It's uncanny how any post about problems with HP always has the same solution in the comments. Brother.
In related news, learning what Audi is doing with their new model and subscriptions makes me think the world has gone mad.
It's a good brand. I have their laser printer and it's great. No annoying registration, 3rd party toner cartridges are allowed. Super fast compared to inkjet. Overall a great experience compared to my HP printer which won't let me scan unless I register on the HP app.
I have a network enabled model from Brother and it's never once shown up on my pi-hole. I'm a fan for life. Will never buy an HP printer again.
For a second I thought you meant never showed up as in your pihole can't print to it. I was mildly surprised when my pihole automatically recognized and configured my brother printer on my network. But now that you mention it, I don't think I've ever seen it black holed in my query log either!
I need to get a pihole... It might not fix my Linux printing situation though. I'm able to print but a big document with a lot of pages will just randomly cancel half through for no reason.
They're amazing. I run mine on an Amazon Lightsail instance. $6/mo. or so? I need to bring that back in-house on an old Pi.
Every tried setting one up? It's hilariously easy. Install Debian or Ubuntu Server, run:
Receive PiHole. Setting a static IP on it is probably the most complicated thing. :)
Thanks for reminding me. Might just do that tonight!
I love my brother printer.
I have installed no drivers and can print from Linux / windows and my iPhone.
It sits on my network, it accepts prints, it gets turned off when I’m done.
I’ve never seen it try to do anything outside my network, I’ve never seen it do much of anything on my network. It just sits listening waiting to print.
Bought a second hand brother laser because of the meme. am not disappointed.
Which model did you get?
brother hll2370dw
edit: works from my android phone, and dual boot windows / Ubuntu pc as well
OK and did you need to get drivers to use it on ubuntu? Thanks :)
I have the TN830 that is joined to WiFi that my Ubuntu/windows pc sees on my network without having to have installed any drivers.
Similarly can print from my iPhone.
yes but from the brother site easily
Unfortunately all the options in that industry are shit.
Enshittification hitting the physical realm is pain.
Printers pioneered enshittification.
The lightbulb cartel had a head start on them!
Not $250/yr for WiFi & nav that you’re referring to, no?
Nor 2019’s scheme which sounds like $1000/mo to drive any of several different Audis?
$1000/month to rent a car? Lol
This reads more like a car club, where you pay a subscription to have access to cars on demand.
For those models probably not a bad deal, if someone only needed a car for a few months. Stupid if you need something longer term.
If you want a non-Brother recommendation, find one of the series 4 HP LaserJets. Those things were figuratively and perhaps literally bulletproof.
My 5P didn't survive the 2012 move. RIP
We had a 5P back in the Win98 days, and it was exactly what you'd expect a printer to be. The refills were pricey, but they'd last a long time (we printed a lot then). And you could get a bit more life out of an empty drum if you shook the hell out it.
I do wonder about compatibility with Win10/11 at this point. I know some other old devices I still have around are all but impossible to get to work.
There's still CUPS support
I remember seeing them abused in my university computer lab. People would print 50 page documents, see they screwed something up, trash the whole thing, and then print again.
Keyboards, monitors, mice, computers, and network switches would come and go but those tanks would just keep rolling. Plus we could program rude messages on the screens via the web interface, which was fun.
You will earn nothing and be happy.
Meanwhile cheapskates who buy used old products, renew them and use them: happy.
I have a brother multifunction laser printer scanner thing. It is a cheap piece of crap with flaky wireless.
Unlike the HP printers I've had or worked with, with the Brother I feel like I at least get what I pay for... but it's a pretty low bar.
I bet the Audi model (pricing) is relying of folks leasing vs buying the cars. I can see how they could cram this on a car someone will only have a couple years vs a purchase.
Personally I'd spend the 800 for VAGcom and make a business unlocking cars features.
Any of the luxury brands are smart moves to lease because they depreciate while being under a needed warranty.
Anyone who buys a luxury car new and keeps it past the bumper to bumper is not smart with money.
Everybody donate to Pine64 so they can get that open source printer off the ground someday.
Wait, what?
Pine64, the company that has made such excellent projects as the PinePhone, PineBook, and PineTime(open source hardware and software smartphone, laptop and smart watch), has stated that one of their dream projects would be an open source, hackable printer. There's obviously a ton of logistics though and it will likely never materialize unless they really start making big bucks.
First time I see it and couldn't find any sources. What kind of printer? Thermal, matrix, laser/led, inkjet?
They only mentioned it in passing once (afaik) in a blog post. These aren't actual plans so much as a pipe dream I think
Epson EcoTank. They’re expensive printers, but the ink is so cheap they make up for it. I absolutely love mine and recommend it to anyone looking for a printer.
If you're gonna spend money on a decent printer, go with a laser printer unless you specifically need ink printing.
I have an HP I got like a decade ago, and only had to change the OEM toner carts in the last 6mo or so. The thing has survived 3 moves too, so it's held up like a champ. It probably helps that it's an older HP, so it was before they went to shit.
Hi, this is Hewlett Packard here. We read your post and are happy you love our products! Wouldn’t it make sense for you to upgrade to one of our newer models? I’m sure you’re tired of lugging your heavy, old printer these days.
Our new ones are much lighter! Lighter in weight due to beautiful design! Lighter even on your wallet (at first, and for now)!
Won’t you consider upgrading and locking in - I mean - “purchasing” a new printer, pretty please? uwu :3
Here’s a friendly Kirby to convince you to upgrade! See, we’re cool and we know how to use product placement! Upgrade now or else!! We can’t wait for YOUR SOUL TO BE OURS.
Your Friend,
HP
(We rebranded. Now the “P” stands for Predatory, but like the cute kind 😘. It’s okay to give us your money, trust us.)
"Predatorial is good: cats are predators, and people love cats".
Won’t you consider upgrading and locking in - I mean - “purchasing” a new printer, pretty please? uwu :3
Not a chance lol
Yup. Inkjet printers became popular because of digital cameras. But unless you’re printing a bunch of photos, you really don’t need an inkjet. And even if you are printing photos, it’s usually better to just go to a print shop or use Google Photos.
I'd like to just say that I appreciate the nuance of printer usage around here. Reddit was single minded about Brother lasers, and had no idea what high end inkjet photo printers were for. It's a niche, but >$1000 inkjets with 7 different ink colors exist for a reason.
If people want a simple answer, then it's that no printer under $150 or so should exist. If you can't afford spending a little more up front, then you won't be able to afford the ink on those printers.
Disadvantage with laser is they are bigger and heavier and when you do have to replace parts other than the toner, it’s expensive. I don’t have a large house and went with a small Canon inkjet for space considerations. We only print occasionally so it’s worked ok for us.
Do you have issues with the inkjet heads crusting up and causing issues with ink waste? We only print like once or twice a month at most, and that was the reason I went away from them.
That was my issue. Pretty much print a handful of times a year, mostly around tax season and without fail my ink has dried out and needs to be repurchased. Got a brother laser printer 2 yrs ago, still haven't replaced the original toner. Easily in the black for not having to buy ink 2x despite the laser printer being pricier than I'd prefer
At least you can replace parts.
When is the last inkjet that had something user replaceable?
Maybe the print head?
Laser Printers are made for businesses and long lifetime generally.
Anyway HP has turned me bitter.
I love my HP LaserJet but it's like 7 years old at this point...
They really don't have to be bigger and heavier. I have a Pantum P2502w laser printer and it is seriously one of the smallest printers I've ever owned including inkjets. I feel like laser printers always default to paper storage being underneath them instead of having a feeder tray that sticks out further from the body? And that puts them into a larger form factor.
That being said, I'm fairly sure this is a much lighter duty laser printer than other heavier ones.
Also this is not really an endorsement for Pantum, the software and firmware are buggy as hell, but the software isn't bad enough for me to throw it out and the hardware will probably last a decade so good luck to me.
Honestly, if I printed enough to warrant it, I'd go for that Epson... But I stick with my color laser because it's over ten years old and I print so little it still has the starter cartridges in it, ink would have dried out so many times during that period
Boom. My HP is a tiny B&W from 10+ years ago. Runs like a champ, $20 for an easy 1,000 pages, or more. WFH and do a little company printing so they buy the supplies. MUCH love. When it finally kicks it, if I can't find a refurb kit, I'll go Brother.
Hands down the best printer I've ever had. Only challenge is cleaning the printer heads because I don't print often enough.
I just run the automated thing like 4 or 5 times until it prints well again. It always works eventually.
I won't go eco tank personally, clogs and cleaning is a royal pain on them and there's no good purge feature. I would fully recommend going this path only if accuracy on color is requirement further then laser printers do
I’ve had mine for about four years. I’ve had clogged print heads once, and I ran the auto cleaning five times, then it worked. I’ll give you that it was a pain, but the purge feature works. You’ve just gotta do it multiple times if it’s a really bad clog.
Actually they have a power wash feature you can use. It just wastes a lot of ink.
Actually eco tank printers are also designed to fail as they have ink pads that can only be replaced by the manufacturer I recommend you watch this video explaining the problem with tank printers like the eco tank.
That’s an ink absorber, and all inkjet printers have them. It’s not “designed to fail”, it’s a physical limitation of the universe. You can’t just keep dumping ink into a sponge forever. Eventually it will become saturated and you can either clean it or replace it.
I’ve had my printer for about four years and haven’t needed to replace one yet. They only cost about $10 when you do need to replace it. If they cost several hundred dollars, I would see your point, but the savings in ink more than makes up for having to replace a sponge every decade or so.
What I meant by "designed to fail" is that most of these ecotank printers need the counter to be reset by epson themselves. You can easily replace the pads. But you can't easily reset the counter. It is possible but it involves trusting sketch sites and paying for a license to use the reset software. Older cartridges based epson printers had waste tanks with chips so that it could know when it was replaced. Newer eco tank printers don't have the chip that let's it know when the waste tank is replaced.
That’s not designed to fail, that’s designed to be serviced. Do you call cars “designed to fail” because they need new oil filters and the check engine light comes on when you need an oil change?
Yeah but it's the same as if the oil filter in your car was super glued in and the dealership was the only ones that had the chemical to dissolve the glue.
You just said there are other ways to do it besides Epson. There are multiple sites that provide utilities to reset the counter.
The sponges are cheap. Way cheaper than using a cartridge printer. You can even just clean out the sponge and put it back in. You don’t have to buy a new one.
Even going through Epson’s first party maintenance program is way cheaper than using a cartridge printer. Like, orders of magnitude cheaper.
It would be nice of them to sell replacement kits, though
That's fine, but make it easily user replaceable then!
It is? It’s behind a panel on the back of the printer. Just take the single Phillips head screw off.
It is designed to fail. But for other reasons and by different mechanisms.
It’s not designed to fail. It’s designed to be user serviceable. You can buy a replacement and replace it yourself. It literally only requires a Phillips head screwdriver to take out the one screw on the back panel. If that is designed to fail, then a car needing an oil change is “designed to fail”.
It literally only requires a Phillips head screwdriver to take out the one screw on the back panel.
Literally rocket science. I'm gonna have to pay a monthly subscription so a service tech can come out and do it for me.
It is made out of materials that have a set lifetime or propensity for easily breaking, like glass screens that explode into a supernova if you look at them wrong.
What materials could be used here that wouldn't have that problem?
A fair market?
The market will magically make a better material? Are you a libertarian?
Ok, at this point I feel like you’re just joking. If not, you’re legitimately mad.
Yes and no. I have one and they work fine until you unplug them for any length of time. Then you have to deal with cleaning all the printheads and getting it to work properly again. Typically needs multiple passes before it will print right. I know it's a problem with all ink jet printers. It's a shame toner is more expensive and colour laser printers are so expensive. If not I would switch to one of them.
Actually eco tank printers are also designed to fail as they have ink pads that can only be replaced by the manufacturer I recommend you watch this video explaining the problem with tank printers like the eco tank.
Fuck Epson, fuck them fuck them fuck them fuck Epson, Epson can suck my dick, Epson can lick my asshole, Epson can dance in traffic and go to hell. Fuck Epson.
Tell us how you really feel.
Epson is the only one for me, my beloved. She prints in black, when the colours are empty. She has simple and intuitive router pairing. She did not fucking explode a FUCKING INK CARTRIDGE ONTO MY FUCKING FACE I CANT KEEP THIS CHARADE UP I FUCKING HATE EPSON PRINTERS RRRRRRRGGGGGHHHHHHH
The fact that HP didn't even say anything makes it look less like profiteering and more like spite. Idiots. I'm actually in the market for a printer and from what I can tell, in order to get something that won't stiff me in some way I have to get one which is really old. And not made by HP.
You just want a Brother laser jet black and white printer
It's no bullshit and will work forever
I've owned a HL-3070cw for a decade (I think, close to if not) - I've changed the toner carts 4 times, it's printed high res color daily for pennies. Shit just works, and quality isn't bad at all. Works from any device on the network - phones tablets desktops laptops - practically zero network admin/setup, it just fucking works for everyone. Cannot recommend enough.
HL-2040 gang represent!
2070N here! It came out in 2005. Brother still sells it because why not?
Which is fine until Grandma wants to print out all the selfies and other photos our Grand kids send her. Then, that black and white anything won't cut it.
And I can't afford a photo quality laser printer..........
There's online and supermarket printing services for that. Usually works out cheaper than maintaining a printer.
Yep and there are also fairly cheap strictly photo printers (cheap compared to getting film developed, at least)
There nearest grocery store that might offer that kind of service would be at least a 200 mile round trip. And while we are old enough to remember sending real film to film labs for developing and then waiting weeks to get something back, she's not very interested in doing so anymore. To her the cost is not worth the inconvenience of waiting anymore.
And frankly, some arguments are not worth having. In marriage, you need to pick your fights.
Apparently Brother, and some Lexmark, printers don't come with this BS DRM baked into the firmware.
Has anyone cracked the HP firmware to give us proper access to our hardware?
Thanks to DMCA, circumventing this protection and sharing it with people is illegal.
Honestly hasn’t stopped people in the past but I suspect it hasn’t been cracked because of how it connects to an external server to verify. Probably need to patch the firmware entirely
Thanks to DMCA, circumventing this protection and sharing it with people is illegal.
🏴☠️ Which means hypothetically it would need to be done anonymously. 🏴☠️
I've been around in IT long enough... The emails went to someone who has left or someone set auto delete "on these annoying spam emails!".
Not to make it right or better, hp sucks donkey balls, but I don't believe the would've been zero contact.
If you buy a subscription printer and stop paying for a subscription... That's on you.
Subscription printer. Why the fuck is that even a thing.
Because if you make everything this level of shit and you sell someone "printer that always works at £6 a month!" It sounds like a great deal.
Seen this so many times and glad to keep seeing it.
More people being informed on these scummy practices to look out for and avoid is a good thing.
I'm not glad that I keep seeing it. They were using managed printing i.e. pay-per-page. HP may make garbage and overcharge for ink, but I'm sick of people tapping the up arrow on low effort posts like this.
I will happily upvote anything that rags on HP printers, I don't care how low effort it is. In fact, I would hate to think someone spent actual effort on anything HP related.
HP printers have been kicking puppies and insulting your mother for well over 20 years. Wait, they haven't? Well, after a certain point a company has burned so much good will by making marginal printers, less-than marginal drivers and artificially differentiating inks and toners to such a degree it's hard to see it as anything other than profiteering... pant pant ...that nobody cares if it's unfair or inaccurate.
Don't buy HP. Think of the puppies. Think of your mother, for God's sake!
I just don't see the point in spreading misinformation. I have had almost entirely bad experiences with HP, but that doesn't mean I go around spreading lies.
The point in shitting on HP is to shit on HP. Not sure what other point you're looking for. Are you concerned that people are going to start feeling sympathetic?
No, i just don't want to see misinformation period. The reason the printer wasn't working is because they were on a managed printing plan, not because HP was trying to pull one over on them.
HP turned my mother into a newt!
For those who don't know, Wendigoon is a creepy lore youtuber.
He's also sometimes been acredited with creating the aesthetic of the boogaloo boys, not sure how true that is.
As far as I've heard, his videos are fairly consistent with documentation of the events he covers, such as the unibomber, the MLK assassination, etc.
It's very funny to think he wasn't radicalized before the printer situation.
I did not know that! Thank you.
Yeah, he has a... questionable history, what with the "boogaloo boys" memes, but he stopped engaging with that pretty quickly around the time it became associated with Actual Nazis instead of semi-ironic government-hating libertarians.
He is not exactly radical, he is not a fan of the government and loves a good conspiracy.
He also is a devote Christian, but not a dick about it.
He, by all accounts, is a wonderful person that everybody who knows him loves.
He interviewed a fed.
He’s also sometimes been acredited with creating the aesthetic of the boogaloo boys, not sure how true that is.
I don't really know anything about him, but I just checked out his channel and I don't really think that's true since its only 3 years old
Printers shouldn't be allowed to the edge...vlan with no Internet access.... it's a fucking printer not a web host.
Jokes on you it's hosting hornets.
Get a brother printer
I was given a Brother printer that had spent 10+ years in a damp cellar. I already had one but this one was A3 and that could be ha'dy. Unfortunately it was an ink jet.
So, of course, I had to buy cartridges as the printer was screaming bloody murder. Alas, the whole feeding circuit and the printing head were clogged beyond salvage (the manual insists that it's not to be left unplugged for extended periods).
But that's not the point of the story. The whole (compatible) set of four cartridges was something like 17€. Also the scanner still worked just fine.
Looked like a great machine, probably not worth it to fix (new one is about 450€).
I replaced my HP with a brother laser printer. Works great and no more ink cartridges. That toner cart will last me years
Fuck HP. Simple as that.
As other comments have said. Never buy anything from HP.
Get a Brother printer.
My mom bought a cheap HP printer/scanner several years ago and subscribed to their "instant ink" subscription which was actually surprisingly cheap (like $3/mo) but once the printer stopped reliably connecting to the internet and nobody could print wirelessly anymore with it, she canceled the subscription and HP DISABLED ALL OF THE INK CARTRIDGES. The cartridges themselves have wifi connections so HP can automatically send you new ink when they get low. What a scam.
No, they have serial numbers that are read by the printer when you try to use them. Air Gap the printer.
This is just what HP told us.
I need to print once a year. When I do, I print at my local library.
every time I see this screenshot I'm disappointed that it misses the photo of Ted Kaczynski he responded with
this one?
No this one
Never use a smart printer. If this is your only choice, make sure this dorker has no internet connection. If it does make any sudden movements, use the 9mm.
Don't buy HP ever, they straight up refuse to work without wi-fi.
I got an old… Ricoh? machine from some company sellout with a heck of a lot of toners. Was €500 but I’ll never need to buy anything again for the next 3 decades.
I prefer the .45 for stawpping powa. PC Load Letter?! Blamblamblam.
It’s crazy how the people and govt have let this go on for so long. This has been a known issue with consumer grade printers for a long time now. I remember my parents bitching about ink costs when I was in grade school. Now these companies have raced to the bottom and are locking them down.
Personally, I have found myself to print less than a dozen pages per year. Usually it’s some government office that wants hard copy. For every instance, I just used my local Office Depot to handle all of my printing needs. So glad I don’t have to deal with printer bs
My old HP printer takes XL refills and HP can't do a thing about it. I need them to know this too.
I did an internship at an OEM that was the dying most of the revenue came from government make work money for economic development and selling machines to the 3rd world because they were too dangerous for first world.
Our high end products did this remote deactivation thing. Hated it at the time still hate it today.
And while you’re at it, get a laser printer.
Join the wendigoon trail, REBEAL
That is frustrating for sure, but they prob should have read their agreement when they purchased whatever subscription they signed up for. It's like complaining that T-Mobile has locked their subscription-discounted phone despite them not paying the bill.
Yeah they should really invent a printer with a tiny internet connected screen on the front that could convey this type of message about a person's account and the nature of the problem.
It isn't like that at all. T-Mobile would've given you a better deal for taking a contract such as that, HP just decided they didn't want you to even THINK about purchasing ink or something from anyone else but them. It'd be more like if T-Mobile sold you a phone that you paid full price for, and then decided they'd remotely lock your phone and wipe it if you tried to buy a charging cable from anywhere but their store.
This is straight malicious anti-consumer bullshit, and it is basically rapist behavior. It's disgusting.
If you buy a printer that has it already included, then you're either getting a discounted printer or "discounted" ink for a subscription period. They make it clear that it is a subscription service when you do so. They all sell printers that are not subscription-based. I'm guessing you can still sign up for their subscription-based service, and you should read the fine print about being able to cancel or what happens if you don't pay.
I absolutely hate HP by the way. They do things like include spyware in their "drivers" that are pushed through Windows Update. However, in this case, a simple Twitter screenshot doesn't accurately capture the full story. If you want to provide some more context, then by all means feel free to do so.
It's uncanny how any post about problems with HP always has the same solution in the comments. Brother.
In related news, learning what Audi is doing with their new model and subscriptions makes me think the world has gone mad.
It's a good brand. I have their laser printer and it's great. No annoying registration, 3rd party toner cartridges are allowed. Super fast compared to inkjet. Overall a great experience compared to my HP printer which won't let me scan unless I register on the HP app.
I have a network enabled model from Brother and it's never once shown up on my pi-hole. I'm a fan for life. Will never buy an HP printer again.
For a second I thought you meant never showed up as in your pihole can't print to it. I was mildly surprised when my pihole automatically recognized and configured my brother printer on my network. But now that you mention it, I don't think I've ever seen it black holed in my query log either!
I need to get a pihole... It might not fix my Linux printing situation though. I'm able to print but a big document with a lot of pages will just randomly cancel half through for no reason.
They're amazing. I run mine on an Amazon Lightsail instance. $6/mo. or so? I need to bring that back in-house on an old Pi.
Every tried setting one up? It's hilariously easy. Install Debian or Ubuntu Server, run:
curl -sSL https://install.pi-hole.net | bash
Receive PiHole. Setting a static IP on it is probably the most complicated thing. :)
Thanks for reminding me. Might just do that tonight!
I love my brother printer.
I have installed no drivers and can print from Linux / windows and my iPhone.
It sits on my network, it accepts prints, it gets turned off when I’m done.
I’ve never seen it try to do anything outside my network, I’ve never seen it do much of anything on my network. It just sits listening waiting to print.
Bought a second hand brother laser because of the meme. am not disappointed.
Which model did you get?
brother hll2370dw
edit: works from my android phone, and dual boot windows / Ubuntu pc as well
OK and did you need to get drivers to use it on ubuntu? Thanks :)
I have the TN830 that is joined to WiFi that my Ubuntu/windows pc sees on my network without having to have installed any drivers.
Similarly can print from my iPhone.
yes but from the brother site easily
Unfortunately all the options in that industry are shit.
Enshittification hitting the physical realm is pain.
Printers pioneered enshittification.
The lightbulb cartel had a head start on them!
Not $250/yr for WiFi & nav that you’re referring to, no?
Nor 2019’s scheme which sounds like $1000/mo to drive any of several different Audis?
$1000/month to rent a car? Lol
This reads more like a car club, where you pay a subscription to have access to cars on demand.
For those models probably not a bad deal, if someone only needed a car for a few months. Stupid if you need something longer term.
If you want a non-Brother recommendation, find one of the series 4 HP LaserJets. Those things were figuratively and perhaps literally bulletproof.
My 5P didn't survive the 2012 move. RIP
We had a 5P back in the Win98 days, and it was exactly what you'd expect a printer to be. The refills were pricey, but they'd last a long time (we printed a lot then). And you could get a bit more life out of an empty drum if you shook the hell out it.
I do wonder about compatibility with Win10/11 at this point. I know some other old devices I still have around are all but impossible to get to work.
There's still CUPS support
I remember seeing them abused in my university computer lab. People would print 50 page documents, see they screwed something up, trash the whole thing, and then print again.
Keyboards, monitors, mice, computers, and network switches would come and go but those tanks would just keep rolling. Plus we could program rude messages on the screens via the web interface, which was fun.
You will earn nothing and be happy.
Meanwhile cheapskates who buy used old products, renew them and use them: happy.
I have a brother multifunction laser printer scanner thing. It is a cheap piece of crap with flaky wireless.
Unlike the HP printers I've had or worked with, with the Brother I feel like I at least get what I pay for... but it's a pretty low bar.
I bet the Audi model (pricing) is relying of folks leasing vs buying the cars. I can see how they could cram this on a car someone will only have a couple years vs a purchase.
Personally I'd spend the 800 for VAGcom and make a business unlocking cars features.
Any of the luxury brands are smart moves to lease because they depreciate while being under a needed warranty.
Anyone who buys a luxury car new and keeps it past the bumper to bumper is not smart with money.
Everybody donate to Pine64 so they can get that open source printer off the ground someday.
Wait, what?
Pine64, the company that has made such excellent projects as the PinePhone, PineBook, and PineTime(open source hardware and software smartphone, laptop and smart watch), has stated that one of their dream projects would be an open source, hackable printer. There's obviously a ton of logistics though and it will likely never materialize unless they really start making big bucks.
First time I see it and couldn't find any sources. What kind of printer? Thermal, matrix, laser/led, inkjet?
They only mentioned it in passing once (afaik) in a blog post. These aren't actual plans so much as a pipe dream I think
Epson EcoTank. They’re expensive printers, but the ink is so cheap they make up for it. I absolutely love mine and recommend it to anyone looking for a printer.
If you're gonna spend money on a decent printer, go with a laser printer unless you specifically need ink printing.
I have an HP I got like a decade ago, and only had to change the OEM toner carts in the last 6mo or so. The thing has survived 3 moves too, so it's held up like a champ. It probably helps that it's an older HP, so it was before they went to shit.
Hi, this is Hewlett Packard here. We read your post and are happy you love our products! Wouldn’t it make sense for you to upgrade to one of our newer models? I’m sure you’re tired of lugging your heavy, old printer these days.
Our new ones are much lighter! Lighter in weight due to beautiful design! Lighter even on your wallet (at first, and for now)!
Won’t you consider upgrading and locking in - I mean - “purchasing” a new printer, pretty please? uwu :3
Here’s a friendly Kirby to convince you to upgrade! See, we’re cool and we know how to use product placement! Upgrade now or else!! We can’t wait for YOUR SOUL TO BE OURS.
Your Friend, HP
(We rebranded. Now the “P” stands for Predatory, but like the cute kind 😘. It’s okay to give us your money, trust us.)
"Predatorial is good: cats are predators, and people love cats".
Not a chance lol
Yup. Inkjet printers became popular because of digital cameras. But unless you’re printing a bunch of photos, you really don’t need an inkjet. And even if you are printing photos, it’s usually better to just go to a print shop or use Google Photos.
I'd like to just say that I appreciate the nuance of printer usage around here. Reddit was single minded about Brother lasers, and had no idea what high end inkjet photo printers were for. It's a niche, but >$1000 inkjets with 7 different ink colors exist for a reason.
If people want a simple answer, then it's that no printer under $150 or so should exist. If you can't afford spending a little more up front, then you won't be able to afford the ink on those printers.
Disadvantage with laser is they are bigger and heavier and when you do have to replace parts other than the toner, it’s expensive. I don’t have a large house and went with a small Canon inkjet for space considerations. We only print occasionally so it’s worked ok for us.
Do you have issues with the inkjet heads crusting up and causing issues with ink waste? We only print like once or twice a month at most, and that was the reason I went away from them.
That was my issue. Pretty much print a handful of times a year, mostly around tax season and without fail my ink has dried out and needs to be repurchased. Got a brother laser printer 2 yrs ago, still haven't replaced the original toner. Easily in the black for not having to buy ink 2x despite the laser printer being pricier than I'd prefer
At least you can replace parts. When is the last inkjet that had something user replaceable?
Maybe the print head?
Laser Printers are made for businesses and long lifetime generally.
Anyway HP has turned me bitter.
I love my HP LaserJet but it's like 7 years old at this point...
They really don't have to be bigger and heavier. I have a Pantum P2502w laser printer and it is seriously one of the smallest printers I've ever owned including inkjets. I feel like laser printers always default to paper storage being underneath them instead of having a feeder tray that sticks out further from the body? And that puts them into a larger form factor.
That being said, I'm fairly sure this is a much lighter duty laser printer than other heavier ones.
Also this is not really an endorsement for Pantum, the software and firmware are buggy as hell, but the software isn't bad enough for me to throw it out and the hardware will probably last a decade so good luck to me.
Mine's tiny and light and runs like a champ.
https://support.hp.com/us-en/product/details/hp-laserjet-pro-p1102-printer-series/model/4110306
I run an easy 1,000+ pages a year for work, printing targets and other misc. stuff.
Honestly, if I printed enough to warrant it, I'd go for that Epson... But I stick with my color laser because it's over ten years old and I print so little it still has the starter cartridges in it, ink would have dried out so many times during that period
Boom. My HP is a tiny B&W from 10+ years ago. Runs like a champ, $20 for an easy 1,000 pages, or more. WFH and do a little company printing so they buy the supplies. MUCH love. When it finally kicks it, if I can't find a refurb kit, I'll go Brother.
Hands down the best printer I've ever had. Only challenge is cleaning the printer heads because I don't print often enough.
I just run the automated thing like 4 or 5 times until it prints well again. It always works eventually.
I won't go eco tank personally, clogs and cleaning is a royal pain on them and there's no good purge feature. I would fully recommend going this path only if accuracy on color is requirement further then laser printers do
I’ve had mine for about four years. I’ve had clogged print heads once, and I ran the auto cleaning five times, then it worked. I’ll give you that it was a pain, but the purge feature works. You’ve just gotta do it multiple times if it’s a really bad clog.
Actually they have a power wash feature you can use. It just wastes a lot of ink.
Actually eco tank printers are also designed to fail as they have ink pads that can only be replaced by the manufacturer I recommend you watch this video explaining the problem with tank printers like the eco tank.
That’s an ink absorber, and all inkjet printers have them. It’s not “designed to fail”, it’s a physical limitation of the universe. You can’t just keep dumping ink into a sponge forever. Eventually it will become saturated and you can either clean it or replace it.
I’ve had my printer for about four years and haven’t needed to replace one yet. They only cost about $10 when you do need to replace it. If they cost several hundred dollars, I would see your point, but the savings in ink more than makes up for having to replace a sponge every decade or so.
Edit: I missed that you said only the manufacturer can replace it. That’s not true. It’s user replaceable with a Phillips head screwdriver.
Edit 2: Added links.
What I meant by "designed to fail" is that most of these ecotank printers need the counter to be reset by epson themselves. You can easily replace the pads. But you can't easily reset the counter. It is possible but it involves trusting sketch sites and paying for a license to use the reset software. Older cartridges based epson printers had waste tanks with chips so that it could know when it was replaced. Newer eco tank printers don't have the chip that let's it know when the waste tank is replaced.
That’s not designed to fail, that’s designed to be serviced. Do you call cars “designed to fail” because they need new oil filters and the check engine light comes on when you need an oil change?
Yeah but it's the same as if the oil filter in your car was super glued in and the dealership was the only ones that had the chemical to dissolve the glue.
You just said there are other ways to do it besides Epson. There are multiple sites that provide utilities to reset the counter.
The sponges are cheap. Way cheaper than using a cartridge printer. You can even just clean out the sponge and put it back in. You don’t have to buy a new one.
Even going through Epson’s first party maintenance program is way cheaper than using a cartridge printer. Like, orders of magnitude cheaper.
It would be nice of them to sell replacement kits, though
https://epson.com/Accessories/Printer-Accessories/EcoTank-Ink-Maintenance-Box-T04D100/p/T04D100
Or
https://epson.com/Accessories/Printer-Accessories/EcoTank-Ink-Maintenance-Box-T04D000/p/T04D000
That's fine, but make it easily user replaceable then!
It is? It’s behind a panel on the back of the printer. Just take the single Phillips head screw off.
It is designed to fail. But for other reasons and by different mechanisms.
It’s not designed to fail. It’s designed to be user serviceable. You can buy a replacement and replace it yourself. It literally only requires a Phillips head screwdriver to take out the one screw on the back panel. If that is designed to fail, then a car needing an oil change is “designed to fail”.
Literally rocket science. I'm gonna have to pay a monthly subscription so a service tech can come out and do it for me.
It is made out of materials that have a set lifetime or propensity for easily breaking, like glass screens that explode into a supernova if you look at them wrong.
What materials could be used here that wouldn't have that problem?
A fair market?
The market will magically make a better material? Are you a libertarian?
Ok, at this point I feel like you’re just joking. If not, you’re legitimately mad.
Yes, planned obsolescence is madness, MADNESS!
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
video
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Yes and no. I have one and they work fine until you unplug them for any length of time. Then you have to deal with cleaning all the printheads and getting it to work properly again. Typically needs multiple passes before it will print right. I know it's a problem with all ink jet printers. It's a shame toner is more expensive and colour laser printers are so expensive. If not I would switch to one of them.
Actually eco tank printers are also designed to fail as they have ink pads that can only be replaced by the manufacturer I recommend you watch this video explaining the problem with tank printers like the eco tank.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
video
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Fuck Epson, fuck them fuck them fuck them fuck Epson, Epson can suck my dick, Epson can lick my asshole, Epson can dance in traffic and go to hell. Fuck Epson.
Tell us how you really feel.
Epson is the only one for me, my beloved. She prints in black, when the colours are empty. She has simple and intuitive router pairing. She did not fucking explode a FUCKING INK CARTRIDGE ONTO MY FUCKING FACE I CANT KEEP THIS CHARADE UP I FUCKING HATE EPSON PRINTERS RRRRRRRGGGGGHHHHHHH
What did they do to you?
The fact that HP didn't even say anything makes it look less like profiteering and more like spite. Idiots. I'm actually in the market for a printer and from what I can tell, in order to get something that won't stiff me in some way I have to get one which is really old. And not made by HP.
You just want a Brother laser jet black and white printer
It's no bullshit and will work forever
I've owned a HL-3070cw for a decade (I think, close to if not) - I've changed the toner carts 4 times, it's printed high res color daily for pennies. Shit just works, and quality isn't bad at all. Works from any device on the network - phones tablets desktops laptops - practically zero network admin/setup, it just fucking works for everyone. Cannot recommend enough.
HL-2040 gang represent!
2070N here! It came out in 2005. Brother still sells it because why not?
Which is fine until Grandma wants to print out all the selfies and other photos our Grand kids send her. Then, that black and white anything won't cut it. And I can't afford a photo quality laser printer..........
There's online and supermarket printing services for that. Usually works out cheaper than maintaining a printer.
Yep and there are also fairly cheap strictly photo printers (cheap compared to getting film developed, at least)
There nearest grocery store that might offer that kind of service would be at least a 200 mile round trip. And while we are old enough to remember sending real film to film labs for developing and then waiting weeks to get something back, she's not very interested in doing so anymore. To her the cost is not worth the inconvenience of waiting anymore.
And frankly, some arguments are not worth having. In marriage, you need to pick your fights.
Apparently Brother, and some Lexmark, printers don't come with this BS DRM baked into the firmware.
Has anyone cracked the HP firmware to give us proper access to our hardware?
Thanks to DMCA, circumventing this protection and sharing it with people is illegal.
Honestly hasn’t stopped people in the past but I suspect it hasn’t been cracked because of how it connects to an external server to verify. Probably need to patch the firmware entirely
🏴☠️ Which means hypothetically it would need to be done anonymously. 🏴☠️
I've been around in IT long enough... The emails went to someone who has left or someone set auto delete "on these annoying spam emails!".
Not to make it right or better, hp sucks donkey balls, but I don't believe the would've been zero contact. If you buy a subscription printer and stop paying for a subscription... That's on you.
Subscription printer. Why the fuck is that even a thing.
Because if you make everything this level of shit and you sell someone "printer that always works at £6 a month!" It sounds like a great deal.
Seen this so many times and glad to keep seeing it.
More people being informed on these scummy practices to look out for and avoid is a good thing.
I'm not glad that I keep seeing it. They were using managed printing i.e. pay-per-page. HP may make garbage and overcharge for ink, but I'm sick of people tapping the up arrow on low effort posts like this.
I will happily upvote anything that rags on HP printers, I don't care how low effort it is. In fact, I would hate to think someone spent actual effort on anything HP related.
HP printers have been kicking puppies and insulting your mother for well over 20 years. Wait, they haven't? Well, after a certain point a company has burned so much good will by making marginal printers, less-than marginal drivers and artificially differentiating inks and toners to such a degree it's hard to see it as anything other than profiteering... pant pant ...that nobody cares if it's unfair or inaccurate.
Don't buy HP. Think of the puppies. Think of your mother, for God's sake!
I just don't see the point in spreading misinformation. I have had almost entirely bad experiences with HP, but that doesn't mean I go around spreading lies.
The point in shitting on HP is to shit on HP. Not sure what other point you're looking for. Are you concerned that people are going to start feeling sympathetic?
No, i just don't want to see misinformation period. The reason the printer wasn't working is because they were on a managed printing plan, not because HP was trying to pull one over on them.
HP turned my mother into a newt!
For those who don't know, Wendigoon is a creepy lore youtuber.
He's also sometimes been acredited with creating the aesthetic of the boogaloo boys, not sure how true that is.
As far as I've heard, his videos are fairly consistent with documentation of the events he covers, such as the unibomber, the MLK assassination, etc.
It's very funny to think he wasn't radicalized before the printer situation.
I did not know that! Thank you.
Yeah, he has a... questionable history, what with the "boogaloo boys" memes, but he stopped engaging with that pretty quickly around the time it became associated with Actual Nazis instead of semi-ironic government-hating libertarians.
He is not exactly radical, he is not a fan of the government and loves a good conspiracy.
He also is a devote Christian, but not a dick about it.
He, by all accounts, is a wonderful person that everybody who knows him loves.
He interviewed a fed.
I don't really know anything about him, but I just checked out his channel and I don't really think that's true since its only 3 years old
Printers shouldn't be allowed to the edge...vlan with no Internet access.... it's a fucking printer not a web host.
Jokes on you it's hosting hornets.
Get a brother printer
I was given a Brother printer that had spent 10+ years in a damp cellar. I already had one but this one was A3 and that could be ha'dy. Unfortunately it was an ink jet.
So, of course, I had to buy cartridges as the printer was screaming bloody murder. Alas, the whole feeding circuit and the printing head were clogged beyond salvage (the manual insists that it's not to be left unplugged for extended periods).
But that's not the point of the story. The whole (compatible) set of four cartridges was something like 17€. Also the scanner still worked just fine.
Looked like a great machine, probably not worth it to fix (new one is about 450€).
I replaced my HP with a brother laser printer. Works great and no more ink cartridges. That toner cart will last me years
Fuck HP. Simple as that.
As other comments have said. Never buy anything from HP.
Get a Brother printer.
My mom bought a cheap HP printer/scanner several years ago and subscribed to their "instant ink" subscription which was actually surprisingly cheap (like $3/mo) but once the printer stopped reliably connecting to the internet and nobody could print wirelessly anymore with it, she canceled the subscription and HP DISABLED ALL OF THE INK CARTRIDGES. The cartridges themselves have wifi connections so HP can automatically send you new ink when they get low. What a scam.
No, they have serial numbers that are read by the printer when you try to use them. Air Gap the printer.
This is just what HP told us.
I need to print once a year. When I do, I print at my local library.
every time I see this screenshot I'm disappointed that it misses the photo of Ted Kaczynski he responded with
No this one
Never use a smart printer. If this is your only choice, make sure this dorker has no internet connection. If it does make any sudden movements, use the 9mm.
Don't buy HP ever, they straight up refuse to work without wi-fi.
I got an old… Ricoh? machine from some company sellout with a heck of a lot of toners. Was €500 but I’ll never need to buy anything again for the next 3 decades.
I prefer the .45 for stawpping powa. PC Load Letter?! Blamblamblam.
It’s crazy how the people and govt have let this go on for so long. This has been a known issue with consumer grade printers for a long time now. I remember my parents bitching about ink costs when I was in grade school. Now these companies have raced to the bottom and are locking them down.
Personally, I have found myself to print less than a dozen pages per year. Usually it’s some government office that wants hard copy. For every instance, I just used my local Office Depot to handle all of my printing needs. So glad I don’t have to deal with printer bs
My old HP printer takes XL refills and HP can't do a thing about it. I need them to know this too.
I did an internship at an OEM that was the dying most of the revenue came from government make work money for economic development and selling machines to the 3rd world because they were too dangerous for first world.
Our high end products did this remote deactivation thing. Hated it at the time still hate it today.
And while you’re at it, get a laser printer.
Join the wendigoon trail, REBEAL
That is frustrating for sure, but they prob should have read their agreement when they purchased whatever subscription they signed up for. It's like complaining that T-Mobile has locked their subscription-discounted phone despite them not paying the bill.
Yeah they should really invent a printer with a tiny internet connected screen on the front that could convey this type of message about a person's account and the nature of the problem.
It isn't like that at all. T-Mobile would've given you a better deal for taking a contract such as that, HP just decided they didn't want you to even THINK about purchasing ink or something from anyone else but them. It'd be more like if T-Mobile sold you a phone that you paid full price for, and then decided they'd remotely lock your phone and wipe it if you tried to buy a charging cable from anywhere but their store.
This is straight malicious anti-consumer bullshit, and it is basically rapist behavior. It's disgusting.
If you buy a printer that has it already included, then you're either getting a discounted printer or "discounted" ink for a subscription period. They make it clear that it is a subscription service when you do so. They all sell printers that are not subscription-based. I'm guessing you can still sign up for their subscription-based service, and you should read the fine print about being able to cancel or what happens if you don't pay.
I absolutely hate HP by the way. They do things like include spyware in their "drivers" that are pushed through Windows Update. However, in this case, a simple Twitter screenshot doesn't accurately capture the full story. If you want to provide some more context, then by all means feel free to do so.