Some, such as the Gun Violence Archive, include events in which multiple people are shot regardless of number of deaths, and so report much higher figures.
This carries a fun implication: letโs deflate the number of mass shooting by only including the deaths and not how many people are actually shot (and perhaps saved by emergency room personnel).
It also misses the damage done by witnessing that violence and being shot at and losing loved ones to gun violence.
How do you plan on quantifying that?
You don't, most people won't get the mental health care service they need after that type of event and the harm just gets ingrained in those communities.
It also ignores any lingering effects the survivors might suffer, whether physically or mentally. Just because you're alive doesn't mean you are whole.
Or economically, given the absurd costs of medical attention in the USA.
It also encourages confusion that each mass shooting is someone trying to kill as many people as possible in a public place, when that overwhelmingly isn't actually true.
The new definition is mostly gang violence now, but that's not what any of us think of when we see or hear "mass shooting".
It's a dog whistle for justifying the gun violence as only being between black people and hispanics, as if that makes it okay.
I mean it seems like a change to inflate the numbers, but shifting it to minorities could prolly keep the right quiet.
That last part is important, because our emergency responders have gotten very good at saving lives (sadly, they've had to). People will point to deaths as the only relevant stat--and it's amazing that isn't enough for some people--but it's a huge burden and cost for healthcare.
Mass shooting, not mass killing. I'd even want to know about instances of multiple, unrelated targets. If we get a string of shooters with terrible aim and nobody is actually hurt I don't consider that an improvement of our epidemic.
I can already hear the wing conspiracy theories about how liberal doctors are letting mass shooting victims die in order to bolster the numbers.
Kind of like the conspiracies theyโd throw around about the numbers of cases and deaths related to Covid.
Fact is, when we hear "mass shooting", we're thinking of the Mother Jones definition.
"If I just focus on rhetoric, all the rampant gun violence goes away! I mean, no, there is no gun violence. Regardless, everything is fine, you just have to pretend. Guns have nothing to do with gun violence, also war is peace, and I am sane in the head. I'm sure people will buy this if I just repeat it a lot."
YEAH!
WE DID IT AMERICA!
U.S.A! U.S.A.! U.S.A!
All these senseless murders every fucking year, and not one of them directed at the republicans that have ruined everything.
It's conservatives doing the shootings. Why does it seem that 95% of all mass shooters have a white supremacist manifesto?
Because white supremacists' arguments are easily dismantled to their core components of idiocy, racism and ignorance. They can't convince anyone who isn't a moron racist and they believe that those who don't think like they do are trying to replace them so they resort to mass murder. Because they are racist morons.
Media bias.
Seriously, when talking about this people use different definitions of "mass shooting" depending on what fits their agenda.
If we're talking about the "nutter shoots up a public place" type shootings, then those caused about 1400 deaths between the middle of 1964 and the middle of 2021 based on numbers posted by WaPo.
If you define it as "any shooting with more than three dead" then the numbers go way up but a huge chunk of that is gang violence and family annihilators (people who murder-suicide their family). These are different kinds of problems that need to be treated differently. And neither of those is going to respond much to gun control laws.
You had me until your last sentence.
different definitions of โmass shootingโ
The definition by the FBI is the only one I've seen. What number works for you?
mostly the media focus
Ah, yes, it's all a lie, that you see through, because YOU are not gullible.
Next.
Over 80% of mass shootings by white supremacists is not media focus.
You have to skew your media consumption a lot to think violence comes from the left in the US.
Beware of the media bias arguments, they are mostly used by biased media.
Well thats just a lie
More or less, it's white supremacists related so it gives a bigger number making the article look more impressive (while still showing the propaganda we should fight against).
I wanted to see if you were gonna try to check my claims but that's not how your brain works. That's why you end up thinking you're on the right side of history by fighting people on the left. Go out there and challenge your beliefs.
You are so full of shit and you know it. I've no need to prove an obvious lie is
Or don't challenge them, your choice, at this point I've pretty much given up on your bunch, it makes me too sad and strangers on the Internet don't deserve that effect on me.
"my bunch" can you think in anything but stereotypes?
Disprove them by attempting to disprove me with actual data.
This feels fucked up to write, but incels shooting women/children/non-whites is probably better than having lefties/righties shooting each other. That's how you actually get a civil war.
Yeah.
Lets let the perpetrators encouraging mass shootings continue to get off scott free while actively enraging their base with falsehoods.
That'll totally prevent a civil war.
Lets let the perpetrators encouraging mass shootings continue to get off scott free while actively enraging their base with falsehoods.
Remember back in July 2022, when there was a mass shooting in Denmark and some Americans would say "see it happens even in a gun regulated country"?
There hasn't been one since...
If you make the same search for America, letter B is probably on purge page 3
purge 3
Quite the Freudian slip
I live in a country where it is almost impossible* to get gun. But there were some shootings even in schools. And every sane person agrees that neither any changes in laws will do anything nor all those bogus turnstiles, fences and locking fire exits. This circus of prison mentally harms children even more, fences don't let students escape in case of shooting and locking fire exits... Dear Princess Celestia, we didn't learn anything.
* unless you are male between age 18 and 27. In this case good uncle Voencom will give you AK even if you don't want it.
It's weird how the BuT OtHeR CoUnTrIeS HaVe iT tOo argument is so rapidly debunked even without showing how 'both sides' it is.
theres like 5 million Danes. their per capita count is still higher.
Have you done the maths, or are you guessing?
For the rate to be equal, there must have been 220 mass shooting in the US since 1994, wich is the earliest mass shootings on this list.
(332 mil / 6mil) X 4 mass shootings registered since 1994
Notice it is SINCE 1994. I believe there are double this EVERY year in the US. The actual comparison is 15000 (mass) shootings Vs 220 (adjusted to reflect the population) making it 70! Times higher in the US, after accounting for the population differences
So you are not correct when you say it is higher in Denmark.
Also note that this is a comparison for mass shootings. Gun violence in general is even more extreme
This is a VERY rough comparison simply to prove you wrong, but there is a good article about this, comparing Denmark and the US here
Well that one guy in Denmark got eighty alone, and the states 200 this year, so yeah it was fast math, but at least I used numbers of victims, not incidents. You're doing some excellent fast talking shitty math yourself there.
I think you're confusing Denmark with Norway my fast talking friend...
That said, i dont think you'd want to look into gun casualties to prove your point also what is that 200 you mention? I don't know how many have died in mass shootings in the US, but it is a lot more than the 200 you claim it to be.
I mean read the article causing this commentary
Imagine mass shootings being so common that people can't agree on what they are...
Please, stop being stupid
You first
They already are. So how about you educate yourself on something else than your NRA approved gun manual.
Oh fuck off moron .
Denmark's rate is 1.08. This is actually quite high by European standards, but to claim it's higher than the US is a joke.
Math is hard ๐...
I don't disagree that gun violence is a huge problem in the US, and we can all agree that we need to have serious discussion about realistic solutions.
But there are SO many more people in the US than in Denmark. It's not even close. It has roughly the population as Colarado for the entire country.
That's not to say there aren't many, many more mass shooting instances in Colarado (I'm using the term mass shooting to mean a person shooting strangers on purpose in a planned attack in a place unlikely to have armed victims like a school, movie theater or gay night club) than Denmark, so I feel it's a bit disingenuous to compare the whole US to Denmark.
Denmark also has a lot less poverty and better access to healthcare and mental health services as compared to the US.
So I know it feels good to try and make your point this way, but it's not really the same at all. There's more to this than guns and "Americans dumb".
It's easier to veiw these gun statistics less by a side by side comparison of total population and more by gun related deaths per every 10, 000 people. That allows an adjustment for population.
The US in 2023 had 10.89 gun deaths per every 10k people. Denmark had 1.08 per 10k. So roughly Denmark would have had to have roughly 10x the number of gun deaths to draw parallel with the US.
This metric does cover all homicides and suicides. For a better picture homicides only made up 7% of all gun related fatalities in Denmark in the US 43% of gun deaths were homicides. One interesting difference is that Denmark accidental gun deaths is a much bigger slice of their piechart than the US.
Strong social welfare programs and measures to check extreme wealth aggregation are also things the US would have money to manage. Technically speaking the ratio of Government wealth per adult in the US is greater than Denmark's meaning Denmark is doing more with less.
Also poverty crime is still pretty high in Denmark. The social safety net means you don't starve so much and have a place to come home to but it's a very lean existance. A lot of people there are barely making ends meet. Technically speaking the poverty rates between the two countries are actually very comparable.
Thank you. I was about to look for such a per population representation as well. Bonus points to you if you could also provide the sources of your numbers. :>
Sorry about that. Copy pasting anything on my cell is a nightmare on Lemmy. Here's my main sources.
No, there's nothing more to this than guns and Americans dumb. You have to remember, we have functioning education in most other places in the world, so the kind of imbecile propaganda you all fall victim to has no effect on us, you only come across as a moron trying to regurgitate it.
[looks around NL nervously....]
Ok, but controlling for population doesn't actually make it better for you guys. You're still far and away the number one in number of mass shootings. By orders of magnitude.
Note that there is a really bad outdated study that puts US in the number 11 (and it's not relevant, because it's really outdated by now. I suspect that because of these frequent record breaks, it would look bad even with the fuckery), because they did a lot statistical fuckery to make it so. It's too long of an explanation to write out what they did.
However, you can just use the average for number of mass shootings per year/month/week and you propel to the top like a rocket.
So, yes it's more than just "Americans dumb", but everything points to the fact that US is rotten to the core, and lack of gun control is definitely part of the problem. Poverty, inequality, police violence, lack of social programs (because fuck commies, fam) and so forth... But while it's not unique to US, it's definitely typical US problem.
Ok let's compare the entirety of Europe to the US (Europe has about 750 000 000 inhabitants, so double the US)
Amount of school shootings happened in the US last year: 52
Amount of school shooting happened in Europe: 31 since the year 1900
I mean it's still an entire country. The comparisons are the same for Australia and England as well. Sure they have violence. It's mitigating the tools to create violence. They have the easiest access in a country that breeds toxicity. Take some of those things away and maybe keeping the guns as they are a worthy discussion. But because they aren't, it's the most common sense way to handle the problem.
And we'll do nothing about it as always. On to the next year. America, you're a real winner.
Not true. We posted some "thoughts and prayers" messages to Facebook. What else did you expect, actual gun control?
Pay teachers living wages. Or double living wages.
America is bathing in money, it can afford.
That money isn't for the people dummy. It's for like 30 people at the top...
Tax
To celebrate the milestone, ArmaLite is offering a ten percent discount on the purchase of a new AR-15!
Nice! These discounts will really help us break the record next year!
At this point the US is just competing against itself.
It's good that the US doesn't get complacent and continues to challenge itself to new heights. Often times a country would be years or even decades ahead in a field only to become unmotivated, overtaken and forever doomed to obscurity and mediocrity.
[I]n Dallas a 21-year-old with a previous aggravated assault charge shot five people in a house, including a toddler.
If that toddler was armed it wouldn't have happened
Sadly I would put more faith into a good guy toddler with a gun than the police from Uvalde.
If that person was actually convicted of the felony instead of likely plead out to a misdemeanor, it also wouldn't have happened.
All they had was a charge, not a conviction. Are you saying you want to strip the right of self defense from innocent people?
Probably why they used the word "if". IF they'd been convicted, the incident wouldn't have happened. Not, they should've lost their gun cos they were charged. As it stands, nobody needs a gun for self defence anyway. The number of countries who manage to cope in this way far out numbers the US.
congrats?
... so far.
We're 92.8% through the year, so even if one happens it's mighty impressive.
I fail to understand your comment. Should another shooting happen, the headline would still be correct.
They're saying they don't believe the situation will improve, and there will be a greater number in a future year
Not if we deploy enough thoughts and prayers
How many bullets can those withstand?
Most mass shootings in a single year so far.
World: But it's already December!
America: hold my beer
"No way to prevent this"
"Says only country where this happens" :(
happy holidays
Warm Kwanzaa greetings to your family and friends as well.
I'm more of a Saucy Saturnalia partaker, but thank you.
Those fools! If only we had 1.3 guns per person to defend ourselves!
If only this was a purely sarcastic sentiment and not unironically spouted by libertarian gun nuts.
No, no, they've got a point: if every citizen has enough guns to be entirely covered in them, the bullets won't be able to get through!
I'm excited for people to come into this thread and insist on a definition of assault rifle.
Or mass shooting
It's not a mass shooting unless it happens in Massachusetts, otherwise it's just sparkling shooting
USA! USA! USA! NUMBER 1 BAYBAY! (Shotgun blasts)
Isn't this old news already? Wasn't there already another mass shooting at UNLV that barely makes the news because this happens like three times a month?
What a world.
World? Nah, just US.
Since they break the record every year, it's news every year
They need to know make the news at all. They're only popular because they do make news.
they need to not make the news
FTFY since autocorrect failed you :)
That it did, thank you.
Alternatively, at the rate they're happening, it'll stop being newsworthy soon.
It already is. Most mass shootings don't make the news unless they are very public and go into double digits. Or if they are the shooting that takes us past last year's goal count.
Pro Life! Fuck yea!
U S A! NUMBER ONE!
I'm sure someone has done the math on it, how many of these mass shootings were right wingers? How many were not right wing trans people?
Try the Southern Poverty Law Center
Can you just pay teachers fucking living wage?
No. We can arm them with AR15s though
They'll have to pay for the ammo themselves, of course.
Just like any other classroom supply.
Funny, but horribly impractical.
training
safe storage with easy emergency access
ammunition management
If every classroom has an AR-15 secured behind a desk, then every school can outfit a gang. Remember that the gun violence in countries without so many available guns is coincidentally a lot lower.
And teachers aren't paid enough as it is. They're not gonna take a life for the pittance they're getting.
It was only half a joke, Republicans notoriously have wanted to arm teachers for a long timr
How about you pay those teachers in AR15s then?
Look at all the good all those good guys with guns are doing. /s
It's mixing mass shooting with mass killing.
The first number deals with people shot, and the second counts incidents where four or more people died from their injuries. I believe the second number isn't just gun violence - so stabbings or vehicular homicide are counted - but I'm not sure because the number of mass attacks are far lower when the victim can avoid injury by moving only three feet to one side.
The number of mass shootings, where 4+ people were injured by guns but less than 4 were killed, has been as many as 9 in one day.
I think the number of strictly school shootings is more than 38 this year. Like, a Columbine somewhere, every pay-cheque.
This is as stupid as sad.
There it is again, that funny feeling.
Given the opportunity to outlaw "assault weapons" or eliminate hate, fear and greed, which do you think would reduce deaths the most?
Saying this because Amish communities are generally armed to the teeth without any shootings.
I would guess countries/societies with a (much) smaller wealth gap and more homogenous culture/values have less mass shootings. Perhaps in these societies there is less isolation between people, for better and worse?
Ah yes, the Amish. Famously violent, and always running around with their AR-15s, high capacity magazines, just to really show off how modest, simple and peaceful their lives are.
Outlaw assault weapons. That's the easy one.
Amish communities deal with those things in a different horrible way. Like excommunicating people who know nothing outside of the community.
Two attacks on Sunday occurring within a couple of hours of each other in Texas and Washington state were the yearโs 37th and 38th mass shootings.
Authorities believe a murder-suicide was responsible for the death of five family members in Vancouver, a suburb of Portland, Oregon, just across the border in Washington, while in Dallas a 21-year-old with a previous aggravated assault charge shot five people in a house, including a toddler.
Another attack occurred on Sunday in New York City, when a 38-year-old man stabbed four of his relatives โ including two children โ as well as another woman and two police officers before they shot him.
Some, such as the Gun Violence Archive, include events in which multiple people are shot regardless of number of deaths, and so report much higher figures.
The Fourth of July long weekend was overshadowed by 16 shootings in which 15 people were killed and nearly 100 injured.
But the deadliest attack of 2023 happened in Lewiston, Maine, on 25 October when an army reservist murdered 18 people in a bowling alley and a bar.
The original article contains 380 words, the summary contains 182 words. Saved 52%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Big whoop! As an american it doesn't affect me because I've a gun for self defense.
A gun is not a guarantee of safety against other people with guns, otherwise war would be pretty anticlimactic.
You should also invest in getting some t-shirts made that say "GOOD GUY" in big letters, that way the police know you're a good guy with a gun and don't kill you like they did to the last guy who stopped a mass shooter.
I thought you'd recommend AR15s against other people with guns.
Why do you need a gun, when you can just murder people with words?
Gun takes less effort and I'm lazy.
If you need a gun to feel safe in your own country, you live in a shithole.
Yet every other person in this world want to live in the " shithole".
I was in Australia recently and noticed so many Australian want to become American. They put in some real effort.
Wait. you guys only lost 200 people in mass shootings? There's four hundred million of you. no wonder no one cares. News makes it sound like you lose 50,000 that way.
No, we lose 50,000 people per year in normal shootings. Quite a few of those are suicides though, so no one cares.
We very much should
Total homicides usually clocks in around 26k or so. About half with firearms. About 10% with specifically rifles.
Of that ~26k, about 200 this year have been from shootings in which more than 3 people were killed. To get the number that high you aren't just counting "nutter with a manifesto shoots up a public place"-style shootings (there were 1400 or so total killed in those between the mid 60s and 2021, according to WaPo - they stopped that count at the point and since started a new project with a more broad measure of what counts), you're mostly counting gang violence and family annihilators (think person kills own spouse and kids, then themself).
We focus on nutters shooting up public places and want to primarily ban rifles, because the people calling for it pay attention to a few incidents that get lots of media attention and then see statistics measuring something different and connect the two as is intended.
You're not disingenuous. That's rare.
Yeah if you want to see that in lemmy check out this dude
Whose record did we break? Our own?
Exactly. Congrats!
We're number 1!!! Eat it, Canada!
It's like the other countries aren't even trying.
I know Our Town is creepy place, but it does not have any shooting.
Shooters? Not in Our Town!
...honestly, I'd rather get shot
Weโre Number One!!!
USA! USA! USA!
๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท๐ฑ๐ท
Accidental liberian
Nobody Liberiaโs intentionally
Oof
That's Puerto Rico
Nobody tell Donny that PR is a US territory
That is the joke
Ha ha ha
Don't tell them...
This carries a fun implication: letโs deflate the number of mass shooting by only including the deaths and not how many people are actually shot (and perhaps saved by emergency room personnel).
It also misses the damage done by witnessing that violence and being shot at and losing loved ones to gun violence.
How do you plan on quantifying that?
You don't, most people won't get the mental health care service they need after that type of event and the harm just gets ingrained in those communities.
It also ignores any lingering effects the survivors might suffer, whether physically or mentally. Just because you're alive doesn't mean you are whole.
Or economically, given the absurd costs of medical attention in the USA.
It also encourages confusion that each mass shooting is someone trying to kill as many people as possible in a public place, when that overwhelmingly isn't actually true.
The new definition is mostly gang violence now, but that's not what any of us think of when we see or hear "mass shooting".
It's a dog whistle for justifying the gun violence as only being between black people and hispanics, as if that makes it okay.
I mean it seems like a change to inflate the numbers, but shifting it to minorities could prolly keep the right quiet.
That last part is important, because our emergency responders have gotten very good at saving lives (sadly, they've had to). People will point to deaths as the only relevant stat--and it's amazing that isn't enough for some people--but it's a huge burden and cost for healthcare.
Mass shooting, not mass killing. I'd even want to know about instances of multiple, unrelated targets. If we get a string of shooters with terrible aim and nobody is actually hurt I don't consider that an improvement of our epidemic.
I can already hear the wing conspiracy theories about how liberal doctors are letting mass shooting victims die in order to bolster the numbers.
Kind of like the conspiracies theyโd throw around about the numbers of cases and deaths related to Covid.
Words have meanings and require definition.
Gun Violence Archive has about the most liberal definition, Mother Jones about the most conservative. (I can't believe I used Mother Jones and conservative in the same sentence.)
Fact is, when we hear "mass shooting", we're thinking of the Mother Jones definition.
"If I just focus on rhetoric, all the rampant gun violence goes away! I mean, no, there is no gun violence. Regardless, everything is fine, you just have to pretend. Guns have nothing to do with gun violence, also war is peace, and I am sane in the head. I'm sure people will buy this if I just repeat it a lot."
YEAH!
WE DID IT AMERICA!
U.S.A! U.S.A.! U.S.A!
All these senseless murders every fucking year, and not one of them directed at the republicans that have ruined everything.
It's conservatives doing the shootings. Why does it seem that 95% of all mass shooters have a white supremacist manifesto?
Because white supremacists' arguments are easily dismantled to their core components of idiocy, racism and ignorance. They can't convince anyone who isn't a moron racist and they believe that those who don't think like they do are trying to replace them so they resort to mass murder. Because they are racist morons.
Media bias.
Seriously, when talking about this people use different definitions of "mass shooting" depending on what fits their agenda.
If we're talking about the "nutter shoots up a public place" type shootings, then those caused about 1400 deaths between the middle of 1964 and the middle of 2021 based on numbers posted by WaPo.
If you define it as "any shooting with more than three dead" then the numbers go way up but a huge chunk of that is gang violence and family annihilators (people who murder-suicide their family). These are different kinds of problems that need to be treated differently. And neither of those is going to respond much to gun control laws.
You had me until your last sentence.
The definition by the FBI is the only one I've seen. What number works for you?
mostly the media focus
Ah, yes, it's all a lie, that you see through, because YOU are not gullible.
Over 80% of mass shootings by white supremacists is not media focus. You have to skew your media consumption a lot to think violence comes from the left in the US. Beware of the media bias arguments, they are mostly used by biased media.
Well thats just a lie
More or less, it's white supremacists related so it gives a bigger number making the article look more impressive (while still showing the propaganda we should fight against). I wanted to see if you were gonna try to check my claims but that's not how your brain works. That's why you end up thinking you're on the right side of history by fighting people on the left. Go out there and challenge your beliefs.
You are so full of shit and you know it. I've no need to prove an obvious lie is
Or don't challenge them, your choice, at this point I've pretty much given up on your bunch, it makes me too sad and strangers on the Internet don't deserve that effect on me.
"my bunch" can you think in anything but stereotypes?
Disprove them by attempting to disprove me with actual data.
sure. actual data says not 80 percent.
Hey it happened once. He couldn't shoot for shit, but someone tried...
This feels fucked up to write, but incels shooting women/children/non-whites is probably better than having lefties/righties shooting each other. That's how you actually get a civil war.
Yeah.
Lets let the perpetrators encouraging mass shootings continue to get off scott free while actively enraging their base with falsehoods.
That'll totally prevent a civil war.
Is there a /c/insanepeoplelemmy yet?
Remember back in July 2022, when there was a mass shooting in Denmark and some Americans would say "see it happens even in a gun regulated country"?
There hasn't been one since...
If you make the same search for America, letter B is probably on
purgepage 3Quite the Freudian slip
I live in a country where it is almost impossible* to get gun. But there were some shootings even in schools. And every sane person agrees that neither any changes in laws will do anything nor all those bogus turnstiles, fences and locking fire exits. This circus of prison mentally harms children even more, fences don't let students escape in case of shooting and locking fire exits... Dear Princess Celestia, we didn't learn anything.
* unless you are male between age 18 and 27. In this case good uncle Voencom will give you AK even if you don't want it.
It's weird how the BuT OtHeR CoUnTrIeS HaVe iT tOo argument is so rapidly debunked even without showing how 'both sides' it is.
theres like 5 million Danes. their per capita count is still higher.
Have you done the maths, or are you guessing? For the rate to be equal, there must have been 220 mass shooting in the US since 1994, wich is the earliest mass shootings on this list.
(332 mil / 6mil) X 4 mass shootings registered since 1994
Notice it is SINCE 1994. I believe there are double this EVERY year in the US. The actual comparison is 15000 (mass) shootings Vs 220 (adjusted to reflect the population) making it 70! Times higher in the US, after accounting for the population differences
So you are not correct when you say it is higher in Denmark.
Also note that this is a comparison for mass shootings. Gun violence in general is even more extreme
This is a VERY rough comparison simply to prove you wrong, but there is a good article about this, comparing Denmark and the US here
https://www.desifacts.org/policy-law/gun-laws-and-denmark
Well that one guy in Denmark got eighty alone, and the states 200 this year, so yeah it was fast math, but at least I used numbers of victims, not incidents. You're doing some excellent fast talking shitty math yourself there.
I think you're confusing Denmark with Norway my fast talking friend...
That said, i dont think you'd want to look into gun casualties to prove your point also what is that 200 you mention? I don't know how many have died in mass shootings in the US, but it is a lot more than the 200 you claim it to be.
I mean read the article causing this commentary
Imagine mass shootings being so common that people can't agree on what they are...
Please, stop being stupid
You first
They already are. So how about you educate yourself on something else than your NRA approved gun manual.
Oh fuck off moron .
Denmark's rate is 1.08. This is actually quite high by European standards, but to claim it's higher than the US is a joke.
Math is hard ๐...
I don't disagree that gun violence is a huge problem in the US, and we can all agree that we need to have serious discussion about realistic solutions.
But there are SO many more people in the US than in Denmark. It's not even close. It has roughly the population as Colarado for the entire country.
That's not to say there aren't many, many more mass shooting instances in Colarado (I'm using the term mass shooting to mean a person shooting strangers on purpose in a planned attack in a place unlikely to have armed victims like a school, movie theater or gay night club) than Denmark, so I feel it's a bit disingenuous to compare the whole US to Denmark.
Denmark also has a lot less poverty and better access to healthcare and mental health services as compared to the US.
So I know it feels good to try and make your point this way, but it's not really the same at all. There's more to this than guns and "Americans dumb".
It's easier to veiw these gun statistics less by a side by side comparison of total population and more by gun related deaths per every 10, 000 people. That allows an adjustment for population.
The US in 2023 had 10.89 gun deaths per every 10k people. Denmark had 1.08 per 10k. So roughly Denmark would have had to have roughly 10x the number of gun deaths to draw parallel with the US.
This metric does cover all homicides and suicides. For a better picture homicides only made up 7% of all gun related fatalities in Denmark in the US 43% of gun deaths were homicides. One interesting difference is that Denmark accidental gun deaths is a much bigger slice of their piechart than the US.
Strong social welfare programs and measures to check extreme wealth aggregation are also things the US would have money to manage. Technically speaking the ratio of Government wealth per adult in the US is greater than Denmark's meaning Denmark is doing more with less.
Also poverty crime is still pretty high in Denmark. The social safety net means you don't starve so much and have a place to come home to but it's a very lean existance. A lot of people there are barely making ends meet. Technically speaking the poverty rates between the two countries are actually very comparable.
Thank you. I was about to look for such a per population representation as well. Bonus points to you if you could also provide the sources of your numbers. :>
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0300943274901137
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country
https://injuryfacts.nsc.org/home-and-community/safety-topics/guns/
https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/young-people-in-denmark-at-highest-risk-of-facing-poverty-among-eu-countries/2865213
Sorry about that. Copy pasting anything on my cell is a nightmare on Lemmy. Here's my main sources.
No, there's nothing more to this than guns and Americans dumb. You have to remember, we have functioning education in most other places in the world, so the kind of imbecile propaganda you all fall victim to has no effect on us, you only come across as a moron trying to regurgitate it.
[looks around NL nervously....]
Ok, but controlling for population doesn't actually make it better for you guys. You're still far and away the number one in number of mass shootings. By orders of magnitude.
Note that there is a really bad outdated study that puts US in the number 11 (and it's not relevant, because it's really outdated by now. I suspect that because of these frequent record breaks, it would look bad even with the fuckery), because they did a lot statistical fuckery to make it so. It's too long of an explanation to write out what they did.
However, you can just use the average for number of mass shootings per year/month/week and you propel to the top like a rocket.
So, yes it's more than just "Americans dumb", but everything points to the fact that US is rotten to the core, and lack of gun control is definitely part of the problem. Poverty, inequality, police violence, lack of social programs (because fuck commies, fam) and so forth... But while it's not unique to US, it's definitely typical US problem.
https://www.desifacts.org/policy-law/gun-laws-and-denmark
Nah, y'all dumb.
Ok let's compare the entirety of Europe to the US (Europe has about 750 000 000 inhabitants, so double the US)
Amount of school shootings happened in the US last year: 52
Amount of school shooting happened in Europe: 31 since the year 1900
I mean it's still an entire country. The comparisons are the same for Australia and England as well. Sure they have violence. It's mitigating the tools to create violence. They have the easiest access in a country that breeds toxicity. Take some of those things away and maybe keeping the guns as they are a worthy discussion. But because they aren't, it's the most common sense way to handle the problem.
And we'll do nothing about it as always. On to the next year. America, you're a real winner.
Not true. We posted some "thoughts and prayers" messages to Facebook. What else did you expect, actual gun control?
Pay teachers living wages. Or double living wages.
America is bathing in money, it can afford.
That money isn't for the people dummy. It's for like 30 people at the top...
Tax
To celebrate the milestone, ArmaLite is offering a ten percent discount on the purchase of a new AR-15!
Nice! These discounts will really help us break the record next year!
At this point the US is just competing against itself.
It's good that the US doesn't get complacent and continues to challenge itself to new heights. Often times a country would be years or even decades ahead in a field only to become unmotivated, overtaken and forever doomed to obscurity and mediocrity.
If that toddler was armed it wouldn't have happened
Sadly I would put more faith into a good guy toddler with a gun than the police from Uvalde.
If that person was actually convicted of the felony instead of likely plead out to a misdemeanor, it also wouldn't have happened.
All they had was a charge, not a conviction. Are you saying you want to strip the right of self defense from innocent people?
Probably why they used the word "if". IF they'd been convicted, the incident wouldn't have happened. Not, they should've lost their gun cos they were charged. As it stands, nobody needs a gun for self defence anyway. The number of countries who manage to cope in this way far out numbers the US.
congrats?
... so far.
We're 92.8% through the year, so even if one happens it's mighty impressive.
I fail to understand your comment. Should another shooting happen, the headline would still be correct.
They're saying they don't believe the situation will improve, and there will be a greater number in a future year
Not if we deploy enough thoughts and prayers
How many bullets can those withstand?
Most mass shootings in a single year so far.
World: But it's already December!
America: hold my beer
"No way to prevent this"
"Says only country where this happens" :(
happy holidays
Warm Kwanzaa greetings to your family and friends as well.
I'm more of a Saucy Saturnalia partaker, but thank you.
Horny Hogswatch for me, thanks
Those fools! If only we had 1.3 guns per person to defend ourselves!
If only this was a purely sarcastic sentiment and not unironically spouted by libertarian gun nuts.
No, no, they've got a point: if every citizen has enough guns to be entirely covered in them, the bullets won't be able to get through!
I'm excited for people to come into this thread and insist on a definition of assault rifle.
Or mass shooting
It's not a mass shooting unless it happens in Massachusetts, otherwise it's just sparkling shooting
USA! USA! USA! NUMBER 1 BAYBAY! (Shotgun blasts)
Isn't this old news already? Wasn't there already another mass shooting at UNLV that barely makes the news because this happens like three times a month?
What a world.
World? Nah, just US.
Since they break the record every year, it's news every year
They need to know make the news at all. They're only popular because they do make news.
FTFY since autocorrect failed you :)
That it did, thank you.
Alternatively, at the rate they're happening, it'll stop being newsworthy soon.
It already is. Most mass shootings don't make the news unless they are very public and go into double digits. Or if they are the shooting that takes us past last year's
goalcount.Pro Life! Fuck yea!
U S A! NUMBER ONE!
I'm sure someone has done the math on it, how many of these mass shootings were right wingers? How many were not right wing trans people?
Try the Southern Poverty Law Center
Can you just pay teachers fucking living wage?
No. We can arm them with AR15s though
They'll have to pay for the ammo themselves, of course.
Just like any other classroom supply.
Funny, but horribly impractical.
If every classroom has an AR-15 secured behind a desk, then every school can outfit a gang. Remember that the gun violence in countries without so many available guns is coincidentally a lot lower.
And teachers aren't paid enough as it is. They're not gonna take a life for the pittance they're getting.
It was only half a joke, Republicans notoriously have wanted to arm teachers for a long timr
How about you pay those teachers in AR15s then?
Look at all the good all those good guys with guns are doing. /s
It's mixing mass shooting with mass killing.
The first number deals with people shot, and the second counts incidents where four or more people died from their injuries. I believe the second number isn't just gun violence - so stabbings or vehicular homicide are counted - but I'm not sure because the number of mass attacks are far lower when the victim can avoid injury by moving only three feet to one side.
The number of mass shootings, where 4+ people were injured by guns but less than 4 were killed, has been as many as 9 in one day.
I think the number of strictly school shootings is more than 38 this year. Like, a Columbine somewhere, every pay-cheque.
This is as stupid as sad.
There it is again, that funny feeling.
Given the opportunity to outlaw "assault weapons" or eliminate hate, fear and greed, which do you think would reduce deaths the most? Saying this because Amish communities are generally armed to the teeth without any shootings.
I would guess countries/societies with a (much) smaller wealth gap and more homogenous culture/values have less mass shootings. Perhaps in these societies there is less isolation between people, for better and worse?
Ah yes, the Amish. Famously violent, and always running around with their AR-15s, high capacity magazines, just to really show off how modest, simple and peaceful their lives are.
Outlaw assault weapons. That's the easy one.
Amish communities deal with those things in a different horrible way. Like excommunicating people who know nothing outside of the community.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Two attacks on Sunday occurring within a couple of hours of each other in Texas and Washington state were the yearโs 37th and 38th mass shootings.
Authorities believe a murder-suicide was responsible for the death of five family members in Vancouver, a suburb of Portland, Oregon, just across the border in Washington, while in Dallas a 21-year-old with a previous aggravated assault charge shot five people in a house, including a toddler.
Another attack occurred on Sunday in New York City, when a 38-year-old man stabbed four of his relatives โ including two children โ as well as another woman and two police officers before they shot him.
Some, such as the Gun Violence Archive, include events in which multiple people are shot regardless of number of deaths, and so report much higher figures.
The Fourth of July long weekend was overshadowed by 16 shootings in which 15 people were killed and nearly 100 injured.
But the deadliest attack of 2023 happened in Lewiston, Maine, on 25 October when an army reservist murdered 18 people in a bowling alley and a bar.
The original article contains 380 words, the summary contains 182 words. Saved 52%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Big whoop! As an american it doesn't affect me because I've a gun for self defense.
A gun is not a guarantee of safety against other people with guns, otherwise war would be pretty anticlimactic.
You should also invest in getting some t-shirts made that say "GOOD GUY" in big letters, that way the police know you're a good guy with a gun and don't kill you like they did to the last guy who stopped a mass shooter.
I thought you'd recommend AR15s against other people with guns.
Why do you need a gun, when you can just murder people with words?
Gun takes less effort and I'm lazy.
If you need a gun to feel safe in your own country, you live in a shithole.
Yet every other person in this world want to live in the " shithole". I was in Australia recently and noticed so many Australian want to become American. They put in some real effort.
Wait. you guys only lost 200 people in mass shootings? There's four hundred million of you. no wonder no one cares. News makes it sound like you lose 50,000 that way.
No, we lose 50,000 people per year in normal shootings. Quite a few of those are suicides though, so no one cares.
We very much should
Total homicides usually clocks in around 26k or so. About half with firearms. About 10% with specifically rifles.
Of that ~26k, about 200 this year have been from shootings in which more than 3 people were killed. To get the number that high you aren't just counting "nutter with a manifesto shoots up a public place"-style shootings (there were 1400 or so total killed in those between the mid 60s and 2021, according to WaPo - they stopped that count at the point and since started a new project with a more broad measure of what counts), you're mostly counting gang violence and family annihilators (think person kills own spouse and kids, then themself).
We focus on nutters shooting up public places and want to primarily ban rifles, because the people calling for it pay attention to a few incidents that get lots of media attention and then see statistics measuring something different and connect the two as is intended.
You're not disingenuous. That's rare.
Yeah if you want to see that in lemmy check out this dude
Err....that just links back to here