Donald Trump's Nato comments labelled ‘appalling and unhinged’
And so it begins. Nine months still to go before the next US presidential election and already the Republican party favourite and former President Donald Trump is sending eyes rolling skywards with his seemingly outlandish statements.
And yet they will delight many of his supporters.
Suggesting at a rally in South Carolina that he would "encourage" aggressors (for example Russia) "to do whatever the hell they want" with Nato countries that fail to pay their dues has prompted an immediate slap down from the White House. A spokesman called the comment "appalling and unhinged", saying it was "encouraging invasions of our closest allies by murderous regimes".
Nato Secretary-general Jens Stoltenberg has also responded forcefully, saying: "Any suggestion that allies will not defend each other undermines all of our security, including that of the US, and puts American and European soldiers at increased risk."
But we are going to elect him anyway, because the other guy forgot a thing once. Just like we elected him 8 years ago, because the other one ran her own email server.
We’re going to get Trump again (barf) because the DNC insists on running shit candidates and refuses to acknowledge that they are bad, instead insisting that the voters are just too ignorant to understand how good their candidates really are.
Hillary Clinton was a horrible candidate: immensely unpopular even with the Democrat base, running on a status quo platform right in the wake of disappointment with Obama’s failure to deliver on “hope and change”, and acting as if she was somehow entitled to the position.
Biden is not as bad as Clinton in most ways, but is utterly lackluster and feels more like a moderate Republican. His unwavering support for Israel during their campaign of atrocities is despicable and shameful. The fact that he’s totally ancient and losing his mind isn’t helpful in the least. Why can’t we have a more compelling candidate from the DNC?!
This post will get modded down and ignored, as will the incredibly common and widespread sentiment that it expresses, and we will get Trump again as the nation and the DNC acts shocked yet again. It’s so predictable and infuriating.
If we're going to get Trump again it's in part because of the absolutely all-or-nothing brook-no-compromise attitude of voters. Like this, for example. Biden's support has not been unwavering, he's criticized Israel's actions. But not enough for you, and so he gets no credit whatsoever for any moderation he might have. And that's why you say he "feels like a Republican" to you, because someone can only be 100% totally on your side or they must be on the other side.
I'd love for there to be a viable fully-progressive candidate who happened to agree with everything I believe in. I'd also love to have a pet unicorn. When elections actually roll around in reality, though, none of the candidates are going to be perfect. And unfortunately in many first-past-the-post electorates the system is set up in such a way that there are only two viable candidates. So pick the one that's closest to your views. Push for better candidates in the primary, of course, but accept that you won't always get everything you want.
All the people critisizing """Genocide Joe""" give me a aneurysm when cosidering their alternative:
Yep. The uninformed gEnoCiDe jOe kids are obnoxious. I’ve tried in the beginning to calmly reason with them and explain how things work and I’ve been met with being reported and even banned from a few instances.
Now, when I see them- I just block them from my feed. It’s not worth it. They don’t want to know what they’re doing is dangerous to democracy.
Get out of reddit and take your reasonable pragmatic opinion with you.
Thats what i did. Day one, and im already banned from world news on Lemmy as well now. For calling out russian talking points when they came up.
Then you're doing it right my friend. Hexbear and lemmy.world are overrun by Putin sympathizers who want nothing more than chaos and the continued decline of western democracy.
So messaging a mod wasnt a good move? xD
Only if your message was "I'm sick of your anti-American Russian apologists. Please ban me." in which case that was a BDE move.
Close enough?
I have not found lemmy mods to be reasonable or empathetic at all. They don't give a shit about your opinion so you are likely wasting your time. If it bothers you, just block that instance. If you still want to torture yourself just make another lemmy user. I moved to lemm.ee and cancelled my lemmy.world for this reason.
See, i could block that instamce, but then how would i torture myself with things to bitch about?
The most popular worldnews lemmy is on lemmy.ml it is a tankie shit show.
I was on lemmy.world and no difference. Just pure, unadulterated, kremlin talking points at every corner. But dont u dare call em out! I saw someone point out the accidental russian spelling of a word to being swarmed downvotes.
Tankie bitches gonna tankie bitch.
Biden has actually done a lot to restrain Israel but the MSM fails, as usual because outrage sells. Too bad people just run with whatever is on hand.
That’s the thing though. Biden doesn’t represent my views and voting for him to keep Trump out will be interpreted by the DNC as an endorsement of him and a reason not to change their platform to better suit the electorate. I’ve been doing this lesser-of-two-evils thing for decades now and the outcome keeps getting worse. Maybe it’s just a bad strategy.
The platform of “vote for us or we’ll let the other guy ravage society” is not a compelling platform and rewarding them for running on that platform isn’t going to end well for us. This will turn out for us how paying the Danegeld always does.
You'll vote lesser of two evils in most elections pretty much until the other side starts putting up reasonable candidates. Blaming Democrats for not giving you decent choice just completely misses the point: The Republicans choosing fascism means they aren't a viable choice. They are removing choice from the ballot, not Democrats. You're not being forced into anything by Democrats, they are simply running a platform that you should have the opportunity to disagree with, but you can't, because the other side is fascism.
But let's take the approach of "not rewarding them" for putting out shitty candidates (that aren't fascist). Do you think once the fascists get into power, that Dems will even have the opportunity to change? What is your end game, because not voting for the lesser evil is the acceptance and indifference of either evil, and allows the worst evil to win.
The time for that fight is the primary, local elections, and between election cycles. Refusing to participate at the ballot box because you don't like the choices you've been given is counterproductive, not just pointless.
So don't vote democrat and enjoy your Trump presidency /shrug. What do you really expect anyone to say to this sort of attitude?
Maybe it's a bad strategy, but it may still be the best strategy.
The main point of my post is that even if you don't like Biden, you should at least be truthful in your complaints about him. If you paint him as worse than he actually is then instead of people holding their nose and voting for him they may just not vote at all, or worse.
Just to elaborate, the only real currency we have with the parties is cold hard cash (where we’re hopelessly outgunned) and votes. Giving away our votes without demanding something in return is selling ourselves short. We will /never/ have any sort of real change or progress if we hold our nose and vote for the lesser of two evils. We will only continue to lose ground as we devalue our votes by giving them away for nothing.
I see what you’re saying and I subscribed to that strategy long ago, but in the long run it’s clearly a losing strategy.
So what's the winning strategy? Let Trump win instead?
The world isn't perfect. Holding out for a perfect candidate means never voting, at which point you have nothing to bargain with either.
Go ahead and vote your conscience in the primaries, sure. It's not such a big deal if you hold out for perfect in those. But in the American election system the actual vote for president is going to be between Trump and Biden. It sucks but you get just those two options there.
There’s a phrase I’m reminded of as it’s used in Australian politics quite often when it comes to our Greens party trying amend Labor legislation:
That is, don’t let your quest for the best possible outcome one prevent you from supporting a lesser outcome. Don’t let wanting a super progressive president prevent you from voting for the mildly progressive president which lets the regressive president end up winning.
I don’t like him in that he’s further down the wrong path than we’ve ever been with a Democrat president. He’s further down that path than Nixon or Bush Sr. Holding our noses isn’t working out for us.
I think that the Democratic Party needs to really grasp that it has to work for its votes and build a platform that genuinely attracts voters instead of talking them for granted. I thought the first Trump incident would drive that home for them, but maybe it will take another. Holding our noses will only tell them that they will reliably get votes as long as they’re not as bad as the other guy.
Getting rid of first-past-the-post and breaking up the stranglehold that the D/R dichotomy has on our government is the best strategy, and is in progress, but it’s slow and resisted by the same parties.
Certainly. But can you get it done before the next election? If not, the choice will be between Biden or Trump.
Maybe a nation of 330 million people only having two political parties was a bad thing after all?
Fuck Putin.
100%, May he DIAF. Or were you insinuating that any opposition to Biden (and Trump) can only come from Russian trolls?
Fuck Putin.
Before New Hampshire's primary I thought Biden was fucked.
I'm still worried now, but I'm no longer sure we're doomed.
What happened at the new Hampshire primary? Im ootl
Yeah, who is the candidate that has beaten Trunp before anyway?
Not if we beat the drum about him being insane, instead of letting him get away with it as just another wacky thing
I mean, the people did elect her. She won the popular vote, but as I understand it, the electoral college had different plans.
Despite how abhorrent Trump is, what if he actually got elected again simply because Americans are that fed up with establishment politics status quo? Maybe Americans are desperate for change, anything but the same abuse by corporate overlords we’ve suffered since the 1970s, even if we know it’s going to do more harm than good?
Also, if you think the main reason Hillary lost is because of email-gate, consider that your own point of view may be compromised by Republican framing.
Are you going to pretend the genocide being carried out in Gaza is a non-factor?
Biden is not complicit in Israel's attack on Gaza.
Biden has bypassed congress to sell arms to Israel.
Doesn't congress know those artillery shells aren't going to be fired into Gaza? Are they just antisemitic?
https://time.com/6551227/biden-administration-bypasses-congress-israel-weapons-sale/
If Trump wins and dissolves NATO, and Russia, China, North Korea and Iran start a massive conflict as an axis of evil, tens of millions, if not a hundred million or more could die. More, if nuclear weapons are used.
Russia alone lost 24,000,000 people in the last war alone.
40-50,000,000 were killed in WW2. And that was with ancient technology, by comparison. Going to Normandy and seeing the endless rows of graves stretching as far as the eye can see shows the incalculable loss of global war, something that must not ever be repeated. Far too many paid the ultimate price to keep evil at bay.
I'm not campaigning for Trump. Sticking your head in the sand and pretending that Gaza isn't a problem will not help Biden win re-election.
"Appalling and unhinged" describes the vast majority of things Trump has said in the last decade or 2.
But here's the cool thing: it's somehow going to get worse!
Oh bull fucking shit, don't downplay his idiocy and danger
Yeah... his understanding of his own lunatic words and actions is of very little consequence when compared their real world impact.
Can we all agree to say Trump has dementia, and constantly hound him, his supporters and gop about this, beating the drum non stop, instead of just pointing out his wild statements when they come up, we need to question his sanity constantly like they do about Biden senility. If rather have a forgetful old man, than a bonafide lunatic
The good news is that Biden isn't even a forgetful old man. The media just takes every normal slip up he makes and runs it non-stop.
He's in pretty good shape for his age, both mentally and physically. I'd still rather have somebody younger. On the other hand, I genuinely cannot think of anyone less qualified than the Orange Baboon.
I would rather have an actual orange baboon as president than Donald Trump.
It would be far less damaging to international relations, that's for fucking sure.
Dementia Donnie
It's like Donnie Darko's creepy uncle.
And dressed in a carrot outfit
Well said!
That tracks, because Trump is appalling and unhinged.
Where is the shocked fry meme when you need it.
I am honestly scared and I don't think society (not just the US) would really survive if this turd becomes reelected a second time.
Vote. Get all your friends and family to vote. Four more years should buy us enough time while his power is waning.
If there was ever an election that was important to vote and be clear-eyed in, it's this one.
Very few people care who your little country chooses to lead it.
The US doesn't run the world, and is having less influence every year at this point. Society will pull through.
The US military's influence throughout the world is as strong as ever, and Trump is 100% on board with reducing its presence worldwide. I don't necessarily disagree with it, but global trade will take a massive hit out of the gate, not to mention the more obvious issues with Russia, Israel, etc. But hey, Trump has been critical of Israel lately.
I'm not saying it won't be a negative outcome. I'm saying society will survive.
I mean if you're gonna be technical, "society" will literally survive a nuclear exchange and total civilizational collapse. As long as there's more than one person and those people aren't killing each other (or even if they are), there's "society".
Donald Trump = traitor
Everyone knows that. Even his voters.
They just don't care if they can diss the libs.
Which is why each and every drumph voter should be stripped of their nationality for treason and expedited to Alaska or whatever country will have them.
Drumpf was in fact his original family surname.
I'm sure the original etymology is Dumb so the exact letters don't really matter anymore.
Since when has calling someone a traitor ever convinced anyone? It's the political equivalent of calling your opponent bad.
Vote. Get all your friends and family to vote. Four more years should buy us enough time while his power is waning.
If there was ever an election that was important to vote and be clear-eyed in, it's this one.
I hope this time around he won't be able to hide behind "he doesn't mean it, he'd never actually do that"
I don't think anything Donnie says correlates with reality. Does that mean we shouldn't worry? Fuck no! He's a disaster.
I love this sentiment simply because the idea that the US would be spending less on the military if they weren't in NATO is ridiculous. There's no stopping US military spending without absolutely crippling the US economy. Other NATO members spending more on their militaries will not save the US taxpayer a dime.
I's about selling more weapons made by the US military industrial complex to NATO countries. Which does bring more money into the US economy, but only by growing the military industrial complex larger.
Kinda like franchising out McDonald's but with more death machines involved.
But personally, I like Ike, "Beware the military industrial complex."
I'm actually okay with the idea that perhaps Europe ought to be more interested in bolstering their own defenses. The part about urging Russia toward aggression I think any reasonable person can see what's wrong with that.
But the military presence worldwide, in more instances than not, exists to protect corporate interests. I'm almost okay with the idea of scaling it all back. Tax money shouldn't go to line pockets of the wealthy. The obvious issue is the immediate effect on the economy, but where do we draw the line? I know this site leans towards stopping the global corporatocracy, but I don't know that anyone's ready for things to really grind to a halt.
So I guess we will just have to wait til next January and then we will see what happens!
Trump wants to sell weapons to Russia so they can take over Europe. I honestly think Trump just doesn't like that there's no many countries and leaders in Europe to keep track of and wishes it was all just run by one guy he can try him art of the deal bullshit on.
If the US is stupid enough to elect this idiot a second time, then we deserve to become the banana republic we've instituted in countless other countries. I'm not too worried about it. He lost by 7 million votes in 2020 and about 1 million of his voters died with COVID. Plus I know at least a few percentage points of his voters that will not vote for him again. And I don't know ANYONE that hasn't voted for him before that are now interested in giving him their vote. It will take unprecedented election interference for Trump to win the electoral vote (there's not a chance he wins the popular).
"A banana republic, if you can keep it"
United Fruit Company bitches!
Embrace Idiocracy
There’s always money in the banana republic.
I did the math a few years ago because I couldn't find anyone else who had published it. This is rough and IANAM (mathmagicman).
Every single day 8,000 boomers and above die, and 12,000 people turn 18 and those numbers are actually accelerating. If you use existing data to estimate conservative/liberal and likely voters within those groups it works out to a delta of 10,000 per day on a national scale. That's 5,000 votes switching every single day. That might not seem like alot. Because it really isn't. Out of 155 million votes cast, 10,000 is .006 percent. But here's the thing. It's cumulative. And it just doesn't stop. It is relentless. it's 300k a month, 3.6 million per year. And that pace is accelerating. Between 2020 and 2024 it's a 15 million vote difference. By 2028 it's 30 million.
It used to be that people age into conservatism. But that is not happening with millennials. The demographics are changing, and changing quickly. The most conservative group in the country is dying. While the most liberal group is rising.
We just have to hold on to democracy for a few more years. This will all be behind us. Another 10k today.
And that explains why Republicans have given up on democracy. Thanks for doing the math.
Interesting. But I think there is also a conversion from left to right with age. We are making conservatives as fast as we are losing them. They are converted because we all become fearful with age and Republican mass media preys on that with FUD.
That's not happening with Millennials. You can debate why, but the data is clear.
https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/financial-times-millennials-conservatives-age-b2253902.html
This chart in particular is extremely telling.
https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1608746369505976323
Fascinating thank you! This is also encouraging for both the US and UK.
The fuck else is new
It's not Nato, it's NATO isn't it?
It's Nato according to the BBC:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/newsstyleguide/grammar-spelling-punctuation
If you don't like this, then start referring to the BBC as bubbakuh, so they'll have to change the spelling to Bbc.
Well, the Bbc is on their own on that, because I've never seen it done that way elsewhere, including the NATO website. They're unhinged.
Their English what do you expect?
I see what you did their.
Which Etonian fuckwit came up with this?
I know this isn't the place, but what's that helmet strap thing they're sporting?
Could be IR strobes/beacons
I was thinking this, but I'm not sure what would be on the front and I don't see a mount for the goggles.
The center and left guy's helmets have night vision mounts, guessing the things on the front of the straps are for fitment/compatibility with different helmets
Laser training?
https://www.edrmagazine.eu/saab-receives-order-to-expand-czech-republic-tactical-training-system
https://www.saab.com/products/live-training
That looks pretty right to me.
It's the movie Idiocracy. He's fixin to do somethin prezidential up in here. /S
I'd so much rather vote for president Camacho.
labeled?