I'm 42 and have known since I was 4 years old that I never wanted to be a mother. It's seriously one of my earliest memories - I didn't want to make my bed, my mother was exasperated with me and said "you'll be sad you treated me so badly when you have kids of your own"... and I remember being just appalled at the thought of being a parent.
I just don't enjoy children. I like peace, quiet, and order, and the freedom to do what I want without having to factor in children. Plus it looks super stressful to be a parent. I have 2 nephews and a niece, and while they're good kids, their parents always look so utterly exhausted and overwhelmed. And I'm definitely not good at being an aunt - interacting with children just doesn't come naturally to me.
Everyone told me I'd grow out of it. I had to fight to get my tubes tied in my mid-twenties (for real, I had to see so many doctors and had a botched Essure procedure at Planned Parenthood before I finally found an OBGYN who would take me seriously!).
No regrets rugrats!
I swore against having kids-for lots of reasons-, same as my wife. But accidents happened and we became parents. As the cliche goes "it is life changing".
It alters who you are and your idea of importance. There was stress, and exhausting times, but now they are adults they are my favourite people :)
It is a threshold moment situation, if you like your life how it is never have kids. If you have kids your life becomes different. No path is better than the other; just altered.
If there's one thing childfree people love, it's how there is always a parent ready to reply about how rewarding kids are.
I hear ya, but I don't mind - it's a discussion thread, after all! - and it's interesting to see a different perspective than my own.
That's very generous of you. In my experience, the perspective I replied to is the one that is most prevalent and you can't mention being happy without kids without somebody chiming in to say or imply how happy you would be if you had them. It gets really old.
Understood, that used to bother me too. After a while people realized I was firm and laid off. Other than a few occasional passive-aggressive comments from my mom about how she doesn't have grandchildren, nobody really says anything anymore.
Thanks for being open. as i mentioned there is no right or wrong choice, just different
You got it, I'm a very firm believer in 'different strokes for different folks'!
As an unrelated side note: One thing that has been interesting is watching genes play out. My daughter smirks like her grandfather, and she has had maybe 5 days exposure to him in her lifetime. And my youngest rubs his feet together when stressed, like a self soothing routine, something his great-grandfather used to do, but he died before my son was born. We like to think we are all about choices and choose to be unique, But some invisible biology still controls things.
That's so funny, what a specific behavior! I really do wonder to what degree we're all just automatons behaving on the whims of our genes.
Then you have kids growing up with shit parents... the threshold isn't worth it
it is a fair point. On another platform I got pummeled for suggesting that a terrible family that killed their young kids, had done them a favour; in that they didn't have to endure a lifetime of abuse, and also would not pass on the learned abuse pattern to the next gen. To cold a suggestion I guess.
We have one boy and it didn't really change our life that much. Some time running him to activities and overseeing homework and such, but our hobbies and friends didn't change.
I'm gonna have my uterus removed because of that. I'm much younger and although I have some pain during my period it's not debilitating at all, so it's not that much medically necessary.
It was also super easy to get a doctor to do it. I'm glad things are getting better in this regard.
I can't wait to not have to deal with bleeding, pain, and libido killer contraception.
Even though I do want children myself eventually, I think those doctors are silly for wanting to limit the person from their wishes of no children. It's bonkers.
"Oh, you want to do any ? Why, we know better than someone who probably has already took years thinking about it!"
Medical gatekeeping is real. It's annoying. It's why abortion, fertility treatments (of many kinds), HRT, and so on, all honestly should be way easier to access with the person's own consent.
They might argue, but what about the regret rate, the 10 people that according to some rag paper regret it for life. And then they promptly ignore that many 100,000s of people actually have been enormously helped by it, and that they won't magically go away if you make it harder to access -- you'll just make it unsafer for them, because now they rely on trenchcoat abortions, poor surgeries, lack of safe medicine due to deliberate underfunding of training, forbidding life-saving medicine, etc.
We oblige no duty to breed. Instead, we have a plight to make life enjoyable for ourselves and for each other. This goes their way too.
It's not such a binary thing. For example, you can obtain some, hodl for a bit, and later return them for a profit. It's basically like the stock market, except people refer to the money you get as a "ransom" rather than a "profit" for some reason. What many people outside the industry don't know is that it doesn't officially become a crime until police get involved. So just insist on "No police!" in your sales calls. /s
Interpretierte Instruktionen falsch, Kind steckt in Toaster fest!
Mag-sein, dass du musst deinen Babelfisch fixieren.
If my life were financially more secure and if the climate didn’t seem objectively fucked in the future I could imagine myself being a happy father of kids
Yeah man, this is it. I like freedom and disposable income. But I feel like it would be rewarding raising kids. But also it's sentencing them to whatever fucked up reality the last few generations have pushed us towards.
This is it for me. I absolutely love kids, but everything is so expensive. Having kids would be a big risk as things could quickly become very difficult is there was an emergency.
I'm in my mid 40s now but I knew even when I was a kid that I never wanted kids. I see my friends and family now struggling with their own children and I just cannot imagine that life for me. I have no regrets not having kids, but if I ever did, I know it's better to regret NOT having them than to regret having them.
I never want kids. I don't know how they're going to take the news.
Kids for me. They have improved my life more than anything else. Having the first two pushed me to go back to school and get a real job. I got more when my ex & I split and I married a guy with kids; we have a staggering number between us, most were teens or older when we got together and they are all close now, so they have a network of family to help and socialize with. The youngest is almost done with high school so we are in the final stretch of having them at home. The Thanksgiving feast here is insane, so many people, chaotic and fun.
Now - having said all that, I always knew I wanted kids, not necessarily to birth them but to raise them. Babies are adorable , little kids blistering cute, teenagers so much fun and occasionally helpful, and then they grow up and are actual people. It is work I find fulfilling and it helps the world to have educated, sensible, open-minded people. Most of my kids don't want kids themselves and that's fine! Everyone has their own life to live.
So for me, kids. For you, whatever you want, I don't think it's essential to become an adult and don't think it's the only way to get a family either.
I'm struggling with teenagers being enjoyable, both of mine were monsters. They are adults and doing well now, but I wouldn't re-do the teenage years if you paid me. I'm glad your experience was much better.
I had two terrible toddlers, but once they were kids they were cool. Two who I guess will get a midlife crisis, because they never caused trouble as kids or teens. The rest I got when they were teens or older and while not all of them (bio or other) were academic superstars or high performing athletes or anything, they were all reasonable and interesting and diverse people by teenage years.
thanks for the opinion.
its so heartwarming to read your comment
pardon my english :)
I'm in my 40s now and never liked children, even when I was one myself. So to me the decision not to procreate came very natural and has never changed. I was so certain that I never wanted any kids that I got myself sterilized when I was 25 or 26, don't remember exactly. Just to be certain I couldn't be trapped by some oopsie. Didn't regret that step for a second.
I don't remember my mom being motherly, and asked her about it once. She said "I don't like kids." I said"but you have so many kids!" And her reply?
"Well, I like you all now, I knew you would grow up, kids don't stay kids, they grow into people."
Good on you, live your life on your terms!
Kids. I've known that's what I wanted since I was eight years old.
great, hope you have a good life from this time and beyond,
pardon my english :)
Even if it were possible, I still would not prefer to have any kids.
First off, I haven't even been a "proper adult", and probably would never be. How can I be expected to raise a child with the care and love they deserve when I don't even have my life sorted out? Even if you argue that I'd have to change once having a child, I've also seen people fail to change even after having children they swore they loved even more than their own life.
Secondly, we've already got enough people that are unwanted and abandoned. Why not take better care of people we already have now?
Lastly, parenting is a huge commitment. It's not just about you and your "legacy", but another life that will suffer for your mistakes. For those who are up to the task and willingly take on the responsibility, thank you and best of luck!
I don’t have kids of my own, but through my time with my step-kids, I’ve learned I would’ve loved to have one or two. I totally understand people who don’t want kids. They can be a huge, expensive hassle. But I feel like I’ve gotten so much more back from them than it ever cost me. Plus they gave me this cup that I drink from every morning.
That cup is awesome (☞ﾟヮﾟ)☞
That is a trophy right there
This is marvellous!
I was well into my 40's when my kid was born, so I've had it both ways. I vastly prefer the kid. Yes it sucks to not being able to do some stuff on occasion. It even sucks more that my parents are gone so I have a real hard time finding babysitters. But I just love the little one so damn much!
No. I hate to live, my country and this entire world. Plus, there’s no future for humanity. I don’t want my children to feel this way.
No thank you, no kids.
I like my freedom and that it is quiet.
I've known since I was young that I don't want any. This was only reinforced after I adopted a kitten last year, regretted it to the point of depression after about 2 months, and adopted him off to someone else who I trust. I realised I absolutely don't ever want that kind of responsibility again so a human life would be infinitely worse of an idea. this is on top of terrible genetic health issues that I wouldn't want to force onto another existence.
No, absolutely not. At least, certainly none of my own, even if I were capable of it... I don't really see the point in procreating with the world on such a catastrophic trajectory. On the other hand, if I find myself in a situation where I have a home and resources to share, and some unfortunate already-existing kids need those things, I'd certainly offer them a place. That would be just as true for non-kids though, so I dunno how much of a "parent" that'd really make me.
I always wanted children. Damn near every major life choice has been fueled by that. Took a job I knew I wouldn't be happy at, but could be successful at to provide a better life. Yhe cars I've bought the safety rating for kids was to priority followed by reliability. The house I bought is within walking distance of every grade school, and the basement could easily be setup for a hangout spot for the teen years, oh and a good sized backyard for playing. One of the reasons I stayed at this job is I'm at max PTO and they actually offer paternity leave! I always make mental notes of fun places for kids so I could take them. When they were younger, and I was still considered cool, my niece and nephew wanted to move in with me 😆.
Just never met the right lady.
Oof. Not sure if you're still trying, but maybe try focusing on (improving) yourself with the same dedication?
I just wanna say I am sorry that it is near impossible for single dads to adopt kids. I understand the reasoning but want to cry because there are kids who need parents but you can't be the parent to one.
No biological kids. In my opinion, there is no reason to produce biological children when there already are millions of parentless, unloved children in foster homes.
That being said, some days I yearn to take care of a child - to know I have given an existing being the opportunity to a better life.
A couple of years ago, in Portugal, there were more couples looking to adopt than "viable" children up for adoption. While your statement makes total sense, it may be a insensible option on your country. Make due research!
There are options, you could foster too or adopt.
Thanks! I never thought of that.
No kids.
I don't want any more stress, and I don't like kids anyway. Plus the idea of bringing someone else in this world... I want to die, why would I cause living to someone else?
And even if my views do change in the future, I'd rather go for adoption. Not only would I not create more life, but I could perhaps give someone a better chance.
I don't really understand the appeal of your kids being blood-related anyway. What's the point?
I'm a parent, and we made the conscious decision to become parents. That said, I can fully understand people who don't want to have that responsibility. It can be exhausting and thankless, changing almost everything with your life, hobbies and habits.
On the other side of the coin, the depth of love you feel as a parent is impossible to describe. With that comes a set of incredible feelings, watching your children experience, learn and grow.
Basically, parenthood is almost completely thankless, but I wouldn't give it up for the world.
And then the grandkids show up....it's like amping up the feelings for my kids x10
All the fun, none of the long term responsibilities!
Not everyone who has kids ends up feeling this way though :(
I've known from a pretty early age that I never want kids. Don't get me wrong, I actually love kids. At social events I'll often be the one entertaining them, and I can't wait for my friends to start having kids so I can be the cool & fun babysitter.
However, kids are dreadful roommates, I'd be a horrible parent, I don't want to bring a living being into this cruel world (especially with climate change), I'm too poor for children, and, being non-binary, parenthood just seems so tied down to gender norms I don't adhere to.
Have seen both sides of the fence on this.
Met my first wife when I was in my 20s, she was a bit older, already divorced with kids. We were together for over 10 years, and one of her sons lived with us off and on during his teenage years. We enjoyed all the benefits of a childless existence - disposable income, freedom to do whatever we wanted evenings/weekends, etc, etc.
Eventually our marriage broke down. The reasons for it are entirely unrelated to us not having kids, but we were definitely not destined to be together for the rest of our lives.
About a year or so later I met an incredible woman, and I truly learned what it meant to have a soulmate. We were awesome together. She already had two young kids - 6yo and 9yo - and, a year or so later again, we had our own baby girl. We married a couple of years after that.
We now have a family that includes an amazing 21yo woman, a fabulous 18yo fella, and a beautiful 10yo daughter. My life is complete and I can't imagine it without any of them in it.
When you know, you know.
I've never really felt the urge to have kids. Plus it saves on resources and finances. I have nephews and nieces already and that's good enough for me. I'm at the point where some of my friends are having kids. Others aren't. I love being an uncle.
In any case, it depends on how much you as an individual want to have kids. For me, it just didn't add up. My wife and I both don't want them. We both work and want to retire as early as possible.
I often feel like the odd one out in this conversation because I feel like I'm the only person with no strong feelings one way or the other. Like I could be totally okay with never having kids, but also fine with having kids.
I know several people who feel this way!!
I have a kid and I feel this way.
To be clear, I absolutely love my son and I'm glad I have him. But I also still feel like if I had decided not to have kids, I'd have been fine with it.
It's a different framing now though, of "Do you want a kid", in the hypothetical, vs. "Would you be ok if you didn't have [Insert your kid's name here]." I'd be devastated if my son were not in my life. But I think I'd have been fine if I chose not to have a kid.
This is a complicated question. I hate kids. Multiple. They are loud, dumb. But when there's only one kid, I actually really like interacting with them! It's so much fun to forget who I am for a moment and play games with a kid! I love teaching new things to them and seeing them try them out.
I will only "have" a kid when the conditions are ideal. That being, finacially stable and away from my family. I do not want them to corrupt the kid's mind with their religion bullshit. A partner for me is not neccesary. I also plan on adopting a kid rather than making one. Infant or a kid? I'm uncertain.
My mom said once that if everyone waited until their life was perfect to have a kid, that was the end of humanity. There is never a perfect time.
With all due respect, I disagree. As long as people that are uneducated on sex exist there will always be children born. And there will always be uneducated people around. So we are covered on that.
I think what your mother implies by her words is that no one's life will be perfect. I'm an optimistic person so that is total bullshit to me. What I'm asking for is far from perfection. I really do not think being financially stable/independent and being away from my parents is a lot to ask for.
No kids, ever. I can hardly take care of myself, can't even be trusted with a plant, and I find them disgusting. Who will care for me when I am old? I have worked long and hard with the elderly, and knowing how many of them were abandoned by their families, it is easy to see that my odds are better investing the money I would use to raise a child, in a retirement fund instead.
But with how broke I am, I am not even getting to do the retirement fund thing, so yay. Glad I didn't let an ex change my mind when I was earning a lot back in the day, because those jobs got "optimized" and outsourced.
There would have to be some dramatic changes in the world socially and politically before I'll feel even remotely comfortable having kids. Also my finances would need to change.
And my family also has some genetic issues I'd rather not pass on.
Adoption is an option, but I'm pretty sure I don't even want one in the first place. When I was younger I thought having kids seemed like a sucker's game. My opinion has softened on that a bit, but it's still difficult to imagine actually wanting children.
Kids.
Nothing comes close to how difficult it is. It takes everything.
Nothing comes close to how amazing it is, and I mean nothing! It’s fantastic, rewarding in so many ways, it even develops your character.
I didn’t know I wanted them.
Same boat. We didn’t realize we wanted it until it was happening. It sometimes isn’t so black-and-white.
I wish I could, but given the condition I'm in - soon-to-be 24, unemployed, mentally poor, no heirloom, no inheritance, no labor laws, high levels of pollution - these aren't ideal conditions for a child.
I've also never courted a woman before - I can probably not, because it is my intrinsic bias that I won't have anything to provide from my end, and that I don't want it to be one-sided, and also because personal circumstances - abusive family, you know.
I don't want another cog to this exploitative capitalist machine. I guess I'm just unlucky, but hopefully, this suffering ends with me. This makes me feel a little sad, but I don't want to be selfish.
And no, I'm not taking care of adopted kids. There's barely a few rupees in my account. Worst case possible, I want save it for the endgame.
its so sad to read your comment
i hope you will get all the helps you need, and i hope you will get a better life
pardon my english :)
I wish you find happines. You deserve it.
I don't have time for this, also every persons i know see their health being ruined giving birth. So thanks but no, My health is more important.
No kids, I like peace and quiet and I would be a terrible father.
Single uncle with 2 nieces is where it's at 😉
Winky face at the end is kinda creepy
What are you talking about, nephew... ;)
I have one kid and it's one of the best things so far life has dished out for me. I love him so much and he's so much fun. I know one kid is my limit though. Enjoy!
Having no kids. I currently have no children and do not plan to. I am satisfied with my life. My only real concerns are about who would support me when I age. Not monetarily but just in case my mind starts to slip and I need someone to help me get the help I need. I don't feel comfortable having a child or adopting with that being the sole reason.
Never considered the who would support you in advanced age argument. But I live in the US and any children I have would end up as probably the poorest generation to ever exist in this country, so not them I suppose.
Like I said, I view the financial aspect of my responsibility. It's more like I'd be worried about not really being able to make my own decisions and not having someone there to help me out. Someone to help pick what retirement home or elder care facility I end up in. Someone to check on me and make sure those places aren't doing elder abuse. That sort of stuff.
I’d be worried about not really being able to make my own decisions and not having someone there to help me out.
I don't know about you, but I sure hope I'd be able to check out before that time comes for me. Before my mind and body becomes too feeble, I'd like to be able to just nope out.
I agree, but I also don't know if I'll have that opinion in the future...
So, I have a few family members getting on in age and they are worried about the same thing. In one instance, they hired a house cleaner to come on once a week, just purley my happenstance, but she is able to let us know if said family member feels "a little off base"
It was bad enough to have to get through the world of children and especially teenagers once. I have zero desire to ever watch and accompany someone else having to go through that hell.
Oh my God I would never want to BE a kid again, it was a nightmare. But my kids say they enjoyed it ok, and weren't as uncomfortable as I was. Maybe it skips a generation.
Kids for me. On my third one. It is hard at times and you sacrifice a lot of your time, and energy (money is less of an issue up to the second one I'd say, the real costs starts at three where you need to upgrade cars and shit) in order to be a good parent. But watching them grow up and be brilliant boys, is very rewarding. I am happy that I am providing them a good life so far, they are smart and devour knowledge, and they take on my interests kinda naturally so it's fun teaching them things I enjoy.
In a few years we will be nerding out on Dota or PoE or whatever, anime, maybe I will DM an rpg for them and their cousins that live nearby. Start them up with python or so. Teach them Japanese, maybe have them start tennis or so. Or maybe they will nerd out with something on their own. Well see..
Tomorrow I'll grab the boys and go to the countryside for hiking up the mountains, playing in the forest, eating awesome food in taverns and so on. Will be tiring, but will be fun.
So yeah. Kids are fun and they give me a purpose to strive for. Peace and quiet while being alone was definitely something, but after experiencing both, for me it is purposeless, unfulfilling, and gets pretty boring pretty quick.
its so good to have someone that have the same interests, especially if thats our kids.. have a great life
pardon my english :)
You have very different kids to me.
Late 40s. I wanted kids, or at least I think I wanted kids. Might have just been society telling me I wanted kids.
Regardless, kids never happened and I’m glad. My partner and I both agree this world is messed up. And honestly, I probably shouldn’t pass my messed up genes to a new generation.
I made the choice to not have kids. I didn't want the responsibility and I didn't think I'd make a good parent. I'm in my late 40s now, and honestly - it's been pretty great. It was the right choice.
I love kids, however, with the current situation of our planet and the inhabitants of it, no more. I just hope that our youngest will be able to grow up and live a full life. Shit is going downhill at an accelerated rate.
I don't have social life. I want kids. It's a fucking contradiction.
Absolutely no kids ever even if I wasn’t gay or had ability to adopt. I don’t remember my childhood positively at all, I think my parents should’ve never decided to have kids, and despite me trying hard to not be like them, I found myself making similar mistakes. I don’t understand people being so obsessed about having kids and saying stuff like “wait until you got ur own”, I’m like bitch it’s not happening ever unless it’s a nightmare I wake up all wet after with relief that it’s not real
No kids. They’re a huge, life long commitment that you need to be willing to sacrifice everything for. Your happiness, your sanity, your time, your money… everything.
And I’m not the type of person who wants kids nearly enough to do that.
Especially when people tell me that I should for reasons like having a caretaker when I’m older. I’m not attached to my parents enough to do that. Why would I expect that of anything I pop out? And what a horrible selfish reason to make a new human that is!
If the only reason I’d be having a kid is selfish reasons in the distant future that aren’t even a guarantee, then that’s not worth sacrificing myself for right now.
Nothing against other people who want to be parents, so long as they’re prepared and not doing it as some sort of life insurance or to make a clone of themselves.
yep, good opinion sir..
The moment humans brought nuclear armaments into the world was also the moment that we severed ourselves from our humanity. We are still living in the shadows of metaphorical guns to our heads. This escalation of madness has led us down a very dark path, and for that reason, I'm out.
Wars have always been brutal and involved murdering/raping citizens. Don't act like nuclear power made a change in morals. Only thing that changed is the scale. The darkness has always been there.
lol
My wife had my first when I was 39. I wish I had had kids sooner. I love going to minor hockey games and taking to my daughter about her crafts and school.
I would probably be a mom by now if I could be, not because I want to be but due to regular happenstance, but with everything I face and everything having kids could add to that, I don't trust myself as one, with both bad genetics and a fear of imbuing a bad childhood at play.
Kids! I thought when I was a kid I wanted them no matter what. In my early twenties I decided I only wanted kids if I could find the right partner. Now I have one. Sometimes my partner is great, sometimes he sucks. I don't care, because my kid is great. She's a joy to be around and gives my life purpose in a way I didn't realize was possible. My whole purpose is just to enjoy reading her a story in that moment. My whole purpose is to feed her when she's hungry. My whole purpose is to look into her eyes. My whole purpose is just to enjoy the moment I'm in, and she accidentally causes me to be fully present so often. It's amazing.
That said, I would say if you're not 80% sure you want kids, don't. Figure out what would get you to 80% first. Financial stability, a good partner, a solid career field, etc.
Expensive and bad for the planet.
Having kids, that is the only way my genes can live on. But even having step or adopted kids is preferable.
It just brings so much joy as nothing else.
Why is it essential for our genes to live on?
Ego.
It's not our genes that he cares about. It's his genes.
For me personally, I feel that I am inherently good, humanity is inherently good, and I just want to pass the torch to the next generation and see how far they can carry it. We're currently in a bit of a slump as a species, but I believe that everything will turn out alright in the end and I'd like for my descendants to be around to enjoy and indeed contribute to it.
Why does it matter if they're your descendants or others'? My 16 great great grandparents are as much strangers to me as any other 16 people walking around 100 years ago. And everyone here now is in the same place, whoever they came from. Not like I'll be alive to (or would do so in any case) take pride in saying 'ooh those 12 people have something to do with me if you go back far enough"
Why wouldn't it matter? If your family doesn't matter to you, what does?
'ooh those 12 people have something to do with me if you go back far enough"
It's not about that, it's that those 12 people won't ever exist if I never have any kids. They have everything to do with me, because without me, they wouldn't be alive. And I also think the world will be a better place if they do exist.
I think that's pure conjecture about how having kids affects the world. And the nature, worthiness, or value of those 12 people has nothing to do with whether or not you happen to personally be their ancestor. There's nothing different or more special about one person's progeny than another, so who cares if it's your kids or 8 billion other people. The idea that that is important in the future is all about making yourself important in the present.
There’s nothing different or more special about one person’s progeny than another
How do you figure that? Are you familiar with the theory of evolution? How do you think we got to the point where I'm communicating to you through a global communication network? Dumb luck?
We are as important to future generations as past generations are to us. If previous human beings hadn't done everything they did, we wouldn't be here now. Likewise, everything that we do in the present has a rippling effect for the rest of human history. Having kids allows you to have a little more direct input on what kind of ripples you leave behind.
My point is not that previous people haven't done significant things, it's that they did those things independently of who one of their many ancestors happened to be. Much like an actual ripple, the larger the pond, the less likely any disturbance is to reach the shore, and the more likely it is to be quickly lost to the natural turbulence of any body of water.
If your evidence against that is the existence of significant inventions, there are very few, if any, that wouldn't have been invented by someone else within years. No major invention or discovery, from the light bulb to relativity, has been made while others weren't working on the same problem and making similar, if slightly slower, progress.
That's why they say necessity is the mother of invention, not a person or an institution or anything that could be credited to a single creator.
And if you think humans are still evolving according to selection pressure the way that other species have/do, you just don't understand how evolution actually works. The moment we gained self awareness and created social structures, we drifted so far from biological evolution that it's an entirely moot point in terms of future generations. The least adaptive of us now, on average, still lives through the entirety of our birthing/fertile years, while significant portions of a population dying during or prior to fertility is the only way that natural selection works. That or the existence of bachelor herds that lead to a very slim minority being the only ones to breed. Neither of those are the case with humans.
Ultimately, having kids to ensure your own legacy is possibly the most selfish reason you could create someone and thrust them into 80 years of what should be their own life.
I don't believe that anyone truly acts independently. We are all products of our environment, of which our ancestors comprise a significant portion. I don't believe in free will.
Your contention regarding inventions is wrong, but irrelevant anyway. I understand that it's nearly impossible to discuss this topic objectively without allowing your personal emotions to bleed into it, so I'll just leave it at that. I've already made my points but you don't seem to understand at all.
significant portions of a population dying during or prior to fertility is the only way that natural selection works. That or the existence of bachelor herds that lead to a very slim minority being the only ones to breed.
And I don't understand evolution? Wow. I think it's possible you may be suffering from a severe case of the Dunning-Kruger effect.
What about my understanding of evolution is incorrect, and how do you see natural selection working in present humans? Very possible that Dunning-Kruger is at play, but we may have to agree to disagree as to where...
I'll get back to you on that. Seriously, I just don't have time rn but I'll edit this when I have a chance within the next 24 hrs. The second half of your question is particularly difficult to answer.
Ok I just accidentally wiped my entire edit before saving. Fuck that, I'm not writing all that again. God damn it that was such a good response too. Sorry.
I'm just a vehicle to my genes which they use to travel to the future. They only can travel when they have a suitable host who can reproduce them and can make sure that the next version has the best chances to reproduce again. So over time natural selection optimized for the vehicles to want to reproduce. Everyone who didn't have the desire to have kids in the past has none (other than rape victims) to move their genes forward.
Anyway this is a extreme oversimplification of the whole idea of The Selfish Gene
Those who truly know their own preference have no choice in the matter.
What do you mean by this?
Kids. The whole world is new and interesting to them and that is infectious.
having children sounds disgusting. every year that I'm still alive and I see more of my friends on Facebook posting their fat naked baby slobber garbage I am even more happy than before. fuck your cookie slobber food garbage bowling ball head fat screaming toothless idiot crap. do not ever come to my house. im blocking them all
I wish I could have a kid. But I'm a virgin at 35 without a job and still living with my mother. It ain't going to happen.
I'm not quite the same demographic as you, but I get it.
For me, it's simply not possible to have kids unless I adopted. And that ain't happening (adoption is a long, arduous, and expensive process and I'm only one person...wouldn't want to take that alone). I suppose technically my body might physically be able to produce kids...I haven't tried, but that's missing the point.
People sometimes ask me if I want kids and it's just such a silly question for someone like me. It's like asking if I had a mega mansion, how would I decorate the 7th bathroom? What I want is irrelevant because that's not at all in the realm of possibility.
I don't know if I would want kids or not. But since it's not possible, it's not worth dwelling over.
Me and my wife has kinda agreed to not have kids. But as life goes on you kind do want it. You don't want to be in your 50s and wish you had kids to spend time with.
So soon we are having our second. And yes, life is very different but honestly I wouldn't want it any other way.
'Steve and I were talking about children one time, and he said the problem with children is that they carry your heart with them. The exact phrase was, “It’s your heart running around outside your body.”'
-- Eric Schmidt, quoting Steve Jobs.
Ironic considering how he treated his first daughter.
thanks for the quote
I have kids, it is great knowing that I’ve successfully continued my bloodline like my ancestors before me.
While those that have not procreated will die as failures in the eyes of nature. Their bloodlines will end in 100 years it will be like they were never there to begin with.
Kids are also pretty awesome to have.
You're asking a bunch of lonely post redditers, all your gonna get is child free posting to cope with them not having a relationship
I'm not sure you're going to get an objective answer to this as no one has lived a life of either having kids or not having kids, hungrythirstyhorny.
I will say that, as a single male in his mid forties who has observed a good amount of life; first, the thought of not having people to rely on in you're old age is a little worrisome; and two, not having had someone to pass my knowledge and skills down to is a little sad. However, I really enjoy the freedom and opportunities my life (and bank account) affords me.
There is always a cost to freedom. Or, as Jonis Joplin put it - freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose. Choosing to not have children is a selfish act. Whether "selfish" is a bad thing or not is subjective.
I would offer that anyone who's going through life without children, find some altruistic outlet to participate in. You can otherwise find yourself wondering what your legacy may be or what the point of your life has been - aka a mid-life crisis.
I think that deciding not to have kids is not a selfish act. Having kids just to have a fallback when old and frail on the other hand side is very much so.
I agree, I don't think not having kids has anything to do with being selfish.
But I guess what they meant to say is just that having kids is hard. A lot of times, people become more selfless and less focused on their own wants and needs after they become parents.
Of course, some people don't actually become more selfless or responsible, and instead they just become bad, narcissistic parents. But the choice to have kids is associated with the choice to be a responsible adult and work for the benefit of others, at least in theory.
That argument makes sense. Though I see it more from choosing to prioritize yourself and own self interests over having children and sharing a life with them as selfish too. I guess we're all selfish one way or another.
Right, I get what you mean, and I agree. No matter how you put it, nothing is ever entirely selfless.
In your second paragraph, the two reasons you stated to have kids are entirely selfish. Then you say not having kids is selfish?
I offered two reasons I personally may regret not having children. I could list several others such as the pure joy of watching them grow into adults and mimic you and your partner. If you want to say that's selfish, to bring another human into the word to experience a universe of emotion you'd otherwise never experience, I understand that perspective. No argument.
But then I offered that choosing to prioritize your own life is in and of itself a selfish act. It's more explicitly about you than it is about another person.
Would you disagree that going out to eat by yourself is more of a selfish act than inviting a friend to eat out with you? Sharing an experience is less selfish, no?
owh okay i see
but for me, i prefer not having any kids, not because of the freedom,
but sometimes i think, i wont be a good parent for them
im afaraid that i cant provide them with all the good things that any parents should give..
i accept your opinion, thank you
pardon my english :)
My initial reason for not having kids was financial. I think a lot of people have learned it may be better to have children later in life when you can properly care for them. I know many people who've had their first child in their late-30s and early-40s. My aunt had her first child in her fifties. That's not something that was common before modern medicine.
I have always had the idea that I would have a kid if and when I met the right person to share parenting with. That hasn't happened so I've had to put some thought into my priorities. It's not fair to have a child just because it's what society says you should do or just because you want someone to take care of you when you're old. It's so much more than that and I think people should be more mindful of the responsibilities and long term repercussions.
You can't have "a kids". You can have "a kid" or "kids", but not "a kids".
I'm 42 and have known since I was 4 years old that I never wanted to be a mother. It's seriously one of my earliest memories - I didn't want to make my bed, my mother was exasperated with me and said "you'll be sad you treated me so badly when you have kids of your own"... and I remember being just appalled at the thought of being a parent.
I just don't enjoy children. I like peace, quiet, and order, and the freedom to do what I want without having to factor in children. Plus it looks super stressful to be a parent. I have 2 nephews and a niece, and while they're good kids, their parents always look so utterly exhausted and overwhelmed. And I'm definitely not good at being an aunt - interacting with children just doesn't come naturally to me.
Everyone told me I'd grow out of it. I had to fight to get my tubes tied in my mid-twenties (for real, I had to see so many doctors and had a botched Essure procedure at Planned Parenthood before I finally found an OBGYN who would take me seriously!).
No
regretsrugrats!I swore against having kids-for lots of reasons-, same as my wife. But accidents happened and we became parents. As the cliche goes "it is life changing".
It alters who you are and your idea of importance. There was stress, and exhausting times, but now they are adults they are my favourite people :)
It is a threshold moment situation, if you like your life how it is never have kids. If you have kids your life becomes different. No path is better than the other; just altered.
If there's one thing childfree people love, it's how there is always a parent ready to reply about how rewarding kids are.
I hear ya, but I don't mind - it's a discussion thread, after all! - and it's interesting to see a different perspective than my own.
That's very generous of you. In my experience, the perspective I replied to is the one that is most prevalent and you can't mention being happy without kids without somebody chiming in to say or imply how happy you would be if you had them. It gets really old.
Understood, that used to bother me too. After a while people realized I was firm and laid off. Other than a few occasional passive-aggressive comments from my mom about how she doesn't have grandchildren, nobody really says anything anymore.
Edit: whoops, that posted 3 times!
Thanks for being open. as i mentioned there is no right or wrong choice, just different
You got it, I'm a very firm believer in 'different strokes for different folks'!
As an unrelated side note: One thing that has been interesting is watching genes play out. My daughter smirks like her grandfather, and she has had maybe 5 days exposure to him in her lifetime. And my youngest rubs his feet together when stressed, like a self soothing routine, something his great-grandfather used to do, but he died before my son was born. We like to think we are all about choices and choose to be unique, But some invisible biology still controls things.
That's so funny, what a specific behavior! I really do wonder to what degree we're all just automatons behaving on the whims of our genes.
I mean, yeah. Only one of both groups had both experiences.
Child free people love to shit on an experience they know nothing about, sure parents are ready to reply to those.
Nobody is telling people to have children...
Oh yes, they are. Maybe not in this thread, but in real life.
I'm glad it worked out well for you! :)
Then you have kids growing up with shit parents... the threshold isn't worth it
it is a fair point. On another platform I got pummeled for suggesting that a terrible family that killed their young kids, had done them a favour; in that they didn't have to endure a lifetime of abuse, and also would not pass on the learned abuse pattern to the next gen. To cold a suggestion I guess.
We have one boy and it didn't really change our life that much. Some time running him to activities and overseeing homework and such, but our hobbies and friends didn't change.
I'm gonna have my uterus removed because of that. I'm much younger and although I have some pain during my period it's not debilitating at all, so it's not that much medically necessary.
It was also super easy to get a doctor to do it. I'm glad things are getting better in this regard.
I can't wait to not have to deal with bleeding, pain, and libido killer contraception.
Even though I do want children myself eventually, I think those doctors are silly for wanting to limit the person from their wishes of no children. It's bonkers.
"Oh, you want to do any ? Why, we know better than someone who probably has already took years thinking about it!"
Medical gatekeeping is real. It's annoying. It's why abortion, fertility treatments (of many kinds), HRT, and so on, all honestly should be way easier to access with the person's own consent.
They might argue, but what about the regret rate, the 10 people that according to some rag paper regret it for life. And then they promptly ignore that many 100,000s of people actually have been enormously helped by it, and that they won't magically go away if you make it harder to access -- you'll just make it unsafer for them, because now they rely on trenchcoat abortions, poor surgeries, lack of safe medicine due to deliberate underfunding of training, forbidding life-saving medicine, etc.
We oblige no duty to breed. Instead, we have a plight to make life enjoyable for ourselves and for each other. This goes their way too.
It's not such a binary thing. For example, you can obtain some, hodl for a bit, and later return them for a profit. It's basically like the stock market, except people refer to the money you get as a "ransom" rather than a "profit" for some reason. What many people outside the industry don't know is that it doesn't officially become a crime until police get involved. So just insist on "No police!" in your sales calls. /s
Interpretierte Instruktionen falsch, Kind steckt in Toaster fest!
Mag-sein, dass du musst deinen Babelfisch fixieren.
If my life were financially more secure and if the climate didn’t seem objectively fucked in the future I could imagine myself being a happy father of kids
Yeah man, this is it. I like freedom and disposable income. But I feel like it would be rewarding raising kids. But also it's sentencing them to whatever fucked up reality the last few generations have pushed us towards.
This is it for me. I absolutely love kids, but everything is so expensive. Having kids would be a big risk as things could quickly become very difficult is there was an emergency.
I'm in my mid 40s now but I knew even when I was a kid that I never wanted kids. I see my friends and family now struggling with their own children and I just cannot imagine that life for me. I have no regrets not having kids, but if I ever did, I know it's better to regret NOT having them than to regret having them.
I never want kids. I don't know how they're going to take the news.
Kids for me. They have improved my life more than anything else. Having the first two pushed me to go back to school and get a real job. I got more when my ex & I split and I married a guy with kids; we have a staggering number between us, most were teens or older when we got together and they are all close now, so they have a network of family to help and socialize with. The youngest is almost done with high school so we are in the final stretch of having them at home. The Thanksgiving feast here is insane, so many people, chaotic and fun.
Now - having said all that, I always knew I wanted kids, not necessarily to birth them but to raise them. Babies are adorable , little kids blistering cute, teenagers so much fun and occasionally helpful, and then they grow up and are actual people. It is work I find fulfilling and it helps the world to have educated, sensible, open-minded people. Most of my kids don't want kids themselves and that's fine! Everyone has their own life to live.
So for me, kids. For you, whatever you want, I don't think it's essential to become an adult and don't think it's the only way to get a family either.
I'm struggling with teenagers being enjoyable, both of mine were monsters. They are adults and doing well now, but I wouldn't re-do the teenage years if you paid me. I'm glad your experience was much better.
I had two terrible toddlers, but once they were kids they were cool. Two who I guess will get a midlife crisis, because they never caused trouble as kids or teens. The rest I got when they were teens or older and while not all of them (bio or other) were academic superstars or high performing athletes or anything, they were all reasonable and interesting and diverse people by teenage years.
thanks for the opinion.
its so heartwarming to read your comment
pardon my english :)
I'm in my 40s now and never liked children, even when I was one myself. So to me the decision not to procreate came very natural and has never changed. I was so certain that I never wanted any kids that I got myself sterilized when I was 25 or 26, don't remember exactly. Just to be certain I couldn't be trapped by some oopsie. Didn't regret that step for a second.
I don't remember my mom being motherly, and asked her about it once. She said "I don't like kids." I said"but you have so many kids!" And her reply?
"Well, I like you all now, I knew you would grow up, kids don't stay kids, they grow into people."
Good on you, live your life on your terms!
Kids. I've known that's what I wanted since I was eight years old.
great, hope you have a good life from this time and beyond,
pardon my english :)
Even if it were possible, I still would not prefer to have any kids.
First off, I haven't even been a "proper adult", and probably would never be. How can I be expected to raise a child with the care and love they deserve when I don't even have my life sorted out? Even if you argue that I'd have to change once having a child, I've also seen people fail to change even after having children they swore they loved even more than their own life.
Secondly, we've already got enough people that are unwanted and abandoned. Why not take better care of people we already have now?
Lastly, parenting is a huge commitment. It's not just about you and your "legacy", but another life that will suffer for your mistakes. For those who are up to the task and willingly take on the responsibility, thank you and best of luck!
I don’t have kids of my own, but through my time with my step-kids, I’ve learned I would’ve loved to have one or two. I totally understand people who don’t want kids. They can be a huge, expensive hassle. But I feel like I’ve gotten so much more back from them than it ever cost me. Plus they gave me this cup that I drink from every morning.
That cup is awesome (☞ﾟヮﾟ)☞
That is a trophy right there
This is marvellous!
I was well into my 40's when my kid was born, so I've had it both ways. I vastly prefer the kid. Yes it sucks to not being able to do some stuff on occasion. It even sucks more that my parents are gone so I have a real hard time finding babysitters. But I just love the little one so damn much!
No. I hate to live, my country and this entire world. Plus, there’s no future for humanity. I don’t want my children to feel this way.
No thank you, no kids.
I like my freedom and that it is quiet.
I've known since I was young that I don't want any. This was only reinforced after I adopted a kitten last year, regretted it to the point of depression after about 2 months, and adopted him off to someone else who I trust. I realised I absolutely don't ever want that kind of responsibility again so a human life would be infinitely worse of an idea. this is on top of terrible genetic health issues that I wouldn't want to force onto another existence.
No, absolutely not. At least, certainly none of my own, even if I were capable of it... I don't really see the point in procreating with the world on such a catastrophic trajectory. On the other hand, if I find myself in a situation where I have a home and resources to share, and some unfortunate already-existing kids need those things, I'd certainly offer them a place. That would be just as true for non-kids though, so I dunno how much of a "parent" that'd really make me.
I always wanted children. Damn near every major life choice has been fueled by that. Took a job I knew I wouldn't be happy at, but could be successful at to provide a better life. Yhe cars I've bought the safety rating for kids was to priority followed by reliability. The house I bought is within walking distance of every grade school, and the basement could easily be setup for a hangout spot for the teen years, oh and a good sized backyard for playing. One of the reasons I stayed at this job is I'm at max PTO and they actually offer paternity leave! I always make mental notes of fun places for kids so I could take them. When they were younger, and I was still considered cool, my niece and nephew wanted to move in with me 😆.
Just never met the right lady.
Oof. Not sure if you're still trying, but maybe try focusing on (improving) yourself with the same dedication?
I just wanna say I am sorry that it is near impossible for single dads to adopt kids. I understand the reasoning but want to cry because there are kids who need parents but you can't be the parent to one.
No biological kids. In my opinion, there is no reason to produce biological children when there already are millions of parentless, unloved children in foster homes.
That being said, some days I yearn to take care of a child - to know I have given an existing being the opportunity to a better life.
A couple of years ago, in Portugal, there were more couples looking to adopt than "viable" children up for adoption. While your statement makes total sense, it may be a insensible option on your country. Make due research!
There are options, you could foster too or adopt.
Thanks! I never thought of that.
No kids.
I don't want any more stress, and I don't like kids anyway. Plus the idea of bringing someone else in this world... I want to die, why would I cause living to someone else?
And even if my views do change in the future, I'd rather go for adoption. Not only would I not create more life, but I could perhaps give someone a better chance.
I don't really understand the appeal of your kids being blood-related anyway. What's the point?
I'm a parent, and we made the conscious decision to become parents. That said, I can fully understand people who don't want to have that responsibility. It can be exhausting and thankless, changing almost everything with your life, hobbies and habits.
On the other side of the coin, the depth of love you feel as a parent is impossible to describe. With that comes a set of incredible feelings, watching your children experience, learn and grow.
Basically, parenthood is almost completely thankless, but I wouldn't give it up for the world.
And then the grandkids show up....it's like amping up the feelings for my kids x10
All the fun, none of the long term responsibilities!
Not everyone who has kids ends up feeling this way though :(
I've known from a pretty early age that I never want kids. Don't get me wrong, I actually love kids. At social events I'll often be the one entertaining them, and I can't wait for my friends to start having kids so I can be the cool & fun babysitter.
However, kids are dreadful roommates, I'd be a horrible parent, I don't want to bring a living being into this cruel world (especially with climate change), I'm too poor for children, and, being non-binary, parenthood just seems so tied down to gender norms I don't adhere to.
Have seen both sides of the fence on this.
Met my first wife when I was in my 20s, she was a bit older, already divorced with kids. We were together for over 10 years, and one of her sons lived with us off and on during his teenage years. We enjoyed all the benefits of a childless existence - disposable income, freedom to do whatever we wanted evenings/weekends, etc, etc.
Eventually our marriage broke down. The reasons for it are entirely unrelated to us not having kids, but we were definitely not destined to be together for the rest of our lives.
About a year or so later I met an incredible woman, and I truly learned what it meant to have a soulmate. We were awesome together. She already had two young kids - 6yo and 9yo - and, a year or so later again, we had our own baby girl. We married a couple of years after that.
We now have a family that includes an amazing 21yo woman, a fabulous 18yo fella, and a beautiful 10yo daughter. My life is complete and I can't imagine it without any of them in it.
When you know, you know.
I've never really felt the urge to have kids. Plus it saves on resources and finances. I have nephews and nieces already and that's good enough for me. I'm at the point where some of my friends are having kids. Others aren't. I love being an uncle.
In any case, it depends on how much you as an individual want to have kids. For me, it just didn't add up. My wife and I both don't want them. We both work and want to retire as early as possible.
I often feel like the odd one out in this conversation because I feel like I'm the only person with no strong feelings one way or the other. Like I could be totally okay with never having kids, but also fine with having kids.
I know several people who feel this way!!
I have a kid and I feel this way.
To be clear, I absolutely love my son and I'm glad I have him. But I also still feel like if I had decided not to have kids, I'd have been fine with it.
It's a different framing now though, of "Do you want a kid", in the hypothetical, vs. "Would you be ok if you didn't have [Insert your kid's name here]." I'd be devastated if my son were not in my life. But I think I'd have been fine if I chose not to have a kid.
This is a complicated question. I hate kids. Multiple. They are loud, dumb. But when there's only one kid, I actually really like interacting with them! It's so much fun to forget who I am for a moment and play games with a kid! I love teaching new things to them and seeing them try them out.
I will only "have" a kid when the conditions are ideal. That being, finacially stable and away from my family. I do not want them to corrupt the kid's mind with their religion bullshit. A partner for me is not neccesary. I also plan on adopting a kid rather than making one. Infant or a kid? I'm uncertain.
My mom said once that if everyone waited until their life was perfect to have a kid, that was the end of humanity. There is never a perfect time.
With all due respect, I disagree. As long as people that are uneducated on sex exist there will always be children born. And there will always be uneducated people around. So we are covered on that.
I think what your mother implies by her words is that no one's life will be perfect. I'm an optimistic person so that is total bullshit to me. What I'm asking for is far from perfection. I really do not think being financially stable/independent and being away from my parents is a lot to ask for.
No kids, ever. I can hardly take care of myself, can't even be trusted with a plant, and I find them disgusting. Who will care for me when I am old? I have worked long and hard with the elderly, and knowing how many of them were abandoned by their families, it is easy to see that my odds are better investing the money I would use to raise a child, in a retirement fund instead.
But with how broke I am, I am not even getting to do the retirement fund thing, so yay. Glad I didn't let an ex change my mind when I was earning a lot back in the day, because those jobs got "optimized" and outsourced.
There would have to be some dramatic changes in the world socially and politically before I'll feel even remotely comfortable having kids. Also my finances would need to change.
And my family also has some genetic issues I'd rather not pass on.
Adoption is an option, but I'm pretty sure I don't even want one in the first place. When I was younger I thought having kids seemed like a sucker's game. My opinion has softened on that a bit, but it's still difficult to imagine actually wanting children.
Kids.
Nothing comes close to how difficult it is. It takes everything.
Nothing comes close to how amazing it is, and I mean nothing! It’s fantastic, rewarding in so many ways, it even develops your character.
I didn’t know I wanted them.
Same boat. We didn’t realize we wanted it until it was happening. It sometimes isn’t so black-and-white.
I wish I could, but given the condition I'm in - soon-to-be 24, unemployed, mentally poor, no heirloom, no inheritance, no labor laws, high levels of pollution - these aren't ideal conditions for a child.
I've also never courted a woman before - I can probably not, because it is my intrinsic bias that I won't have anything to provide from my end, and that I don't want it to be one-sided, and also because personal circumstances - abusive family, you know.
I don't want another cog to this exploitative capitalist machine. I guess I'm just unlucky, but hopefully, this suffering ends with me. This makes me feel a little sad, but I don't want to be selfish.
And no, I'm not taking care of adopted kids. There's barely a few rupees in my account. Worst case possible, I want save it for the endgame.
its so sad to read your comment
i hope you will get all the helps you need, and i hope you will get a better life
pardon my english :)
I wish you find happines. You deserve it.
I don't have time for this, also every persons i know see their health being ruined giving birth. So thanks but no, My health is more important.
No kids, I like peace and quiet and I would be a terrible father.
Single uncle with 2 nieces is where it's at 😉
Winky face at the end is kinda creepy
What are you talking about, nephew... ;)
I have one kid and it's one of the best things so far life has dished out for me. I love him so much and he's so much fun. I know one kid is my limit though. Enjoy!
Having no kids. I currently have no children and do not plan to. I am satisfied with my life. My only real concerns are about who would support me when I age. Not monetarily but just in case my mind starts to slip and I need someone to help me get the help I need. I don't feel comfortable having a child or adopting with that being the sole reason.
Never considered the who would support you in advanced age argument. But I live in the US and any children I have would end up as probably the poorest generation to ever exist in this country, so not them I suppose.
Like I said, I view the financial aspect of my responsibility. It's more like I'd be worried about not really being able to make my own decisions and not having someone there to help me out. Someone to help pick what retirement home or elder care facility I end up in. Someone to check on me and make sure those places aren't doing elder abuse. That sort of stuff.
I don't know about you, but I sure hope I'd be able to check out before that time comes for me. Before my mind and body becomes too feeble, I'd like to be able to just nope out.
I agree, but I also don't know if I'll have that opinion in the future...
So, I have a few family members getting on in age and they are worried about the same thing. In one instance, they hired a house cleaner to come on once a week, just purley my happenstance, but she is able to let us know if said family member feels "a little off base"
It was bad enough to have to get through the world of children and especially teenagers once. I have zero desire to ever watch and accompany someone else having to go through that hell.
Oh my God I would never want to BE a kid again, it was a nightmare. But my kids say they enjoyed it ok, and weren't as uncomfortable as I was. Maybe it skips a generation.
Kids for me. On my third one. It is hard at times and you sacrifice a lot of your time, and energy (money is less of an issue up to the second one I'd say, the real costs starts at three where you need to upgrade cars and shit) in order to be a good parent. But watching them grow up and be brilliant boys, is very rewarding. I am happy that I am providing them a good life so far, they are smart and devour knowledge, and they take on my interests kinda naturally so it's fun teaching them things I enjoy.
In a few years we will be nerding out on Dota or PoE or whatever, anime, maybe I will DM an rpg for them and their cousins that live nearby. Start them up with python or so. Teach them Japanese, maybe have them start tennis or so. Or maybe they will nerd out with something on their own. Well see..
Tomorrow I'll grab the boys and go to the countryside for hiking up the mountains, playing in the forest, eating awesome food in taverns and so on. Will be tiring, but will be fun.
So yeah. Kids are fun and they give me a purpose to strive for. Peace and quiet while being alone was definitely something, but after experiencing both, for me it is purposeless, unfulfilling, and gets pretty boring pretty quick.
its so good to have someone that have the same interests, especially if thats our kids.. have a great life
pardon my english :)
You have very different kids to me.
Late 40s. I wanted kids, or at least I think I wanted kids. Might have just been society telling me I wanted kids.
Regardless, kids never happened and I’m glad. My partner and I both agree this world is messed up. And honestly, I probably shouldn’t pass my messed up genes to a new generation.
I made the choice to not have kids. I didn't want the responsibility and I didn't think I'd make a good parent. I'm in my late 40s now, and honestly - it's been pretty great. It was the right choice.
I love kids, however, with the current situation of our planet and the inhabitants of it, no more. I just hope that our youngest will be able to grow up and live a full life. Shit is going downhill at an accelerated rate.
I don't have social life. I want kids. It's a fucking contradiction.
Absolutely no kids ever even if I wasn’t gay or had ability to adopt. I don’t remember my childhood positively at all, I think my parents should’ve never decided to have kids, and despite me trying hard to not be like them, I found myself making similar mistakes. I don’t understand people being so obsessed about having kids and saying stuff like “wait until you got ur own”, I’m like bitch it’s not happening ever unless it’s a nightmare I wake up all wet after with relief that it’s not real
No kids. They’re a huge, life long commitment that you need to be willing to sacrifice everything for. Your happiness, your sanity, your time, your money… everything.
And I’m not the type of person who wants kids nearly enough to do that.
Especially when people tell me that I should for reasons like having a caretaker when I’m older. I’m not attached to my parents enough to do that. Why would I expect that of anything I pop out? And what a horrible selfish reason to make a new human that is!
If the only reason I’d be having a kid is selfish reasons in the distant future that aren’t even a guarantee, then that’s not worth sacrificing myself for right now.
Nothing against other people who want to be parents, so long as they’re prepared and not doing it as some sort of life insurance or to make a clone of themselves.
yep, good opinion sir..
The moment humans brought nuclear armaments into the world was also the moment that we severed ourselves from our humanity. We are still living in the shadows of metaphorical guns to our heads. This escalation of madness has led us down a very dark path, and for that reason, I'm out.
Wars have always been brutal and involved murdering/raping citizens. Don't act like nuclear power made a change in morals. Only thing that changed is the scale. The darkness has always been there.
lol
My wife had my first when I was 39. I wish I had had kids sooner. I love going to minor hockey games and taking to my daughter about her crafts and school.
I would probably be a mom by now if I could be, not because I want to be but due to regular happenstance, but with everything I face and everything having kids could add to that, I don't trust myself as one, with both bad genetics and a fear of imbuing a bad childhood at play.
Kids! I thought when I was a kid I wanted them no matter what. In my early twenties I decided I only wanted kids if I could find the right partner. Now I have one. Sometimes my partner is great, sometimes he sucks. I don't care, because my kid is great. She's a joy to be around and gives my life purpose in a way I didn't realize was possible. My whole purpose is just to enjoy reading her a story in that moment. My whole purpose is to feed her when she's hungry. My whole purpose is to look into her eyes. My whole purpose is just to enjoy the moment I'm in, and she accidentally causes me to be fully present so often. It's amazing.
That said, I would say if you're not 80% sure you want kids, don't. Figure out what would get you to 80% first. Financial stability, a good partner, a solid career field, etc.
Expensive and bad for the planet.
Having kids, that is the only way my genes can live on. But even having step or adopted kids is preferable.
It just brings so much joy as nothing else.
Why is it essential for our genes to live on?
Ego.
It's not our genes that he cares about. It's his genes.
For me personally, I feel that I am inherently good, humanity is inherently good, and I just want to pass the torch to the next generation and see how far they can carry it. We're currently in a bit of a slump as a species, but I believe that everything will turn out alright in the end and I'd like for my descendants to be around to enjoy and indeed contribute to it.
Why does it matter if they're your descendants or others'? My 16 great great grandparents are as much strangers to me as any other 16 people walking around 100 years ago. And everyone here now is in the same place, whoever they came from. Not like I'll be alive to (or would do so in any case) take pride in saying 'ooh those 12 people have something to do with me if you go back far enough"
Why wouldn't it matter? If your family doesn't matter to you, what does?
It's not about that, it's that those 12 people won't ever exist if I never have any kids. They have everything to do with me, because without me, they wouldn't be alive. And I also think the world will be a better place if they do exist.
I think that's pure conjecture about how having kids affects the world. And the nature, worthiness, or value of those 12 people has nothing to do with whether or not you happen to personally be their ancestor. There's nothing different or more special about one person's progeny than another, so who cares if it's your kids or 8 billion other people. The idea that that is important in the future is all about making yourself important in the present.
How do you figure that? Are you familiar with the theory of evolution? How do you think we got to the point where I'm communicating to you through a global communication network? Dumb luck?
We are as important to future generations as past generations are to us. If previous human beings hadn't done everything they did, we wouldn't be here now. Likewise, everything that we do in the present has a rippling effect for the rest of human history. Having kids allows you to have a little more direct input on what kind of ripples you leave behind.
My point is not that previous people haven't done significant things, it's that they did those things independently of who one of their many ancestors happened to be. Much like an actual ripple, the larger the pond, the less likely any disturbance is to reach the shore, and the more likely it is to be quickly lost to the natural turbulence of any body of water.
If your evidence against that is the existence of significant inventions, there are very few, if any, that wouldn't have been invented by someone else within years. No major invention or discovery, from the light bulb to relativity, has been made while others weren't working on the same problem and making similar, if slightly slower, progress.
That's why they say necessity is the mother of invention, not a person or an institution or anything that could be credited to a single creator.
And if you think humans are still evolving according to selection pressure the way that other species have/do, you just don't understand how evolution actually works. The moment we gained self awareness and created social structures, we drifted so far from biological evolution that it's an entirely moot point in terms of future generations. The least adaptive of us now, on average, still lives through the entirety of our birthing/fertile years, while significant portions of a population dying during or prior to fertility is the only way that natural selection works. That or the existence of bachelor herds that lead to a very slim minority being the only ones to breed. Neither of those are the case with humans.
Ultimately, having kids to ensure your own legacy is possibly the most selfish reason you could create someone and thrust them into 80 years of what should be their own life.
I don't believe that anyone truly acts independently. We are all products of our environment, of which our ancestors comprise a significant portion. I don't believe in free will.
Your contention regarding inventions is wrong, but irrelevant anyway. I understand that it's nearly impossible to discuss this topic objectively without allowing your personal emotions to bleed into it, so I'll just leave it at that. I've already made my points but you don't seem to understand at all.
And I don't understand evolution? Wow. I think it's possible you may be suffering from a severe case of the Dunning-Kruger effect.
What about my understanding of evolution is incorrect, and how do you see natural selection working in present humans? Very possible that Dunning-Kruger is at play, but we may have to agree to disagree as to where...
I'll get back to you on that. Seriously, I just don't have time rn but I'll edit this when I have a chance within the next 24 hrs. The second half of your question is particularly difficult to answer.
Ok I just accidentally wiped my entire edit before saving. Fuck that, I'm not writing all that again. God damn it that was such a good response too. Sorry.
I'm sure it was better than Darwin
I'm just a vehicle to my genes which they use to travel to the future. They only can travel when they have a suitable host who can reproduce them and can make sure that the next version has the best chances to reproduce again. So over time natural selection optimized for the vehicles to want to reproduce. Everyone who didn't have the desire to have kids in the past has none (other than rape victims) to move their genes forward.
Anyway this is a extreme oversimplification of the whole idea of The Selfish Gene
Those who truly know their own preference have no choice in the matter.
What do you mean by this?
Kids. The whole world is new and interesting to them and that is infectious.
having children sounds disgusting. every year that I'm still alive and I see more of my friends on Facebook posting their fat naked baby slobber garbage I am even more happy than before. fuck your cookie slobber food garbage bowling ball head fat screaming toothless idiot crap. do not ever come to my house. im blocking them all
I wish I could have a kid. But I'm a virgin at 35 without a job and still living with my mother. It ain't going to happen.
I'm not quite the same demographic as you, but I get it.
For me, it's simply not possible to have kids unless I adopted. And that ain't happening (adoption is a long, arduous, and expensive process and I'm only one person...wouldn't want to take that alone). I suppose technically my body might physically be able to produce kids...I haven't tried, but that's missing the point.
People sometimes ask me if I want kids and it's just such a silly question for someone like me. It's like asking if I had a mega mansion, how would I decorate the 7th bathroom? What I want is irrelevant because that's not at all in the realm of possibility.
I don't know if I would want kids or not. But since it's not possible, it's not worth dwelling over.
Me and my wife has kinda agreed to not have kids. But as life goes on you kind do want it. You don't want to be in your 50s and wish you had kids to spend time with.
So soon we are having our second. And yes, life is very different but honestly I wouldn't want it any other way.
'Steve and I were talking about children one time, and he said the problem with children is that they carry your heart with them. The exact phrase was, “It’s your heart running around outside your body.”'
-- Eric Schmidt, quoting Steve Jobs.
Ironic considering how he treated his first daughter.
thanks for the quote
I have kids, it is great knowing that I’ve successfully continued my bloodline like my ancestors before me.
While those that have not procreated will die as failures in the eyes of nature. Their bloodlines will end in 100 years it will be like they were never there to begin with.
Kids are also pretty awesome to have.
You're asking a bunch of lonely post redditers, all your gonna get is child free posting to cope with them not having a relationship
I'm not sure you're going to get an objective answer to this as no one has lived a life of either having kids or not having kids, hungrythirstyhorny.
I will say that, as a single male in his mid forties who has observed a good amount of life; first, the thought of not having people to rely on in you're old age is a little worrisome; and two, not having had someone to pass my knowledge and skills down to is a little sad. However, I really enjoy the freedom and opportunities my life (and bank account) affords me.
There is always a cost to freedom. Or, as Jonis Joplin put it - freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose. Choosing to not have children is a selfish act. Whether "selfish" is a bad thing or not is subjective.
I would offer that anyone who's going through life without children, find some altruistic outlet to participate in. You can otherwise find yourself wondering what your legacy may be or what the point of your life has been - aka a mid-life crisis.
I think that deciding not to have kids is not a selfish act. Having kids just to have a fallback when old and frail on the other hand side is very much so.
I agree, I don't think not having kids has anything to do with being selfish.
But I guess what they meant to say is just that having kids is hard. A lot of times, people become more selfless and less focused on their own wants and needs after they become parents.
Of course, some people don't actually become more selfless or responsible, and instead they just become bad, narcissistic parents. But the choice to have kids is associated with the choice to be a responsible adult and work for the benefit of others, at least in theory.
That argument makes sense. Though I see it more from choosing to prioritize yourself and own self interests over having children and sharing a life with them as selfish too. I guess we're all selfish one way or another.
Right, I get what you mean, and I agree. No matter how you put it, nothing is ever entirely selfless.
In your second paragraph, the two reasons you stated to have kids are entirely selfish. Then you say not having kids is selfish?
I offered two reasons I personally may regret not having children. I could list several others such as the pure joy of watching them grow into adults and mimic you and your partner. If you want to say that's selfish, to bring another human into the word to experience a universe of emotion you'd otherwise never experience, I understand that perspective. No argument.
But then I offered that choosing to prioritize your own life is in and of itself a selfish act. It's more explicitly about you than it is about another person.
Would you disagree that going out to eat by yourself is more of a selfish act than inviting a friend to eat out with you? Sharing an experience is less selfish, no?
owh okay i see
but for me, i prefer not having any kids, not because of the freedom,
but sometimes i think, i wont be a good parent for them
im afaraid that i cant provide them with all the good things that any parents should give..
i accept your opinion, thank you
pardon my english :)
My initial reason for not having kids was financial. I think a lot of people have learned it may be better to have children later in life when you can properly care for them. I know many people who've had their first child in their late-30s and early-40s. My aunt had her first child in her fifties. That's not something that was common before modern medicine.
I have always had the idea that I would have a kid if and when I met the right person to share parenting with. That hasn't happened so I've had to put some thought into my priorities. It's not fair to have a child just because it's what society says you should do or just because you want someone to take care of you when you're old. It's so much more than that and I think people should be more mindful of the responsibilities and long term repercussions.
You can't have "a kids". You can have "a kid" or "kids", but not "a kids".
thank you for the correction, sir..
i appreciated it..
pardon my english,
Grammar nazi much?