"No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.
Matthew 6:24
Thank you. The best way to fight this is quoting scripture. Half these chuckles haven’t even seen a bible, let alone know what the words inside say.
If any of the chucklefucks actually gave a shit about what the bible says, they'd all be as socialist as Jesus and would've burned Trump at a stake for being the antichrist.
You can't deprogram religious extremists with religion.
I'm Jewish, and thus not an expert on Jesus by any means. Still, even I know that Biblical Jesus would be a socialist today, not a Republican.
He gave out free healthcare.
He fed the hungry without charging them.
He hung around people who were on the fringes of society.
He worked against the wealthy.
If Biblical Jesus were to magically appear in modern society, the only reason he would enter a MAGA church would be to flip a few tables.
Wasn't Jesus Jewish though?
Yes, but his teachings aren't part of Judaism. Especially when you get into the "Jesus is the Messiah/son of God" stuff that Christianity has.
Not looking to deprogram with religion, just logic. And even though they will be mad at me for pointing out their flaws, hopefully someone somewhere will go “hmm..”
It doesn't matter, they pick and choose what they want to believe. If you try throwing scripture at them they just contort themselves into a pretzel trying to explain why that particular scripture is not to be taken literally.
Just because they will be 100% unwilling to admit to you that they are actually physically experiencing the feeling of doubt, does not mean it isn't actually happening.
Don't expect them to be honest about what's going on inside them though. They value fighting, never giving up, persistence, dedication, loyalty, strength, power, confidence and security. None of these things makes it more likely for them to admit to you when something they disagree with might sound reasonable.
It's a defense mechanism. Can't just give it permission to function though.
You do have to back off before you actually infuriate them though, as the emotion of anger will strengthen the defense mechanisms dramatically. Better to walk away having peacefully left some food for thought. You can't convince them though, being so readily convinced would itself be unacceptable to them, just on principle.
This. Best explanation I ever heard of narcissism is that we all eventually reach a point where we feel intense shame. It's a chasm. Some people look at it, fall in, and never recover. Some people look at it, realize the danger, and stay away from the edge but don't run screaming.
And some people see it, and become so terrified, that they pretend it never happened and will fight anyone who reminds them of the shame.
That's the narcissists, which are empowered by systems of religious dogma. Very often they're least faithful - they're just lying to avoid anyone around them finding out.
I find it fun backing them into corners and them becoming enraged. I then point out that they are not being very Christ like, and that usually ends my conversation with the charlatan.
Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
I was a stranger, and ye took me in: 36naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. 37Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? 38When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? 39Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? 40And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
Why does our country embody NONE of these ideals? Why do modern day Christians embody NONE of these ideals? How can we call ourselves a nation under god when we bomb innocent civilians, starve children for profit, imprison a population disproportionately then use them as slave labor, and shoot at immigrants for merely crossing an imaginary line.
What GOD would want us?
What GOD would want us?
The one that fell the walls of Jericho and asked Abraham to kill his son to show loyalty, and tested Job by murdering his family. That's their god.
I agree in sentiment with this, but any serious reading of the Christian Bible shows the entire point of Christ is basically replacing the vengeful god with a loving and forgiving one. These people are just bad Christians.
Most Christians are bad Christians.
Yeah, I mean Christianity, i.e. being Christ-like is an extremely tough ask, hence forgiveness is a sacrament. It’s really all about keeping up that push and eventually overcoming our bad habits or learning to act more selflessly.
Interesting. You'd think most were trying to be more selfish than selfless... Almost like they aren't even trying to be Christ-like. They should excommunicate themselves for being terrible Christians.
Yeah I don’t know if I’m going to go ahead and judge millions of people on whether or not they are selfish. Throwing the first stone and all that. 😉
Oh it's not a judgement. It's a call to action that they should actually practice what they preach. They seriously SHOULD be excommunicating each other for this stuff, but they don't.
They DEMONSTRATE that the institution is corrupt. It requires no judgement from me for that to be wholly true.
So, the problem is that Jesus is also the one who is promised to come back riding on clouds of fire and lightning to exact vengeance against unbelievers. Which Jesus you believe in has obvious ramifications (and that doesn't include the versions invented wholecloth from the minds of pastors with agendas).
Now, I'm an ex-Christian and would wholly support removing Revelation from the canon, but the issue is that it remains and informs the worldview of people who claim the name of "Christian."
So I submit that they're actually being good Christians, just not good people.
That’s the general shape of my reply when someone tries to tell me that it’s gay people or trans people or abortion or pornography that are ‘causing God to hate us’. You mean, it’s me and my husband and our trans friends, and not the hate and the murder and the greed and the privation of the downtrodden?
It’s never a productive conversation, let me tell you…
Also better not eat shellfish or pork. And he absolutely better not go back on his word. (The tale of Onan is sometimes misinterpreted as being about masturbation, but it's really about God killing a guy for going back on his word.)
He promised not to masturbate? Nofap vibes
Back in the day, women couldn't inherit property. So if their husbands died without leaving a male heir, they could become homeless. Instead of the obvious solution of "let's give women property rights," though, there was another system in place.
The brother of the dead husband could sleep with the widow. The child of this relationship would be considered the dead husband's child for inheritance purposes.
Onan agreed to this arrangement. He had sex with his sister-in-law. Only, at the last second, he pulled out and "spilled his seed on the ground." So, he got the benefit of the deal for him (sex) without giving the woman her side of the deal (a shot at a child). He went back on his word and was struck down by God.
Of course, many religious folks focus on "spilled seed on the ground" and declare this to be a ban on masturbation - completely ignoring all the context around those words.
He was supposed to sleep with his brother's widow in order to continue the family bloodline and make the widow more a part of the family, IIRC. He didn't want to do that, but was pressured so much that he said he'd try. This was more similar to the vibe of stealthing, but in reverse.
He's wearing a good quality suit, he's mixing materials as that liner is almost certainly silk and the shirt linen or cotton.
It is odd to me how many people claim to be guided by a 400+ year old European version of a 2000+ year old Middle-Eastern text.
A text that's been edited and changed for political reasons since it existed
And several books that originally made up the Christian cannon were omitted because their message was profoundly anti authority/centralization and much more focused on the divine inside oneself and bringing it out. No hell and no judgement, we are all an aspect of god, and while I’m not a Christian of any variety anymore I find that’s a much more reasonable teleological explanation for our existence than the “live and believe exactly this way or you will go to hell” philosophy of modern day Christianity
Don't forget that it may have plagiarized the story of Horus, which predated the Bible..
Nor should we forget that the basis for the Christian god originates in the polytheistic religion of the Canaanites. The Canaanite deity Yahweh, that eventually became known as the Abrahamic creator god, was merely a god of weather and war, rather than the supreme God. That was a different deity, ʼĒl, who eventually became conflated with Yahweh in the process of switching from polytheistic to monotheistic.
That's such a classic answer because the bible doesn't say shit other than what we decide it says. Our interpretation of it follows cultural norms, not the other way around. One thing it damn sure doesn't say is abortion is wrong or that life begins at conception - it explicitly says the opposite and that hasn't somehow changed anyone's opinions.
I'm too lazy to try to find a citation for your claim about our morals guiding how we interpret religious canons (not vice-versa), but this was taught to me in multiple philosophy courses and is well-established.
Our morality is developed thru our upbringing and exposure, including being influenced by parents, teachers, peers, media, culture, etc. We then pick and choose passages from canons based on our pre-established moral beliefs.
I find Dan McClellan's videos on TikTok to be informative and accessible. He's a biblical scholar and Mormon but he makes very clear that the bible is not flawless nor univocal. That's not a recommendation I make lightly because I'm an atheist and think Mormonism is a crazy cult, but he's very clearly an expert on the matter (he has a doctorate) who speaks very matter of factly because he draws a pretty clear line between personal faith and the actual facts about the bible and pretty much only talks about the latter.
If only we could have this conversation happen then:
Chapter and verse! I wanted to ask you a couple of questions while I had you here. I’m interested in selling my youngest daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. She’s a Georgetown sophomore, speaks fluent Italian, and always cleared the table when it was her turn. What would a good price for her be? While thinking about that, can I ask another? My Chief of Staff, Leo McGarry, insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly says he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or is it okay to call the police? Here’s one that’s really important, ‘cause we’ve got a lot of sports fans in this town. Touching the skin of a dead pig makes one unclean: Leviticus 11:7. If they promise to wear gloves, can the Washington Redskins still play football? Can Notre Dame? Can West Point? Does the whole town really have to be together to stone my brother, John, for planting different crops side by side? Can I burn my mother in a small family gathering for wearing garments made from two different threads? Think about those questions, would you? One last thing, while you may be mistaking this for your monthly meeting of the Ignorant Tight-Ass Club, in this building, when the President stands, nobody sits.
Taking all the God stuff out of the equation, I've always been puzzled by the garment thing. Given context of ancient time, low levels of sanitation, and lack of preservation, I can see some merit to some of the dietary stuff. But the garment thing. I've got nothing.
Edit: Quick Google search suggests only priests could wear dual material garments, so it was some weird social hierarchy thing.
Elsewhere he wrote, “Experts project that homosexual marriage is the dark harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy that could doom even the strongest republic.”
The gays are too powerful. Happily married homosexuals are too strong to contain.
Who are these experts on gayness? His weekend buddies?
homosexual marriage is the dark harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy
Oh, my
I think this is the best sentence I have read in a long time, and I now need to figure out how
to work it into a conversation lol
brb selling my daughter
Dude claims to be a Christian, but he’s the one who needs to read his Bible. Half the stuff he espouses doesn’t come from the New Testament.
A lot of the stuff wingnuts espouse doesn't come from the new testament. They love the fire-and-brimstone, it shall be an abomination unto whatever horseshit from the old testament -- but only the bits and pieces of it that fit their preconceived notions and particular brand of hate.
They also love to blather about the "ten commandments." They can never tell you which set of ten, though. (Because they haven't read the damn book; The list in Exodus is different from the one in Deuteronomy.) None of them seem to be prepared to cite what Big J said about the commandments, either.
I'm athiest, but spent many years in church, so here's my understanding of why he references the Old testament:
Jesus said he came to fulfill the law, not to abolish it. (Matthew 5:17-18) So the Law, which is found in the OT, is still in effect. Each denomination and individual decides for themselves what parts they'll pay attention to.
Many Christians throw out the entire Old Testament, but most just pick and choose which parts they want enforced. They love the 10 commandments, for example. But they also wear mixed fabrics, eat pork & shrimp, and some get tattoos...all of which are forbidden in the OT.
This guy plays Pick & Choose. If it's in the OT and he can use it to make this country a "Biblical Republic", he will use those verses. If it means he can't eat crawfish etouffee, then that verse clearly doesn't matter to him.
The scariest part about this dude is that he interprets everything thru the lens of scripture. And he does not believe the separation of church and state is real.
I've been saying most of my life that "the" bible is basically a Rorschach blot used for confirmation bias for both liberal xtians and conservative xtians. Many liberals look at the "red letter" portions of the NT and want to dispense with most everything else, including the OT.
The weirdest thing about the NT is why on Earth Paul gets so much prominence. This is a guy who, even according to the narrative, never even met the character of Jesus...and yet, so many xtians seem to lean on things he wrote, even though they contradict things the character of Jesus is made to say in their stories. These people should be called Paulians.
It's cus he was a wealthy Roman citizen of the time while the Apostles were mostly poor Palestinians
The way I have always viewed Christians vs Catholics is that Christians fundamentally believe faith in god is the only requirement. In Catholicism it is not enough to believe, but they believe that good deads are required, hence Catholic guilt. In that way, Christians don't really care about the new testament and the teachings of jesus, believe in god is all they require to be good Christians.
Interesting take. I grew up Catholic, Sunday school yada yada. That guilt.. that is some fucked up shit to put into a child.
But as you put it, Christians are far more insufferable and a significant reason why I changed my faith.
And please spare me how the Catholic Church is somehow king of pedo. Every Christian sect is rife with them. If you care about your kids stay away from them all. You can give them a better handle on ethics and mortality with some basic cartoons. And they'll probably enjoy them rather than groan at the stupid outdated biblical shit you want to make them learn.
Yeah, I'm biased but i stand by that statement.
Them catholics sure like to dig around for something to assuage their 'guilt' inside little boy holes.
How does someone this deranged get elected to any position of power more influential than a homeowner's association?
Leaded Gasoline and disinformation.
He found a club that is genuinely evil and got elected by other evil people to be in charge of it.
I wonder what his two daughters think about him being fully on board with this:
"ExCUSE ME? You cannot rape these men, I believe they are angels, and they're my guests! The AUDACITY of your request! How DARE you! But please, rape my daughters on your way out. I insist." -Lot
Don't worry. Those daughters got their revenge. After Sodom and Gemorah were destroyed, they got their father drunk, slept with him, and had his babies.
But the Bible is totally fine for kids to read, everyone!
Yes, I can see why Republicans want us to pick up the Bible and read it. You can take all these stories and apply them to living a good life today. /S
Christians don't read they bible. They listen to the preacher tell them what's in the bible. And you know that he is not telling them these parts, has he passes the collection plate.
A lot of fucked up stuff going on in that house, pun intended..
And if they die a couple days after a beating the master is absolved of wrongdoing.
The bible is fucked
Yet here he is proudly claiming "its his worldview". As far as red flags go, I'd put that on par with him saying his celebrity crush was Jeffery Dahmer.
Years ago, I remember a scholar - interviewed on NPR - that had compared "the" bible to the Quran and it may not shock very many people that "the" bible is highly problematic, even compared to the problematic parts of Quran.
Bet you anything this asshole ignores most, if not all, of the teachings of Jesus whenever it's convenient or profitable.
IF he reads his bible then he should know that there is almost unlimited room for interpreting most of its contents.
Does he not know how many different Christian denominations there are in the US? And that those exist because of theological differences?
I am concerned about the lack of depth he is demonstrating. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised.
ETA: It IS the house after all. My expectations should be lower, right?
I think what we can take from such a statement is that his worldview is a disparate collection of stories, that he desperately tries to reconcile with some sort of overarching narrative, but fails, and so gives idiotic platitudes like "the Bible is my worldview" to cover for his lack of curiosity necessary for having a grounded epistemology.
"ETA"?
ETA = Edited To Add
Interesting. TIL.
He's probably referring to the parts where women and slaves are property, you can beat your kids, and God orders his followers to commit genocides regularly.
Off to stone the sinners.
There are plenty of Cristofascists in America that would be elated if this was a thing in this country
So I take it that he has no opinions about his civil rights, or anyone else’s. Because the Bible does not talk about our rights, only our responsibilities. You will not find a single verse referencing freedom of religion, surely. But also nothing about freedom of speech, the right to bear arms, freedom from unreasonable search and seizure, the right to privacy; or the right to a speedy trial by a jury of your peers, in which you have the right to face your accusers, and to see the evidence against you. And on and on, all the way down. Nothing at all.
These rights were so important to the colonists that they laid down their lives for them, against one the the most powerful empires in the history of the world. Why doesn’t Mike Johnson respect the founders of his own country? Or perhaps he doesn’t actually understand anything about it?
Sooo... that means he is qualified to hold a position in ancient Judea - not modern-day USA.
Him supporting Israel is probably the best thing he'll ever do.
Totally consistent with white, christofascist, imperialist colonizer worldview.
We already know he's a white supremacist - his support for Israel is therefore not surprising.
Contradictory, ridiculously outdated, and easy to twist to your narrative?
Great worldview.
The hypocrisy of the modern Republican Party I guess, but what would such an apparently devout
Christian man see in Donald Trump of all people?!
I've read the Bible, multiple times. And only once when I still considered myself a Christian.
I call BULLSHIT.
Isn’t that the book that talks about horse semen and beastiality? Probably shouldn’t be in schools.
Implying that everyone not only has a Bible on their shelf, but multiple.
You need a bunch because all the cherries get picked out of them
You want atheists? That's how you get atheists
Raises hand
A worldview from 2000 years ago. What forward thinking politicians we have in this day and age!
Did they have shelves back then?
Tracing written records and architectural history, one of the earliest precursors to the modern-day shelf were the storage units at the back of Christian churches prior to the medieval era.
So, maybe?
I think Jezza Chris made some shelves, actually. Being a fictional carpenter invented many centuries after the events and all.
Wait Jesus was an actual guy though. Like regardless of your beliefs on God, he was a real person. Not sure if he was really a carpenter though.
According to the bible (a few pieces of good life advice packaged with a lot of absolute nonsense, much of both copied from other religions and philosophy), a few 3rd hand or worse accounts from a bunch of Romans, most of whom weren't born at the time, and a bunch of religious and religion-affected scholars just agreeing with each other.
Like his divinity and his dad, there's no hard evidence or even thorough account of him ever existing and as such, there's no non-religious reason to believe he existed.
Really? I always thought it was historical consensus that he was physically real (religion aside).
Nope. Just one of those "common knowledge" things that turn out to be unproven bunk. Like waiting half an hour between eating and swimming
They had these diamond shaped shelves for all the scrolls and shit
Except don't actually do that because he hasn't read it either, just just does whatever the fuck he wants and ignores everything that doesn't agree with what he wanted it to say.
This dingus probably read "the" bible like he read The Constitution.
Bears eating children, preachers cursing fig trees, women being turned to salt.
Illegal pop-up restaurant serving fish of dubious origin and wine without a liquor license
A single fish that keeps doubling each time you tear it in half and you're going to claim radiation isn't involved?
No it's not. It's what HE thinks is in the bible (spoiler, a lot of what he thinks is in there isn't).
Jesus and John Wayne is an excellent book that recounts, in considerable detail, how the evangelical movement became based on manliness instead of scripture.
Specifically how it got to the point where Der Gropenfurher is EXACTLY what America’s “evangelical religious” want. He is the symptom, not the cause.
I encourage everyone to read at least the first half of the Bible so you can see how fucking ape shit wacky that crap is
I guess just wringing your hands and going HMMWAHAHAHAHAHA is out of fashion among cartoon villains.
I mean, they seem to be trending that way.
Everything comes back into style eventually
What a bold-faced lie. Nobody follows the Bible directly, especially not him.
So you're a moron then?
In my youth I once did what this man is telling folks to do now, you know what it did? It made me want to stop people like him.
Is he running for Worst Person Ever?
He's in the Republican party so yes. :P
I just hope that enough people see all the crazy, and it motivates them to go fucking vote.
Sadly, the people that he's trying to appeal to will watch this and say "this guy gets it. Our country should be run as a Christian Theocracy like the Founding Fathers intended!"
(While, obviously, not knowing a single thing about the Founding Fathers.)
I hope the young people vote. I am old and always voted progressive or Democrat, but the country may become a Christian Nation unless enough people vote to stop it. It would be very hard to reverse this if it happened. Right now voting can stop it.
BRB getting a male goat without blemish for sacrificing.
Good lord this is gonna be a wild ride.
Pretty sure he hasn't.
I know everyone is up in arms about this but, to me, it just seems.... I dunno, kinda sad? Like, his whole existence has been substituted with a single old book?
There's no room to grow or change or learn. It's just, like, "Everything I am is written down over there and that's it."
How small and petty and sad.
sweats in old testament*
What a dumbass. Fairy tales for Bronze Age sheepherders is no way to run a modern society. This asshat is an actual young Earth creationist.
So sick of these stupid snake handlers getting paid attention to AT ALL, much less calling the shots for the rest of us.
So you agree with me then, that what goes into a man's mouth is not important but what comes out of it is? Meaning you're not allowed to be a racist asshole but you are allowed to suck dick? Because that is something I got from a quote from Jesus
Also tomorrow is Sunday and I I believe the house is still convening for that day. who exactly is going to be stoning you to death for working that day?
One more thing, given that some men are called upon to become eunuchs and should not be judges for it...
Given the classical definition of a eunuch, does this mean that you are now in support of transgender rights?
Oh and since we are not meant to put our faith in princes and a camel has a better chance of going through the eye of a needle than a rich man has entering heaven, can we officially put you down as having denounced Donald Trump as the Republican candidate?
I wanted to say for legal purposes, that I do not Advocate anyone Stone to death any member of congress, and that my statement was purely for satirical purposes. I denounce anyone who actually plans any domestic terrorist actions against any us official, no matter how Despicable the senator.
Matthew 6:24
Thank you. The best way to fight this is quoting scripture. Half these chuckles haven’t even seen a bible, let alone know what the words inside say.
If any of the chucklefucks actually gave a shit about what the bible says, they'd all be as socialist as Jesus and would've burned Trump at a stake for being the antichrist.
You can't deprogram religious extremists with religion.
I'm Jewish, and thus not an expert on Jesus by any means. Still, even I know that Biblical Jesus would be a socialist today, not a Republican.
He gave out free healthcare.
He fed the hungry without charging them.
He hung around people who were on the fringes of society.
He worked against the wealthy.
If Biblical Jesus were to magically appear in modern society, the only reason he would enter a MAGA church would be to flip a few tables.
Wasn't Jesus Jewish though?
Yes, but his teachings aren't part of Judaism. Especially when you get into the "Jesus is the Messiah/son of God" stuff that Christianity has.
Not looking to deprogram with religion, just logic. And even though they will be mad at me for pointing out their flaws, hopefully someone somewhere will go “hmm..”
It doesn't matter, they pick and choose what they want to believe. If you try throwing scripture at them they just contort themselves into a pretzel trying to explain why that particular scripture is not to be taken literally.
Just because they will be 100% unwilling to admit to you that they are actually physically experiencing the feeling of doubt, does not mean it isn't actually happening.
Don't expect them to be honest about what's going on inside them though. They value fighting, never giving up, persistence, dedication, loyalty, strength, power, confidence and security. None of these things makes it more likely for them to admit to you when something they disagree with might sound reasonable.
It's a defense mechanism. Can't just give it permission to function though.
You do have to back off before you actually infuriate them though, as the emotion of anger will strengthen the defense mechanisms dramatically. Better to walk away having peacefully left some food for thought. You can't convince them though, being so readily convinced would itself be unacceptable to them, just on principle.
This. Best explanation I ever heard of narcissism is that we all eventually reach a point where we feel intense shame. It's a chasm. Some people look at it, fall in, and never recover. Some people look at it, realize the danger, and stay away from the edge but don't run screaming.
And some people see it, and become so terrified, that they pretend it never happened and will fight anyone who reminds them of the shame.
That's the narcissists, which are empowered by systems of religious dogma. Very often they're least faithful - they're just lying to avoid anyone around them finding out.
I find it fun backing them into corners and them becoming enraged. I then point out that they are not being very Christ like, and that usually ends my conversation with the charlatan.
Matthew 19:21
https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Matthew%2019%3A21
Mathew 25: 36 - 40
Why does our country embody NONE of these ideals? Why do modern day Christians embody NONE of these ideals? How can we call ourselves a nation under god when we bomb innocent civilians, starve children for profit, imprison a population disproportionately then use them as slave labor, and shoot at immigrants for merely crossing an imaginary line.
What GOD would want us?
The one that fell the walls of Jericho and asked Abraham to kill his son to show loyalty, and tested Job by murdering his family. That's their god.
I agree in sentiment with this, but any serious reading of the Christian Bible shows the entire point of Christ is basically replacing the vengeful god with a loving and forgiving one. These people are just bad Christians.
Most Christians are bad Christians.
Yeah, I mean Christianity, i.e. being Christ-like is an extremely tough ask, hence forgiveness is a sacrament. It’s really all about keeping up that push and eventually overcoming our bad habits or learning to act more selflessly.
Interesting. You'd think most were trying to be more selfish than selfless... Almost like they aren't even trying to be Christ-like. They should excommunicate themselves for being terrible Christians.
Yeah I don’t know if I’m going to go ahead and judge millions of people on whether or not they are selfish. Throwing the first stone and all that. 😉
Oh it's not a judgement. It's a call to action that they should actually practice what they preach. They seriously SHOULD be excommunicating each other for this stuff, but they don't.
They DEMONSTRATE that the institution is corrupt. It requires no judgement from me for that to be wholly true.
So, the problem is that Jesus is also the one who is promised to come back riding on clouds of fire and lightning to exact vengeance against unbelievers. Which Jesus you believe in has obvious ramifications (and that doesn't include the versions invented wholecloth from the minds of pastors with agendas).
Now, I'm an ex-Christian and would wholly support removing Revelation from the canon, but the issue is that it remains and informs the worldview of people who claim the name of "Christian."
So I submit that they're actually being good Christians, just not good people.
That’s the general shape of my reply when someone tries to tell me that it’s gay people or trans people or abortion or pornography that are ‘causing God to hate us’. You mean, it’s me and my husband and our trans friends, and not the hate and the murder and the greed and the privation of the downtrodden?
It’s never a productive conversation, let me tell you…
I think I've seen this porn..
Motherfucker better not mix fabrics.
Also better not eat shellfish or pork. And he absolutely better not go back on his word. (The tale of Onan is sometimes misinterpreted as being about masturbation, but it's really about God killing a guy for going back on his word.)
He promised not to masturbate? Nofap vibes
Back in the day, women couldn't inherit property. So if their husbands died without leaving a male heir, they could become homeless. Instead of the obvious solution of "let's give women property rights," though, there was another system in place.
The brother of the dead husband could sleep with the widow. The child of this relationship would be considered the dead husband's child for inheritance purposes.
Onan agreed to this arrangement. He had sex with his sister-in-law. Only, at the last second, he pulled out and "spilled his seed on the ground." So, he got the benefit of the deal for him (sex) without giving the woman her side of the deal (a shot at a child). He went back on his word and was struck down by God.
Of course, many religious folks focus on "spilled seed on the ground" and declare this to be a ban on masturbation - completely ignoring all the context around those words.
He was supposed to sleep with his brother's widow in order to continue the family bloodline and make the widow more a part of the family, IIRC. He didn't want to do that, but was pressured so much that he said he'd try. This was more similar to the vibe of stealthing, but in reverse.
He's wearing a good quality suit, he's mixing materials as that liner is almost certainly silk and the shirt linen or cotton.
It is odd to me how many people claim to be guided by a 400+ year old European version of a 2000+ year old Middle-Eastern text.
A text that's been edited and changed for political reasons since it existed
And several books that originally made up the Christian cannon were omitted because their message was profoundly anti authority/centralization and much more focused on the divine inside oneself and bringing it out. No hell and no judgement, we are all an aspect of god, and while I’m not a Christian of any variety anymore I find that’s a much more reasonable teleological explanation for our existence than the “live and believe exactly this way or you will go to hell” philosophy of modern day Christianity
Don't forget that it may have plagiarized the story of Horus, which predated the Bible..
Nor should we forget that the basis for the Christian god originates in the polytheistic religion of the Canaanites. The Canaanite deity Yahweh, that eventually became known as the Abrahamic creator god, was merely a god of weather and war, rather than the supreme God. That was a different deity, ʼĒl, who eventually became conflated with Yahweh in the process of switching from polytheistic to monotheistic.
That's such a classic answer because the bible doesn't say shit other than what we decide it says. Our interpretation of it follows cultural norms, not the other way around. One thing it damn sure doesn't say is abortion is wrong or that life begins at conception - it explicitly says the opposite and that hasn't somehow changed anyone's opinions.
I'm too lazy to try to find a citation for your claim about our morals guiding how we interpret religious canons (not vice-versa), but this was taught to me in multiple philosophy courses and is well-established.
Our morality is developed thru our upbringing and exposure, including being influenced by parents, teachers, peers, media, culture, etc. We then pick and choose passages from canons based on our pre-established moral beliefs.
I find Dan McClellan's videos on TikTok to be informative and accessible. He's a biblical scholar and Mormon but he makes very clear that the bible is not flawless nor univocal. That's not a recommendation I make lightly because I'm an atheist and think Mormonism is a crazy cult, but he's very clearly an expert on the matter (he has a doctorate) who speaks very matter of factly because he draws a pretty clear line between personal faith and the actual facts about the bible and pretty much only talks about the latter.
Edit: Here he is addressing this very issue: https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8BN3gCR/
There are some seriously juicy bits in the bible I'd read to him and ask him: Is this really your world view?
His response: "The Bible says a lot of things." (Then ignores what it means)
"The important thing to keep in mind is that there are cherry picked verses in the Bible that justify my bigoted views."
So has he sold all of his possessions and given the proceeds to the poor?
No no no, he worships supply side Jesus, not Hebrew Jesus. I mean fuck Jesus was brown...
What kinda woke bullshit is this!? /s
Also how are his bitter water abortion potion brewing skills?
That Jesus is the woke Jesus, though, so...
https://geoffrobson.com/2017/09/28/squaring-off-against-jed-bartlet-an-alternate-ending-to-the-west-wing-and-homosexuality/
If only we could have this conversation happen then:
Chapter and verse! I wanted to ask you a couple of questions while I had you here. I’m interested in selling my youngest daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. She’s a Georgetown sophomore, speaks fluent Italian, and always cleared the table when it was her turn. What would a good price for her be? While thinking about that, can I ask another? My Chief of Staff, Leo McGarry, insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly says he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or is it okay to call the police? Here’s one that’s really important, ‘cause we’ve got a lot of sports fans in this town. Touching the skin of a dead pig makes one unclean: Leviticus 11:7. If they promise to wear gloves, can the Washington Redskins still play football? Can Notre Dame? Can West Point? Does the whole town really have to be together to stone my brother, John, for planting different crops side by side? Can I burn my mother in a small family gathering for wearing garments made from two different threads? Think about those questions, would you? One last thing, while you may be mistaking this for your monthly meeting of the Ignorant Tight-Ass Club, in this building, when the President stands, nobody sits.
Taking all the God stuff out of the equation, I've always been puzzled by the garment thing. Given context of ancient time, low levels of sanitation, and lack of preservation, I can see some merit to some of the dietary stuff. But the garment thing. I've got nothing.
Edit: Quick Google search suggests only priests could wear dual material garments, so it was some weird social hierarchy thing.
The gays are too powerful. Happily married homosexuals are too strong to contain.
Who are these experts on gayness? His weekend buddies?
Science: https://i.imgur.com/vikBY8P.png
brb selling my daughter
Dude claims to be a Christian, but he’s the one who needs to read his Bible. Half the stuff he espouses doesn’t come from the New Testament.
A lot of the stuff wingnuts espouse doesn't come from the new testament. They love the fire-and-brimstone, it shall be an abomination unto whatever horseshit from the old testament -- but only the bits and pieces of it that fit their preconceived notions and particular brand of hate.
They also love to blather about the "ten commandments." They can never tell you which set of ten, though. (Because they haven't read the damn book; The list in Exodus is different from the one in Deuteronomy.) None of them seem to be prepared to cite what Big J said about the commandments, either.
I'm athiest, but spent many years in church, so here's my understanding of why he references the Old testament:
Jesus said he came to fulfill the law, not to abolish it. (Matthew 5:17-18) So the Law, which is found in the OT, is still in effect. Each denomination and individual decides for themselves what parts they'll pay attention to.
Many Christians throw out the entire Old Testament, but most just pick and choose which parts they want enforced. They love the 10 commandments, for example. But they also wear mixed fabrics, eat pork & shrimp, and some get tattoos...all of which are forbidden in the OT.
This guy plays Pick & Choose. If it's in the OT and he can use it to make this country a "Biblical Republic", he will use those verses. If it means he can't eat crawfish etouffee, then that verse clearly doesn't matter to him.
The scariest part about this dude is that he interprets everything thru the lens of scripture. And he does not believe the separation of church and state is real.
I've been saying most of my life that "the" bible is basically a Rorschach blot used for confirmation bias for both liberal xtians and conservative xtians. Many liberals look at the "red letter" portions of the NT and want to dispense with most everything else, including the OT.
The weirdest thing about the NT is why on Earth Paul gets so much prominence. This is a guy who, even according to the narrative, never even met the character of Jesus...and yet, so many xtians seem to lean on things he wrote, even though they contradict things the character of Jesus is made to say in their stories. These people should be called Paulians.
It's cus he was a wealthy Roman citizen of the time while the Apostles were mostly poor Palestinians
The way I have always viewed Christians vs Catholics is that Christians fundamentally believe faith in god is the only requirement. In Catholicism it is not enough to believe, but they believe that good deads are required, hence Catholic guilt. In that way, Christians don't really care about the new testament and the teachings of jesus, believe in god is all they require to be good Christians.
Interesting take. I grew up Catholic, Sunday school yada yada. That guilt.. that is some fucked up shit to put into a child.
But as you put it, Christians are far more insufferable and a significant reason why I changed my faith.
And please spare me how the Catholic Church is somehow king of pedo. Every Christian sect is rife with them. If you care about your kids stay away from them all. You can give them a better handle on ethics and mortality with some basic cartoons. And they'll probably enjoy them rather than groan at the stupid outdated biblical shit you want to make them learn.
Yeah, I'm biased but i stand by that statement.
Them catholics sure like to dig around for something to assuage their 'guilt' inside little boy holes.
How does someone this deranged get elected to any position of power more influential than a homeowner's association?
Leaded Gasoline and disinformation.
He found a club that is genuinely evil and got elected by other evil people to be in charge of it.
I wonder what his two daughters think about him being fully on board with this:
"ExCUSE ME? You cannot rape these men, I believe they are angels, and they're my guests! The AUDACITY of your request! How DARE you! But please, rape my daughters on your way out. I insist." -Lot
Don't worry. Those daughters got their revenge. After Sodom and Gemorah were destroyed, they got their father drunk, slept with him, and had his babies.
But the Bible is totally fine for kids to read, everyone!
Family values.
Yes, I can see why Republicans want us to pick up the Bible and read it. You can take all these stories and apply them to living a good life today. /S
Christians don't read they bible. They listen to the preacher tell them what's in the bible. And you know that he is not telling them these parts, has he passes the collection plate.
A lot of fucked up stuff going on in that house, pun intended..
Genesis 19. Total insanity.
Made my day, thanks for the laffs.
Well, raping of men would be gay, though. Raping two young girls: totally cool w/ their god Jehovah/Yahweh/Allah. NO HOMO.
Well he should sell one his daughters in slavery.
Exodus 21:7-11
And if they die a couple days after a beating the master is absolved of wrongdoing.
The bible is fucked
Yet here he is proudly claiming "its his worldview". As far as red flags go, I'd put that on par with him saying his celebrity crush was Jeffery Dahmer.
Years ago, I remember a scholar - interviewed on NPR - that had compared "the" bible to the Quran and it may not shock very many people that "the" bible is highly problematic, even compared to the problematic parts of Quran.
Bet you anything this asshole ignores most, if not all, of the teachings of Jesus whenever it's convenient or profitable.
IF he reads his bible then he should know that there is almost unlimited room for interpreting most of its contents.
Does he not know how many different Christian denominations there are in the US? And that those exist because of theological differences?
I am concerned about the lack of depth he is demonstrating. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised.
ETA: It IS the house after all. My expectations should be lower, right?
I think what we can take from such a statement is that his worldview is a disparate collection of stories, that he desperately tries to reconcile with some sort of overarching narrative, but fails, and so gives idiotic platitudes like "the Bible is my worldview" to cover for his lack of curiosity necessary for having a grounded epistemology.
"ETA"?
ETA = Edited To Add
Interesting. TIL.
He's probably referring to the parts where women and slaves are property, you can beat your kids, and God orders his followers to commit genocides regularly.
Off to stone the sinners.
There are plenty of Cristofascists in America that would be elated if this was a thing in this country
So I take it that he has no opinions about his civil rights, or anyone else’s. Because the Bible does not talk about our rights, only our responsibilities. You will not find a single verse referencing freedom of religion, surely. But also nothing about freedom of speech, the right to bear arms, freedom from unreasonable search and seizure, the right to privacy; or the right to a speedy trial by a jury of your peers, in which you have the right to face your accusers, and to see the evidence against you. And on and on, all the way down. Nothing at all.
These rights were so important to the colonists that they laid down their lives for them, against one the the most powerful empires in the history of the world. Why doesn’t Mike Johnson respect the founders of his own country? Or perhaps he doesn’t actually understand anything about it?
Sooo... that means he is qualified to hold a position in ancient Judea - not modern-day USA.
Him supporting Israel is probably the best thing he'll ever do.
Totally consistent with white, christofascist, imperialist colonizer worldview.
We already know he's a white supremacist - his support for Israel is therefore not surprising.
Contradictory, ridiculously outdated, and easy to twist to your narrative?
Great worldview.
The hypocrisy of the modern Republican Party I guess, but what would such an apparently devout Christian man see in Donald Trump of all people?!
I've read the Bible, multiple times. And only once when I still considered myself a Christian.
I call BULLSHIT.
Isn’t that the book that talks about horse semen and beastiality? Probably shouldn’t be in schools.
Implying that everyone not only has a Bible on their shelf, but multiple.
You need a bunch because all the cherries get picked out of them
You want atheists? That's how you get atheists
Raises hand
A worldview from 2000 years ago. What forward thinking politicians we have in this day and age!
Did they have shelves back then?
Tracing written records and architectural history, one of the earliest precursors to the modern-day shelf were the storage units at the back of Christian churches prior to the medieval era.
So, maybe?
I think Jezza Chris made some shelves, actually. Being a fictional carpenter invented many centuries after the events and all.
Wait Jesus was an actual guy though. Like regardless of your beliefs on God, he was a real person. Not sure if he was really a carpenter though.
According to the bible (a few pieces of good life advice packaged with a lot of absolute nonsense, much of both copied from other religions and philosophy), a few 3rd hand or worse accounts from a bunch of Romans, most of whom weren't born at the time, and a bunch of religious and religion-affected scholars just agreeing with each other.
Like his divinity and his dad, there's no hard evidence or even thorough account of him ever existing and as such, there's no non-religious reason to believe he existed.
Really? I always thought it was historical consensus that he was physically real (religion aside).
Nope. Just one of those "common knowledge" things that turn out to be unproven bunk. Like waiting half an hour between eating and swimming
They had these diamond shaped shelves for all the scrolls and shit
Except don't actually do that because he hasn't read it either, just just does whatever the fuck he wants and ignores everything that doesn't agree with what he wanted it to say.
This dingus probably read "the" bible like he read The Constitution.
Bears eating children, preachers cursing fig trees, women being turned to salt.
Illegal pop-up restaurant serving fish of dubious origin and wine without a liquor license
A single fish that keeps doubling each time you tear it in half and you're going to claim radiation isn't involved?
All that says to me is he has shit for brains.
Blessed are the cheese makers
No it's not. It's what HE thinks is in the bible (spoiler, a lot of what he thinks is in there isn't).
Jesus and John Wayne is an excellent book that recounts, in considerable detail, how the evangelical movement became based on manliness instead of scripture.
Specifically how it got to the point where Der Gropenfurher is EXACTLY what America’s “evangelical religious” want. He is the symptom, not the cause.
I encourage everyone to read at least the first half of the Bible so you can see how fucking ape shit wacky that crap is
I guess just wringing your hands and going HMMWAHAHAHAHAHA is out of fashion among cartoon villains.
I mean, they seem to be trending that way.
Everything comes back into style eventually
What a bold-faced lie. Nobody follows the Bible directly, especially not him.
So you're a moron then?
In my youth I once did what this man is telling folks to do now, you know what it did? It made me want to stop people like him.
Is he running for Worst Person Ever?
He's in the Republican party so yes. :P
I just hope that enough people see all the crazy, and it motivates them to go fucking vote.
Sadly, the people that he's trying to appeal to will watch this and say "this guy gets it. Our country should be run as a Christian Theocracy like the Founding Fathers intended!"
(While, obviously, not knowing a single thing about the Founding Fathers.)
I hope the young people vote. I am old and always voted progressive or Democrat, but the country may become a Christian Nation unless enough people vote to stop it. It would be very hard to reverse this if it happened. Right now voting can stop it.
BRB getting a male goat without blemish for sacrificing.
Good lord this is gonna be a wild ride.
Pretty sure he hasn't.
I know everyone is up in arms about this but, to me, it just seems.... I dunno, kinda sad? Like, his whole existence has been substituted with a single old book?
There's no room to grow or change or learn. It's just, like, "Everything I am is written down over there and that's it."
How small and petty and sad.
What a dumbass. Fairy tales for Bronze Age sheepherders is no way to run a modern society. This asshat is an actual young Earth creationist.
So sick of these stupid snake handlers getting paid attention to AT ALL, much less calling the shots for the rest of us.
So you agree with me then, that what goes into a man's mouth is not important but what comes out of it is? Meaning you're not allowed to be a racist asshole but you are allowed to suck dick? Because that is something I got from a quote from Jesus
Also tomorrow is Sunday and I I believe the house is still convening for that day. who exactly is going to be stoning you to death for working that day?
One more thing, given that some men are called upon to become eunuchs and should not be judges for it...
Given the classical definition of a eunuch, does this mean that you are now in support of transgender rights?
Oh and since we are not meant to put our faith in princes and a camel has a better chance of going through the eye of a needle than a rich man has entering heaven, can we officially put you down as having denounced Donald Trump as the Republican candidate?
I wanted to say for legal purposes, that I do not Advocate anyone Stone to death any member of congress, and that my statement was purely for satirical purposes. I denounce anyone who actually plans any domestic terrorist actions against any us official, no matter how Despicable the senator.