise or movement at the wrong time, scaring off the prey or getting the attention of a predator (like a lion). Well, there goes your survival once again.
Nope, it's definitely in my head.
My thoughts are definitely disordered.
Here's an expert talking about outcomes https://youtube.com/watch?v=26V6LCbKXJU&si=Mu1mO845lvJYCgH8
Tldw: worse outcomes in education, relationships, careers, automobile safety, finance. So all you have to do is not be in school, drive, be in a relationship (romantic or not), have a career, have credit, etc. Your suggestion that it's just the environment and all we have to do is change how finance, the job market, education, and human relationships work and get fully self driving cars right now is not only woefully uninformed but also such a massive undertaking to the point of being a joke.
I suggested no such thing. You are coming to wild conclusions on your own. Please read it again more carefully. I have in no way suggested that it is possible to change the environment.
This you?
Where in this sentence is it implied that it is possible let alone easily doable to change the environment? Using an "if" conditional implies a hypothetical and nothing more. You people are being nonsensical and looking to be angry for reason beyond comprehension at this point.
So you don't think it should be labeled a disorder because doing something that you are now claiming is you never said "possible let alone easily doable" fixes it?
Please clarify exactly why you don't think it should be called a disorder. You seem to be rapidly backpedaling about what you did or didn't say without actually backing up your point, just whining that any mistake on your part is a misunderstanding on mine. You have an opportunity to clarify instead of whine, explicitly. So go ahead, clarify why it shouldn't be a disorder.
I have dealt with ADD and a problem called misophonia my entire life. I'll stick with misophonia for now since it is easier to summarize. This is a very real difference with my mind that can be thought of as "not normal" among the majority. Specific sounds cause what can be described as an anxiety attack for me. This is completely out of my control and no amount of logical reasoning can make my body stop behaving this way. Even when I know for certain there is nothing wrong with that sound and I shouldn't be so annoyed with it. Regardless, it has caused me a lot of trouble being able to function in modern society where I can't avoid being around these specific sounds. When something different with your mind starts to cause significant problems functioning in society is when we label something as a mental disorder. This is literally the definition of a mental disorder. Now imagine for a moment there was an environment that didn't have any of these sounds that cause me problems. Or how about an environment with no sounds at all? The difference with my mind would never even have an opportunity to present itself and thus would never even be known. Therefore it can be said that I don't have a mental disorder in this environment. It is likely not possible for most mental disorders to have any feasible change environment that could make it not difficult to exist in that environment. I've made no such claims and that is an entirely a fabrication of yours.
The crux of the problem I am getting at is that the way people think of mental disorders is from an ableist perspective. That there is something wrong with the person themselves for the way they were born. This is merely a problem of semantics and definitions as I have said many times.
In the future please stop being so rude and intentionally misinterpreting intent. You give off the impression of a very rude person with ableist points of view which is rather uncool.
You're damn right I'm being rude to somebody that says my very real disorder shouldn't be recognized because if we were in an environment that doesn't exist we'd be ok, so it doesn't really count . Well, I live in a real place that I can't control and I have very real maladaptations to it. There is absolutely something wrong with me that will likely shorten my life and make it worse in a number of ways. Pretending that those outcomes don't exist or erasing the struggle of the people with ADHD, including your own, by saying it doesn't deserve to be classified as a disorder is erasure and ableist. I'm not misinterpreting your point, it's just a bad point.
TIL I'm not poor because in a different environment (where money doesn't exist) I'm fine!
One person with ADHD to you: you're wildly misunderstanding or you're trolling. There is no alternative here.
They are not suggesting ADHD should not be recognized as something we deserve accomodations for. They are saying the exact opposite on a true but unrealistic level. They are saying it's only a problem that requires accomodations because of the way the world runs on neurotypical ideas and generally under neurotypical leadership. Everything.
Neurotypical folks will never question the 9-5 because it works for them. But it's a problem for them if you can't maintain working schedules.
They will never understand the constant executive challenges we face, so they cannot relate to our struggles. They don't care enough to empathize, so it's an ironic character judgement against you.
Finding a job that even tickles your interest is hard. Finding leadership that gets it is very difficult. Making it through the screening process to the interview can be almost impossible. But that's just how things are, right?
The environmental problem is neurotypical dominance at every level of life from the top down and the expectations you will held to by default as a direct result of that. The ease with which you are brushed off is a result of the combination of those unfair expectations, their lack of understanding, and the connotation of "disorder." It makes you a problem not worth considering to them.
The desire for freedom from the expectation of working like a robot on a rigid schedule doing something that doesn't interest you in the slightest, is probably universal. Sure.
There are plenty of ADHD folks who are able to outperform neurotypical peers when they have a suitable environment. They typically have quite a few accomodations being made by empathetic leadership to create the mental space they need. In my own case, this meant a near complete disregard for when working hours occur, judgements based on results as opposed to daily stand-ups and reports, and completely bypassing hierarchies of communication to limit people's access to pulling me out of hyperfocus.
Not like overwhelming people with needlessly repetitive information stretched out over long periods of time littered with small talk and nonsense doesn't have value, it's just completely counter to what the ADHD brain needs to work.
The almost complete lack of alternatives which align to your natural cycles and focus states is a social failing to recognize that you are not disordered at all. You just do not have viable options so they slapped disordered on you and make you jump through fees and hoops for accomodations. Because this is America: one size fits all or you're broken.
So here you are, demanding they close your cage and keep you in there. (which is a shitty band-aid you appear to recognize is the best we've got)
Since changing the world in that way (suggested by Izzy) is impossible, it is trolling everyone to suggest that the problem isn't real because if the environment were changed it wouldn't be a problem. It's a hypothetical fantasy and should have been stated as such. It's a shallow excuse to argue to invalidate the experiences of others. An attempt to lessen how seriously this disorder is seen. It is so precisely written and constructed to do this, that it seems quite impossible to have been an accident. Basic composition classes in college struggle to teach people to do this on purpose so clearly and succinctly.
No, genuinely, you're reading it wrong and taking it personally because others already started the downvote train. Yes what they suggest isn't immediately realistic, but it's easily achievable if people actually wanted to do it.
Like are you under the belief that all of our social structures were borne out of the natural order of the universe - entirely immutable and incapable of change?
Is it truly not possible in your mind that we are arbitrarily subjecting ourselves to unnecessary cruelty for the comfort of people who think change can't happen?
They never said the problem isn't real. They said the way society is structured is what make it manifest as a problem because society is not equipped to accommodate you as you deserve. You don't deserve to be treated as a broken individual, you deserve to not have an unjustly difficult life because of something you were born with. Giving it a negative connotation label as a disorder affects the way people (without a clinical understanding of the word) behave toward you. The label is enhancing the harm you face and would be the first step toward altering the public understanding of ADHD.
Yeah, blocking you, too. That's not the start to a good faith conversation.
I understand. I disagree. I refuse to pretend ADHD would be great in some magical land. It would still suck. I would still be tired all the time. I would still have many symptoms that have no upside. I would still want it gone.
Ok troll
Looks like @Skiv must be @Izzy on a second user account.
I have to assume you are trolling at this point. Please go away if you are going to be an asshole. You are completely fabricating nonsense on your own which makes me feel like you are just making fun of people with conditions. This is directly against the rules.
It most certainly is a disorder. Makes everything in my life more challenging.
You have misunderstood what has been said. It's more challenging because society has built an environment that is not suitable for you and many others. This is just a matter of semantics and how to attribute fault with definitions. It's not your fault who you are is not suitable for the way things are. It's the way things are that are not suitable for you.
We aren't neurotypical, that's really all there is to it. Doesn't really have anything to do with how society is structured.
That might the gist of it, but it definitely has everything to do with how the environment is structured. There might be no other feasible way to structure the environment though.
Not really, though. Rigid structure helps with ADHD, but only when someone else is enforcing the structure. Prepubescent kids with ADHD aren't typically capable of maintaining their own structure. They aren't neurotypical, it's more than distraction and energy, they have a functioning issue. They can't tune out all the stimulus that normal brains do, and because of it they miss a lot of social cues that help with development.
My son has ADHD and no amount of reorienting our family environment would help him - he could (and has) literally be in a bare concrete room with nothing but his thoughts and get distracted and slam his hands together making exploding/punching sounds for hours, where a typical kid would get bored in seconds.
I feel like rigid structure is when my ADHD gets worse...
By the same logic paraplegics aren't disabled because they just aren't in an environment suitable for physically disabled people.
While societal changes can help, there is plenty that environment can't fix.
A set of conditions becomes a disorder when they have a significant negative impact on a person. It's the difference between "oh I'm so OCD giggle"and "if I don't flip the light switch exactly four times, someone will die". Even under perfect conditions, there are still negative impacts.
Declassifying it only hurts patients as then insurance and society at large world be given no reason to cut a little slack (for lack of a faster description).
you're like almost getting at the social model of disability, but framing it in a way that invalidates people's lived experiences of having a brain that works fundamentally differently from the norm.
I'm not doing any such thing. Everyone has just had some weird misunderstanding. The topic of the thread is about putting a positive spin on the term and I am agreeing to that as it is something I personally deal with. I find that the term "disorder" has an unfair negative connotation and could possibly be called something else. Preferably with a more positive connotation that doesn't imply there is something wrong being born this way. If that isn't possible then people should at least understand the medical definition of what a disorder is to help remove the negative connotation.
The response has been disturbing to say the least. Considering how ridiculous some people have been I have to assume negative intent of trolling and ableism.
Try to keep in mind how many redditors are now on lemmy.
They get emotional and want to fight over semantics and anecdotes constantly especially when they realize they've assumed intent incorrectly. They only know how to double down. It's not their fault.
They're only hearing "your problem isn't real" because they're not listening.
"Disorder" can be seen negatively. That is fair. However, if you use a milder term than "disorder", then it is even harder for people to take ADHD seriously as a real thing. This is already a challenge, and using a less serious word would make it worse.