I am assuming she is serving those 30 days in a freezer.
Yeah, reading the article, I expected it to say that it was only 30 days, because they realized, she has psychological problems. Punishment doesn't usually help with that. But I also expected this article to say that the baby will be taken into custody by the state until therapy concedes. And there's just no mention of any of that.
A shit reason. She needa to be thrown in an insane asylum for 30 years. See if that helps her psychologucal problem.
Sounds like you need to take a trip there first buddy. Maybe learn how to spell on the way, jarjar
Or we could, I don't know, maybe try to treat her? I would rather live in a world where we treated all mentally ill people, even dangerous ones, with compassion than one where we just lock them up and throw away the key. I personally think that we, as a society, have a moral responsibility to lift each other up, but even if you look at it from a selfish point of view, it still makes sense. For example, it's possible that someday, you might have a mental break, maybe due to a tragic event or brutal experience, and will need help and wouldn't you rather be treated kindly rather than being locked away and forgotten about?
I never said you shouldn't provide mental health care. I just doubt she'd stop being a threat after a mere 30 days.
Because that's what we should be doing with people who are mentally ill? Take a look at yourself.
And what will that actually achieve? Beyond costing a fuckload of money and satisfying those that get their dicks hard at the thought of human suffering?
Maybe the judge mistakingly put days instead of years
And another mother got two years for giving her daughter abortion pills.
Don’t EVER let them tell you it’s to protect the children.
What are you driving at?
Who is the "them" in this scenario?
Under what circumstances was the mother protecting children or advocating protecting children?
her actions were done as a test to see if the child’s father “gave a f--k at all,”
Authorities said while the officer was taking McDonald to jail, she said that her actions were done as a test to see if the child’s father “gave a f--k at all,” adding she waterboarded her baby to try and make Neal come back to the apartment.
So she decided to extend the toxic relationship she has with her child's father to their child. WTAF?! What an absolute piece of shit person.
I read the article hoping to see that she had lost all rights to the child. But nothing about that was mentioned. So she probably hasn't lost any parental rights.
She's not going to lose all rights that fast. My wife's mom left her alone for days as a toddler drinking toilet water and allowed her to be abused by her johns (no idea if she sold her or was just too fucking high to put a stop to it) and it took years for her to lose all rights. Parents are given a lot of chances to get their shit together even when anyone else would look at them and know that wasn't ever going to happen.
That's why when I hear stories about people getting their kids taken away for playing alone in the back yard or walking up the street, I suspect there's a lot more to those stories. That's a huge amount of effort and they aren't going to do that shit over something so minor. But of course the government is going to be all no comment about those things so we only ever hear the side saying how ridiculous it is. That's right - it's ridiculous. So why would you believe it went down that way?
I dunno. Kids get such a fucking raw deal. They have no choice who they're born to and even lots of well intentioned parents fuck it up, to say nothing of people like this crazy fucking bitch in the article.
That's a great point. It does usually take a long time, doesn't it. Hopefully the media attention will fast-track things in this case. But it probably won't.
30 days seems too short.
Must be a typo, surely it's years?
I honestly hate stories like this. What is the use of knowing this? Who does it benefit to hear this story and proliferate it?
So we can all go "wow what a monster" in the comments?
How many things happened today that actually will affect our lives instead?
I think it's a cautionary tale against forcing women to have kids.
We need access to birth control, healthcare (including abortion), sex education, and quality education.
These horrible things cannot be hidden, just like war images shouldn't be hidden. This is reality and we can't turn a blind eye. We have to address real shit that happens in the real world to learn from it and get better. Or at least face the reality of the things we force people into.
This will continue happening if the jail sentence is only 30 days...
Jail sentences were never detracting anyone from crimes. Crimes are either planned so the criminal does not think they will be caught or done out of emotion so the criminal does not think about possible punishment
The severity of the punishment is not an effective deterrent. This has been known since a UN study from the 1980s, yet people still cling to the belief that a long prison sentence or the death penalty is a good deterrent.
So long as the punishment is significant enough that it cannot be dismissed (eg a small fine is meaningless to someone wealthy), then the only effective deterrent is the certainty of being caught.
It was mentioned at the end of this Amnesty International fact sheet (pdf) that it was first published in 1988 then updated, I think there was also a fifth edition in 2015 so maybe there's an even another new one now. I'm not sure if this is exactly the same source I saw previously, but that could be because of the various revisions.
Thank you!
If she's in jail she can't waterboard her kid and put it in the freezer again... Do you motherfuckers even think about what you're saying before you spout off with these tired arguments?
Same if they take away her kid.
Not really, there's still a baby freezing psychopath on the loose in that case. Who knows what she'll do to the next person she blames all her problems on.
Who knows what she'll do to the next person she blames all her problems on.
If they're not a baby... get a bigger freezer?
Until October 6, when she gets out of jail.
Unfortunately the foster system is also fucked.
This comment chain is in response to that sentence not being long enough. I'd gamble on the foster system over the known lady that puts the kid in the freezer.
The jail sentence has nothing to do with this happening.
This will keep happening while people are forced to bear kids they don't want in financial situations, where nothing can be afforded and everything is shit.
The mother was torturing her child because she needed to vent and her kid seemed like the root of all her problems, not because there were only 30 days of jail sentence.
And with poor access to mental health support.
Every time there's a mass shooting, Republicans say, "guns aren't the problem, mental health is" and then they want to do absolutely nothing about it.
The only conclusion you can make is that they like mentally ill people who torture and murder.
Exactly. Then they'll take that and turn it into fear. Then they'll take that fear and blame the Democrats for it. Then their base with their room temperature IQ will eat that shit up and show up on voting day and vote for hatred and projection while being completely oblivious to the fact it's their party's fault nothing is being done about it.
Celsius or Fahrenheit?
...they like mentally ill people who torture and murder.
Well I mean every political party tries to develop their base
I think that's only been a recent thing they've mentioned; mostly they seem to come out with the 'moar guns' line, or the good guys with guns statement, but that's coming from an outsider so it may well be different from your actual experience.
She said she actually did it to spite the father...
Yes, I wrote this somewhere else, but my point still stands. The kid seemed as the root of all her problems and the jail sentence did never occur to her.
This is not an excuse (as some people said) it is still a horrible thing to do. I just want to make people aware, that these thing point to systemic problems and not necessarily evil people.
Do you have evidence this woman was forced to bear this child? I didn't read that in the article. And since you provided your opinion of why the mother did this to the child, I know for a fact you didn't read the article.
Do you have evidence this woman was forced to bear this child?
I do not, but I also rather meant my text as generalization for parents harming their children this much.
Okay, let's look into the article to see if a jail sentence would help.
Authorities said while the officer was taking McDonald to jail, she said that her actions were done as a test to see if the child’s father “gave a f--k at all,” adding she waterboarded her baby to try and make Neal come back to the apartment.
She allegedly admitted her actions were done “out of spite.”
I would argue, this crime has nothing to do with the sentence and everything to do with the circumstances I and others have mentioned.
And maybe she didn't want to abort, but also maybe she would have chosen to, if it were more accepted and education in that matter was better.
It's accepted in Oregon
A lot of maybes and speculation. Sure, education is never a bad thing, but you're trying to use this horrible situation to push your beliefs. This woman hurt her own child to spite the child's father.
I made no mention of the jail sentence. You made a claim that was false. I responded to it with facts from the article. You responded with some "maybes" and speculation.
I think it's pretty messed up to use this situation to push your opinion how having access to abortion (being "forced" to bear this child) might have prevented this. There's a time and a place for such an argument.
... And apparently the place is not the comment section under the link to the article. Cool.
Have it your way, but be careful to never think about systemic problems too much. It may hurt your brain.
But Oregon has had widely available abortion for decades, since the late 60s/early 70s.
This lady also lives in Multnomah County, home of Portland, one of the most progressive cities in the US. She had access to many resources although it so kind like she didn't use them.
Haha just had to get one insult in, didn't you? The sign of a petty personality. Just couldn't agree to disagree, could you? Nope. Just haaaaaad to drop an insult. Feels like reddit all over again.
Oh, Mr. "pretty messed up" doesn't want to hear an no-no-word directed at them? Shocking.
Oh, I didn't realize that poor financial situations excuse people from waterboarding babies
Did I write that somewhere? No.
Did I mean it? No.
Okay, but do you think, that maybe her life was so shitty, that she didn't even care for her kid and that this is maybe even a systemic problem and she has no way of solving that herself?
Holy shit please tell me you don't have kids.
I have kids and wouldn't harm them even if there was no jail sentence and I would gain money from it. What is your point?
"She was torturing them because she needed to vent." Sounds an awful lot like justifying her actions.
It is a justification. Still abhorrent and unforgiven, but it is still better than just seeing this as a singular incident with no corralation to any other such occurrence. Highlighting this as a systemic problem would really help all involved.
Shunning those who point these errors out will not help however.
Pretending the incident was random and unpredictable is your preferred way of preventing incidents like this from happening again?
Figure out what how and why the problem came to exist, that's kinda a big part of solving it.
She's a fucking lunatic and belongs in an asylum away from normal members of society. That's why this happened
Fortunately, being an infant, it still has a pretty good chance of that.
True. Poor kid will probably also have a life-long fear of drowning though, and won’t know why.
WOW, it really sucks that the government is just going to let her murder her child. That's what's going to happen. Kid will definitely be dead within the year because of gross negligence by the criminal justice system.
That's awful...I'm going to go hug my 1 year old now
Why, is he very cold? Is that why you're hugging him? Is it?
Booo
What kind of response is this?
It was a terrible joke and I told em so
It was a good joke.
Nah
Oh.
Don't let the downvotes bother you, man. I thought your joke was good. Lemmy is becoming reddit too much to my taste as of lately.
I mean it wasn't even funny...where was the joke?
The joke was in the reference to the bad news. I acknowledge that the timing was poor, though.
So you think it's a joke and a good one at that to tell someone upset at this story who wants to love on their own child? That's so fucked up.
I don't know, man. I've lost friends to ALS. And I almost got injured very badly once. I still enjoy dark humor jokes.
If I die because I fell off a bridge by accident, I want people to joke about it. Life is too short.
Sure, but that's not everyone.
I can see that now.
Ever wake up and see something that makes you hate humanity before you’ve even gotten out of bed? Yeah, that was this for me.
Damn near every day.
That's no mother
They mean they're going to stick her in a freezer for 30 days, right? Right?!
I hate this planet.
Imagine being this terrible a person.
And they are always the ones on Facebook talking about what great parents they are.
I don't know, seems there's a will to diminish the gravity of an act with such sentences. lot of crime against children are not punished as it should.
People like that need to be taken out on the spot. No prison. Just look at that face. Remorseless. End that creature before it does more harm.
F**k’s sake, what is happening to people?
We built a system that rewards sociopaths and then made it mandatory to participate
Nothing. Fucked up shit has always been happening, it's just that you have more opportunity to hear about it now.
Jesus Christ wtf, who would do that to their own kid?
I'm a dad and I just wanted to sleep. Thanks...
Yeah but baby was coming right for her
She looks every bit as demonic as she acted.
Jesus fuck.
Any dad who did the same crime would have gotten a way, way worse punishment.
The phrasing of this could be interpreted to sound like your problem isn't that the woman's punishment was too lenient, just that a theoretical guy would have experienced an actual consequence.
Well you see a couple hundred years ago her ancestors were treated poorly so that's why she done this. No other reason at all.
30 days??
I am assuming she is serving those 30 days in a freezer.
Yeah, reading the article, I expected it to say that it was only 30 days, because they realized, she has psychological problems. Punishment doesn't usually help with that. But I also expected this article to say that the baby will be taken into custody by the state until therapy concedes. And there's just no mention of any of that.
A shit reason. She needa to be thrown in an insane asylum for 30 years. See if that helps her psychologucal problem.
Sounds like you need to take a trip there first buddy. Maybe learn how to spell on the way, jarjar
Or we could, I don't know, maybe try to treat her? I would rather live in a world where we treated all mentally ill people, even dangerous ones, with compassion than one where we just lock them up and throw away the key. I personally think that we, as a society, have a moral responsibility to lift each other up, but even if you look at it from a selfish point of view, it still makes sense. For example, it's possible that someday, you might have a mental break, maybe due to a tragic event or brutal experience, and will need help and wouldn't you rather be treated kindly rather than being locked away and forgotten about?
I never said you shouldn't provide mental health care. I just doubt she'd stop being a threat after a mere 30 days.
Because that's what we should be doing with people who are mentally ill? Take a look at yourself.
And what will that actually achieve? Beyond costing a fuckload of money and satisfying those that get their dicks hard at the thought of human suffering?
Maybe the judge mistakingly put days instead of years
And another mother got two years for giving her daughter abortion pills.
Don’t EVER let them tell you it’s to protect the children.
What are you driving at?
Who is the "them" in this scenario?
Under what circumstances was the mother protecting children or advocating protecting children?
Because she obviously doesn't...
What. The. Fuck.
So she decided to extend the toxic relationship she has with her child's father to their child. WTAF?! What an absolute piece of shit person.
I read the article hoping to see that she had lost all rights to the child. But nothing about that was mentioned. So she probably hasn't lost any parental rights.
She's not going to lose all rights that fast. My wife's mom left her alone for days as a toddler drinking toilet water and allowed her to be abused by her johns (no idea if she sold her or was just too fucking high to put a stop to it) and it took years for her to lose all rights. Parents are given a lot of chances to get their shit together even when anyone else would look at them and know that wasn't ever going to happen.
That's why when I hear stories about people getting their kids taken away for playing alone in the back yard or walking up the street, I suspect there's a lot more to those stories. That's a huge amount of effort and they aren't going to do that shit over something so minor. But of course the government is going to be all no comment about those things so we only ever hear the side saying how ridiculous it is. That's right - it's ridiculous. So why would you believe it went down that way?
I dunno. Kids get such a fucking raw deal. They have no choice who they're born to and even lots of well intentioned parents fuck it up, to say nothing of people like this crazy fucking bitch in the article.
That's a great point. It does usually take a long time, doesn't it. Hopefully the media attention will fast-track things in this case. But it probably won't.
30 days seems too short.
Must be a typo, surely it's years?
I honestly hate stories like this. What is the use of knowing this? Who does it benefit to hear this story and proliferate it?
So we can all go "wow what a monster" in the comments?
How many things happened today that actually will affect our lives instead?
I think it's a cautionary tale against forcing women to have kids.
We need access to birth control, healthcare (including abortion), sex education, and quality education.
These horrible things cannot be hidden, just like war images shouldn't be hidden. This is reality and we can't turn a blind eye. We have to address real shit that happens in the real world to learn from it and get better. Or at least face the reality of the things we force people into.
"If it bleeds, it leads"
This will continue happening if the jail sentence is only 30 days...
Jail sentences were never detracting anyone from crimes. Crimes are either planned so the criminal does not think they will be caught or done out of emotion so the criminal does not think about possible punishment
The severity of the punishment is not an effective deterrent. This has been known since a UN study from the 1980s, yet people still cling to the belief that a long prison sentence or the death penalty is a good deterrent.
So long as the punishment is significant enough that it cannot be dismissed (eg a small fine is meaningless to someone wealthy), then the only effective deterrent is the certainty of being caught.
Could you share a link to that study?
I've done a little digging, I think it might be this book: Roger Hood, The Death Penalty: A World-wide Perspective.
It was mentioned at the end of this Amnesty International fact sheet (pdf) that it was first published in 1988 then updated, I think there was also a fifth edition in 2015 so maybe there's an even another new one now. I'm not sure if this is exactly the same source I saw previously, but that could be because of the various revisions.
Thank you!
If she's in jail she can't waterboard her kid and put it in the freezer again... Do you motherfuckers even think about what you're saying before you spout off with these tired arguments?
Same if they take away her kid.
Not really, there's still a baby freezing psychopath on the loose in that case. Who knows what she'll do to the next person she blames all her problems on.
If they're not a baby... get a bigger freezer?
Until October 6, when she gets out of jail.
Unfortunately the foster system is also fucked.
This comment chain is in response to that sentence not being long enough. I'd gamble on the foster system over the known lady that puts the kid in the freezer.
The jail sentence has nothing to do with this happening.
This will keep happening while people are forced to bear kids they don't want in financial situations, where nothing can be afforded and everything is shit.
The mother was torturing her child because she needed to vent and her kid seemed like the root of all her problems, not because there were only 30 days of jail sentence.
And with poor access to mental health support.
Every time there's a mass shooting, Republicans say, "guns aren't the problem, mental health is" and then they want to do absolutely nothing about it.
The only conclusion you can make is that they like mentally ill people who torture and murder.
Exactly. Then they'll take that and turn it into fear. Then they'll take that fear and blame the Democrats for it. Then their base with their room temperature IQ will eat that shit up and show up on voting day and vote for hatred and projection while being completely oblivious to the fact it's their party's fault nothing is being done about it.
Celsius or Fahrenheit?
Well I mean every political party tries to develop their base
I think that's only been a recent thing they've mentioned; mostly they seem to come out with the 'moar guns' line, or the good guys with guns statement, but that's coming from an outsider so it may well be different from your actual experience.
She said she actually did it to spite the father...
Yes, I wrote this somewhere else, but my point still stands. The kid seemed as the root of all her problems and the jail sentence did never occur to her.
This is not an excuse (as some people said) it is still a horrible thing to do. I just want to make people aware, that these thing point to systemic problems and not necessarily evil people.
Do you have evidence this woman was forced to bear this child? I didn't read that in the article. And since you provided your opinion of why the mother did this to the child, I know for a fact you didn't read the article.
I do not, but I also rather meant my text as generalization for parents harming their children this much.
Okay, let's look into the article to see if a jail sentence would help.
I would argue, this crime has nothing to do with the sentence and everything to do with the circumstances I and others have mentioned.
And maybe she didn't want to abort, but also maybe she would have chosen to, if it were more accepted and education in that matter was better.
It's accepted in Oregon
A lot of maybes and speculation. Sure, education is never a bad thing, but you're trying to use this horrible situation to push your beliefs. This woman hurt her own child to spite the child's father.
I made no mention of the jail sentence. You made a claim that was false. I responded to it with facts from the article. You responded with some "maybes" and speculation.
I think it's pretty messed up to use this situation to push your opinion how having access to abortion (being "forced" to bear this child) might have prevented this. There's a time and a place for such an argument.
... And apparently the place is not the comment section under the link to the article. Cool.
Have it your way, but be careful to never think about systemic problems too much. It may hurt your brain.
But Oregon has had widely available abortion for decades, since the late 60s/early 70s.
This lady also lives in Multnomah County, home of Portland, one of the most progressive cities in the US. She had access to many resources although it so kind like she didn't use them.
Haha just had to get one insult in, didn't you? The sign of a petty personality. Just couldn't agree to disagree, could you? Nope. Just haaaaaad to drop an insult. Feels like reddit all over again.
Oh, Mr. "pretty messed up" doesn't want to hear an no-no-word directed at them? Shocking.
Oh, I didn't realize that poor financial situations excuse people from waterboarding babies
Did I write that somewhere? No.
Did I mean it? No.
Okay, but do you think, that maybe her life was so shitty, that she didn't even care for her kid and that this is maybe even a systemic problem and she has no way of solving that herself?
Holy shit please tell me you don't have kids.
I have kids and wouldn't harm them even if there was no jail sentence and I would gain money from it. What is your point?
"She was torturing them because she needed to vent." Sounds an awful lot like justifying her actions.
It is a justification. Still abhorrent and unforgiven, but it is still better than just seeing this as a singular incident with no corralation to any other such occurrence. Highlighting this as a systemic problem would really help all involved.
Shunning those who point these errors out will not help however.
Pretending the incident was random and unpredictable is your preferred way of preventing incidents like this from happening again?
Figure out what how and why the problem came to exist, that's kinda a big part of solving it.
She's a fucking lunatic and belongs in an asylum away from normal members of society. That's why this happened
Gods. I hope that child gets a better family.
Fortunately, being an infant, it still has a pretty good chance of that.
True. Poor kid will probably also have a life-long fear of drowning though, and won’t know why.
WOW, it really sucks that the government is just going to let her murder her child. That's what's going to happen. Kid will definitely be dead within the year because of gross negligence by the criminal justice system.
That's awful...I'm going to go hug my 1 year old now
Why, is he very cold? Is that why you're hugging him? Is it?
Booo
What kind of response is this?
It was a terrible joke and I told em so
It was a good joke.
Nah
Oh.
Don't let the downvotes bother you, man. I thought your joke was good. Lemmy is becoming reddit too much to my taste as of lately.
I mean it wasn't even funny...where was the joke?
The joke was in the reference to the bad news. I acknowledge that the timing was poor, though.
So you think it's a joke and a good one at that to tell someone upset at this story who wants to love on their own child? That's so fucked up.
I don't know, man. I've lost friends to ALS. And I almost got injured very badly once. I still enjoy dark humor jokes.
If I die because I fell off a bridge by accident, I want people to joke about it. Life is too short.
Sure, but that's not everyone.
I can see that now.
Ever wake up and see something that makes you hate humanity before you’ve even gotten out of bed? Yeah, that was this for me.
Damn near every day.
That's no mother
They mean they're going to stick her in a freezer for 30 days, right? Right?!
I hate this planet.
Imagine being this terrible a person.
And they are always the ones on Facebook talking about what great parents they are.
I don't know, seems there's a will to diminish the gravity of an act with such sentences. lot of crime against children are not punished as it should.
Little bit of baby torture. No harm done.
People like that need to be taken out on the spot. No prison. Just look at that face. Remorseless. End that creature before it does more harm.
F**k’s sake, what is happening to people?
We built a system that rewards sociopaths and then made it mandatory to participate
Nothing. Fucked up shit has always been happening, it's just that you have more opportunity to hear about it now.
Jesus Christ wtf, who would do that to their own kid?
I'm a dad and I just wanted to sleep. Thanks...
Yeah but baby was coming right for her
She looks every bit as demonic as she acted.
Jesus fuck.
Any dad who did the same crime would have gotten a way, way worse punishment.
The phrasing of this could be interpreted to sound like your problem isn't that the woman's punishment was too lenient, just that a theoretical guy would have experienced an actual consequence.
Well you see a couple hundred years ago her ancestors were treated poorly so that's why she done this. No other reason at all.