Because this country has a festering fascism problem
Perpetuated by an education problem
Caused by the fascist problem
Right....
I'm simply pointing out that facism is not at all a common endpoint one arrives at through accurate/natural/honest education. Unless you're born into the top echelons of wealth, hardly any political actions in current platforms are of true benefit to you.
I’m simply pointing out that facism is not at all a common endpoint
i mean, i feel like you could argue it's a common outcome for people that don't respect the system (i.e. trump)
Education may have a part in it, but people believed uri geller could break spoons...
Trump respected the system and thats why his "smol loan" got him places. That is the system. It was created by and for the very fuckery that he is known for.
i'm talking in a more directed political context, those who do not respect the decorum of the political institution are doomed to succumb to the fate of fascism inevitably.
The entire purpose of the decorum is for the system to function properly.
Decorum that asks for people to "respect" and follow is a built-in loophole.
Hard, robust, and readily reassessed punitive rules are the only solution.
yeah you can argue that, until a tank rolls up to the capitol, and that starts to become a seriously effective bargaining deal right there.
There is literally nothing more potent than using force. Decorum is what prevents everything from being some form of fascism at the end of the day. It needs to be upheld, either through law, or social behavior.
Thats literally what I said,except im not calling it decorum as thats a nonobligatory word for what should be forcibly compelled by law for all. And that law should be easily reaxamined and reformed so as to remain robust with time.
I'm pretty sure I learned more about the US government growing up in Canada than a lot of US citizens. We had Schoolhouse Rock on tv with our Saturday morning cartoons (I'm old) and studied the US federal government structure for a few weeks in middle school.
The "intended" functions and responsibilities are still taught as far as I'm aware. The more accurate and honest current functions behind not only our own government, but others, is entirely missed at a highschool and below level, and is dependent on college professors personal political values for accuracy and honesty in relevant courses.
I would say most colleges don't require gov/civics courses either.
my HS had a rather comprehensive and detailed government course, as per state curriculum. So it depends on where you go i guess.
Nazis modeled their final solution after various aspects of slavery. Disney, Ford, trump ,and many other prominent Americans supported fascism and Hitler.
Bin Laden didn't have shit on how much this guy is a threat to American democracy.
bin laden was an accelerationist and made it much easier for this orange sack of sh*t to, decades later, cleave the insane from a divided and distracted america.
Bin Laden was evil Dr. Strange. Saw millions of realities and chose the path that leads to Trump to destroy the USA.
agreed. dude had this country pegged 100%.
Corruption, due to the traitor John Roberts and his decision in Citizens United.
Merrick Garland.
Because they have managed to subvert the US legal system. Not that the other side made it particularly hard for them.
Hopefully this time with a competent President in the White House, a proper response will take place to any traitors. Maybe some more of these whackos can become martyrs for agent orange.
First was not a well planned attack. It was only a trial to see what would happen if they send a mob to the White House.
This time he won't have the advantage of already being in the white house and having the legitimacy of already running the government. I'm sure that will make things harder as well
I don’t understand why he’s not in prison after being found guilty. What happened to sentencing?
It was delayed till September as the judge needs to look at evidence admitted in the case that may now fall under the Supreme Courts made up presidential immunity ruling. Trump's team is trying to argue that the case should be tossed because evidence of things Trump did while in office were used during the trial (even though the crime started while he was only a candidate and was all admitted into evidence prior to this newly manufactured ruling).
white collar crimes are notoriously lax on criminal punishment when it comes to anything that isn't fines.
Theres one last job Biden needs to get right. A big part of how Trumps last coup attempt got so far was because security was very light that day and the response slow, as trump was still in charge of all of it.
This time Biden will be in charge. Maybe this time he'll take the threat trump poses seriously.
Agreed, I hope everyone will be diligently watching. It's hard to believe how close we have come (and how close we still are) to have our democracy be in such danger and so many people to not care or actively support it being harmed.
Speaker Johnson will refuse to swear into Congress on January 3rd a handful of those Democrats, claiming there are “irregularities” in their elections that must be first investigated.
There’s nothing Democrats can legally do to stop Speaker Johnson from pulling this off: he can postpone swearing a member in for as long as he wants.
Then, regardless of how many votes Biden won by, electoral or popular, the House simply refuses to certify the electoral college votes of enough states that the minimum of 270 isn’t reached. Under the 12th Amendment, like with the election of 1876, that throws the election to the House, where each state has one vote.
While a majority of Americans live in a state run by Democrats, a majority of the states themselves are run by Republicans. Each state gets one vote for president in the House, and right now 26 state delegations are GOP-controlled, meaning that a majority of the House would simply vote to put Trump back into the White House, 26-23 (Pennsylvania’s delegation is 50/50). All totally legal.
Then Biden declares martial law and files a lawsuit forcing them to certify the results.
imho, considering the extremely wide range of immunity the supreme court has already given to the executive, Biden would only have to declare the results certified himself - he wouldn't even need to declare martial law, much less file a lawsuit.
it's fucking deranged, but that's where we're at.
The immunity thing doesn't give the president full power over everything. It just means the president can't be held accountable for crimes they commit for "official reasons".
Biden can't just dictate whatever he wants. The avenue for dictator power is via using that immunity to remove political opponents or incite mobs to do it for him.
Which Trump will do, if he gets in it will go from 0-100 during that first week, he probably already has a list of people that need to be removed and will use the reaction to that list to make the next list, with the goal of removing as much institutional support as he can for the insurrection that will follow once the masses realize just how serious things are.
How about the Biden admin declares a few official acts - very precise, such as arresting Johnson and anyone else complicit in such things, as well as those directing such things, and send them all to Gitmo (or given a drumhead court-martial if the admin so chooses). All complicit qons are replaced by Democrats, and life moves on.
"totally legal" doesn't mean anything at that point. Anyone can declare a coup is legal, but what matters is how everyone else reacts.
Do you have a source for this? Is this an actual plan they've talked about or is it just a possibility?
Nvm, just saw the comment with the article
The previous crop of insurrectionist losers got treated with kid gloves, so there would be no claim of political retribution. Kamala gets elected, the new ones will face a black woman prosecutor. Do you really want to be on the receiving end of that?
They'll just paint her as racist against white people - there's always some bullshit spun they can parrot to their drones. But fuck em - they are weak and scared. I've not been this hopeful for the future of America in a hot minute - so I cannot wait to get out there and vote for Madam President Harris.
I mean, actual racism being called out for generations has been habitually and systemically ignored. In the same way, demonstrably false charges can also be ignored.
I don't disagree. But magachuds
And yet we've made progress.
Never go back
This man is a terrorist attacking America and so are his voters. They should be treated as such and put in jail.
Ah yes, let's combine is violent rhetoric with claims of jailing people for committing the crime of...falling for a conman and voting for him.
That's the spirit.
It may have started as falling for a conman. But at a certain point, you have to ask yourself at what point is each individual responsible for his threats to democracy.
You either are a willing and active participant or you are willfully ignorant.
I've met people on both sides of that spectrum and I'll tell you right now, they no longer can claim they fell to his con.
Until someone actually breaks a law, suggesting that people should.be jailed for who they vote for is something I expect out of an idiotic authoritarians mouth, like trump.
Ah, so you're on the "willful ignorant" side.
Trump has already committed several crimes. The classified documents case alone would be enough to put literally anyone else behind bars for several lifetimes. But Trump gets off with stealing literal boxes of the stuff and then selling it to the highest bidder. He got several people killed, but gets to get away with it because it was an "oFfIcIaL aCt". Give me a fucking break.
And that's just one of his many crimes. Wake up and pay attention.
Trump's a fucking criminal twat, and at best you're a rube if you are voting for him.
I recognize this, but it's not a crime to be stupid and fall for his shit.
I also don't doubt that his voters would pull another Jan 6 if he lost. None of it should be taken lightly. These people are sociopaths and a danger to society.
I don't either, and we should prepare for that and arrest and prosecute those criminals.
I recognize this, but it’s not a crime to be stupid and fall for his shit.
unfortunately no, but the fact that you can even push criminals through presidency is, rather funny.
Nah, it's the way it should be; jailing a political opponent should absolutely not be a way for someone in power to stop people from voting for someone. It's just sad that this is going to protect an actual criminal.
so you're saying a political opponent should be immune? Period?
Because for the entire history of american politics, from the founding until now, that has never been the case. The president is no more immune than any average person, because the president is literally an average person, this is in the federalist papers.
Like i don't disagree, jailing someone to prevent them from running is absurd, but there are more nuanced and complete solutions to this problem like, having a functional justice system for example.
so you’re saying a political opponent should be immune? Period?
No, absolutely not. How could one possibly come to this conclusion based on what I said? Are you okay?
why would you ever argue for immunity in any other manner? The president already has a form of acting immunity, like most politicians in office currently hold.
Most official presidential acts are not something a president can be charged for, using the military for example.
Dude just stated that voting for him is a vote for ending democracy
Jail for terrorists
I've seen plenty of people trying to justify it trying to convince themselves, and others, that this is not what he said. I've not seen a single person say it's good that he would do that, but those people probably should be watched closely.
They committed a crime. They should go to jail no matter how badly they go kicking and screaming. Who cares what Fox News says about it. Just get the National Guard ready. Why all the games to protect criminals?
I was responding to someone saying we should jail people for voting for trump. That's not a crime, just stupidity.
Yeah, I missed that part. I thought you were defending letting the insurrectionists off easily.
says probably a centrist who has ignored every violent rhetoric the right has used for the last decade.
If you have to make up a position to make someone wrong, you can rest assured even you realize you don't have an actual argument.
bro im shitposting.
didn't he start shouting "they cheated!!!" months or years before the 2020 election too?
The moment his polling was behind, just like this.
He was screaming it was rigged after he won in 2016
Well that's terrifying. The only peaceful way to stop this according to the author:
The best way to prevent this from happening is to widely publicize their scheme so public opinion will become so intense that they fear the consequences.
Shame that that is literally the best and likely the only recourse we have. Seems like these are huge gaping loopholes we should have closed decades ago.
You are talking about a coup. There are many ways to stop one.
We own the white house this time. If they try this shit again the insurrection should be put down.
But they control the house... You know the body that counts the electoral votes.
True but Biden is still president and commander in chief until the 20th, I’m sure they plan to spin anything he might do as a coup but it’s a bit different than last time. Still scary shit though
If they try it this time, there will be deaths, and Dementia Don the racist rapist with 34 felonies won't walk away from it. There will be more military there than people and that shit will get shut down instantly.
No there wont. People will do what they did last time: piss and moan, then get on with their distractions.
I propose the use of Willie Pete if they try anything again.
But I thought the convicted felon was so popular? Why wouldn't he just, uh, win an election?
Also - why not just arrest him right now?
ARREST HIM.
He's literally prepping for a dictatorship, he has all but admitted it.
all but admitted
He has stated openly that he would be a dictator, on Dec 7 2023 in a Fox News interview with Sean Hannity.
Keep it up orangefuck. Only so many threats before you get taken up on tbem
I wish I believed that
Yeah he should go all the way. Also, only the most badass alpha maga supporters wear their name, phone number and SSN printed on their shirts in large letters while they do it, completed with some thin blue line flags, a punisher skull, and a no regrats tattoo
It's a GOOD THING we enact SWIFT Punishment last time a Terrorist sent a Mob of Terrorists to Attack the Capitol!
The DHS should be planning a "much bigger" response and getting ready to round up and arrest all the perps, from the convicted felon on down to the lowest level chud.
They arrested hundreds of regular people for J6 but they are somehow powerless to deal with this fuck. Scary how fragile our government truly is.
The last one didn't work, so that makes sense
Good god, why is he a free man
Why is he allowed to run for president?
Because this country has a festering fascism problem
Perpetuated by an education problem
Caused by the fascist problem
Right....
I'm simply pointing out that facism is not at all a common endpoint one arrives at through accurate/natural/honest education. Unless you're born into the top echelons of wealth, hardly any political actions in current platforms are of true benefit to you.
i mean, i feel like you could argue it's a common outcome for people that don't respect the system (i.e. trump)
Education may have a part in it, but people believed uri geller could break spoons...
Trump respected the system and thats why his "smol loan" got him places. That is the system. It was created by and for the very fuckery that he is known for.
i'm talking in a more directed political context, those who do not respect the decorum of the political institution are doomed to succumb to the fate of fascism inevitably.
The entire purpose of the decorum is for the system to function properly.
Decorum that asks for people to "respect" and follow is a built-in loophole.
Hard, robust, and readily reassessed punitive rules are the only solution.
yeah you can argue that, until a tank rolls up to the capitol, and that starts to become a seriously effective bargaining deal right there.
There is literally nothing more potent than using force. Decorum is what prevents everything from being some form of fascism at the end of the day. It needs to be upheld, either through law, or social behavior.
Thats literally what I said,except im not calling it decorum as thats a nonobligatory word for what should be forcibly compelled by law for all. And that law should be easily reaxamined and reformed so as to remain robust with time.
I'm pretty sure I learned more about the US government growing up in Canada than a lot of US citizens. We had Schoolhouse Rock on tv with our Saturday morning cartoons (I'm old) and studied the US federal government structure for a few weeks in middle school.
The "intended" functions and responsibilities are still taught as far as I'm aware. The more accurate and honest current functions behind not only our own government, but others, is entirely missed at a highschool and below level, and is dependent on college professors personal political values for accuracy and honesty in relevant courses.
I would say most colleges don't require gov/civics courses either.
my HS had a rather comprehensive and detailed government course, as per state curriculum. So it depends on where you go i guess.
Always has been.
Nazis modeled their final solution after various aspects of slavery. Disney, Ford, trump ,and many other prominent Americans supported fascism and Hitler.
Because Russian money has infiltrated The Supremacy Court
Also the Senate. McTurtleFucker tanked both impeachments and then said that it was up to the legal system to hold him to account.
They knew what they were doing, and the whole fucking party is complicit.
blatant corruption that no one's doing anything about
Bin Laden didn't have shit on how much this guy is a threat to American democracy.
bin laden was an accelerationist and made it much easier for this orange sack of sh*t to, decades later, cleave the insane from a divided and distracted america.
Bin Laden was evil Dr. Strange. Saw millions of realities and chose the path that leads to Trump to destroy the USA.
agreed. dude had this country pegged 100%.
Corruption, due to the traitor John Roberts and his decision in Citizens United.
Merrick Garland.
Because they have managed to subvert the US legal system. Not that the other side made it particularly hard for them.
Hopefully this time with a competent President in the White House, a proper response will take place to any traitors. Maybe some more of these whackos can become martyrs for agent orange.
First was not a well planned attack. It was only a trial to see what would happen if they send a mob to the White House.
This time he won't have the advantage of already being in the white house and having the legitimacy of already running the government. I'm sure that will make things harder as well
I don’t understand why he’s not in prison after being found guilty. What happened to sentencing?
It was delayed till September as the judge needs to look at evidence admitted in the case that may now fall under the Supreme Courts made up presidential immunity ruling. Trump's team is trying to argue that the case should be tossed because evidence of things Trump did while in office were used during the trial (even though the crime started while he was only a candidate and was all admitted into evidence prior to this newly manufactured ruling).
white collar crimes are notoriously lax on criminal punishment when it comes to anything that isn't fines.
Theres one last job Biden needs to get right. A big part of how Trumps last coup attempt got so far was because security was very light that day and the response slow, as trump was still in charge of all of it.
This time Biden will be in charge. Maybe this time he'll take the threat trump poses seriously.
Agreed, I hope everyone will be diligently watching. It's hard to believe how close we have come (and how close we still are) to have our democracy be in such danger and so many people to not care or actively support it being harmed.
Then Biden declares martial law and files a lawsuit forcing them to certify the results.
imho, considering the extremely wide range of immunity the supreme court has already given to the executive, Biden would only have to declare the results certified himself - he wouldn't even need to declare martial law, much less file a lawsuit.
it's fucking deranged, but that's where we're at.
The immunity thing doesn't give the president full power over everything. It just means the president can't be held accountable for crimes they commit for "official reasons".
Biden can't just dictate whatever he wants. The avenue for dictator power is via using that immunity to remove political opponents or incite mobs to do it for him.
Which Trump will do, if he gets in it will go from 0-100 during that first week, he probably already has a list of people that need to be removed and will use the reaction to that list to make the next list, with the goal of removing as much institutional support as he can for the insurrection that will follow once the masses realize just how serious things are.
How about the Biden admin declares a few official acts - very precise, such as arresting Johnson and anyone else complicit in such things, as well as those directing such things, and send them all to Gitmo (or given a drumhead court-martial if the admin so chooses). All complicit qons are replaced by Democrats, and life moves on.
"totally legal" doesn't mean anything at that point. Anyone can declare a coup is legal, but what matters is how everyone else reacts.
Do you have a source for this? Is this an actual plan they've talked about or is it just a possibility?Nvm, just saw the comment with the article
The previous crop of insurrectionist losers got treated with kid gloves, so there would be no claim of political retribution. Kamala gets elected, the new ones will face a black woman prosecutor. Do you really want to be on the receiving end of that?
They'll just paint her as racist against white people - there's always some bullshit spun they can parrot to their drones. But fuck em - they are weak and scared. I've not been this hopeful for the future of America in a hot minute - so I cannot wait to get out there and vote for Madam President Harris.
I mean, actual racism being called out for generations has been habitually and systemically ignored. In the same way, demonstrably false charges can also be ignored.
I don't disagree. But magachuds
And yet we've made progress.
Never go back
This man is a terrorist attacking America and so are his voters. They should be treated as such and put in jail.
Ah yes, let's combine is violent rhetoric with claims of jailing people for committing the crime of...falling for a conman and voting for him.
That's the spirit.
It may have started as falling for a conman. But at a certain point, you have to ask yourself at what point is each individual responsible for his threats to democracy.
You either are a willing and active participant or you are willfully ignorant.
I've met people on both sides of that spectrum and I'll tell you right now, they no longer can claim they fell to his con.
Until someone actually breaks a law, suggesting that people should.be jailed for who they vote for is something I expect out of an idiotic authoritarians mouth, like trump.
Ah, so you're on the "willful ignorant" side.
Trump has already committed several crimes. The classified documents case alone would be enough to put literally anyone else behind bars for several lifetimes. But Trump gets off with stealing literal boxes of the stuff and then selling it to the highest bidder. He got several people killed, but gets to get away with it because it was an "oFfIcIaL aCt". Give me a fucking break.
And that's just one of his many crimes. Wake up and pay attention.
Trump's a fucking criminal twat, and at best you're a rube if you are voting for him.
I recognize this, but it's not a crime to be stupid and fall for his shit.
I also don't doubt that his voters would pull another Jan 6 if he lost. None of it should be taken lightly. These people are sociopaths and a danger to society.
I don't either, and we should prepare for that and arrest and prosecute those criminals.
unfortunately no, but the fact that you can even push criminals through presidency is, rather funny.
Nah, it's the way it should be; jailing a political opponent should absolutely not be a way for someone in power to stop people from voting for someone. It's just sad that this is going to protect an actual criminal.
so you're saying a political opponent should be immune? Period?
Because for the entire history of american politics, from the founding until now, that has never been the case. The president is no more immune than any average person, because the president is literally an average person, this is in the federalist papers.
Like i don't disagree, jailing someone to prevent them from running is absurd, but there are more nuanced and complete solutions to this problem like, having a functional justice system for example.
No, absolutely not. How could one possibly come to this conclusion based on what I said? Are you okay?
why would you ever argue for immunity in any other manner? The president already has a form of acting immunity, like most politicians in office currently hold.
Most official presidential acts are not something a president can be charged for, using the military for example.
Dude just stated that voting for him is a vote for ending democracy
Jail for terrorists
I've seen plenty of people trying to justify it trying to convince themselves, and others, that this is not what he said. I've not seen a single person say it's good that he would do that, but those people probably should be watched closely.
They committed a crime. They should go to jail no matter how badly they go kicking and screaming. Who cares what Fox News says about it. Just get the National Guard ready. Why all the games to protect criminals?
I was responding to someone saying we should jail people for voting for trump. That's not a crime, just stupidity.
Yeah, I missed that part. I thought you were defending letting the insurrectionists off easily.
says probably a centrist who has ignored every violent rhetoric the right has used for the last decade.
If you have to make up a position to make someone wrong, you can rest assured even you realize you don't have an actual argument.
bro im shitposting.
didn't he start shouting "they cheated!!!" months or years before the 2020 election too?
The moment his polling was behind, just like this.
He was screaming it was rigged after he won in 2016
And before
This theory has been floating around for months, but doesn't seem to be getting much coverage https://hartmannreport.com/p/the-new-over-the-top-secret-plan-518?sort=new
Well that's terrifying. The only peaceful way to stop this according to the author:
Shame that that is literally the best and likely the only recourse we have. Seems like these are huge gaping loopholes we should have closed decades ago.
You are talking about a coup. There are many ways to stop one.
We own the white house this time. If they try this shit again the insurrection should be put down.
But they control the house... You know the body that counts the electoral votes.
True but Biden is still president and commander in chief until the 20th, I’m sure they plan to spin anything he might do as a coup but it’s a bit different than last time. Still scary shit though
If they try it this time, there will be deaths, and Dementia Don the racist rapist with 34 felonies won't walk away from it. There will be more military there than people and that shit will get shut down instantly.
No there wont. People will do what they did last time: piss and moan, then get on with their distractions.
I propose the use of Willie Pete if they try anything again.
But I thought the convicted felon was so popular? Why wouldn't he just, uh, win an election?
Also - why not just arrest him right now?
ARREST HIM.
He's literally prepping for a dictatorship, he has all but admitted it.
He has stated openly that he would be a dictator, on Dec 7 2023 in a Fox News interview with Sean Hannity.
Keep it up orangefuck. Only so many threats before you get taken up on tbem
I wish I believed that
Yeah he should go all the way. Also, only the most badass alpha maga supporters wear their name, phone number and SSN printed on their shirts in large letters while they do it, completed with some thin blue line flags, a punisher skull, and a no regrats tattoo
It's a GOOD THING we enact SWIFT Punishment last time a Terrorist sent a Mob of Terrorists to Attack the Capitol!
The DHS should be planning a "much bigger" response and getting ready to round up and arrest all the perps, from the convicted felon on down to the lowest level chud.
They arrested hundreds of regular people for J6 but they are somehow powerless to deal with this fuck. Scary how fragile our government truly is.